Portrait lens on 4x5

[pound]

hi all

I very new to LF and got a Nikkor 100mmW on a Toyo View 45Cx. This lens is great but it did not allow me to explore much movements. (or I may be doing things wrongly). So I am ready to looking for another lens primarly for portrait uses.

What should I look out for ? read elsewhere in the forum that I should care about the maximum bellows length when looking for a longer focal mength lens ? I check toyo site and there is a line that said "Max. Extension 445mm". is this what they are talking about?

Lastly would Nikkor 300mm M lens a good choice in terms of weight? the camera seems light enough and I do not want a heavy lens to make it front heavy.

Thanks a lot.

[Peter Gomena]

A 210 or 240mm lens is a good portrait length on 4x5.

Peter Gomena

[Armin Seeholzer]

It depends for what kind of portrait. All lenses from 135-300mm can be fine, if you know what are you doing and why!

Cheers Armin

[eddie]

i like longer lenses for portrait work. so i like 250 and 300 mm lenses on 4x5.

your max bellows is 445. so a 300mm lens will be using most of the bellows at or near portrait distances. (the closer you are to the model the more bellows you need. and the bigger the model is on the film. so tight head shots require more bellows)

keep an eye out for a 210-250 as mentioned above. KEH.com has some great deals on shuttered lenses in that range. look for one in a copal shutter. most will be either copal 0 or 1 for your application.

i just looked. you can get some for less than 150$.

eddie

[Ari]

I am very partial to the 210 wide-open for portraits, but as I've been traveling for the last three months, I've been using a Rodenstock 127mm on my converted Polaroid 110, and it does a great job.
When I shot only Hasselblad, my normal portrait lens was the 50mm, or sometimes the 80mm with a Proxar.
Try a few different FLs before buying, if possible, and learn to appreciate the subtleties of each.
Good luck.

[rdenney]

Some issues:

1. A full-face portrait on 4x5 will require approximately 1:3 macro--12" of head will be around 4" on the film. The distance from the lens's rear nodal point to the subject will be three times the distance from the rear nodal point to the film, and the math says the rear nodal point will therefore be 1-1/3 times the focal length of the lens from the film.

So, for a 300mm lens, you'll need 400mm of bellows extension. That's for a lens where the rear nodal point is close to the lens board. Thus, a camera with a 440mm extension should be able to a handle a conventional 12" lens (315mm) at that magnification.

2. If you desire narrow depth of field, you'll want a lens in the f/5.6-f/6.3 range, with reasonable performance wide open.

3. The main advantage of telephoto designs is that their rear nodal point is in front of the lens, which means they need less bellows draw for a given subject distance. A telephoto design might allow as much as a 400mm lens for a full-face portrait. But they tend to be slower.

4. If you want to carry the camera on your back a long way, a process-type or telephoto lens with an f/9 maximum aperture will be smaller and lighter. But, see No. 2 above.

5. Beyond the above, lens design doesn't matter unless you have particular demands on the appearance of the background when it is out of focus.

6. You won't use much in the way of lens movements for portraits, unless you have an exceptionally patient sitter.

7. The faster the lens, the bigger and heavier it will be. 300mm f/5.6 plasmats like the Symmar and Sironar use a Copal No. 3 shutter and they are very large and heavy. 12" tessars like the f/6.3 Kodak Commercial Ektar and its imitators use an Ilex No. 4 shutter. If you don't want a big, heavy lens, but you do want selective focus, consider something shorter. Also 300mm lenses are popular for 8x10 users and therefore get higher prices.

8. The fastest inexpensive and available lens of shorter focal lengths is something like the 8-1/2" (215mm) Ilex Paragon, f/4.5. It is quite good for portraits, and your camera could focus it at 1:1 if you just want a picture of the sitter's nose and one eye. It is also big and uses an Ilex No. 4, so you may not want it.

9. Fast, long, light: Pick two.

10. For 3/4, full-length, or environmental portraits, the required bellows extension is pretty close to the focal length of the lens. Most large-format portraits I see are more like this, and tight head shots seem to be more often done with smaller formats just as a matter of practicality.

Rick "thinking tight head shots are not the usual approach to portraits with large-format cameras, because of the above" Denney

[eddie]

Some issues:



So, for a 300mm lens, you'll need 400mm of bellows extension. That's for a lens where the rear nodal point is close to the lens board. Thus, a camera with a 440mm extension should be able to a handle a conventional 12" lens (315mm) at that magnification.



Rick "thinking tight head shots are not the usual approach to portraits with large-format cameras, because of the above" Denney

all good points. while the camera may handle the 300mm lens using a view camera at it's full (or close to) extension has its own challenges. so while a 300 may work i would say it is not optimum for the OP at this time.

i love tight head shots on LF. if you use a longer lens (300 on 4x5) you get a bit more DOF as you are not focusing quite as close to get the head to fill the frame. and if you are shooting film (as opposed to collodion) you can stop down a bit to get the important features you want in focus.

have fun

[pound]

thanks to all who responded. Quite a lot of information you have given me and I will need some time to digest them and of course to check out keh.com and ebay.

Long, quick, light. I guess i will go for long and light. Hopefully light on weight and wallet:)