Manfrotto 400, 405, 410 geared heads

[numnutz]

Hi - I wish to by a geared head for my 4 x 5 Gandolfi and 8 x 10 Deardorff cameras to put on top of a Berlebach Tripod.

I had discounted the Manfrotto 410 as it is rather lightweight for the Deardorff and I thought about the Manfrotto 405, but I have heard that they, both the 405 and the 410, suffer from wear as the gearing is only made from nylon. Can anyone confirm this? The nearest alternative is the Manfrotto 400, however this is a bit more than I wanted to spend - does this have nylon gears as well?

Also there is a Majestic, I really have do a bit more research on these. The price seems to be OK but they look really heavy.

The only other decent geared head I have found is the Multiflex http://photoclam.en.ec21.com/MultiFlex--4530072_4521844.html although I feel this is going to be far, far too expensive for me, and as they don't reply to their e-mails I don't really want to send them money.

Any suggestions or help anyone can give will be welcome.


nn :)

[Paul Kierstead]

I don't know what the material is, but I'm willing to bet you'll get a lot of years of service from one of the manfrotto's before it wears out.

The 410 is too light for 8x10, IMO. It is good for field type camera for 4x5, but found the high center of gravity on a heavy monorail makes it iffy for that. Just my experience.

I have a Majestic gear head. It is bulletproof, dead steady and heavy as hell. Great studio head, might be ok out of the trunk, you wouldn't want to pack it.

In my observation, many or most 8x10 users tend to use something like a double tilt head or perhaps 3-way head.

[ljsegil]

Haven't used the 405, but found the 410 couldn't handle an 8x10 with much extension. Pick up a used 400, can hold a boulder still, but weighs as much as the boulder. Recommended if you're not traveling far, but also requires heavy duty legs to match it.
LJ

[Brian Ellis]

I used the 410 with several different cameras weighing in the 3 to 6 pound range for about 9 years. I never noticed any excessive wear. However, I agree with others that the 410 isn't sturdy enough for most 8x10 cameras.

[Capocheny]

The 400 head is a great piece of equipment but, IMHO, it's really meant for usage in a studio as opposed to being lugged around out in the field.

Both the 405 and 410 are nice heads but the 410 is far too light for your Dorff.

For your Gandolfi 4x5... either head will work more than adequately.

I had the Majestic head with the big supporting plate... it's also not the lightest head in the world but will hold the Dorff without any issues. At the end of the day, I went with the Arca Swiss B2 head and carbon fiber Gitzo legs for my Dorff 8x10.

Cheers

[numnutz]

Thank you all for your observations

nn :)

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

I know I am coming late to the party here.

I have a 410 head which I use for 4x5. The shop that sold it to me told me that if I were to get much into 8x10 I'd eventually want a bulkier head. Since I am doing a lot of packing gear into shoots I went with the lighter-weight lighter-duty model for now.

It's a real nice piece of kit.

[vinny]

I didn't have my 410 for more than three years before it showed sloppy gearing. I loved using it though, nothing quite like it.

[numnutz]

I eventually purchased an almost new 400 head from the auction site It is extremely substantial and as ljsegil comments:
can hold a boulder still, but weighs as much as the boulder The gears used are Brass on Aluminium on the others - the 405 and 410, the gears are nylon against Aluminium.

I do prefer using it as against a simple pan tilt type of head especially with the Deardorff...

Thank you all for your comments.

nn :)

[GSX4]

Love my 410 with my chamonix 45-1N and some fairly big petzval's but would not consider it a suitable fit for any 8x10.... Especially my Kodak 2D which is a boat anchor! You might get by with something light like a Chamonix 8x10, but still think this head is too light a duty for even that.

[dave_whatever]

Word on the street is the 410 can be tightened by an allen key on each axis behind the labels if/when the gears eventually gets slack. Pretty sure the gears are available from manfrotto as spares too. All in all I don't think its a reason not to try one. There's basically nothing else anywhere near that price or weight that does the same job. Bearing in mind the arca cube is about an order of magnitude more expensive.

[jim kitchen]

I use a Manfrotto 400 with my 8X10 field camera, and I would not leave home without it... :)

The geared movements are solid in any weather, the 400's geared tension can be adjusted with an Allen Key, and the 400's quick release plate can be compressed tightly without fear of movement. My only complaint happens to be associated with the protruding rotating knobs, since they are prone to modification when the tripod accidentally falls against the ground without the camera body attached, as you lean the tripod against the side of the truck. The knobs find the pavement's hard surface without hesitation, bending ever so slightly and enough to annoy me, and landing face down like a peanut butter sandwich falling on the floor. Such a pain in the butt...

jim k

[Brian Ellis]

I used a 410 for many years with a 4x5 Linhof Technika V and Master Technia (about 7 pounds with lens and film holder) and it worked well and is still going strong. But even though I'm a big fan of "the lighter the better" when it comes to tripods I never even thought to try my 8x10 Deardorff on it.

[Vaughn]

...as you lean the tripod against the side of the truck. The knobs find the pavement's hard surface without hesitation, bending ever so slightly and enough to annoy me, and landing face down like a peanut butter sandwich falling on the floor. Such a pain in the butt...

jim k

It happens with Ries heads, too.:o

[mikebarger]

I've use my 410 with my Zone VI 4x5 and it works well. However, it was not up to the task with a Sinar F. I think the camera being so far above the mounting surface made the difference.

Mike

[Mark Stahlke]

For the record, I always use a 410 with my Canham 8x10 Lightweight Wood Field. This camera weighs about 8 or 9 pounds sans lens. I find the 410 works just fine with it.

[vinny]

Word on the street is the 410 can be tightened by an allen key on each axis behind the labels if/when the gears eventually gets slack. Pretty sure the gears are available from manfrotto as spares too. All in all I don't think its a reason not to try one. There's basically nothing else anywhere near that price or weight that does the same job. Bearing in mind the arca cube is about an order of magnitude more expensive.

Nope. I sent mine in to bogen after that didn't work. They "fixed" it but I saw no difference and moved on to other heads.

[mandoman7]

I have a 410, the "jr", that I like a lot. The geared movements are great, but they add a little weight and the quick release system does have a little wobble. I like it, though, and have used it with an 8x10 a few times, waiting for things to settle before firing the shutter (!).

My other head, though, a gitzo G1570 when tested didn't really hold all that more steady during the firing of the shutter. By tested I mean the water glass on the camera method. Once a holder was inserted and things settled, there was no more vibration showing with the 410 than with the gitzo and its much larger base plate.

I guess I'm saying that I'm still shopping for a good 8x10 head myself. I like Kitchen's 400 model, but is there a more modestly priced option that everyone likes?

[Jan Pedersen]

I use a 410 head with my 8x10 Chamonix and have used that combo for two and a half year, works fine just need to twist the quick release locks a little counter clockwise and it is nice and tight

[dsphotog]

I have a 410, I use it with a Deardorff V8, no problems, but I think it's about maxxed-out.
I've also used a Majestic head on a studio stand, works great, I don't want to carry it.
I'd like to see a 405, but $500 for a head is kinda steep for me.

[toyotadesigner]

Just ask the dealer to open a 405 head, or send a mail to Manfrotto to clarify if these heads feature nylon gears. The 410 definitely features metallic gears. First thing I've done was disassembling the head and greasing the gears with Lithium Grease. That way I figured out that Manfrotto only put a tiny bit of grease to the top part of the gears. After the treatment the head is running smooth as silk.

[Noah A]

I'm sick of fighting with my ballhead to level the camera so I'm in the market for a geared head. I've used Majestics in the past (when I was shooting 8x10) but they're huge and only geared in one direction.

If anyone has used both the 405 and 410--is it worth the extra weight to go with the 405? I now shoot 4x5 with a relatively small camera (wista VX) but I sometimes do long exposures and night work, and I often work in windy conditions.

[Peter De Smidt]

I've used both. I'd go with the 410.

[dsim]

Both the 410 and 405 are suitable.

[Jeremy Graves]

I have both the 405 and 410 heads.

For your purpose I would go with the 405, buy it once and be done with it.
I've had mine for 5 years with no problems. I use the smaller 410 for 35mm DSLR work and it works but it isn't as smooth as the 405. I do find the 410 to be sloppy after a few years of daily use in architectural photography.

I take the 405 outside on a regular basis to photograph landscape and it is easy to operate with gloves and still be precise, I can't say that about the 410 with it's small knobs.

[Kirk Gittings]

I do find the 410 to be sloppy after a few years of daily use in architectural photography.

I haven't found this problem and I use the 410 for everything from 4x5 to DSLR. If it does loosens up there are some easy adjustments.

[Noah A]

Thanks for the advice. I'm now shooting with a slightly bigger camera--a Linhof Technikardan. Sounds like the 410 would still be sufficient, but I may try to check both heads out in person. The 405's larger knobs sound helpful. But the added size and weight would be the tradeoff of course...

[Richard Wasserman]

I've been using a 410 for about 3-4 years and really like it. I use it with a Horseman FA and an RB67—it's solid and smooth.

[perfectedmaya]

I haven't found this problem and I use the 410 for everything from 4x5 to DSLR. If it does loosens up there are some easy adjustments.

Hi

i am thinking to get a gear head for my Sinar F. Other recommend me to get a 405 at least.

Hi Kirk, how heavy is your setup? u think 410 is ok for Sinar 4x5 setup?

i have an good offer for an used 400, it is cheap but it is too heavy i think.

[Kirk Gittings]

I guess both my 4x5s are pretty light, a Phillips and a Calumet wide field.
Maybe someone else can comment-Richards Horseman is a better comparison.

[Peter De Smidt]

With wide lenses, it should be ok, but I wouldn't use a Sinar F on a 410 with any longer lenses, or for macros, or out in the wind... (Mind you, I really like the 410, just not for the purposes mentioned.)

[Sevo]

With wide lenses, it should be ok, but I wouldn't use a Sinar F on a 410 with any longer lenses, or for macros, or out in the wind... (Mind you, I really like the 410, just not for the purposes mentioned.)

Been there, done that. The Sinar F in itself is far more vibration prone than the 410 - that combination won't increase the issues visibly. But it would be pointless to use a P (or any other very rigid camera) to be more wind safe and then put that up on a 410.

[rdenney]

think 410 is ok for Sinar 4x5 setup?

No. I have mounted a Sinar F on a 410, and it was noticeably more wobbly than the same camera on a Sinar tilt-head. The head was new. The plate for the 410 is not big enough for the Sinar rail clamp, and I made an Arca-plate adapter by bolting the Manfrotto plate to a Kirk Arca-style clamp. I used two 3/8" bolts and that was not the source of any wobble. But it reinforces the point that a Sinar and a 410 are not easy partners. Since getting the tilt head, I've discovered I don't really need geared tripod head movements.

Rick "who really ought to sell that 410" Denney

[Peter De Smidt]

The plate for the 410 is not big enough for the Sinar rail clamp,

Yeah, Rick is right, as the screw on the 410 plates is off-set.

If you have a Sinar round rail camera, get a Sinar pan/tilt head.