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Fourtoes
10-Sep-2010, 00:58
I recently acquired this MPP camera.

I think its a Mark III model but it has red leather body with black bellows.
The only text on it is across the top of the body - Micro Precision Products Ltd England.

It has a Wray Lustrar lens 4.5 and a compur shutter.

It in pretty good condition if its a Mark III. The MPPusers website says this is the most commonly seen model. I've seen plenty of VII and VIII around but rarely a III and never a red one.

I've emailed MPPusers club but just wondered if anybody one here has any other thoughts.

Fourtoes
10-Sep-2010, 01:31
I really should be less impatient.

David from MPP users club just emailed me to say the serial number is behind the rotating back.doh.

This is a 1285 - Mark I starts at 1001 and last Mark III ends with 2260.

So its one of those then but its still red leather/ette which I've not seen before.

dustypixie
12-Sep-2010, 10:19
Oo that's a pretty unique looking thing! I've not seen a red MPP before, thanks for sharing the pics and info!

davkt
17-Oct-2010, 04:04
Think the red one was a marketing tweak to make them more attractive studio cameras

IanG
17-Oct-2010, 04:32
Not when this one was made, a few later MPP's yes. This camera's currently being sold online :D

Ian

gari beet
17-Oct-2010, 06:24
£300 starting bid!!!!! is it me or is the price of LF stuff going up on
this site? even the junk!
Actually I have one of these, somewhat more sober I may add. perhaps it's time to let it go:rolleyes:

Gari

IanG
17-Oct-2010, 06:47
MPP's have reached a bit of a cult status in the UK and sell for more than their true value in comparison to other cameras on ebay. But at the same time press camera's in general fetch much higher prices in the UK than the US.

So don't be surprised if it sells for that price.

Ian

davkt
17-Oct-2010, 07:01
Yep, I've been looking around on ebay for bits I could put together into an LF pinhole camera with and was somewhat stunned by the price of MPPs. Bought mine on there about 3 1/2 years ago, working perfectly complete with 2 lenses for around £150, seems to be double that for some without a lens and no assurance given as to bellows or mechanical functionality.

IanG
17-Oct-2010, 08:10
Some of the UK photo suppliers sell MPP's for closer to their more practical worth which is £150-£200.

If you buy a kit with a couple of lenses etc you can find them on Ebay at much more reasonable prices. I was looking for one for quite a while then changed my mind as I've enough cameras to finish restoring or get missing parts for to get functioning :D

In many cases it seems to be people who've never used one and very often never seen one in the flesh who pay the high prices, but then Pacemaker Speed & Crown Graphics sell for 2-4 times US prices.

Ian

engl
17-Oct-2010, 09:44
MPP's have reached a bit of a cult status in the UK and sell for more than their true value in comparison to other cameras on ebay. But at the same time press camera's in general fetch much higher prices in the UK than the US.

So don't be surprised if it sells for that price.

Ian

Which are these other cameras compared to which the MPP is selling for "more than their true value"?

I'm curious since I bought a MPP mk7 about two months ago, in excellent mechanical and cosmetic condition, for 300£ including a roll film back and 135/4.7 lens. I think I have looked at all options for an affordable field camera, such as the Speed/Crown/Super, Horseman, Wista, B&J, Busch, Meridian, and for me MPP seemed to be the best option. Others were lacking in quality, movements or were too expensive.

Edit: actually I paid less, 266£, and that is including VAT (if I buy from US, I have to add 27% VAT+customs on top of the sale+shipping cost...

davkt
17-Oct-2010, 09:50
Yep they all look to gone up quite a bit over the last 3 years or so engl. I know when I was searching I looked at all those you mention and as it is a camera that gets carted about to some less than camera friendly places went with the MPP as it seemed the most robust.

IanG
17-Oct-2010, 11:13
Which are these other cameras compared to which the MPP is selling for "more than their true value"?

I'm curious since I bought a MPP mk7 about two months ago, in excellent mechanical and cosmetic condition, for 300£ including a roll film back and 135/4.7 lens. I think I have looked at all options for an affordable field camera, such as the Speed/Crown/Super, Horseman, Wista, B&J, Busch, Meridian, and for me MPP seemed to be the best option. Others were lacking in quality, movements or were too expensive.

Edit: actually I paid less, 266£, and that is including VAT (if I buy from US, I have to add 27% VAT+customs on top of the sale+shipping cost...

Well you'll notice I said MPP's fetch more realistic prices as a kit, and that's exactly what you bought, take out the Roll film back and Xenar (a guess as it's f4.7) which would be roughly £120 or more if bought separately, then that leaves £146.

On that basis my realistic comparative price of £150-£200 for an MPP is about right especially as the Mk VII is the best model followed by the Mk VIII.

So this much earlier model is roughly twice the price you paid, although it's possibly been restored.

My rough comparison is Speed & Crown Graphics, reasonable condition prices (often with a lens), US $150-$300 (£95 -£180), MPP's Mk VII £150-£200, Linhof £300 minimum. Things like Super Graphics and the Toyo, Rittrek/Wista's etc vary wildly in price you can be lucky and pay £300 usually more though.

I've left out Busch Pressman's and Meridian's as they are less common and the Pressman has a snmall lens board & is a pain with modern WA lenses.

You made a Typo, total Duty & VAT on an camera or lens (& postage) imported from the US is around 21% at the moment, I was lucky and paid none on my 3 Graphics and also Busch Pressman.

So you did exactly the right thing in waiting and getting a good fair priced deal. My comments were more about the rather high UK prices some people are selling for on ebay.

Ian

davkt
17-Oct-2010, 11:16
You made a Typo, total Duty & VAT on an camera or lens (& postage) imported from the US is around 21% at the moment, I was lucky and paid none on my 3 Graphics and also Busch Pressman.


And don't forget the Parcel Force/DHL/UPS etc ransom fee once they have paid the tax on you behalf, can easily add a few more percent!

Fourtoes
17-Oct-2010, 13:23
Yep I know £300 is a bit cheeky but you never know. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

engl
17-Oct-2010, 14:02
Well you'll notice I said MPP's fetch more realistic prices as a kit, and that's exactly what you bought, take out the Roll film back and Xenar (a guess as it's f4.7) which would be roughly £120 or more if bought separately, then that leaves £146.

On that basis my realistic comparative price of £150-£200 for an MPP is about right especially as the Mk VII is the best model followed by the Mk VIII.

So this much earlier model is roughly twice the price you paid, although it's possibly been restored.

My rough comparison is Speed & Crown Graphics, reasonable condition prices (often with a lens), US $150-$300 (£95 -£180), MPP's Mk VII £150-£200, Linhof £300 minimum. Things like Super Graphics and the Toyo, Rittrek/Wista's etc vary wildly in price you can be lucky and pay £300 usually more though.

I've left out Busch Pressman's and Meridian's as they are less common and the Pressman has a snmall lens board & is a pain with modern WA lenses.

You made a Typo, total Duty & VAT on an camera or lens (& postage) imported from the US is around 21% at the moment, I was lucky and paid none on my 3 Graphics and also Busch Pressman.

So you did exactly the right thing in waiting and getting a good fair priced deal. My comments were more about the rather high UK prices some people are selling for on ebay.

Ian

Okay I see, I did not notice the later message, but the message I replied to was about comparing MPP prices to those of other cameras. MPP cameras seem like bargains to me compared with paying total 200-250£ for an imported Crown Graphic (which is the camera I had before).

About VAT, actually, Im not in the UK but Sweden. We have a higher VAT here, 25%. Customs is another 2-3%, to the total is around 27%. This will be added to the final cost (including shipping) whenever buying from outside of Europe, but I have never had anything added when buying from eBay sellers in Europe.

IanG
18-Oct-2010, 01:11
The £ seemed to imply you were in the UK, apologies :D

Juggling the Vat/Import duties is getting worse. the UK's set for a 2.5% rise at the end of the year.

With your Vat even higher it becomes a more critical factor.

Ian

Fourtoes
19-Oct-2010, 02:16
Didnt sell, oh well.

bbjorkum
19-Oct-2010, 03:34
I'm pretty sure the red leather on your camera is not the original one. It looks rather rough compared to the finish these cameras usually have.

.-) Bjarte

IanG
19-Oct-2010, 05:47
Didnt sell, oh well.

It's difficult selling to get a good price. Some MPP's get listed with low starting prices and fetch well over £300, it all depends who's looking and bidding.

I was given some MPP dark-slides a couple of years ago, I asked where the camera was and got told it had been given away no-one wanted them any more :D

Ian

Fourtoes
19-Oct-2010, 08:51
Bjarte - actually the leather/ette covering is in very good condition and is far from rough.

Ian - yep totally agree, just thought I'd chance my arm at that price. I relisted it as a lower ish buy it now with offers. I'm in no rush so if it sells it sells.