Transporting 8X10 gear

[Randy]

Before I waste $80 on yet another of my many mistakes, any thoughts on using a hand-truck to transport my 8X10 gear (camera case, tripod, and film holder case) when I go off on an easy hiking trail, around old downtowns, etc?

Amazon has this for $79 shipped. It is lighter (nylon) than the steel tube models, cheaper than the aluminum models, and has 10" inflatable tires.

http://rsphoto.fileave.com/handtruck.jpg

[John Kasaian]

Not a good idea for off pavement---these are way too tippy when fully loaded..
I have an army surplus 5 gallon jerry can "cooler" bag. It will hold a 'dorff V8, 3 film holders, focusing cloth, two lensboards with lenses attached, meter, loupe, lens cleaning kit and filters wallet. It has a sling to carry over the (artheritic) shoulder leaving the other shoulder free for tripod duty. I think it cost about $17.

Ralph Barker recommends a baby jogger cart thingy.
Man, would that would be "uptown deluxe" transportation or what?:D

[Walter Calahan]

Baby jogging stroller. Works for me.

[jeroldharter]

A hand cart is not very good. IT will tire you out, is not very stable, difficult on stairs, generally awkward. Depending on how the weight of your gear is distributed, the "hitch weight" on your arms could be pretty heavy. Also, you have no place to store any loose items and the packing options are not very versatile.

I have tried numerous options in addition to the usual backpacks and carry cases. I tried a hand cart similar to the ones you listed. I tried a baby car seat carrier with caster wheels on which I could lash down camera bags, sort of like a table on wheels. But the best thing is a baby jogging stroller.

http://www.juniorbaby.com/images/products/ISTP01BA100.jpg

I bought an In-Step jogging stroller. It is relatively inexpensive as these things go. The build quality is pretty good. The inflatable tires are so easy to push. A fixed front wheel is better than a pivoting wheel (contrary to my initial impression). It hauls loads of gear and offers some weather protection. It is easy to carry along a small lunch cooler and water also.

It is not good for ice, snow, sand, or mud but what is? Also, you have to improvise to find the best way to carry your gear. My favorite setup for camera gear is an f64 view camera case like this:

https://www.badgergraphic.com/store/images/products/3477.jpg

It fits in the seat securely and is easy to work from without removing it from the stroller. Attaching a tripod is a work in progress for me but I manage. I should mention that baby strollers are permitted on airplanes so they are great to take along traveling. You should be careful about the size of your rental car (or vehicle in general) because the strollers can be somewhat awkward to store even when folded. Mine is much more compact with the front wheel removed. Good luck.

[Randy]

Jerold, have you used your setup off the sidewalks and paved roadways and onto the rocky trails?

My camera is large and heavy as far as 8X10's go, and old Folmer & Schwing. Right now I have it in one of those medium size suite cases with the small wheels that you see people pulling through airports. It fits perfectly in it and my two lenses are wrapped and inside the camera. Dark cloth, exposure meter, lupe, etc are in the outer zippered pockets. The film holders (9) are in their own separate case. All that is left is the tripod - an old surveyors tripod with a Majestic head.

Camera and lenses in case - 35 lbs
Film holders in case - 15 lbs
Tripod - 15 lbs

Will the jogging stroller carry my weight and do it in the gravel and rocks? I'm not going to drag this stuff up the side of a mountain but would like to take it for easy hikes on our local unpaved nature trails.
Will the jogging stroller handle the weight of my gear?

Thanks for your thoughts everyone.

[jeroldharter]

Jerold, have you used your setup off the sidewalks and paved roadways and onto the rocky trails?

My camera is large and heavy as far as 8X10's go, and old Folmer & Schwing. Right now I have it in one of those medium size suite cases with the small wheels that you see people pulling through airports. It fits perfectly in it and my two lenses are wrapped and inside the camera. Dark cloth, exposure meter, lupe, etc are in the outer zippered pockets. The film holders (9) are in their own separate case. All that is left is the tripod - an old surveyors tripod with a Majestic head.

Camera and lenses in case - 35 lbs
Film holders in case - 15 lbs
Tripod - 15 lbs

Will the jogging stroller carry my weight and do it in the gravel and rocks? I'm not going to drag this stuff up the side of a mountain but would like to take it for easy hikes on our local unpaved nature trails.
Will the jogging stroller handle the weight of my gear?

Thanks for your thoughts everyone.

I don't know if it will carry your weight. Perhaps a piggy back ride or a wheelchair would work? Just kidding.

Yes, mine would carry your weight, but I think that would be top end. You could get a double jogging stroller which is usually rated for 100 pounds I think.

Yes, unpaved nature trails are no problem. The wheels are like bicycle tires but with less weight than a bike would carry. So taking them on trails of mulch, gravel, dirt, grass, etc would be fine. Not so good with really soft surfaces or really big gravel like softball size stones. Just think of a bike. I have used mine in Zion, Bryce Canyon, Joshua Tree, and many other places. Somewhat problematic on trails with many stairs. They are manageable on stairs but 5-10 stairs rather than 200 for example. The stroller is also helpful at crowded lookouts because it takes up some space so people aren't crowding around your gear so much.

[Randy]

One last question Jerold - I am guessing there may be occasion where pulling your rig would be easier than pushing (up hill on rough terrain). Have you had to do that, pull the stroller backwards (behind you) so that the front wheel is now trailing? Does it function well like that?

[jeroldharter]

One last question Jerold - I am guessing there may be occasion where pulling your rig would be easier than pushing (up hill on rough terrain). Have you had to do that, pull the stroller backwards (behind you) so that the front wheel is now trailing? Does it function well like that?

I've never had to do that. It is almost always easier to push and I am not sure how stable it (or the gear) would be pulling it up hill. Going downhill, it has a wrist leash to keep it from getting away.

[Ed Kelsey]

How about one of these?

http://www.sherpacart.com/

[Ben Syverson]

Camera and lenses in case - 35 lbs
Ouch... Might I suggest a lighter 8x10 camera? Compared to the cost of film, the cameras are basically free, and if you can save yourself some hassle, why not?

A beater 2D will weigh in at less than half your current setup, and can be had for the cost of a family trip to the movies. Even a user Deardorff is 12 pounds, and only costs as much as 100 sheets of color film.

[R Mann]

Now for something a little different - take a look at:

http://www.myzigo.com

A combination bike/tricycle and stroller thing.

Or Google for the "Nordic Cab" which is a bike trailer/stroller/ski/dog sled!/hiking "thing" made in Norway.

[eddie]

what ben said.

a lighter camera. i carry my 8x10 century universal (9 pounds). one or two small lenses. and 2-3 film holders. if i am not far from the car then 2 at a time. you can always go back for more. camera mounted on tripod. (bogen 3021 / 3047) film holders in small back pack with lenses and Dark cloth. i can easily put the camera in the bag with the film holders. if it is too hard to walk with the mounted camera....it rarely is....

edit: if you must use your current set up....get a sherpa...errrr, i mean bring a strong friend or two! that trolley is going to suck on dead branches and off kilter inclines.....but will be perfect for some relatively flat pull....but will get tiresome fast with all your weight.

[John Powers]

Randy,
You might find this thread helpful.
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=10281&highlight=Jogger
My post is #12.
I carry either an 8x10 or a 7x17 and gear as much as four miles on trails and off. 7x17, tripod and head weigh 50 lbs. There is also a bag of lenses and 6 or 7, 7x17 film holders.

Enjoy.

John

[Randy]

Well, you makes your bed, you lays in it. I have had this old heavy camera for years. It functions well for me and it is in pretty good condition for its age. I have looked on ebay for a lighter folder but either they are much more than I can afford - and/or in worse condition than my camera. So, for the time being I'll have to use what I have.

Cost is a big factor for me (otherwise I would not be fretting over spending $80 for the handtruck with out the approval of you guys).

One more thought for your consideration:

http://rsphoto.fileave.com/wheelbarrow.jpg

$112 at my local hardware store. Remove the tub and fabricate a frame or case system of attaching all the gear. Granted, it would be something that would need some modification and would not be as portable as a jogger stroller but would be very pretty sturdy for the off-roading I want to do. I would just have to make sure it would fit in the back seat of my car (I could shorten the handles if necessary).

Thoughts?

[eddie]

After seeing the above I was thinking pulling that behind you... Like a horse cart....guess who tue horse is? :). If you keep the weight over the wheels it may work.

[Forrest Atkins]

Some hardware stores sell wheel barrel replacement parts so maybe you could find the frame sans tub. My vote however is a baby stroller found used in various places, the bay, craiglist, etc.

[John Kasaian]

A good pack mule rocks!

[John Koehrer]

I suspect the Sherpa cart has a pretty narrow track and a golf cart would be wider.
No not the electric one! The stroller works pretty well if you need to pull it, the mod you may have to make though would be a slightly higher handle if you want to pull it so it
would balance over the main axle.

[R Mann]

How about one of these? Kangaroo Bike - Converts from a bike to a stroller -

[joselsgil]

Have you looked at some of Stanley Tools portable tool chests? They are made of sturdy plastic and look like they can hold a lot of items. I am not too sure how they would handle rough terrain, but they look ok for hauling around when you have to park your vehicle a distance from your photo subject.

http://www.stanleytools.com/catalog_images/mid_res/033023R_mid_res.jpg

I was checking these tool chests out at wallyworld. They aren't too expensive. The only thing I would possibly change, would be the wheels. Maybe install taller wheels for more ground clearance.

I have seen two documentaries of photographers using a little trailer, while towing them behind their mountain bicycle. The amount of equipment that they load onto the trailers is amazing.

[Scott Walker]

Have you looked at some of Stanley Tools portable tool chests? They are made of sturdy plastic and look like they can hold a lot of items. I am not too sure how they would handle rough terrain, but they look ok for hauling around when you have to park your vehicle a distance from your photo subject.

http://www.stanleytools.com/catalog_images/mid_res/033023R_mid_res.jpg

I was checking these tool chests out at wallyworld. They aren't too expensive. The only thing I would possibly change, would be the wheels. Maybe install taller wheels for more ground clearance.

I have one of these, I bought it thinking it would be perfect for carying all of my fencing gear on the farm. I was wrong, the more weight you put into it the more impossible it becomes to use on anything other than smooth concrete. The tools I use for fencing weigh about half of what my 8x10 gear with a full complement of film holders does.
It is a very nice rolling box though and if you could adapt a set of say 20 inch bicycle tires and only raise the ground clearence by 3 or 4 inches you might have a winner

[Walter Jakubowski]

Check this out. Here is perhaps a great solution and flexible to most terrain and biking considerations. Unfortunately it is PRICEY!! The idea needs serious cost reduction...
www.monowalker.com

[Scott Walker]

Check this out. Here is perhaps a great solution and flexible to most terrain and biking considerations. Unfortunately it is PRICEY!! The idea needs serious cost reduction...
www.monowalker.com

The price isn't that bad, the top of the line Chariot jogging stroller is well over $1,000 once you add the accessories for hiking, cross country skiing, and cycling. It does look like it is well made.

[John Powers]

Check this out. Here is perhaps a great solution and flexible to most terrain and biking considerations. Unfortunately it is PRICEY!! The idea needs serious cost reduction...
www.monowalker.com

I would suggest the problem is that when you stop moving forward you still need to hold up the weight that is carried. The elimination of this problem is the advantage of the baby jogger. When you stop the bj the weight rests on the wheels.

John

[Steve M Hostetter]

You might look in a sporting goods store "Gander Mountain" for a deer cart . Has a big wheel base and is sturdy..

Myself, I just can't see using a cart but some guys like em. Something you might ask yourself is how often will it even be practical to use it?

Don't waste your $$ and figure out how to carry just what you need instead.!

[Rick A]

I use an old wheel chair that a friend gave me. I modified it and carry two 4x5 kits plus medium format gear and three tripods on it. It folds and fits in the back of my grand cherokee. I've used it around town, and on hiking trails designed for handicapped (I'm disabled) and I can sit on it when I'm tired. The locking brakes are a bonus, just lock them and start setting up without worrying if your gear is going to roll away.

[Cor]

This (http://bakfiets.nl/nl/) is what I use, the kids have grown too large, but it's still very useful for shopping and photo gear, strictly on the road though, but you can work out of the "trunk"..:)

Best,

Cor

[Scott Walker]

This looks very interesting for those of us that kayak/canoe

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg90/Beecool/KayakTrailer.jpg

I could see a few modifications being necessary, like a set of wheels and a hitch for towing behind your bike, maybe a backpacking/snowshoeing harness similar to what Chariot or the Monowalker use.

[jeroldharter]

Another interesting item:

http://www.mollymacpack.com/pack.html

http://www.mollymacpack.com/MMP%20and%20Cinches.jpg

[jeroldharter]

And another...

http://arrowheadequipment.webs.com/apps/webstore/products/show/971844

http://thumbs.freewebs.com/Members/viewThumb.jsp?fileID=119713514&size=large

[Dave Jeffery]

Randy,

The wooden extensions on the wheel barrow that go past the axle would need to be cut back as they don't have much clearance and are designed to hit the ground to dump the wheel barrow obviously. All you have then is the clearance below the axles.

Having the single front tire on a baby stroller seems as lot better for maneuvering over mixed terrain than the two wheels on the wheelbarrow.


Happy Trails!

[Rayt]

I just bought an 8x10! It is rather large at 13.5" wide so now I have a problem. I want to fly with it and don't want to check it in. However none of the commerically available backpacks can take a camera wider than 12.5" and small enough to take as carry on. The alternative would be to get a hard case and check it in. I was set on a backpack so I can easily walk with it but seems I should have considered this before I bought the camera. :(

[cosmicexplosion]

[QUOTE=jeroldharter;687113]And another...

http://arrowheadequipment.webs.com/apps/webstore/products/show/971844


i have been designing this one in my head for ages, someone beat me to it.


at least i know it works now!

[evan clarke]

Before I waste $80 on yet another of my many mistakes, any thoughts on using a hand-truck to transport my 8X10 gear (camera case, tripod, and film holder case) when I go off on an easy hiking trail, around old downtowns, etc?

Amazon has this for $79 shipped. It is lighter (nylon) than the steel tube models, cheaper than the aluminum models, and has 10" inflatable tires.

http://rsphoto.fileave.com/handtruck.jpg

What camera and lenses? I carry mine in a pack and it's actually lighter than my 4x5 kit with 3 lenses and 3 holders...Evan Clarke

[Randy]

Rayt, I have my 8X10 in one of those wheel cases you see all the people pulling behind them in the air ports. It fits perfectly. Just measure your camera and head to the store and find a case that it will fit inside. I think I paid less than $40 for mine.

[Rayt]

Randy, A regular roller case should work since there is no padding. I just have to wrap the camera in something. Thanks.

[Randy]

Well, I finished my 8X10 camera cart. Very simple. Fits in the back of my Subaru Forester with the back seats folded down. I have about $80 in it. Consists of two-wheeled wheelbarrow minus the tub. I mounted a ply-wood base across the handles and strap my lens case (three lenses), film holder case (9 holders), camera case, and small case for exposure meters, lupe, eye glasses, cable release, etc, etc. I then strap the tripod on top of the mess. It's not light. I am guessing the whole thing probably weighs well in excess of 60 lbs, which means I am probably holding about 30 pounds at the handles.
Today was my second outing with it. The first day I hauled it around a junk yard, got a flat tire, and wore my self to a frazzle. Today I took it along a hiking trail that runs along a creek (rocky and up/down hills). No flat tire but I still wore myself out...but, I am 50+, 20 pounds over weight, and out of shape.
It'll do for now :)

[Mark Sampson]

That's a great way to get back in shape. Use it all this season and you won't be 20 lb. overweight by November!

[Fred L]

Hey Randy,

If you move the wheels back, it might balance out better so the load is lighter for you at the handles.

[Uri A]

This is my baby (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqpXhxkZNQ8)

I mostly shoot urban, but have rolled over quite a few grassy knolls as well and it's very stable. Folds up in a flash, and if I am flying, it's only 11-12 pounds.

The video is hilarious - check it out just for the classic Aussie accents and the guy at 3:38 DANCING WITH HIS TROLLEY!! :D

[Scott Walker]

Check this out. Here is perhaps a great solution and flexible to most terrain and biking considerations. Unfortunately it is PRICEY!! The idea needs serious cost reduction...
www.monowalker.com

Thought I would reserect this thread. I have sent an e-mail to find out about availibility, shipping, etc for the Monowalker hikingtrailer.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg90/Beecool/233R3586.jpg

I would love to hear from anyone that has used one of these or something similar for wilderness packing.
It seems ideal for an 8x10 kit & 2 dozen holders plus a few days provisions. :)

[Joshua Dunn]

The Monowalker seems pretty cool. If I am reading their website correctly it converts from a trailer behind the bicycle to a trailer you can tow behind you as you walk (like the man in the photo). I use the Bob Ibex trailer (http://www.bobgear.com/ibex)behind one of my bicycles to tow around my 4x5 and 6x17 rigs. Although I have not tried it with my 8x10 I don’t see that as a problem.

-Joshua

[Daniel Stone]

Scott,

I'd reconsider carrying 24 8x10 holders in that thing, plus camping and camera gear... But i'm not a machine ginger with the 8x10 though...

[Scott Walker]

The Monowalker seems pretty cool. If I am reading their website correctly it converts from a trailer behind the bicycle to a trailer you can tow behind you as you walk (like the man in the photo). I use the Bob Ibex trailer (http://www.bobgear.com/ibex)behind one of my bicycles to tow around my 4x5 and 6x17 rigs. Although I have not tried it with my 8x10 I don’t see that as a problem.

-Joshua

That's what I got from the web site as well. My understanding is that you order it in the configuration you want and then add accessories to convert it into a bicycle trailer or large rigid frame backpack. It looks to me like it was originally designed as the backpack trailer and best suited for that.
The BOB trailer looks to be a very good unit, I will definitely keep it in mind if I ever decide to spend more time on my bike.




Scott,

I'd reconsider carrying 24 8x10 holders in that thing, plus camping and camera gear... But I'm not a machine ginger with the 8x10 though...


I know I carry to many holders and should just break down and use a changing bag in the field but I doubt I ever will. I think I'm addicted to dust free negatives :)

[jp]

Thought I would reserect this thread. I have sent an e-mail to find out about availibility, shipping, etc for the Monowalker hikingtrailer.

I would love to hear from anyone that has used one of these or something similar for wilderness packing.
It seems ideal for an 8x10 kit & 2 dozen holders plus a few days provisions. :)

Looks little different than a wheelbarrow for stability.

For winter use, I'd suggest a shappell Jet Sled.

[ljsegil]

Looks like a fabulous piece of gear until you see the price. Ouch! That's an 8x10 kit right there. But on the other hand if it will get the camera out of the house, where it does nobody any good....
LJS

[John Olsen]

I use an old Wildneress Experience soft suitcase with built in shoulder straps for my 8x10 Deardorff. I've tried wheeled arrangements, but encountering gravelly inclines, steps and muddy patches have convinced me that wheels don't work in the great outdoors. Fully loaded with a Gitzo on my shoulders the full packing is 60 lbs, which admittedly isn't a big encouragement for getting out there.

[Scott Walker]

Looks like a fabulous piece of gear until you see the price. Ouch! That's an 8x10 kit right there. But on the other hand if it will get the camera out of the house, where it does nobody any good....
LJS

It is indeed a bit pricey but when you are a days walk (or more) from civilization the quality of your gear is very important. I have been trying to weigh the cost differential between the Monowalker and the Dixon Roller Pack which is one fourth the cost. To me it appears that the Dixon is something less than one fourth the quality of the Monowalker but since no one in North America seems to inventory the thing it is just an opinion based on pictures and published specifications.

The design seems well suited to my needs since I hike and snowshoe with large heavy packs and with this single wheel pack trailer system (either brand) you only put 50% of the load weight on your body. That 50% is huge, especially when snowshoeing.

You do have a good point about getting the camera out of the house.....if it will get the thing to places that inspire me to photograph the price really is not an issue.

[Scott Walker]

I use an old Wildneress Experience soft suitcase with built in shoulder straps for my 8x10 Deardorff. I've tried wheeled arrangements, but encountering gravelly inclines, steps and muddy patches have convinced me that wheels don't work in the great outdoors. Fully loaded with a Gitzo on my shoulders the full packing is 60 lbs, which admittedly isn't a big encouragement for getting out there.

Thanks for the input. Have you tried any of the single wheel designs or have they all been the 2 wheel variety.
I agree 60+ lbs in a backpack is not good incentive to go walking in the mountains.

[John Koehrer]

I'd think the sherpa cart would be too narrow compared to the jogging stroller. Typically the JS will be around 2'+ I ididn't bother looking for specs on the Sherpa.

[Vaughn]

I have pushed a jogging stroller up many steep trails, up creek beds, across the sand, etc. It did tip over a couple of times. I did not have camera equipment but instead I had my three boys. Now weight-wise what do 3 three or fours year olds weigh -- I have forgotten (they are 14 yrs old now). Probably a minimum of 75 pounds.

And no, I did not tell their mom exactly where I went or that it tipped over a few times

The front wheel was fixed -- no problem, as mentioned earlier.

[Scott Walker]

I got a response from Kai Fuchs at Monowalker, he works full time and is out of the country until Feb 28, he is quality control for a bike company. So it will take a month or possibly 2 before I could get one if I decide to do so. John Kasaian has a mule for sale in the for sale section here.....maybe that would be a better idea. :p

Excerpt from the e-mail he sent me;

The Monowalker hikingtrailer is a project I do in my sparetime. Yes, I would still have one for you. The question is, when do you need it ? I have the parts in stock but assemble them piece by piece by order, because of lack of time.
Would be great to have an answer concerning your time schedule for tmrw. , so that I can react in case. If it would have time until 28th of February, it would be the best. Shipping time with DHL is 10 days.

Best regards

Kai Fuchs

[Robert Tilden]

Seems like a repurposed golf hand-cart might do the trick. They are often available used, are light, and fold up. Some have seats attached. You'd need to do some modification depending on your load...

[Graybeard]

I'd think the sherpa cart would be too narrow compared to the jogging stroller. Typically the JS will be around 2'+ I ididn't bother looking for specs on the Sherpa.

My experience with the Sherpa Cart is that it is prone to tipping if pulled over rough ground. It is quite a bit more stable when pushed. A wider wheekbase would make it more stable.

[Jim Noel]

I have a collapsible wagon about the size of a large "Little Red Wagon". It easily carries my 7x17 with holders and the Otto tripod.
Prior to finding this I had considered a jogging stroller but soon decided that a game carrier from Cabelas was far superior and cheaper. The game carriers have large bicycle style wheels designed for the rough terrain encountered when transporting game.

[Trigeek]

I recently purchased a Pelican case for travel, which got me to thinking about the whole camera transport question. I really like the case in that when I open it everything is accessible. When I wear my backpack I have to unload it to get at things. I know that there are backpacks like the Kelty Redwing that open in the back, but I have never found these to be comfortable for me. I prefer a pack like the Osprey line. Seems to distribute the load better, though they are only available in a top loading versions.

Anyway, for walking on a trail or terrain that is not too vertical or overly rocky, I have been tinkering with modifying a golf pull cart like one of these:

http://www.discountgolfworld.com/bag-boy-m-330-golf-pull-cart-p2359?man=bagboy&model=m330&id=w2733&utm_source=GoogleBase&utm_term=m330&utm_campaign=bagboy&utm_medium=comparison

I don't think that it would be all that hard to modify this to mount the case, and if I get one with large wheels that have a soft tire on them, it may help protect the gear. Can even mount the tripod on it. They seem stable enough given their wheelbase. Any thoughts?

[jeroldharter]

The challenge is getting the weight centered over the axle so you don't wear your arms out. You might have better luck with a jogging stroller.

[John Kasaian]

A kindly long ears, tehama tree with decent rigging, a lash rope, manty and good set of panniers can get your 8x10 kit into some grand places, and with style!:D

[neil poulsen]

Seems like a repurposed golf hand-cart might do the trick. They are often available used, are light, and fold up. Some have seats attached. You'd need to do some modification depending on your load...

This is what I fixed up. I fastened a base onto the center column. I can put different attachments on it, depending on which outfit I'm using. Each outfit is in a backpack, so I can just strap it onto the cart. Large, cushioned wheels that are spread fairly wide for stability. Light, and folds easily into a trunk.

I only have three 8x10 lenses. So if needed in rough terrain, I can load the 8x10, lenses, and a few holders into my backpack, and carry the tripod.

[Trigeek]

I missed the Robert Tilden comment... sorry Robert. Getting the load over the wheels would just be a matter of a little trial and error. You want the load just to the rear of the wheels to assure the unit sits properly when you take your hand off of it, but not be too heavy to keep level when walking.

Neil, I like your approach. If you want to go off-trail in rough terrain, you could fold up the cart and hide it behind a rock or bush and then carry the load in the pack. Which now brings me back to my first problem with top loading packs.

[thomasfallon]

Best cart I have found. Goes on the beach. Goes up and down stairs.

http://www.beachstore.com/Beach-Products/Wheeleez-Beach-Carts?utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=ac_carts&utm_source=bing&utm_term=wheeleez+cart

[irwinhh]

Off road? A baby stroller - one with the big wheels that some use to Jogg with their children works great - look for used on ebay. Camera, film holders, lens bag and tripod it all fits!