Foma 8x10

[rich caramadre]

Anyone using Foma 8x10 film? I'm looking for a new film since t-max is gone. I have tried illford and just don't like the look I get with it. I see freestyle has Foma in 100 and 400, and Fotokemika Kfke 100. Any thoughs on these films? I shoot only outdoors, natural light, landscape type images. Thanks. Rich

[Jim Noel]

I use Foma, Arista EDU Ultra, FP4+ and HP5+ depending on the subject matter and image desired.
How do you print? If you make platinum or palladium prints you are going to have to do some extensive testing with developers to find one which will produce sufficient HL density. If you make salt or carbon prints Foma will not produce sufficient HL density in any developer I have tried.

If you make silver gelatin prints, you may like Foma. It will not produce the same image as T-Max because the crystal structure is different and the characteristic curve is significantly different. It, as well as FP4+, will produce better separation in the mid-tones than T-Max.

[jp]

I use Foma 100 in 8x10. You see lots of fomapan100 landscape stuff here if you check the image sharing forum, especially the waters edge. I use TMY2 in the other formats (35,120,4x5) and have some TMY2 8x10 in the freezer and on order with Canham for after the foma gets used up. I have no problem with Fomapan 100, but I am more apt to get the results I want by minimizing the film variety.

I only contact print or scan 8x10 negatives. I shoot fomapan 100 at iso 64 and develop in PMK or Xtol 1+2 depending on the scene and the desired outcome. The foma makes awesome silver contact prints and can make awesome cyanotypes depending on the subject. Ilford can make nice results too, but you can't cross it off till you've tried it with multiple developers.

[Michael Kadillak]

I'm looking for a new film since t-max is gone. Rich

T Max is not gone. It is alive and doing exceptionally well. Unfortunately, if you missed the 8x10 TMY Special Order from KB Canham that was discussed extensively here in the weeks past you will have to wait until the end of the year for the next offering. We are working on ULF in TMY as we speak.

[Jiri Vasina]

I use Fomapan 100 in 13x18cm size, and find it to be a very good film. Nice separation in the midtones, good tonality, negligible grain (I develop in Rodinal). It has bad reciprocity failure (kicking in at a mere 1s of exposure), but it's tolerable. I expose at EI 64, and am going to try exposing at EI 50.

I haven't used the Foma 400 in sheets, only in rolls. And I did not like it at all. But personal experience may differ...

Jiri

[rich caramadre]

Jim, I only pint on silver gelatin paper. Contacts or enlarge on to 11x14 paper. You say it has good mid-toes. What about the shadow detial? I've been shoting some tri-x 320 and it has a longish toe, so I need to give a bit more exposure. I really like the shadow detail I get with tmax 100, and the 400 has been quite good also. Maybe I should that I develope my negs in D76 1:1.
Thanks everyone for your input. I know this is a very subjective topic. But it helps to get others input to figure out a starting point.

Rich

[Vlad Soare]

Shadow detail is a matter of exposure. Rate it at ASA 50 and you'll get plenty of shadow detail. :)
Keep in mind that in 8x10" you'll probably use small apertures, which means that at ASA 50 your metered exposure times will be seconds and will become minutes after you account for the reciprocity failure. And correcting for reciprocity failure will make its inherently high contrast go even higher.
I used to like Fomapan 100 a lot, and I still do. It's great for its price, very consistent from batch to batch, no manufacturing defects. But in 4x5", where apertures of f/22-f/32 were the rule rather than the exception, its low speed and awful reciprocity behaviour made me switch to TMY. In 8x10", where f/64 is not uncommon, I expect the problem to be worse. I still use Fomapan 100 from time to time in medium format, because in medium format I shoot at larger apertures, so the speed and Schwarzshild effect are non-issues.

It's a good film. If price is an issue for you, then by all means give Foma a try.

[Michael Kadillak]

I use Fomapan 100 in 13x18cm size, and find it to be a very good film. Nice separation in the midtones, good tonality, negligible grain (I develop in Rodinal). It has bad reciprocity failure (kicking in at a mere 1s of exposure), but it's tolerable. I expose at EI 64, and am going to try exposing at EI 50.

I haven't used the Foma 400 in sheets, only in rolls. And I did not like it at all. But personal experience may differ...

Jiri

Can you comment on the quality control you have experienced with Foma 100 Jiri? Have you found it to not have any emulsion defects or other manufacturing issues that would cause a photographer to expose another sheet just to "be sure"?

Do you know if Foma 100 come in sizes larger than 8x10 such as 11x14 and 8x20?

Thanks

[Jiri Vasina]

Michael,

from all the sheets I have shot (several hundreds, not thousands) I have not had anything that I would ascribe to emulsion defects or manufacturing issues. True, I have had several scratches that could be from manufacture, but it's waaaay more likely the scratches were my fault.

I don't expose another sheet "to be sure" because of fear of problems with the film. But I do expose another sheet recently mostly because of "aperture bracketing" (with the details I sometimes shoot) or very slight composition changes. But that is a different issue.

As to the sizes larger than 8x10, I don't think they regularly cut larger sizes, but I think they might be willing to make a custom run - if there was sufficient order to back it... I don't know how large such an order would have to be, but I'd assume not hundreds of (50sheet) boxes, more like a few tens of boxes.

If there was a real interest (meaning if you wanted enough of the film, or there were a few people willing to participate), I might give them a call and try to persuade the factory... Actually, I'm awaiting arrival of a WholePlate camera and I was thinking of asking people here if they would be interested in having Fomapan 100 in Whole Plate size...

Jiri

[Michael Kadillak]

Michael,

from all the sheets I have shot (several hundreds, not thousands) I have not had anything that I would ascribe to emulsion defects or manufacturing issues. True, I have had several scratches that could be from manufacture, but it's waaaay more likely the scratches were my fault.

I don't expose another sheet "to be sure" because of fear of problems with the film. But I do expose another sheet recently mostly because of "aperture bracketing" (with the details I sometimes shoot) or very slight composition changes. But that is a different issue.

As to the sizes larger than 8x10, I don't think they regularly cut larger sizes, but I think they might be willing to make a custom run - if there was sufficient order to back it... I don't know how large such an order would have to be, but I'd assume not hundreds of (50sheet) boxes, more like a few tens of boxes.

If there was a real interest (meaning if you wanted enough of the film, or there were a few people willing to participate), I might give them a call and try to persuade the factory... Actually, I'm awaiting arrival of a WholePlate camera and I was thinking of asking people here if they would be interested in having Fomapan 100 in Whole Plate size...

Jiri

Thanks for the comments.

A prudent photographer regularly assesses the possibilities relating to sheet film because it is good to be diversified. Each company that manufacturers sheet film has a very unique set of cost and profitability targets that the general public is not privy to. As a result I like to spread the business around to the degree possible. If you have the opportunity to broach this subject with them that would be great. In the interim I hope to give the film a try.

Cheers!

[Pawlowski6132]

Anyone using Foma 8x10 film? I'm looking for a new film since t-max is gone. I have tried illford and just don't like the look I get with it. I see freestyle has Foma in 100 and 400, and Fotokemika Kfke 100. Any thoughs on these films? I shoot only outdoors, natural light, landscape type images. Thanks. Rich

Maybe it's your developer.

[ic-racer]

I shot 100 sheets of the Foma 100 last Summer. In the sunlight the Foma 100 was OK. However, I found that in dimly light shade in the woods etc, with f45, not enough photons reach the film to make any image in the shadows (severe reciprocity failure).

My list of things to try if I get any more Foma 100 are as follows:
1) Try the 400
2) Shoot just in sunlight
3) Open up a lot in the dark shade
4) Try uncoated lens with flare
5) Experiment with pre-flashing

[cdholden]

Can you comment on the quality control you have experienced with Foma 100 Jiri? Have you found it to not have any emulsion defects or other manufacturing issues that would cause a photographer to expose another sheet just to "be sure"?

Do you know if Foma 100 come in sizes larger than 8x10 such as 11x14 and 8x20?

Thanks

Michael,
Yes. In larger sizes, it was rebadged as Wephota last I knew. Wephota specialized in cutting, not manufacturing.
For awhile Geert was selling sheets in various sizes up to ULF (16x20 or 20x24, I forget). I got some 7x17 when it was available, but they also did 8x20/12x20... not sure if they still do though. I know sheetfilm.be hasn't been selling it for some time now.
Chris

[Jiri Vasina]

Chris,

AFAIK Wephota is NOT a rebadged Foma. Wephota has some connection with Orwo I think (it might be that Wephota bought the machinery/factory of Orwo).

I have shot both films (Wephota NP22 and Fomapan 100) and the films are sufficiently different to let me say it's impossible to be just a rebadged film (Wephota NP22 has a speed of EI 100, while Fomapan 100 is more close to EI 64-50. The film base is different, the antihallation layer is of different color, the films' response - spectral characteristics - is different too...)

Fomapan was/is rebadged as Arista.EDU Ultra.

Wephota is sold AFAIK only as Wephota.

[Jiri Vasina]

I shot 100 sheets of the Foma 100 last Summer. In the sunlight the Foma 100 was OK. However, I found that in dimly light shade in the woods etc, with f45, not enough photons reach the film to make any image in the shadows (severe reciprocity failure).

My list of things to try if I get any more Foma 100 are as follows:
1) Try the 400
2) Shoot just in sunlight
3) Open up a lot in the dark shade
4) Try uncoated lens with flare
5) Experiment with pre-flashing

If you don't get enough details in shadow, I'd ask what was the speed you are exposing the film at? (what ISO are you using for metering?) I'd highly recommend using speed of EI 64 (I use that), or EI 50 (Nana Sous Dias uses that) - and shorten your time accordingly to not block the highlights...

With Fomapan 400, those rolls I have shot, I had to rate the film as EI 250-200 to get the shadow detail I wanted. And forget about pushing the film to EI 640-800 (like I regularly do with HP5+) if you want any details in the shade...

Jiri

[Jay DeFehr]

I've been shooting Foma lately, and have been satisfied with my results. I've not seen any emulsion defects. I find it a real bargain.

[eddie]

been shooting thousands of sheets of various foma for yours. great stuff. no issues....well some that i caused damn dust, my finger prints, bad exposures, weird compositions.......oh! those are my defects!

funny thing.....i seem to have collected several hundred sheets of 8x10 kodak film.....so i guess i will be shooting that stuff for a while. :)

[Michael Kadillak]

Fomapan was/is rebadged as Arista.EDU Ultra.

Wephota is sold AFAIK only as Wephota.

So did I just pay Freestyle $139 for 50 sheets of Formapan 100 in 8x10 when I could have acquired 50 sheets of 8x10 @ $99 for the identical sheet film in Arista EDU ultra?

If I got a $40 lesson then maybe someone else can learn from this exercise without the extra expense.

[John Kasaian]

I use Arista.edu Ultra, which is rebadged Fomapan. It is nothing like Tmax, but it is a fine film in it's own right. If you are looking for a replacement for Tmax, check out Ilford Delta---IMHO that would come the closest.

[Michael Kadillak]

I use Arista.edu Ultra, which is rebadged Fomapan. It is nothing like Tmax, but it is a fine film in it's own right. If you are looking for a replacement for Tmax, check out Ilford Delta---IMHO that would come the closest.

I have some Delta coming in 5x7 as I took advantage of the recent Badger offering. I also use Efke 25 in 11x14 and 8x20 as it is stunning in the DR5 reversal process as well as an excellent negative film for prints. My freezer is full of everything from Super XX to TMY and just about everything in between - except Foma/Arista. That gap is being filled as we speak and I look forward to giving it a go.

[Jiri Vasina]

So did I just pay Freestyle $139 for 50 sheets of Formapan 100 in 8x10 when I could have acquired 50 sheets of 8x10 @ $99 for the identical sheet film in Arista EDU ultra?

If I got a $40 lesson then maybe someone else can learn from this exercise without the extra expense.

Michael,

it's not possible for me to lay hands on Arista EDU ultra film, but from all of the sources I have checked, and what I have read, Arista EDU ultra is Fomapan. (It would be kinda silly buying what I consider to be Fomapan 100 on another continent and then having it delivered to some 100km from the original factory, wouldn't it? :D ) So I'd think that you paid a little more for the nice box with Fomapan written on it :))))

Arista EDU (without the ultra) was rebadged Forte film, but the Hungarian factory is gone for several years.

Arista EDU ??"Pro"?? was Ilford FP4+ AFAIK...

(well, regarding that shipping and mistakes: I have bought 2 boxes of Fomapan 100 13x18cm in a local shop here for approximately ~56€, only to later find out I can buy the same Fomapan 100 in Germany for roughly ~45€... incl. shipping from Germany back to the Czech Republic... Worse than funny... :confused: )

Jiri

[rich caramadre]

Michael.

Are you using the Arista EDU Ultra 100 or 400? If it's the 100, dose it have the same reciprocity issues that Foma has that I've been reading about?

[mandoman7]

I have always had the impression that films the required a lot of reciprocity have a shelf at the lower end, such that with very low light situations, the lower values drop off even when some additional time is given. In general, it seems easier to get broad areas of deep blacks with images shot at lower EI's, and not so easy when there's a lot of light. I think that's good actually, to have that palette at your disposal, as long as you have some control with it.

Lovely work on your site, by the way, Jiri.

[Michael Kadillak]

Lessons in life sometimes come in unusual packages. As long as I learn from these exercises and make more informed decisions the second time around I have no problem with the process. Seems that we all can be exposed to these issues at times.

[Michael Kadillak]

Michael.

Are you using the Arista EDU Ultra 100 or 400? If it's the 100, dose it have the same reciprocity issues that Foma has that I've been reading about?

I just ordered some Foma 100 as I have not used this film previously. My research told me that the 100 speed film is the optimal place to start so I went with it.

[rich caramadre]

Michael,
Sorry, my last question was intended for John Kasaian. He said he was using the Arista EDU Ulltra.

[Drew Wiley]

From the published curves, Foma 100 and 400 are very different animals. And I'm beginning to wonder if 100 is just the former 200 more realistically labeled as to ASA.
This was a film with a very steep toe and capable of superb shadow separation, but
otherwise an unusual beast very prone to scratching (I'm convinced that what I got ahold of was scratched during packaging - so losing every other shot didn't save me money at all). I finally ended up with a few really good images which would have been
difficult for any other film, but it was so slow and idiosyncratic in many situations that
it was not proving practical for 8x10 use. The 400 version I tested was merely OK, and relatively disappointing compared to HP5 and even the earlier version of TMax400.
My two cents worth.

[Jiri Vasina]

Drew, it's not. Even the Foma 200 has a different response than Foma 100. Also, Foma 200 is said to have T-grain crystals IIRC...

In my opinion Foma 400 is more like a ISO 200 speed film, that can be pushed to EI 400, but even that is a push - with all the features of a film's push...

Jiri

[Michael Graves]

I use Fomapan 100 in 13x18cm size, and find it to be a very good film. Nice separation in the midtones, good tonality, negligible grain (I develop in Rodinal). It has bad reciprocity failure (kicking in at a mere 1s of exposure), but it's tolerable. I expose at EI 64, and am going to try exposing at EI 50.

I haven't used the Foma 400 in sheets, only in rolls. And I did not like it at all. But personal experience may differ...

Jiri

Jiri's experience mirrors mine identically. I acquired a collection of 13x18 holders and Freestyle was able to get a few boxes of Foma 100 for me. I'm finding I like that film better than my old standby HP5 if I have the light for it. At this time, I'm still taking 5x7 in HP5 and Foma in 13x18 and shooting whatever the subject dictates.

Foma roll film was inexcusably bad. A minor change in developing time skewed contrast, the film curls up into tight little coils when dry and it's a bitch to print. I gave away about fifteen rolls of it just to get it out of my hair. But when I run out of the sheet film, I'll order another few boxes if it's still possible.

[Jiri Vasina]

Michael,

Foma 100 in rolls is quite usable (like the sheets) and does not curl so much IMO.

Foma 400 in rolls does curl a lot. But I have had far worse films in that regard... Rollei Retro 400 being the worst so far... That one curls a lot even after months of being pressed flat in my archive... it was a nightmare to scan (because of the curl)... but the emulsion was way better than Foma 400... if only I could have inter-bred the films... :)

Jiri

[MIke Sherck]

Last spring I ordered some of Freestyle's Arista EDU Ultra in 8x10 and they backordered it. A couple of days later one of their reps called me to ask whether it would be all right if they sent me a box of Foma instead. "It's the same thing." were their own words.

Mike

[Michael Kadillak]

Last spring I ordered some of Freestyle's Arista EDU Ultra in 8x10 and they backordered it. A couple of days later one of their reps called me to ask whether it would be all right if they sent me a box of Foma instead. "It's the same thing." were their own words.

Mike

Live and learn. If I like this film I will not make this mistake again.

I realize that manufacturers regularly allow companies put their name on a host of products at Costco or Sams for example. In a niche market like this one all it does is point out that the manufacturers brand name is going to sit on the shelf given the alternative that costs much less.

[Wayne]

Does the sheet film curl? Boy that would really suck, huh?

[Vlad Soare]

No, the sheet film is nice and stiff, a pleasure to work with.
I never had any problem with Fomapan 100 and 200 in medium format. No curl whatsoever, they have always dried perfectly flat. Maybe I was just lucky, I don't know...

[Jiri Vasina]

No, I think only the Fomapan 400 (and most probably only in rolls) does curl a lot. The Fomapan 100 and 200 behave much better, no curl at all...

Jiri