Film holder protocol?

[George in Georgia]

Which side of the film holder slide handle is generally accepted to indicate that the film is exposed? The dark side or the aluminum side?

I'd like to fit in properly with tradition, since I just bought a 2x3 Busch Pressman C with Wollensack Raptar f4.5 101mm lens in a Wollensack Rapax shutter, and one film holder - to be followed by others as I find them. The little Pressman has a Kalart rangefinder in good working order, a few scuffs on the leather covering the aluminum (I think) body, and a few scratches on the black wrinkle paint. Otherwise seems in lovely condition - the shutter sounds right, the bellows look good, lens is clear, etc. No Grafloc back, although I gather they're not too difficult to fit. But the spring back has a ground glass and the mini- hood for it is in good condition.

I've wanted something like this ever since I used a baby Speed Graphic in my teens on assignment for the local paper. While that bad boy had a synchro shutter - think No. 5 bulbs, yes! - my little gem lacks the solenoid for external synchro. No problem, I plan to do landscapes, etc. While the Wollensack lens is only 3 elements, I gather they are quite good. AND the price was right at a local camera shop.

Now to hit FreeStyle's site and order some sheet film, turn up a developing tank - I think Yankee makes one - and a neg carrier and proper lens for the Beseler 23c. I wonder what the digital crowd will think when they see this sweetie on a tripod with a focusing cloth to use the ground glass!

This should be a nice complement to my Pentax 645n kit.

Any advice from the old hands - or young experts - out there would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks!! :)

[eddie]

white unexposed.

black exposed

[George in Georgia]

white unexposed.

black exposed

Sounds reasonable! Thanks, Eddie.

[Brian C. Miller]

Welcome to the madhouse!

There's another thread about this around here. There are official sources indicating both ways.

The black side is smooth, and the white side has bumps. If you go by color, then white is unexposed, and black is exposed. If you go by feel, no bumps is unexposed, and bumps is exposed.

IIRC, the US Navy trained its photographers that white (no bumps) is unexposed, and the Graflex manual says that no bumps (black) is unexposed. I suppose this is because in the Navy, if you have time to make a photograph then you have time to look at the holders, while the people at Graflex knew that the press photographers would be blindly grabbing at the holders in their pockets.

[D. Bryant]

Sounds reasonable! Thanks, Eddie.

White unexposed. Black opposite of white.

[Wally]

Welcome to the madhouse!

The black side is smooth, and the white side has bumps. If you go by color, then white is unexposed, and black is exposed. If you go by feel, no bumps is unexposed, and bumps is exposed.

Come on, now, Brian, you can't have it both ways!

No bumps is black therefore exposed; bumps is shiny, and unexposed, right?


// Wally, who got it backwards the first time i dropped my holders off at Chrome.

[cowanw]

My brain works differently. white means light and to me light means the film is exposed: to help I have made a big X on the eXposed side of the slide with a marker pen.
Don't let any body else use my holders.

[k8ewl]

I have a Speed Graphic 2 x 3 with the spring back. Are any adapter kits available to mount a 120 back?

[rguinter]

My brain works differently. white means light and to me light means the film is exposed: to help I have made a big X on the eXposed side of the slide with a marker pen.
Don't let any body else use my holders.

Ditto.

And I don't care about tradition of any kind.

White/aluminum to me means light (exposed) and black is no-light (unexposed). Always done it that way.

Bob G.

[grahamcase]

What you should get from all these replies is that there is no right way, except the way YOU do it. Just be consistent, and don't let other people touch your stuff :D

As a corollary to this, what do you do when your holders are empty vs. not empty? What do you do to prevent yourself from opening up a film holder that has film inside it?

[rdenney]

Which side of the film holder slide handle is generally accepted to indicate that the film is exposed? The dark side or the aluminum side?

Gee whiz, why don't you come fresh into a forum and ask us why we like killing babies? Couldn't you have started with a question less likely to start a religious war? Sheesh.

Rick "like, you know, film vs. digital or something uncontroversial" Denney

[sultanofcognac]

Funny - I don't go by the colours. I write the exposure and holder number info down into my exposure booklet and know what I've shot and what's ready for misuse.

Maybe I should consider being more disciplined, but I'm an expert at shirking responsibilities. . . maybe because I was in the Navy. And the Navy (an acronym for Never Again Volunteer Yourself) teaches one that to do anything there is the right way, the wrong way and the Navy way!

[Joanna Carter]

White/aluminum to me means light (exposed) and black is no-light (unexposed). Always done it that way.
As long as you are the only one on the shoot, then no problem. The "tradition" of black meaning exposed is simple to explain - a sheet of B&W negative film is black when exposed. Try it next time you forget to close the shutter :eek: :rolleyes:

[Joanna Carter]

What do you do to prevent yourself from opening up a film holder that has film inside it?
That's what the little turnkeys on the top are for ;)

[cowanw]

As long as you are the only one on the shoot, then no problem. The "tradition" of black meaning exposed is simple to explain - a sheet of B&W negative film is black when exposed. Try it next time you forget to close the shutter :eek: :rolleyes:

As long as you are the only one on the shoot, then no problem. The "tradition" of white meaning exposed is simple to explain - a sheet of B&W negative film is white when printed. Try it next time you forget to close the shutter :p ;)

[Sean Galbraith]

As a corollary to this, what do you do when your holders are empty vs. not empty? What do you do to prevent yourself from opening up a film holder that has film inside it?

Unloaded holders of mine have the darkslide inserted, but the bottom flap is "open".

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4101/5602810283_02678e0853.jpg

[Noah A]

What you should get from all these replies is that there is no right way, except the way YOU do it. Just be consistent, and don't let other people touch your stuff :D

As a corollary to this, what do you do when your holders are empty vs. not empty? What do you do to prevent yourself from opening up a film holder that has film inside it?

There may not be a "right" way, but the standard among all of the professional photographers and assistants I've ever worked with was white=unexposed and black=exposed.

Also, black=empty.

So white means ready to shoot and black means not ready to shoot. If you're doing client work or important personal shooting, the most important thing is to know if the holder is ready to use or not. That's why white ALWAYS=loaded with unexposed film.

If you're out on a shoot it could be a major annoyance to have to use a changing bag or find a dark room to see if there is film in a holder. At home it's easier. So if by some chance I forget if a black-side-out holder is empty or has exposed film in it, it's a minor inconvenience to check.

I clean out the holders and flip the slides back to white immediately before loading.

Of course if you work alone and you're the only ones using your holders then just use whatever system makes sense for you. However I'm a pretty firm believer that whatever color you use for exposed film should also be used for empty.

[MIke Sherck]

You can do it either way, there isn't any advantage or disadvantage. If you borrow a loaded film holder from some one else, ask their method, don't just assume they use yours. Ditto if you loan a loaded holder to someone.

Mike

[jp]

I made labels for mine. "Exposed" and "Loaded". Empties stay on "Exposed" until reloaded. That way empties won't get used without film in them. Sorta like you treat a gun as if it's always loaded, I treat film holders as if they are always loaded (so I don't ruin film or exposed images)

In the darkroom, I have separate stacks on a shelf for "new/loaded", "empty", and "used/loaded" so I can see what I have to develop or reload.

I also dedicate certain film holders to certain types of film and number each; 6 film holders labeled for TMY2 and labeled 1-12, 3 more for labeled for Fomapan100 sheets 1-6.

[Ash]

The tech at college (who works there now the pro work has dried up too much) said he always worked that the black was unexposed, white exposed. I think his reasoning was you can write notes on the white side.

For me it's easier to pick out a shiny white/silver holder to use, if it's black it doesn't attract my eye as much and I look past it. For that reason it's easier for my eyes to have white as unexposed and black as exposed.

[rguinter]

What you should get from all these replies is that there is no right way, except the way YOU do it. Just be consistent, and don't let other people touch your stuff :D

As a corollary to this, what do you do when your holders are empty vs. not empty? What do you do to prevent yourself from opening up a film holder that has film inside it?

Best thing to do with unloaded film holders is to zip them together inside a large ziplock bag labeled "Unloaded Film Holders."

It's what I've done since day one and it keeps them clean and organized when not in use.

Just common sense. Can't figure why anyone would do anything else.

Bob G.

[dave_whatever]

Ditto.

And I don't care about tradition of any kind.

White/aluminum to me means light (exposed) and black is no-light (unexposed). Always done it that way.

Bob G.

Another ditto from me.

[Sirius Glass]

Unloaded holders of mine have the darkslide inserted, but the bottom flap is "open".

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4101/5602810283_02678e0853.jpg

I do this too!

Steve

[Sirius Glass]

That's what the little turnkeys on the top are for ;)

I put both unexposed and exposed holders with the turnkeys locked.

Steve

[cjbroadbent]

Freelance assistants anywhere load white/virgin (they also use canned air before loading).

[lindy]

And the Navy (an acronym for Never Again Volunteer Yourself) teaches one that to do anything there is the right way, the wrong way and the Navy way!

And if your Chief of the Boat was anything like mine he insisted on the Navy way at all times!

[Tim k]

Unloaded holders of mine have the darkslide inserted, but the bottom flap is "open".

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4101/5602810283_02678e0853.jpg

Thats a good idea.

[Graham Patterson]

My process is white=unexposed. When a holder has been used on both sides, it goes into the dust bag slide end down. This separates available holders from used ones if I put one back in the wrong end of the bag, and tends to ensure that the slides don't get pulled by accident. I like the idea of leaving the flap open when empty, especially since my holders live in dust bags most of the time.

[rguinter]

Freelance assistants anywhere load white/virgin (they also use canned air before loading).

I'm not a big fan of canned-air... because its a fluorocarbon and not air. As such it has certain hazards associated with it that most people either don't understand or ignore.

I use the small "Rocket"- style squeeze-air bulbs myself.

Bob G.

[stevebrot]

Light = unexposed/clean/virgin


Steve

[rguinter]

My process is white=unexposed. When a holder has been used on both sides, it goes into the dust bag slide end down. This separates available holders from used ones if I put one back in the wrong end of the bag, and tends to ensure that the slides don't get pulled by accident. I like the idea of leaving the flap open when empty, especially since my holders live in dust bags most of the time.

I keep individual holders inside individual zip-lock plastic bags at all times... except when they are in the camera or in my changing tent. For transporting I use small 6-pack size coolers and ten or so bagged filmholders fit easily in a cooler.

The bags I have are 6x9.75 inches and 4x5 filmholders are a perfect fit.

With this technique they virtually never get dirty even if they are out in the field with me all day.

Bob G.

[rguinter]

I do this too!

Steve

Something about this technique kicks-in my industrial engineering training and just simply "doesn't look good."

Perhaps it works for you but overall it's probably not necessary if you keep your holders in zip-lock bags to begin with. Simply label the bags and there's no need for this routine.

Moreover, if you are not keeping them in zip-locks then the open ends are inviting damages from handling and opening another area for dust to get in.

My 2-cents.

Bob G.

[rguinter]

Light = unexposed/clean/virgin


Steve

No wait a minute... as a human factors engineer with decades of experience evaluating the ways humans behave and function, I'm simply not seeing the connection you're making between the words "light," "unexposed," "clean," and "virgin." I sense this is a stretch.

Now admittedly I haven't seen any experimental psychology studies done on this subject of "metal side vs black-painted" side of film holders. My hypothesis here is that virtually no-one outside the realm of LF photography ever pondered the subject or cared enough to do an academic study.

But knowing what I know about population stereotypes and how they evolve, it seems to me that the concept of "black-painted side" would be more often associated with "lack of light" than "silver" or "white-painted side" would. In fact that was the exact association I made when I first started doing LF photography and loading film holders.

I never asked anybody which side should be used for which because I never knew or cared if there was a conventional wisdom about which side to use for which.

I do see where the existing conventional wisdom originated that others have mentioned above... i.e., with the association of "black-painted side" with the outcome of a processed negative going black. But to me that was never considered since I never did negatives until recently.

So to reiterate, my hypothesis is that most people would associate black with concepts like dark of night, lack of light, etc. and vice versa.

Bob G.

[stevebrot]

No wait a minute... as a human factors engineer with decades of experience evaluating the ways humans behave and function...

Bob G.

I am not human (serious angst)? Or perhaps I am simply lacking in factors...:confused:


Steve


(Sorry...could not resist...)

[Roger Thoms]

Best thing to do with unloaded film holders is to zip them together inside a large ziplock bag labeled "Unloaded Film Holders."

It's what I've done since day one and it keeps them clean and organized when not in use.

Just common sense. Can't figure why anyone would do anything else.

Bob G.

After getting tired of checking holders this is exactly what I started doing.

Roger

[Tracy Storer]

White/Silver = LOADED and UnExpsosed
Black = Don't Shoot. (could be exposed, or empty)

[BetterSense]

When I first started I had no idea and operating in a vacuum, I decided to use black for unexposed and white for exposed. I learned the convention as soon as possible and switched to the popular convention, but it goes to show that there's nothing really fundamental or obvious about white=unexposed.

[Curt]

white unexposed.

black exposed
__________________

[Roger Cole]

I do what the majority do - white = unexposed. Black = exposed or empty. I don't have any problem keeping track of which are empty and which are unexposed.

BTW, welcome neighbor. A few of us (well, three so far) have been trying to get a local shoot together but schedules are just not meshing so far.

[jb7]

Black side- tarnished silver, silver after exposure.

Your mnemonic may vary...

[rguinter]

I am not human (serious angst)? Or perhaps I am simply lacking in factors...:confused:


Steve


(Sorry...could not resist...)

the term "human factors engineer" in the USA refers to the academic study known as "ergonomics" most everywhere else.

It's rooted in the science originally known as "experimental psychology" although that too isn't totally precise. A good part of the experimental work is focused on understanding how human physiology functions as well.

Bob G.

[rguinter]

When I first started I had no idea and operating in a vacuum, I decided to use black for unexposed and white for exposed. I learned the convention as soon as possible and switched to the popular convention, but it goes to show that there's nothing really fundamental or obvious about white=unexposed.

You proved the point I made in post #33.

So my next question, just for the purpose of understanding, is: why is conformance with the conventional wisdom more important than going with your first (intuitive) impression?

Bob G.

[Jack Dahlgren]

You proved the point I made in post #33.

So my next question, just for the purpose of understanding, is: why is conformance with the conventional wisdom more important than going with your first (intuitive) impression?

Bob G.

Because your first impression may not take into account other factors. For example, I may start riding a bicycle in the center of the road - makes sense doesn't it? At least it does until I encounter another bicyclist coming the other direction. Then what? Which side is better then?

Film holders are the same. Makes no difference which way if you are working alone, but if you work with other people (assistants, labs, other photographers) then convention becomes important.

[Noah A]

Which side of the film holder slide handle is generally accepted to indicate that the film is exposed? The dark side or the aluminum side?

I'd like to fit in properly with tradition...

The OP didn't ask about philosophy or logic. I'm not sure if white=unexposed and black=exposed makes any sense logically, but it's been drilled into my head from the first day of the first large format class I took in college. So now it's something I don't question or think about.

In any event, the OP asked if there was a well-accepted convention. And there certainly is, if you talk to labs, commercial photographers, professional assistants, most photo educators, etc...

[Preston]

I use the commonly accepted convention...

White = Unexposed
Black = Exposed, or Empty

I keep my loaded holders in a small stuff sack. After exposure, I place those holders in the bag with the top side down and ensure the lock thingies are engaged.

After I unload the holders, I make sure they are clean and store them in zip lock bags with a sticky note that says 'Empty'

--P

[Brian Ellis]

You need to know three things about a film holder - is it empty, does it have unexposed film in it, or does it have exposed film in it. The dark slide will only tell you two things. I use the dark slide to tell me exposed (black) and unexposed (white). But I also need to know whether a holder is empty. I tell that by the position of the holder in the zip lock bag - if the top of the holder is facing up towards the top of the bag the holder is empty, if it's facing down there's film in it.

My holders stay in a zip lock bag at all times except when they're in the camera and when film is being loaded or unloaded. When I'm loading and unloading film I don't just spread a bunch of holders out on the counter, instead each holder stays in a zip lock bag and they're taken out of the bag one at a time as each is being loaded then they go right back in the bag before moving on to the next holder. Ditto for when film is being processed. It takes a little extra time in the dark to avoid leaving holders sitting out on a darkroom counter for a while but I've been doing it this way for about 15 years and almost never have a dust problem.

This certainly isn't the only way and it probably isn't what labs do. But it works for me. I don't believe in putting anything sticky on film holders because I'm concerned that the sticky residue could become a dust magnet and I don't like to write anything on holders except a number.

[dave_whatever]

I tell that by the position of the holder in the zip lock bag - if the top of the holder is facing up towards the top of the bag the holder is empty, if it's facing down there's film in it.

I do the same, although the exact opposite convention (again...).

[Shadowtracker]

So, George in Georgia; I guess you can see by the little discussion that has taken place here, that you have thrown our perfectly balanced, and happy, little club of LFers - who are anything but 'normal', into a frenzy of heated debate about something they have been doing for years. Not to worry though, this is normal for any 'basic' question about LF conventional approaches to things. It hasn't been the first, and it sure won't be the last time a simple question has done this here.

By the way, Welcome to LF, and this format is a great place to learn a lot of things.

[aluncrockford]

The standard practice in the world of advertising photographers in London is

Check for dust

Bottom left / Top right , so notches are at the base of the siide

White (ridges)- unexposed
Black Smooth) -exposed



This is (or was) the first thing you were shown as an assistant to load any other way invited instant dismissal

[Vaughn]

The more light hits the film the blacker it gets...thus exposed is black.

I teach it this way at the university -- too many students working together to have more than one standard.

Vaughn

[Sirius Glass]

Light = ... /virgin

Not a good choice of words for what I still can do to a piece of film. :eek:

[George in Georgia]

Hey Folks -

Many thanks for the spirited, informative, and often amusing thread! I think I might let aluminum indicate unexposed, and black exposed...at least for the present time.:)

I also like the idea of leaving the "door" open to indicate no film. I hadn't thought of that state of being. Schrodinger's cat, and all that....:confused:

[rguinter]

Silver exposed is tarnished - and turns black. So the black is exposed.

White is pure and untarnished, so is unexposed.

I guess if this mental construct works for those that use the "silver=unexposed, black=exposed" convention it is certainly alright.

As this thread proves, one's preference for use of the black and white sides is actually trivial as long as one is consistent.

But I find myself (essentially never) thinking about tarnished silver and its color when fumbling with film-holders in the field.

As one pointed out in a post above, use of the reverse protocol (way back when) by aspiring professionals could have gotten one instantly "dismissed" or in dire trouble when working with a team.

I certainly never had that worry as I never worked with anyone else or even asked advice on matters like this that held so little real importance.

Bob G.

[mike rosenlof]

I know what I do, but whatever works for you is fine when you're on your own. If you start doing work with others, you gotta make sure you all are doing the same thing!

[John Kasaian]

I do this too!

Steve

I don't. I don't want any dust sneakin' in there when I'm not lookin'

[Steven Tribe]

This has been a problem since the dawn of (photographic) time.
There was once a market for this smart device from Thornton-Pickard!

[Leigh]

Re segregating unloaded holders from loaded ones...

I use the slide locks religiously. I engage the lock as soon as I insert the slide on a loaded sheet.

The only times the locks are disengaged are when the slide is out to take a photo, or when the film is removed for processing.

Therefore, any holder out of the camera with the locks disengaged is empty.

The advantages of this method over leaving the flap sticking out is that the unlocked holders can be stacked, and no dust infiltration.

- Leigh

[Vaughn]

...I also like the idea of leaving the "door" open to indicate no film. I hadn't thought of that state of being. Schrodinger's cat, and all that....:confused:

I don't like the idea of leaving the hinged part open -- places more strain on the hinge tape -- and as John mentioned, increases the chance of dust sneaking in. I tell the students never to do it.

I shake the holder to hear if there is any film rattling around inside. And I make use of post-it notes if things get too confusing.

[Sirius Glass]

I don't. I don't want any dust sneakin' in there when I'm not lookin'

There is no "stinkin', sneakin' dust" to get in the holder. When I take out the film to develop, the film holder goes into a plastic zip bag if I do not reload it then. The hold stays in the zipped bag until I take it out to reload. Since the holder is in a safe place in my home, the hinge is not going to get damaged.

Steve

[domaz]

I have a couple 5x7 wooden film holders that say on the dark slide "Exposed" on one side and not the other. Why couldn't have all film holders always been this way? No argument on that one.

[rguinter]

I think this horse is really a cat!

Must have nine lives to endure all this beating....

[Ari]

I forego all that stuff and use only Grafmatics.

[Vaughn]

I have a couple 5x7 wooden film holders that say on the dark slide "Exposed" on one side and not the other. Why couldn't have all film holders always been this way? No argument on that one.

I have several glass plate holders that are the same.

Sirus -- the reason I tell the students not to leave the hinge open is that any pressure against the holder applies a levered force against the tape, and I have no control over how the holders are transported and treated.

We just finished a 4x5 assignment in the intermediate class (24 students). The two Horseman Wood Fields came back with knobs missing and the stud on one side of the front standard that tightens the rise/fall snapped off. We have a Tachahara that the students broke a while back -- used it for replacement knobs and took its stud over to the jewelery dept and ground it to fit the Horseman. So the two Horseman are back in working order again. The Shen Hao has not yet been returned -- keeping my fingers crossed. The three Calumet rail cameras usually fair better. Tough beasts, but still mortal!

I should have the instructor lead the students in a chant:

Righty tighty, lefty loosey!
Righty tighty, lefty loosey!
Righty tighty, lefty loosey!
And if it won't go, turn it no more!

[Steve Barber]

Someone mentioned there were three things you want to know about a film holder, whether it is exposed or unexposed and whether there is film in it. I would add another, what kind of film is in it?

While the mnemonics for “black equal exposed” work for me, the reason I started with the white side showing for unexposed film is because that is where I could pencil a note as to what kind of film the holder was loaded with. That way, when I pick up a film holder, I can see whether it is exposed or not, and, if not, what kind of film it is. Last, as I think about it, IIRC, I was taught to put the aluminum side out when loading a film holder. However, that was a long time ago, when I took industrial photography in high school.

As to whether it has film in it or not; if it is outside the darkroom, it has film in it. If it is in the dark room and has the dark side showing, it does not have film in it. This, of course, only works because I only take film holders to the darkroom to unload them and I do it right away. When loading film; first I turn all of the dark slides so they show the white side out and, if the film is different, pencil in the type and speed. The only times I use baggies for film holders is to use large ones to separate film types and help keep dust and trash away.

[Roger Cole]

Someone mentioned there were three things you want to know about a film holder, whether it is exposed or unexposed and whether there is film in it. I would add another, what kind of film is in it?

Each side of each of my holders is numbered. I keep a shirt pocket sized notebook in the camera bag with a list of what film is in which number, update as I load them. This way I never have to write anything new on the holders.

I also have the Riteways with the number wheels - I know a lot of people don't like 'em but I do so there. ;) Anyway, the numbers are set to match the number written on that side of that holder. If I ever have a light leak, bad focus or other problem I think is associated with a holder I'll know right away, and it will also help me to identify that such problems might be related to the film holder, if they only appear on those with certain numbers.

[engl]

In order to indicate an empty holder, I pull out the darkslide slightly, say 5mm.

So white is unexposed, black and darkslide all the way in (and locked) is exposed, and darkslide unlocked and slightly pulled out is empty. This is just a fall back though, I keep empty holders separately and have no reason to bring them outside my house.

[Steve Barber]

Each side of each of my holders is numbered. I keep a shirt pocket sized notebook in the camera bag with a list of what film is in which number, update as I load them. This way I never have to write anything new on the holders.

I also have the Riteways with the number wheels - I know a lot of people don't like 'em but I do so there. ;) Anyway, the numbers are set to match the number written on that side of that holder. If I ever have a light leak, bad focus or other problem I think is associated with a holder I'll know right away, and it will also help me to identify that such problems might be related to the film holder, if they only appear on those with certain numbers.

I keep notes and number the holders, but I notch the edges of the holder with a code for the the number of each side. For me, it is easier, making notes only when needed for a particular exposure and tossing them when no longer needed, than it would be trying to keep a permanent record of all the notes with all the different kinds of film used in each holder. And, that way, as you say, I can determine which holder was used if there seems to be a problem with it.

[Steve Barber]

In order to indicate an empty holder, I pull out the darkslide slightly, say 5mm.

So white is unexposed, black and darkslide all the way in (and locked) is exposed, and darkslide unlocked and slightly pulled out is empty. This is just a fall back though, I keep empty holders separately and have no reason to bring them outside my house.

I tried that, for a while, just leaving the dark slide out until reloading the holder with another piece of film. I quit because I did not like having the end flaps loose and I think it can allow dust and other trash to accumulate in the holder. For me, the discipline of unloading the film holders when I first take them into the darkroom solves a lot of problems and, if there is any question, it is no problem to turn out the lights and check.to see if they are, indeed, unloaded.

[engl]

I tried that, for a while, just leaving the dark slide out until reloading the holder with another piece of film. I quit because I did not like having the end flaps loose and I think it can allow dust and other trash to accumulate in the holder. For me, the discipline of unloading the film holders when I first take them into the darkroom solves a lot of problems and, if there is any question, it is no problem to turn out the lights and check.to see if they are, indeed, unloaded.

I only pull out the darkslide a few millimeters, so that the flaps are not loose, and no dust can get into the holder.