Clean shutters with Lighter Fluid ??

[John Q Burch]

I need some help I have the following lens that are out of timing. Yes I should send the lens off for a clean and adjust but I cannot afford it right now. Duri ng the middle of august I have the opportunity to take a class at Coupville Art Center on Using the View camera. My Dad gave me a Linhof Tech III and the len ses are cammed for it. All are in Synchro-Compur shutters that are very random when I use a Calumet shutter tester the list of lenses are 90mm f6.8 Angulon #321xxxx W/Cam 150mm f4.5 Xenar #317xxxx W/Cam 240mm f5.6 Tel-Xenar #332xxxx W/Cam I read that you can use Lighter Fluid to unstuck the shutter blades but it does not look like it would be safe or in other words it looks as though it would be easy to make it worse. I do have a 127mm f4.7 Ektar that I can use for the clas s BUT it would be better if I could use all of the lens if the lighter fluid wor ks. If I can afford to have only one lens cleaned, I was thinking of the 90mm o r the 150mm this would be for the class and Landscape B&W after. Thank you

[TAN K H]

First of all, I would like to warn you that what I am suggesting should be treated as just a quick and dirty way of POSSIBLY solving your problem. I'd seriously recommend a proper clean lube and adjust by a pro technician as early as you can afford. But the following has worked for me - read: I have done this successfully on two 60s/70s Compur shutters. The main piece of advice is to USE CARE (BE GENTLE, USE COMMONSENSE). And certainly, remove the front and back optical groups before you proceed.

I have found lighter fluid to be a VERY TEMPORARY solution. It's more of a salesperson trick than anything else to get a shutter going for a while. As long as the fluid is present, the shutter will work ok. But once it dries up again (which is usually within a day or two), your shutter will either be worse off or be back to the same condition. Shutter mis-timings can be due to at least 3 things: 1. Oil on shutter blades (as you have described); 2. Springs on the timing mechanism that have lost their proper tension' 3. Dried up lubricant within the gear train itself.

Oil on aperture and shutter blades is not too difficult to clean off. The best solvent I have come across for this the now banned solvent 1,1,1 trichloro (WARNING: inhaling its fumes will damage your insides). I can still buy this as "Liquid Paper Correction Fluid" solvent from stationery shops in my country. Apply some to cotton buds (Q-tips?) and gingerly clean the blades when they are closed. Do not bend the blades by using too much force. If your shutter has a preview feature, open the blades halfway after you have cleaned them already to get at the areas where you didn't get to when the blades were fully closed. I have also done this on a Supermatic and it cleaned up nicely. Ideally, you'd re-lubricate the shutter blades with graphite lubricant but this probably best done by a pro.

If 1,1,1 trichloro is unavailable, you can use ethanol - get as pure as possible. My experience with using lighter fluid here is that it merely spreads the grease around without actually helping to clean it off.

I cleaned the shutter and aperture blades on 2 older Compur and one Kodak Supermatic this way and they work wonderfully now.

If its a spring tension issue, then you either have to get the shutter overhauled by a specialist (like SK Grimes), or use the shutter as is by compensating for the off-speeds. You'd still have to somehow get the real speeds timed so you'd know how much to compensate for.

The last possible solution must be done with the utmost of care. In my experience, dried up lubricant on timing gears can be tackled quite easily with a miniscule amount of WD-40. That's right - that humble can of do-it-all spray.

THE MAIN THING TO NOTE IS THAT YOU NEED ONLY A MINISCULE AMOUNT, and I do mean as little as possible. Practise squirting the smallest amount that you can on a tissue (not even a squirt - a teeny little sneeze). Where should you poke that red tube? Most problem shutters with slow speeds that are off can be revived by spraying a very small amount into the slot where the cocking lever is. With the cocking lever in the untensioned state, spray the least possible amount in there. Cock once, and spray the other side. Again, as little as possible. Cock and fire your shutter at all shutter speeds for a few cycles. You'll find that the slow speeds have been revived. The danger when you overdo it is that the WD40 gets all over your shutter and aperture blades. You DO NOT WANT THAT. Leave the shutter out in the open and let it air out for a while before you screw in the lenses.

My two old Compur shutters revived this way have worked perfectly for over a year. Speeds are all on the mark. I would however be sending them for a proper CLA when I can be bothered to do so.

Another word of caution - do not attempt what I have suggested on Compound, Ilex or Rapax shutters.

[John H. Henderson]

Ed Romney recommends benzine for cleaning shutter blades. Heck if I know where to get that. Or ether. Heck if I know where to get that. If anyone can suggest where I might look to find this stuff, please let me know.

Either way, you want to clean cameras and shutter with solvents that don't leave residue. And you want to be careful of using alcohols and acetone, and they will destroy some parts, particularly plastics.

Never lube shutter either, unless you know what you're doing. Only the spindles of the internal gears of a shutter should be lubricated with a very small amount of watch oil.

[Sean Billy Bob Boy yates]

I haven't tried this but the hardware store down the street sells electrical contact cleaner in an aerosol spray can. I believe it has ether as a componant - it certainly evaporates very quickly. I have used it as a cleaner/degreaser on padlocks and various other household things and it seems to work fine for them.

Proceed with caution!

[John Lehman]

I will second the WD-40 suggestion -- I have used it on half a dozen shutters with about a 75% success rate (and in larger qualtities on about the same number of 8mm movie cameras with 100% success). Pay attention to the suggestion above about being careful to use only a small amount and not getting it on the blades.

[Greyhoundman]

Ether? Auto starting fluid. :)
VERY dangerous near any heat or sparks!

[Gene McCluney]

I use zero-residue electrical contact cleaner that I get at an electronics supplies store. It works quite well if you flush enough into every nook and cranny of the shutter, and it evaporates quickly leaving no residue. It does not harm plastic parts. You should fire off the shutter several times while cleaning it to ensure that the cleaner gets into and dislodges all the crud in all the bearings.

If you feel compelled, you could then apply a teeny-tiny bit of no-drip oil to the pivots and bearings of the shutter actuating mechanism, particularly the slow-speed escapement, but never to the iris or shutter blades.

This technique has worked very well for me. This is about all you can do without completely disassembling the parts, and I do not recommend that.

[Gene McCluney]

I should add, that the idea here, using the aerosol contact cleaner, is to FLUSH out the mechanism, this means that you apply quite a bit of cleaner, to the point it is dripping out of and off the mechanism onto the floor. You are flushing out the crud, you see. Don't be shy and apply too little cleaner. It will just move the crud around. Take off the lens elements and put them aside, well out of the spray pattern of the cleaner.

[Uusilehto]

I have an old rim-set compur that was a bit sticky on the slower shutter speeds. I simply put it in a small plastic box and poured lighter fluid in it. The shell seemed to more or less contain the fluid so I let it sit there for some twenty minutes before pouring it all out while squirting new fluid in. Did this a few times and ended up with a bunch of lighter fluid that was too dirty to see through.
I air-dried most of the fluid and let it dry by itself in a warm dry place for a few days. It's been about a month since that operation and everything works just fine now.

[Dave Parker]

WD-40 on a shutter, no way no how, that type of oil is a dust and lint magnet, I have used the lighter fluid method on shutters that can take it with no problem, but your best bet is Flute(SP) last I checked it was $45 to get a shutter CLA'd and she is very highly recommended.

Dave

[Alan Davenport]

I've done the lighter fluid thing with two shutters. Both worked fine afterward, and continue to do so. It's been over 3 years since the first one was done.

Before you do this, make darn sure that your shutter does not have shutter or aperture blades that are made from any kind of fiber-based material. I've not seen such an animal but have it on good authority that some were made.

Remove both front and rear lens cells, plus the front cover of the shutter. Then simply dunk the entire shutter in a dish with enough lighter fluid to more or less cover things. Come back every 10 minutes and swish things around. Do this for an hour.

When you take it out, shake as much off as possible. Then you'll have to be patient as the lighter fluid evaporates slowly. Work the aperture and fire the shutter. Leave the aperture closed so the lighter fluid can evaporate. I also used canned air to blow the fluid out as much as possible, but it was still a couple of days before it was dry to my satisfaction.

I then used a toothpick to apply microdrops of oil to the ends of those rotating shafts that I could get to. Didn't worry about the ones I couldn't reach. NO OIL ON THE TEETH OF THE TIMING GEARS.

Verify function. Close it up. Remount the lens. Happy, happy, happy.

[Jim Jones]

WD-40 is great for some uses, but not in cameras. It appears to be very thin. This is due to a solvent that evaporates, leaving a lubricant that is more like grease than oil. It can gum up relatively crude devices like locks, let along shutters.

[cyrus]

Ed Romney recommends benzine for cleaning shutter blades. Heck if I know where to get that. Or ether. Heck if I know where to get that. If anyone can suggest where I might look to find this stuff, please let me know.

Either way, you want to clean cameras and shutter with solvents that don't leave residue. And you want to be careful of using alcohols and acetone, and they will destroy some parts, particularly plastics.

Never lube shutter either, unless you know what you're doing. Only the spindles of the internal gears of a shutter should be lubricated with a very small amount of watch oil.


Benzene is a serious carcinogen

[Steve Barber]

WD-40 on a shutter, no way no how, that type of oil is a dust and lint magnet, I have used the lighter fluid method on shutters that can take it with no problem, but your best bet is Flute(SP) last I checked it was $45 to get a shutter CLA'd and she is very highly recommended.

Dave

Carol Miller at Flutot's Camera Repair
http://www.flutotscamerarepair.com/

[Jim Noel]

WD40 + shutter+time = 1 glued shutter

Use Benzene from a hardware storre, or lighter fluid

[JOSEPH ANDERSON]

I used acetone on an old suprematic. I put 10 drops on the front and sloshed it around a litle. Then same thing on back of shutter. These old shutters have metal aperture blades,
I think, so acetone didn't hurt. It's been about a year and sutter is working fine. But, let me add I was going to trash this shutter, so I didn't care if it worked or not. I think I
just got lucky.I have killed a few shutters in my time. So pick one or two, you will use for
your class, And send them to a pro for a c/a it's money well spent. You won't be sorry.

good luck, Joe A

[Shen45]

Like many I have tried the bath in lighter fluid or white spirit but it does tend to spread the old grease around and often makes the aperture blades bind together.

If you decide to soak the shutter you run the risk of transferring old grease and dirt to the aperture and shutter blades. And I have been told some shutter/aperture blades react very badly to solvents.

If the shutter is one that you can afford to loose then read on -- if not pay for a CLA

I have done Betax and Alphax shutters with great results but I don't think I would touch a Compur -- yet.

Check on the net for a diagram of your shutter and here is a very good use for a digital camera - snap the layout as you take out every piece.

Take note of where the shutter has previously been lubricated. You will need to give the shutter some lube later in these areas.

Lay them out in a numbered sequence on a tray with sides. Put all screws in envelopes or sealed plastic bags.

Use a white icecream container or as someone has suggested remove springs inside a clear plastic bag. If one decides to leave the shutter case you may never ever find it. I learned the hard way on a practise shutter -- well it is now !!

The shutter blades are usually easy to remove and can be cleaned with paper towel. But be gentle. You may find the shutter has one blade that has two sections just take note of how it all goes back together.

Unless there is something really amiss with the iris leave it alone. It can be easy or hard to get it working correctly. And you wont know that until after you try to put it back in the shutter body.

The clockwork mechanism should be left in place as that can be tricky to get back together in the right order. Use a small artist brush and clean any areas with a small amount of white spirit.

When you have all the components out that you need to clean you can wash them in a bath of white spirit and they will dry very quickly.

You ideally need molygrease which can be obtained from RepCo or the like.

Another small paintbrush now with a very small amount of grease and lightly paint the shafts that carry pivoting parts. A very light smeer.

The clockwork must not be greased but a very light clock oil in the appropriate places is all that is needed.

Put all the bits back together and clean the rimset dial of old grease and regrease lightly and maybe, just maybe it will work.

If not there is always a qualified repairer.

[John Kasaian]

Make sure that the shutter blades aren't some kind of paper or plastic :eek:

[Dawid]

I have had repeated success cleaning shutters with benzene. Nothing comes close except maybe ether or acetone. I'm not sure what lighter fluid contains.
Open it and lightly give it a scrub with an old tooth brush briefly dipped in benzene. Cover the lens and other parts of the camera as it can make a bit of a mess.

It evaporates completely and dissolves oil, grease and other "gunk2 that has accumulated over the years leaving the metal completely unsticky with no residue. Its used in dry cleaning and with prolonged exposure ( years ) can give you lymphoma ( type of blood cancer ) but with short term use and reasonable precautions its OK.

I know in the UK and probably US as well, it's hard to come by ?? due to safety regulations. Strangely in South Africa you can buy it at the local supermarket ! In the UK I couldn't find a single hardware store selling it BUT you can buy it as Coleman camping gas stove fuel from outdoor stores. However it doesn't say on the tin that it is indeed benzene. In the US you should be able to get it because my MSR Whisperlite camping gas stove runs on that and it was made in the US.

Taking apart shutters is not that difficult, usually its only one part that is sticking, like the speed governer. Taking only the affected part out for a good clean and then replacing it is often successful. There are several good sites to give you an idea, like daniel mitchells site etc. I'm currently struggeling with a Prontor SV on a Voigtlander Perkeo I, where the lever that switches between speed above and below 1/10 is bent.

Good luck

[David A. Goldfarb]

I have an old rim-set compur that was a bit sticky on the slower shutter speeds. I simply put it in a small plastic box and poured lighter fluid in it. The shell seemed to more or less contain the fluid so I let it sit there for some twenty minutes before pouring it all out while squirting new fluid in. Did this a few times and ended up with a bunch of lighter fluid that was too dirty to see through.
I air-dried most of the fluid and let it dry by itself in a warm dry place for a few days. It's been about a month since that operation and everything works just fine now.

With Compur and Synchro-Compur shutters this usually works fairly well, because the blades and all the parts are metal. I use naphtha, which is the main ingredient in lighter fluid without any additives. I remove the cover and the dial so that the fluid can pour in and out easily and work the shutter on all speeds in a small container of fluid (before lifting off the dial, which is used to set the speeds). I usually put a drop of fine machine oil on the slow speed retard mechanism as well, and a little white lithium grease in the channels of the dial, so that it moves smoothly. Everything else can run dry.

Don't soak a shutter with paper blades (old Compound shutters) or rubber blades (some shutters used on Graphic and Graflex cameras) without removing the blades first or you'll destroy them.