Tachihara 4x5

[FredWilson]

Looking at getting a used one as my first real foray into the large format field.
I've shot 35mm (slides) for 10 ~ 12 years, kinda lost interest for 8 ~ 10 years, then got bit again by the photo bug. I still have my Canon A2 and about a year ago (after wanting to get back into photography again) bought a Canon 5D MII (digital) and several "good" glassed lenses to go with it.
Now, after having used that for a little over a year I just happened to glance over some of my "old" slides, most of which are Velvia (the original V50) and was utterly shocked at how great film is compared to what I've been getting with a relatively expensive digital (full sized sensor, 21mp).
I've decided that I want to try 4x5 (and I've "dusted" off my old A2 and bought a 5 pack of Velvia 50 to run through it).
Most of my work is landscapes and general "nature" photos and macro.
The Techihara 4x5 seems to have gotten good reviews for a "lightweight" field camera.
Anyway, the question, after all this verbiage, what's the longest lens that I could use on this particular Techihara, with a max. bellows extension of 330mm ?

Thanks for your time,
Fred

[Jon Shiu]

It can use a 300mm, but may not be able to focus very close. If you use an extension lens board, it could focus closer.

Jon

[rguinter]

Fred:

I have a 400-mm telephoto style lens that works well on my Tachihara.

I also have a vintage 305-mm Caltar in a no 4 Acme shutter that works well.

Example photos taken with each are attached below.

I suspect some may not like the Tachihara because it is a bit fragile. But I find it is very convenient to carry in a backpack with several lenses, film holders, and all necessary accessories.

Cheers.

Bob G.

[FredWilson]

Fred:

I have a 400-mm telephoto style lens that works well on my Tachihara.

I also have a vintage 305-mm Caltar in a no 4 Acme shutter that works well.

Example photos taken with each are attached below.

I suspect some may not like the Tachihara because it is a bit fragile. But I find it is very convenient to carry in a backpack with several lenses, film holders, and all necessary accessories.

Cheers.

Bob G.

Bob (and Jon),
Thanks for the replies.

Bob, what's "fragile" with the camera ?
I'm, generally, pretty gentle on all of my camera equipment, so perhaps it won't be a huge concern for me.
Just seems that I've read some good reviews on the Tachihara, and I've found a used one that looks to be in pretty good shape. Not sure, yet, if the price is good, ca $550.00, no lens or lensboard though.
Is there something else that perhaps I should consider ? The Shen Hao seems to be a similar camera and I can get one new for just a few more dollars I guess.
I've been torn between a "field" camera and a monorail for it's extra movements, however, from what I've read, so far, the extra movements may not be a concern for what I normally do.
Also, this is more of a "see if I really like it" type of thing.
I certainly like film and will always carry my 35mm with me whenever I'm carrying my digital.


Thanks,
Fred

[Chuck Peacock]

For all-around use, the longest non-telephoto lens you can use with the Tackihara will be about 210mm (8 inches) or maybe a 240mm (10 inch).

The arithmetic is pretty simple.

With 330mm bellows draw you can focus a 330mm lens at infinity (providing your 330mm extension is measured to the center of focus of your lens) -- but you won't be able to focus any closer than infinity.

With a lens about 1/2 of the 330mm draw (say 150mm or 6 inch) you can focus down to 1:1 and as a bonus most 150mm 4x5 lenses will have a HUGE image circle focused at 1:1.

For real macro work you could get an old Poloroid MP-4 lens at about 75mm and focus to twice life size.

To go even closer you could get a Copal shutter and screw in elements from enlarging lenses (most Componon elements will screw into a #0 or #1 shutter) or you could even experiment with lenses off of otherwise defunct 35mm leaf shutter cameras (work's best if you reverse the elements - not always possible).

If you really need to use a lens longer than about 240mm, you could consider a true telephoto lens. Telephotos as long as 380mm (15 inches) are farily common and not all that expensive used - I'm not certain there are any new ones still in production. Long ones exist, but they are quite rare and quite expensive when you do find them.

[Brian Vuillemenot]

You may also want to look into a Shen-Hao. It's about the same price as a Tachi, but heavier build quailty, and supposedly you can use up to a 500 mm telephoto design lens.

[Gem Singer]

I've owned and operated a couple of 4x5 Tachiharas.

The longest non-telephoto lenses that I was able to focus at infinity on that camera, without using extensions on the front or back, were the Nikon/Nikkor f9 300M and the Fujinon f8.5 300C.

Both are mounted in Copal 1 shutters and are relatively light weight.

BTW, $550 seems high for a previously owned 4x5 Tachi with no lens boards.

$450-$500 for a camera in excellent condition is a more reasonable price.

[Preston]

I like my Tachi, but it would be better if the construction was a bit beefier. Still, it's a nice camera for packing, and gets the job done.


The longest non-telephoto lenses that I was able to focus at infinity on that camera, without using extensions on the front or back, were the Nikon/Nikkor f9 300M and the Fujinon f8.5 300C.

I have the Nikkor 300m and can confirm Gem's observation.

--P

[Heroique]

My Tachi 4x5 has delighted me for many years.

I got one because I’m a landscape photographer, who hikes up and down the mountains.

So what I needed was a smaller, lighter, packable 4x5 – w/ enough movements to satisfy me. The Tachi 4x5 fit the bill. Its limitations, as you’ll read in this forum, include a few less camera movements, which might not be critical to your landscape photography, and less rigidity. Me, I’ve found my Tachi to be plenty rigid. However, I seem to recall that older models (since you might get a pre-owned one) are missing the nylon washers that help increase rigidity when you “tighten down.” But you can find similar washers in any hardware store. (What’s more, I think the older models had 300mm of bellows draw, not 330mm as they do now.)

As a landscape photographer, I have all the movements I need.

Actually, the Tachi has more movements than people suspect. For example, on a sturdy tripod, simply rotate the camera 90 degrees. And presto!
– Front rise/fall converts to front shift
– Front swing converts to front axial tilt
– Back swing converts to back axial tilt

Below is a photo showing the camera’s removable back, a quick way to switch between “landscape” and “portrait” orientation.

Good luck w/ your search & welcome to the forum. We look forward to seeing your shots!

[sun of sand]

for general nature/landscape you can use a 270 and most times a 305 though you'll probably have to be careful about it
I bought a 380 wollensak and eventhough it is a big lens I bought it in "aerial mount" which when taken out of that mount provides you with what is basically a thick, heavy retraining ring that balances the weight on the standard pretty effectively

a normal retaining ring and it would probably worry me too having it dangling out there

[kev curry]

Tachihara's rock and I've never thought of them as fragile. User friendly easy and intuitive to operate. Importantly they come with a really bright ground glass and fresnel as standard. A 270mm G Claron/Copal 1 shutter is quite small and compact and works great as a long lens on a tachi.

[fbf]

I just bought one in LN condition. It's beautifully made. I didn't care for the golden color gear so I chose the chrome version. So far I am very satisfied.

[Brian Ellis]

I've owned two Tachiharas, they're excellent cameras for general purpose photography. Mine haven't been "fragile," they stood up well to normal usage under some fairly difficult conditions. I used a 300mm Nikon M lens on mine and could focus as close as about 12 feet with no problem. The camera has a 13 inch bellows at full extension give or take a mm or two so obviously it will focus closer than infinity with a 300mm lens if the bellows is working as it should. I also used a 400mm Fuji telephoto lens and it worked well too.

Tachiharas are relatively inexpensive, well-made, simple to use, easy to carry on hikes because of their weight, and are reasonably versatile. If you stick with LF you may find that you have some specialized need that it doesn't fulfill but especially as your first LF camera it's an excellent choice IMHO.

[FredWilson]

Actually I'm thinking now a little more towards the Shen-Hao PTB 4X5.
It has interchangeable bellows. Bellows extend to 390mm.
It's new. Comes with a lensboard (I'd have to get a lens regardless of which one I get) and it's "just" $125.00 more.
I don't know, though, if it has a removable back.

Any thoughts ?


Thanks again,
Fred

[SamReeves]

I use a 210mm for the longest lens on mine. A 300mm just might not have enough bellows draw, however Nikkor makes those T-lenses which might abate that problem. But they'll cost a bundle.

[Allen in Montreal]

......Nikkor makes those T-lenses which might abate that problem. But they'll cost a bundle.

I have the Fuji 400 T and is a great lens too.
While not convertible to other lengths, it is not expensive and a great lens.

[rguinter]

Bob (and Jon),
Thanks for the replies.

Bob, what's "fragile" with the camera ?


Fred:

Yes in my opinion it is a bit fragile... what makes the camera so light-weight also makes it more easily broken. I learned that the hard way after my first one fell over in a sudden (unexpected) wind-storm. Hit the back standard and everything just disintegrated. Now I always add ballast to my tripod center-rod in case of sudden weather change.

But I carry mine around in a backpack in all kinds of weather over all kinds of terrain. and with reasonable care it works exceptionally well even in foul weather. I appreciate the light weight because my aging back can't handle heavy packs anymore.

Cheers. Bob G.

[rguinter]

Fred:

Why don't you check the for-sale section of this forum.

eddie listed a Tachihara for sale yesterday and it might still be available.

Bob G.

[Chuck Peacock]

In the end, the difference in weight between most of the wood/carbon fiber field cameras is neglegible. By the time you add the weight of a couple of lenses, a tripod, a focusing cloth and half-a-dozen film holders you won't notice the difference betwwen the lightest and the heaviest.

Pick a cemara that satisfies what you need to do and don't worry too much about the absolute lightest camera.

If you want to save weight consider opting for older, smaller lenses such as a 90mm Angulon or a 207mm f/7.7 Ektar. The Fujinon WS series are also quite small for what they do although they seem to be hard to find. In most cases, particularly with landscape or other outdoor work, the sharpness and contrast of an older lens are more than adequate and the weight can be a quarter or less of a modern design. You really don't need multi-coating with 4 or 6 element lenses -- much of the work of the "great" landscape photographers was done with uncoated lenses.

You can also use 6-sheet Grafmatic holders instead of covnetional holders. The weight saving isn't as great since they are metal, but you get six sheets in the space of about 1-1/2 normal holders.

[Brian Ellis]

Actually I'm thinking now a little more towards the Shen-Hao PTB 4X5.
It has interchangeable bellows. Bellows extend to 390mm.
It's new. Comes with a lensboard (I'd have to get a lens regardless of which one I get) and it's "just" $125.00 more.
I don't know, though, if it has a removable back.

Any thoughts ?


Thanks again,
Fred

I've owned a Shen Hao too. They're very nice cameras and mine had a "removable back" (by which I assume you mean the ability to use the camera in horizontal or vertical orientation).

I'm not familiar with all the different models they now offer but the bellows extension on the one I owned was 12 inches (300mm). It would go to 390mm or something like that only by first using front base tilt to extend the front standard out in front of the camera bed and then fiddling around with front axis tilt to align the lens. I thought it was kind of a pain to do and also didn't seem very sturdy with a heavier lens.

While the Shen has more movements than a Tachi that translates to more complexity in setting up, operating, and taking down and the question is whether you think you'd want or need the extra movements (I forget what they are, I think the Shen has shift on the front or back which the Tachi doesn't, maybe a rise or fall on the back too). But I wouldn't argue that either camera is better than the other, it's just a question of what you need or want (which unfortunately you probably don't really know right now since it's your first LF camera).

One thing to consider when buying new vs buying used is that if you buy used and eventually want another camera you should be able to sell the one you bought used for about what you paid for it. If you buy new you'll probably take a 20% or so hit when you sell. And no matter how much time and effort you expend in buying your first LF camera, it's a fact of LF life that most people eventually want to sell their first camera and buy something different.

[Gem Singer]

One other thing about the Tachihara, it does not have a Graflok sliders on the back, making it difficult to use a roll film back on the camera.

This limits the use of the Tachi to roll film backs that slide under the ground glass, such as the Calumet C2.

[coops]

I have the Tachy. 4x5 and rarely keep it folded in the carry case, always afraid the constant opening and closing may wear the bellows prematurely. Anyone had this experience?

[Jon Wilson]

I have the Tachy. 4x5 and rarely keep it folded in the carry case, always afraid the constant opening and closing may wear the bellows prematurely. Anyone had this experience?


I have had my Tachy for about 8 years and I have always keep it folded. I purchased it used. The bellows have not shown any undue wear, remain supple, and light tight. I especially love the gg on mine which is extremely bright. My back accepts the grafmatic "45" film holders. This has been a very fine light 4x5 which I can pack places.

Jon

[FredWilson]

Fred:

Why don't you check the for-sale section of this forum.

eddie listed a Tachihara for sale yesterday and it might still be available.

Bob G.

Bob,
I can't check the for-sale section yet. I just signed up on this site about a week ago and, it appears, you have to be a member for 30 days before you can access the for-sale section.


Fred

[letchhausen]

I own a Tachihara, I've taken it all over, industrial areas, into the mountains, woods etc. It's very lightweight and stable. I've used a Fuji 240 A on it since that lens is light and fantastically sharp. I would recommend one. I've also used it with a Horseman Roll film 6x9 back. I stick a piece of cardboard between the GG and the back so the little film box holder thing doesn't bang the GG. The spring back does rise high enough for the Horseman to slide under easily. When I was taking color classes I needed to shoot roll film for assignments so I used that quite extensively. Recently I got a deal on a used Ebony SV45U. It's obviously a nicer camera but I have to say that I feel that extra weight on my back. I don't own a car so I carry everything in a Lowepro backpack. I was also unpleasantly surprised to find that the Tachi's GG was brighter than the Ebony's. Someday I hope to make contact with Bill Maxwell to get a new screen for the Ebony.

So there's a lot to recommend the Tachihara. Also, Schneider makes a 350mm lens that comes with a top hat specifically to be used on bellows challenged cameras like the Tachihara or the Shen Hao. So that gives you another choice lens wise.

And I've had that bellows out in the rain and opened and closed that thing a lot and it looks like new. Though I do clean and take care of the camera.

[Kirk Fry]

I own a Tachihara, lightest 4x5 I own, but compared to the CC401, old SwissArca, Linhof, or the crown and speed it is a flapper in the breeze. I built a wooden stick with velcro on it and I have velcro on the front and back standard. After I get it set up I plop the stick down to hold the standards solid. This works fine. If you gotta have light this is it. K