Some Soft Focus Lens Sales Information

[CCHarrison]

As part of my series on Soft Focus Lenses ( see www.antiquecameras.net ), I have been collecting completed sales data, mostly from ebay, for the classic Large Format Soft Focus Lenses.

Data is here: http://www.antiquecameras.net/softfocuslenssales.html

Thanks,
Dan

http://www.antiquecameras.net/images/600_psvq.jpg

[Richard K.]

PM sent re buying :rolleyes: :D

[Richard K.]

Thanks for this, Dan. Excellent resource.

[Steven Tribe]

Interesting!
There was a mint coated Universal Heliar (420mm) in this time period which was sold for $5.500.
200483346454.
Surprised there were no Port-lands.
Do you want tips about others in this time frame?

[imagedowser]

There was a Universal Heliar 360mm f4.5 sold on this site the end of June....

[CCHarrison]

If anyone has sales data they would like to forward, thats great. My searches on ebay dont catch every lens, so any I missed are appreciated. Please email data to dcolucci AT aol.com

Thanks
Dan

[Steven Tribe]

Just as useful as "condition" would be indication of BIN sales. As we all know, these are often above market forces price levels - and sometimes even below!

[Steven Tribe]

There are two other problems about non-e**y sales:

European auction houses often sell groups of lenses as one lot - even when one of these should have had a separate listing as they represent more than 50% of the lot value.

Items sold here usually end up with PM's and the agreed price is often not available - especialy with those that start under "wanted".

[CCHarrison]

Steven,

Because condition can be highly subjective and especially because a seller can call a lens "mint" when it is clearly well used, I have only mentioned condition if the item looks extremely clean ("minty") or if it is in poor condition or broken. If the lens is listed with no comment on condition, its because the lens looked, to me, to be in good usable shape - anywhere from good to excellent condition.

Thanks
Dan

[CCHarrison]

PS - two more pieces of data from Ebay yesterday:

Verito 11 1/2" in Studio Shutter $ 598

Velostigmat II 12" in barrel $ 248

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Appreciated - very valuable info!

[Hugo Zhang]

Dan,

There was a sale of Pinkham-Smith SA lens in shutter at $12,000 (or was it $12,500?) a few months ago on eBay.

Hugo

[SAShruby]

$12,500

[Robert Hughes]

$12,500
Probably sitting on some lawyer's bookshelf now. I bet his pictures are way better than yours... :p

[cowanw]

Is there an economic model that makes sense for a seller to buy their own lens at a high value.
I don't want to impute dishonesty to any one but I do wonder if these 5500-12500 dollar values are from real purchases. I wonder this because I have a hard time thinking such lenses have such value; I am probably just to cheap to imagine it.
I watched the 420mm Universal Heliar auction and It sat and sat until just before the end and then got sold for the buy it now price. I was just surprised; should I have been? Did some one here buy it?
Regards
Bill

[jp]

There are companies like Nikon and Canon selling 35mm super tele lenses for $6000+ every day for bird/nature/sports photography. Not exactly rare, and of limited use. It doesn't surprise me a bit that actual rare and special lenses go for big bucks once in a while. Still it's way out of my price range, but we all know a few people who could afford it if they really wanted it.

[SAShruby]

Probably sitting on some lawyer's bookshelf now. I bet his pictures are way better than yours... :p

Quite expensive paper weight.

[SAShruby]

I was so close to buy that $12,500 lens. I had the money. I was torturing my head with pro's and con's. Lots of pro's. Only one con's.

At the end of two ebay campaigns (it got sold on second one) I satisfied myself by stating there will be another chance down the road. I was willing to pay $X,000 for it.

I bet I wans't alone...

[Dave Wooten]

The price of the Cooke PS945 (which I am obsessing over) is over 3k. If however one checks other Cooke photographic/cine lenses etc. the PS945 is one of the cheapies!

[goamules]

On this particular P&S sale, compare it to the other soft focus lens sales. Was that P&S worth $10,000 more than say a Gundlach Achromat? $9,000 more than a Cooke PS945? Come on, ten thousand dollars is a friggin lot of money. A lot of this sort of pricing is hype, like the "$200 Million lost Ansel negatives." Wait til one comes around at a reasonable price.

[Brian Stein]

On this particular P&S sale, compare it to the other soft focus lens sales. Was that P&S worth $10,000 more than say a Gundlach Achromat? $9,000 more than a Cooke PS945? Come on, ten thousand dollars is a friggin lot of money.

A bit like high end hi-fi: for some people even though its way past the law of diminishing returns it is worth it to them because it does something special for their ears (or eyes in our case). Or its for cachet:rolleyes:

Even though these lenses are beautiful if it was being bought purely for decoration you would be satisfied with any big brass lens at a bunch less money. I think this is the least likely explanation unless some multi-zillionairre has got a penchant for them and regards 12k as pocket change

[jp]

12k for a lens IS pocket change compared to some other hobbies. Compare with vintage motor racing (or any serious motor racing) with the big motorhomes and 6-figure car haulers filled with tools and cars of similar value. People who fly can easily spend 12k on fancy electronics for their plane or similar amounts to overhaul something. Home audio has already been mentioned. Even something a little less high end like Harley-Davidsons; people buy and sell those all day for far over 12k, and the bikes don't even go fast! Then there is sailing... What people spend for boat care, winter storage, transport, the sky is the limit for something that changes with the times even less than the lenses.

[Robert Hughes]

Who cares what the final price was? Find out who's bought one and break in tonight! You'll get it for better than market price, and be able to clear well more than 20x your cost... Borrowing from another thread, "Summing up, buying for less than market is what most of us desire. Some call it "stealing" for fun. Selling for above what you paid for it is normal hobby activity, honorable, and defines economics. Selling a few items a year or month here doesn't make you a dealer, and is much appreciated by the members."

Some people might think this method excessive perchance? But it's mere economics - profit is good - what could be wrong with that?

[Jack Dahlgren]

Is there an economic model that makes sense for a seller to buy their own lens at a high value.
I don't want to impute dishonesty to any one but I do wonder if these 5500-12500 dollar values are from real purchases.

Yes, with items such as this setting the "market" value through a sale can be economically advantageous. Same thing happens with real estate, art and other high value items. You can typically get loans, insurance or perhaps sales by setting an artificially high value for an item and then ...

typically dishonesty at some level is part of the picture though.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

"The older the boys, the expensier their toys" comes to mind ;)

[CCHarrison]

Anyone have a link (cached?) to the $ 12,500 Pinkham ?

Thanks
Dan

[SAShruby]

According to this website http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:LWOTGO5GQZQJ:www.sekaimon.com/EbayFeedbackView.do%3B.jvm102_01%3Fseller_id%3Dsuperferlous+Pinkham-Smith-SemiAchromatic-Doublet-Ser-III-No-III&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

English version: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:US90QwktLoMJ:feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewFeedback%26userid%3Dsuperferlous%26ssPageName%3DVIP:feedback%26ftab%3DFeedbackAsSeller+Pinkham-Smith-SemiAchromatic-Doublet-Ser-III-No-III&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

ebay user nicolaisen2007 is probably the owner. He lives in Switzerland. BTW, he bought Universal Heliar for $5,500 US, quite a guy. Seems like he has a lot of dough. He also bought from dagor77 :) and gokevincameras. I don't want to be obtrusive, but it would be nice to know and congratulate to guy who bought it.

Update: And I know the name.

[goamules]

JP498, it's not about recognizing some people have expensive hobbies. It's about understanding someone spending many times what the market value is. It's the same as paying $1000 for a $190 Velostigmat. Yeah, it's rare, but is it 480% more valuable than the other P&S sales? I saw a Leica lens worth $400 somehow "sell" for like $3000 once. Methinks there is some laundering or something going on....

[CCB]

Isn't it just possible that the prices might reflect the provenance of the lens, rather than it's intrinsic value?

[SAShruby]

The lens went to a female photographer. It's in a good hands...

[Hugo Zhang]

The lens went to a female photographer. It's in a good hands...

Wow, I didn't know it was a female photographer. How smart she was to rather put her money on this lens than a diamond like most other females? She has exquisite taste. :)

[Steven Tribe]

And soon we will have data for the first Darlot version of the de Pulligny adjustable landscape which just about meets the soft lens criterium I would think!
Yes, it made it into part 1 of the already classic CCHarrison series!

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

According to this website http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:LWOTGO5GQZQJ:www.sekaimon.com/EbayFeedbackView.do%3B.jvm102_01%3Fseller_id%3Dsuperferlous+Pinkham-Smith-SemiAchromatic-Doublet-Ser-III-No-III&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

English version: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:US90QwktLoMJ:feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewFeedback%26userid%3Dsuperferlous%26ssPageName%3DVIP:feedback%26ftab%3DFeedbackAsSeller+Pinkham-Smith-SemiAchromatic-Doublet-Ser-III-No-III&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

ebay user nicolaisen2007 is probably the owner. He lives in Switzerland. BTW, he bought Universal Heliar for $5,500 US, quite a guy. Seems like he has a lot of dough. He also bought from dagor77 :) and gokevincameras. I don't want to be obtrusive, but it would be nice to know and congratulate to guy who bought it.

Update: And I know the name.

Bernd Nicolaisen is a he and a well known swiss photographer whom I have the pleasure to know since many years. If he is the new owner, we'll surely see some excellent works using this famous lens soon. His works on ice and old wood for instance are a class of its own.

http://www.berndnicolaisen.com/index.php?lang=en

[SAShruby]

Bernd Nicolaisen is a he and a well known swiss photographer whom I have the pleasure to know since many years. If he is the new owner, we'll surely see some excellent works using this famous lens soon. His works on ice and old wood for instance are a class of its own.

http://www.berndnicolaisen.com/index.php?lang=en

I thought that Kelly Nicolaisen would be the buyer... http://www.kellynicolaisen.com/, but you're right, he seems to be better candidate for the lens. Good for him.

[Steven Tribe]

Having looked at the work done by these two "Nicolaisen"s I would say that the lucky (astute!) Nicolaisen was the more deserving of these two - by a very wide margin.

[CCHarrison]

<<<<http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:US90QwktLoMJ:feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewFeedback%26userid%3Dsuperferlous%26ssPageName%3DVIP:feedback%26ftab%3DFeedbackAsSeller+Pinkham-Smith-SemiAchromatic-Doublet-Ser-III-No-III&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca >>>

Was there any bidding or was this a Buy it Now ? I believe the seller was J. Brewer if I recall and then lens is the one he wrote about on his site http://wideopen1.squarespace.com/journal/2008/7/3/pinkham-smith-semi-achromatic-doublet-ser-iii-no-iii-polaroi.html ?

Thanks
Dan

[SAShruby]

<<<<http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:US90QwktLoMJ:feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewFeedback%26userid%3Dsuperferlous%26ssPageName%3DVIP:feedback%26ftab%3DFeedbackAsSeller+Pinkham-Smith-SemiAchromatic-Doublet-Ser-III-No-III&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca >>>

Was there any bidding or was this a Buy it Now ? I believe the seller was J. Brewer if I recall and then lens is the one he wrote about on his site http://wideopen1.squarespace.com/journal/2008/7/3/pinkham-smith-semi-achromatic-doublet-ser-iii-no-iii-polaroi.html ?

Thanks
Dan

There was only one bid, taken just before the end of the second ebay posting time expiry (re-list), I believe it was a No Buy it Now auction. And yes, it was John's lens.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Yep, Jonathan was the seller. It will take a while until Bernd (N.) will be using it, as he still works on his "ice" projects a lot, so don't hold your breath.

[Jonathan Brewer]

Yep, Jonathan was the seller. It will take a while until Bernd (N.) will be using it, as he still works on his "ice" projects a lot, so don't hold your breath.

Hi Dr. Schmitt

I don't participate on this forum but I'll make this one comment and then disappear. I was the seller of the P&S Semi-Achromatic Ser. III and it's sale was legit, it sold for the price listed.

When I put this lens on e-bay, several folks contacted me, I'd say four individuals indicated that they had the money and were interested in the lens, including the individual who eventually bought it.

The first time I put the lens up for sale, I made a big mistake, I hadn't checked the box for ebay transactions outside the US, so ebay wouldn't let anyone outside the US bid, so the lens didn't sell. I ck'd the right box and relisted the lens and it sold w/the one bid.

I had heard of the individual who ultimately bought the lens but have talked w/him several times, a great individual w/a great family, and from perusing his site he'll get some great stuff out of this lens.

There are two galleries, 'Pellucere, and 'Semi-Achromatic Series III' on my
www.imageandartifact.bz site which show the images I did w/this glass, the individual I sold the lens to has the insight and creativity to carry on w/this lens, I'm glad I sold it to him. He hasn't given me permission to release his name, but I will say he's out of Europe.

The special thing about this lens in one of degree, it renders the sharpest image inside the softest image together of any of the other SF glass, no other lens gets the sharp version of the image THAT SHARP inside a soft image THAT SOFT. That's my take on this, and again, everything about this was honest and on the 'up and up'.

I'll even be allowed to visit the lens if I get around to this gentelman's 'neck of the woods', where I hear they make some of the best beer in Europe.

Ciao

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Thanks Jonathan for sharing additional information with us.

You have a wonderful site with awesome images btw.

[Renee Galang]

I agree with Klaus, nice soft focus images. It makes me want to photograph again.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Don't stop then, follow your wish!

[CCHarrison]

Some recent sale updates;

Bodine Pictorial Lens $ 1,775
Wollensak Vitax # 2 brass $ 499 in shutter
Kodak Portrait 16" $ 766
Pulligny/Darlot Adj Landscp $ 640 no flange, # 1 size
Velostigmat 12" in barrel $ 248
Verito 11 1/2" in shutter $ 598

Dan

[Steven Tribe]

Another Plasticca. 3503888557781. 350mm. Good, late serial number. No flange. Loss of yellow pigment? $550 as best offer.
Aldis 4,5 anastimatic. 230513127083. No 18 8". No flange. Functioning of Soft/Sharp adjustment uncertain. Auction £133.77.

[evgenys]

Pulligny Adj. Landscape (http://cgi.ebay.com/LENS-ADJUSTABLE-LANDSCAPE-M-L-PULLIGNY-VERY-RARE-/120594674596?pt=Film_Cameras&hash=item1c1400b3a4) Optique Française Ligny (Meuse) $2000

[CCHarrison]

Actually the Pulligny above did not sell - I only am tracking items that sell.

Thanks
Dan

Steven - what is the link to the Plasticca ?

[Steven Tribe]

350385577811. Google is a bit quicker than going into e**y. Sorry about too many 8's last time. Condition is based only on visual appearance which can be misleading.

[eddie]

350385577811. Google is a bit quicker than going into e**y. Sorry about too many 8's last time. Condition is based only on visual appearance which can be misleading.

i still do not see it. can you send me the link please in a PM? i would like to look at the completed auction. thx.

[cosmicexplosion]

24” Hermagis Eidoscope No 0 soft focus portrait lens F5 $12,000 !!!!!!!
on ebay now, gogetem!

[CCHarrison]

The Hermagis hasnt sold and has been listed for almost 2 months now. Again, I am only tracking items that actually sell. Its rare, but it wont sell at $ 12K.

[cosmicexplosion]

is there much difference between a diffused filter and an actual diffused or soft lens?

and
what is a good bunch of cheap soft lenses to look for

and does any one want to sell , some one told me vasaline worked

that might help in this lens stroking session?

[goamules]

Try a mid sized Verito. Or use a landscape meniscus, if you can find one you can remove the aperture to shoot it wide open.

On zaney prices (we need a thread for that), how about a little folder camera for $50,000? 190442831568 I think these guys are laundering money or something...

[Steven Tribe]

This may cause a discussion!
270612842373. A Rodenstock Monar. F.3.5, €136. Size 2 - I believe this is about 150mm.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Well, the seller lives just 20 minutes from me - too bad I missed that...

[Sven Schroder]

Hi
Ebay 260663136614 purchase arrived today 9" Kershaw Soft Focus F4.5 No 331 for a total of £39 and a question would the red filter do anything different when used with a
soft focus lens?
Regards
Sven

[CCHarrison]

Wow Sven - thats a steal. The Kershaw isnt found too frequently. The red filter is not connected to the lens in any special way - its just a red filter .

From The New Photo Minature Magazine 1921:

"The Kershaw Soft-focus Lens (Marion & Co.), is a new British lens, with an effective aperture of F:5.6. It is a single achromatic lens, giving a firm quality of diffused definition, variable in degree by the use of smaller diaphragms. It is free from flare or halo even when used at its largest aperture, has a flat field, and, being corrected for color in part, the chemical and visual images are brought reasonably close together, so that the adjustment of focus required before exposure is very slight."

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Congrats Sven!
>>green envy alert!!<<

[Sven Schroder]

Hi
Sorry I couldn't help it,1919 Kalosat on ebay item 170542216361.
Regards
Sven

[Steven Tribe]

Go for it Klaus!

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

On it like wet paint right from when it was listed (RSS is helpful at times)!!
Thanks for stirring up the competition Sven, sure your seller would have
liked that too!

[CCHarrison]

Hi Klaus,

I was about to PM you as well on the Kalosat. The seller emailed me to alert me...he recently sold the rare Bodine Pictorial Lens. Good luck

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Thanks Dan. Appreciate your thoughtfulness!

[Sven Schroder]

Hi
Sorry Klaus forgot about PM, you have first dibs on the k@losat anyway and all those other ebayers should respect that!!
Regards
Sven

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Good joke, har har

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Dallmeyer Soft Focus Portrait 2D here: 200522172471

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

DALLMEYER PATENT PETZVAL 3A F4 16" SOFT FOCUS LENS: 160484735396
(no relations of course)

[Darren Kruger]

12" Beach Multi-focal Series B in Wollensak Betax #5: $228.50 (ebay 130431728599)

[Steven Tribe]

A very reasonable price for a size that almost everyone can use.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Well, I could win a Rodenstock Monar f3.5 lens, supposed to be a soft focus portrait lens.
http://image.artfact.com/housePhotos/AuctionTeamBreker/19/285419/H1256-L18302633.jpg?h=E31C8B4EBAB2E2859638F82BC00D1018

Once I have it, I'll report on it.

[Jim Galli]

Dallmeyer Soft Focus Portrait 2D here: 200522172471


DALLMEYER PATENT PETZVAL 3A F4 16" SOFT FOCUS LENS: 160484735396
(no relations of course)

He tries to re-direct our attention :cool:

hmmm, the barrel on that Kalosat looks surprisingly like my Gundlach Meniscus. I wonder if they had gundlach do the mounting similar to Pinkham & Smith using Wollensak for many of theirs.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Well Jim, I had always thought that this thread is not just about ONE SF lens... ;) ;)

[Jim Galli]

Well Jim, I had always thought that this thread is not just about ONE SF lens... ;) ;)

I was teasing a bit of course. WOW! Old Kalosat lenses are valuable. Who knew. Did you get it??

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Congrats to the new owner! $2.222 - not bad for a 1919 lens with just a meniscus lens.
I hope we'll going to see some results here!!

[jp]

Ebay had a 19" B&L Sigmar 110588860920 that didn't sell for $395. I'm guessing on account of the separation it had. I would have expected it to fetch more since they almost never come up on Ebay. (I have a 19" sigmar, so I keep an eye out on their market)

[CCHarrison]

Actually, the Sigmar was not considered a Soft Focus Lens by B&L.
See http://www.cameraeccentric.com/html/info/bauschlomb_6.html

That was a heck of a price for a Kalosat with no flange...but then again, they dont show up very often...

Dan

[Stephane]

Darlot - Objectif d'artiste, formule anachromatique du Lt Pulligny
110591439220
Got to think about that one...

[Jim Galli]

Ebay had a 19" B&L Sigmar 110588860920 that didn't sell for $395. I'm guessing on account of the separation it had. I would have expected it to fetch more since they almost never come up on Ebay. (I have a 19" sigmar, so I keep an eye out on their market)

Sigmar is a triplet. Seperation is impossible. :confused: :confused:

[CCHarrison]

Webpage listing Soft Focus Sales data (http://www.antiquecameras.net/softfocuslenssales.html) has been updated. Bolded entries are newly added prices since the last update on Aug 15, 2010.

Dan

[Emil Schildt]

Darlot - Objectif d'artiste, formule anachromatique du Lt Pulligny
110591439220
Got to think about that one...

did you think?
I did... but unfortunately my thinking was too slow.....

Thankfully I know about another one, so now I am thinking again....:o

[Emil Schildt]

Webpage listing Soft Focus Sales data (http://www.antiquecameras.net/softfocuslenssales.html) has been updated. Bolded entries are newly added prices since the last update on Aug 15, 2010.

Dan

Dan: how do you get your informations?
following Ebay makes sense, but do private people tell you also?

And are you following other auctions/stores for sales records?

Just curious, as I sometimes buy lenses paivately or on others sites than Ebay....

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Webpage listing Soft Focus Sales data (http://www.antiquecameras.net/softfocuslenssales.html) has been updated. Bolded entries are newly added prices since the last update on Aug 15, 2010.

Dan

Well Dan, when I put my macrolesnes site up, I noticed and increasing interest in these lenses and considerable raising prices. Same happened with my BLOG about UV photography and these special lenses - now I see the same effect on SF lenses. Can I blame you "guilty" ... ;) ;)

[CCHarrison]

Hi,

I am mostly tracking ebay, but yes, people have been emailing me some private information about SF lens deals as well.

...I hope I am not raising prices - in fact, people should check out the (sometimes) wide ranging price deviation of some of these lenses...it means if you take your time on ebay, you can save some good money...for example, the Vitax is turning out to be a bit more common of a lens than I originally thought....and the prices have ranged from $ 381 to $ 899 in the last 6 months, on pretty comparable lenses !

Best,

Dan

[Steven Tribe]

To-day's Dallmeyer 3A was quite a jump in relation to the earlier ones this year. £1550 in an auction that started at £4.99! Only just a soft lens.

[goamules]

Yeah Steven, that one went quite high. We have to remember the auctions are quite variable, the prices can fluctuate by more than 100%. It all depends on who is bidding that week, and who finds the listing, trusts the seller, etc.

[Stephane]

I know you respect this seller, and I kind of understand why.
However, he always throw big names around with any brass lens.

So this one:
120627922705

Sold as a soft focus lens, brother of the pinkham, nephew of the portland... Despite all his knowledge, I think he is pushing it. Please tell me I am wrong...

[CCHarrison]

That Dallmeyer is described as, ".............the lens as being in museum condition and certainly in collector’s condition."

My eyes may be playing tricks, but it looks like that lens has been brasso-d to death ("patina-free")...that knob also looks funny.....

[Steven Tribe]

I remember the Dallmeyer seller when he first started listing some time ago. Very humble - he has certainly learned how to use google to good effect.

[goamules]

Stephan, you are right.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Anyone ever heard about a 1:4 220mm G.Rodenstock München SOFT FOCUS LENS (originally labeled as that in English - export model?)?? Black barrel, but no serial number visible. [no, not on ebay]

[Jim Galli]

Anyone ever heard about a 1:4 220mm G.Rodenstock München SOFT FOCUS LENS (originally labeled as that in English - export model?)?? Black barrel, but no serial number visible. [no, not on ebay]
Nope.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Maybe that helps...

http://forum.mflenses.com/userpix/201010/455_RS_1_1.jpg

http://forum.mflenses.com/userpix/201010/455_RS_5_1.jpg

[CCHarrison]

Klaus - is this GB's lens? I was trying to help him figure this one out as well.

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Not that I would know of...
Any info on that Dan?

I just talked to a guy who knows Rodenstock very well
and he just mentioned that it must have been made for
a very short time "pre Imagon".

[CCHarrison]

Klaus, a fellow SF enthusiast emailed me about the exact same model Rodenstock lens, about a week ago! I couldnt find any data. Markings are a bit un-Rodenstock like.

Best,
Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Did you get pictures - maybe it was the same ??
It has no serial number, which is strange...

[CCHarrison]

I just looked at his pics - different lens - same model. I will send an image privately if you like.

Dan

[Steven Tribe]

Perhaps something like this conversation (in translation) went on at Rodenstocks.

" Have you seen this Graf variable - it is selling quite well".
"Unfortunately it is patented - better be careful".
"It is just a dialyt - like our original Eurynar".
"The patent just applies to position of the front lens. Perhaps we could just increase the F to about 4. That should make it sufficiently soft".
"OK - lets have a look at the bigger Eurynar barrels and see if we cut down on the focal lengths".
"We would certainly be able to put it on the market quite quickly".

I think the barrel design looks a lot like the Eurynars.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Where's the "soo funny" emoticon?? ;) ;)

[Steven Tribe]

Seriously, this must be a very limited production with loan to few select photographers to try them out and give feedback. Or perhaps just within Rodenstock itself. There is no other explanation for the lack of serial numbers.

[CCHarrison]

Steven, the one I have seen also has no serial number and an * marking around the rim along with the same wording as Klaus shows above.

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

The one I have shown has a " in front of the word SOFT,
I'm sure it is no coincidence, but has a meaning. Maybe
indeed prototypes...?

[Steven Tribe]

I cannot believe that Rodenstock would put a lens on the general market with the english expression "Soft Focus Lens". They had moved away from "type descriptive" names like bistigmat, hemi-anastistigmat to real tradenames.
And suitable for german speakers.

[Jim Galli]

A few years ago someone was blowing out 270mm f5.6 Rodenstock Rotelar's as Soft Focus or Portrait lenses. They were remarked and didn't say Rotelar any more iirc. Obviously much newer but my point is that small batches of things got re-named and sold and 80 years later no one can make heads or tales of it. Anyone remember those Rotelar's. Wasn't that long ago.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Well, my Rodenstock MONAR f3.5 soft focus lens is a fine piece in good working condition, but unfortunately the focal length of about 12" is too much for my use and I would swap it or let it go into loving hands. Image circle at least 8.3" (220mm) diameter.

http://forum.mflenses.com/userpix/201010/455_monar_1.jpg

[Emil Schildt]

Well, my Rodenstock MONAR f3.5 soft focus lens is a fine piece in good working condition, but unfortunately the focal length of about 12" is too much for my use and I would swap it or let it go into loving hands. Image circle at least 8.3" (220mm) diameter.

http://forum.mflenses.com/userpix/201010/455_monar_1.jpg

wow...

(I'm a loving person.....:o )

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

A Pinkham-Smith repair project for the not too faint hearted... 280574153913

[seven]

yeah, i was thinking about if it's a good idea to post it. might have ended cheap.
anyway, how much for that Monar ? :)

[eddie]

A Pinkham-Smith repair project for the not too faint hearted... 280574153913

okay who bought it? i wonder what he finally took for it. so much for my snipe bid.

[CCB]

When a seller ends an auction in this manner, how
does he know he's maxed his profit? Seems rather
short sighted.

[eddie]

When a seller ends an auction in this manner, how
does he know he's maxed his profit? Seems rather
short sighted.

ebay is not really a max profit place. it is a place for extremes. extremely high and extremely low....no necessarily market value.

i consider e bay a place for min profit and possible losses....

some one could have offered him $2500! i bet it would have only gone to 600-750 if left to auction.

broken and damaged pieces will bring very low bids from my observations.....

[Stephane]

I asked him and he said he changed his mind and decided to keep it. He said he is a photographer. Well, at least that's what he said and that's what I want to believe (so I can sleep the rest of the week). Every one hopes where real high! OhOhOh!

[Stephane]

It was not really broken, though... Cleaning marks... I mean seriously. 30mn of patience and here it is (almost) as new. It was almost a dream come true...

[CCHarrison]

I have just posted an update of my page on Soft Focus Lens Sales.

On the table, all those marked 4th quarter 2010 are new entries.

During this last update period, a few Dallmeyer's sold for WELL above market, not sure why, but they did.

see http://www.antiquecameras.net/softfocuslenssales.html


Dan

[goamules]

Dan, I appreciate your work tracking these.

But people should know that you are showing just a portion of the sales, that you have picked, and that auction prices are variable and can't be used exclusively to gauge prices. For example, several Dallmeyers didn't sell, even though they were below "market" price.

I also don't agree with your assertion on the page that "Wollensak lenses, for example, frequently sell for perhaps more than they should as they are relatively plentiful..." Supply and demand does set the price. Wollensaks sell for what the market will bear, with 2 or 5 coming up each month. I would say an F3.8, 16 inch Vitax petzval with soft focus selling for, say $900, is a bargain, not overpriced. Supply and demand hits Dallmeyers also. Wollensak made their lenses (Veritos let's say) for perhaps 30 years. The Dallmeyer "soft focus" petzvals were made from the late 1860s til the 1920s. They also have 2 to 5 come up each month. They are relatively more plentiful, but demand makes the price go higher.

Now I agree the demand factor for the esoteric, uncommon soft focus lenses like the Kalostat or Puyo is low, maybe just a handful of people worldwide know them and are searching for them, and they sometimes sell low. But we can easily change demand, if a few people start talking up a particular type of lens. A few posts, some pictures displayed, and the hype becomes viral. Like Gold rim Dagors were a few years ago, or others.

Again, I sure appreciate your great website, and all the valuable information on many, many types of photography equipment.

[CCHarrison]

My page is not a scientifically based, all-inclusive price guide, nor does it claim to be. It includes the Soft Focus Lens sales I find on ebay by looking through current and completed auctions, as much as I can reasonably locate. I only list what sells. It aint perfect, but nobody else is providing anyone this data - and I think its very useful data to boot.

Thanks
Dan

PS - I think my comments about Wollensak lenses are accurate as quoted below:

" I also sense new users to the market tend to over pay as they are unaware of the true scarcity of a given lens. Wollensak lenses, for example, frequently sell for perhaps more than they should - they are almost all relatively plentiful, especially compared to the much more esoteric lenses like the Kalosat, Struss and any of the Pinkham & Smith lenses."

but everyone has their own opinion...

[Jim Galli]

Dan, Thanks for your most helpful efforts. Ebay is a constant source of entertainment :D:D A fellow LFForum participant was asking about my Kodak 16" Portrait meniscus and I quoted him $950 which seemed a little high when we looked at your site. Funny that the Kodak's have sort of stagnated as I'd paid $750 for it 4 or 5 years ago.

One that I'd like to see tracked and quantified is the Voigtlaender Heliar but perhaps that would be a chore as there are so many that come and go. Maybe just size 210 and up would be worthwhile.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Anyone watching the PinkhamSmith battle on ebay right now?

[Jim Galli]

Anyone watching the PinkhamSmith battle on ebay right now?

Not really a battle, just a single bidder bidding against the reserve

[CCHarrison]

the last one on ebay got $ 4550....wonder where this will go..

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

$3.250 for a 12" STRUSS Pictorial (with damaged aperture), 250721594136

[papah]

$3.250 for a 12" STRUSS Pictorial (with damaged aperture), 250721594136

10 seconds before the end, it was at $650 or so... fun to watch!

[Petzval Paul]

I offered $4,000 at the last minute (which was 6:00AM where I am... stayed up all night just to bid) but my PC froze somehow :(

I guess that is more prone to happen here in India...

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

I was tempted but the damaged aperture threw me off...

[Mark Sawyer]

And the first four-figure Velostigmat I've ever seen. Mind you, it looks like a nice one...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=140474451780&si=rL8ZYwjqaKSGAulTvTJd4xBqeAU%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[Jim Galli]

And the first four-figure Velostigmat I've ever seen. Mind you, it looks like a nice one...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=140474451780&si=rL8ZYwjqaKSGAulTvTJd4xBqeAU%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Oh my, and a Burke and James re-paint to boot I'm pretty sure.

[Stephane]

Oh yea! And what's up with the Eidoscope #2 (200540293997)?
€505 / $700
Has the craze vanished?
or I got lucky, didnt I?
;)

[Jim Galli]

Oh yea! And what's up with the Eidoscope #2 (200540293997)?
€505 / $700
Has the craze vanished?
or I got lucky, didnt I?
;)

Wow! A bargain at 2 1/2 X that price

[Stephane]

I have been keeping this auction quiet! The seller might have the flange, and is from where I am from.
The lens belonged to a portrait photographer in Perpignan. Perpignan is 30 km from Ceret and Collioure, where lots of artists visited and produced art (Dali is not far from there either). So this lens might have "seen" Picasso and the likes some years back.
I have been waiting for that one for a while!

[Jim Galli]

I have been keeping this auction quiet! The seller might have the flange, and is from where I am from.
The lens belonged to a portrait photographer in Perpignan. Perpignan is 30 km from Ceret and Collioure, where lots of artists visited and produced art (Dali is not far from there either). So this lens might have "seen" Picasso and the likes some years back.
I have been waiting for that one for a while!

Bravo and congrats! Be sure to ask what else is 'old' and sitting around. Even those 'broken' ones that only have a glass at the back!

[Sven Schroder]

I know this isn't the "biggest steal ...." thread but my Eidoscope No2 cost me 200 euro's
a buy it now from Italy and it rattled all the way badly packed but my luck held out with no damage to the lens.
Regards
Sven

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Another Eidoscope no. 2 sale in France: 110613380191 starting at $800 (no relations)

[Steven Tribe]

Could e**y 180586407923 have been a soft lens experiment from CZJ? The serial number and the engraved date 1913 was at the time when these were popular. Or is it just some sort of Planar experiment/development done by the research department?
Like the real bidders (it reached over $600), I was convinced that this is one of the "lens bank" prototypes that ended up in the US.

[Jim Galli]

Could e**y 180586407923 have been a soft lens experiment from CZJ? The serial number and the engraved date 1913 was at the time when these were popular. Or is it just some sort of Planar experiment/development done by the research department?
Like the real bidders (it reached over $600), I was convinced that this is one of the "lens bank" prototypes that ended up in the US.

It would have been hard to send off 600 bucks for whatever it is from those two pictures. 48mm and 25cm do not add up to f3, or close. :confused:

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

A Graf Variable 16-18" offered by well know seller "dagor77" here 180590740485

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

A not very often seen uncoated 30ies Astro Berlin 2.3/100 SOFT FOCUS 100mm lens offered here 250730779672

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Could e**y have been a soft lens experiment from CZJ? The serial number and the engraved date 1913 was at the time when these were popular. Or is it just some sort of Planar experiment/development done by the research department?
Like the real bidders (it reached over $600), I was convinced that this is one of the "lens bank" prototypes that ended up in the US.

I can look that up once I have access to my Zeiss files again (I can't find it in the "lens bank files" I have).

No wonder I could not find it in the regular files, it is a "Versuchobjektiv" aka test sample #2, made 1913, f3.1 25cm (250mm) but there is no indication that it would have been a "soft focus" lens. The serial number before that was the sample #1, also f3.1 but f=7.5cm (75mm)

[Steven Tribe]

It is a nice confirmation that currently used Zeiss serial number dates are correct.
The Astro is in the VM but with information that only titillates! Are there two versions or not - one with the "artist" name with 3 separate rear cells AND another version with just a single fixed rear cell? Or is VM just confused by the different mounts?

[CCHarrison]

There is also a Struss and P&S VQ # 1 on ebay.

Lots of SF lens activity on ebay the past month as well as current auctions underway !

Dan

[Jim Galli]

Droool.

The Struss is very intersting as it's un-marked. I'd like to visually inspect it next to my 2 strusses and see if I would concur that it probably is a struss. They're kind of unique. And the early P&S IV in the non-wolly barrel is to breathe heavy over! Don't worry about me lads. I can't afford to even covet either of them let alone bid.

[Emil Schildt]

There is also a Struss and P&S VQ # 1 on ebay.

Lots of SF lens activity on ebay the past month as well as current auctions underway !

Dan

found the Struss, but not the P&Q..

any number?

[CCHarrison]

same seller as the Struss

Dan

[Jim Galli]

It WAS here (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=190471321765&si=IVi1MQ%252FODhdXI%252F9X%252BmKci8mCF5g%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT). Obviously someone with exceedingly deep pockets heavy with $$$$$ needed it and arrived at an agreeable arrangement. :cool:

[jp]

I notice seller carrie7 has some very valuable stuff on the site and it all has a buy it now of $2000 listed in the auction but not ebay's buy it now. As someone who has sold a few things on Ebay I certainly understand them wanting to avoid the monster transaction fees, but they could get $5000 for some of the stuff they say buy it now $2000 for. EVERYTHING they are listing is starting at $99 too. Are these things fishy? Carrie7 also has 191 things for sale on Ebay, but only two feedbacks from this year.

[Jim Galli]

I notice seller carrie7 has some very valuable stuff on the site and it all has a buy it now of $2000 listed in the auction but not ebay's buy it now. As someone who has sold a few things on Ebay I certainly understand them wanting to avoid the monster transaction fees, but they could get $5000 for some of the stuff they say buy it now $2000 for. EVERYTHING they are listing is starting at $99 too. Are these things fishy? Carrie7 also has 191 things for sale on Ebay, but only two feedbacks from this year.

Just had those same thoughts. Pinkham Bi-Quality (http://cgi.ebay.com/160510298789) is probably a very good buy at $2,000 but it does smell like old fish. Haven't we seen this before? Gibson guitar's. Hasselblad 903's. All unrelated top end stuff with a little note to send me $2,000 bucks and btw, we'll just leave ebay out of the loop if that's OK with everybody.

Couple years back, maybe 5, this same scheme was going on and a couple of the guys here went ahead and bid against each other on purpose to get the sale up to half a million $$ or whatever the ebay threshold was that they have to go in and investigate.

[Steven Tribe]

Obvious scam.
They choose an old lister active from the 90's who hasn't been active for some time.
All traces of listing now removed by E**y.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Hijacked account(s) after phising for passwords and then fraudulent listings without the owner knowing about, all looking very much alike. If I see some, I usually report those.

[Emil Schildt]

wow - good to know...

I am SO naive.. If they chose something a little less expensive, I might put in a bid or two...

Thank God, I am not that wealthy...

[Steven Tribe]

Putting in a bid or two is not dangerous. Neither is paypal, unless they have that password too and have also changed the linked bank account.

Mostly it is agreed payment outside paypal.

[jp]

I've bought stuff from sellers outside of the ebay transaction a bunch of times.

Things like "that one on Ebay I bid on is what I want; do you have more or similar items?"
Yes, I have a hundred for $x.
"I'll take them all for that if you include shipping".

Or "I want something almost like what you have on Ebay",
Yes we can do that too, it will be $x, paypal to this address:.

But with this carrie7 seller, they put the fishy text in an image file. This does two things. It means since they host the image, they can make the words/evidence dissapear (OR CHANGE!) anytime they want; it won't show up in closed auctions. You file a complaint, they change the image content by reuploading it, ebay will have no log the auction has changed.
It also means Ebay's perhaps automated methods of determining inapropriate instructions in the text of the auction won't find the message, since it's an image not text.

I wouldn't even put a bid on it. They could still take the money you bid if the auction makes it to the end and not send you anything. Or they could send you to a payment system or send an email to you that infects your computer. Paypal can take a lot of time to straigten out things and it's a PITA on your part.

Lots of people use the same password for paypal as they do ebay, and the same email account for paypal and ebay transactions. It is possible for someone'e paypal to get hacked first (by the enormous volume of paypal phishing spam) then their ebay info would get hacked. There's a lot of phishing for webmail accounts for spammers to use too, which would let someone into someones ebay and paypal at the same time too.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

$1613.89 for that unlabeled STRUSS lens 190471322800 from Santa Fe. Nice Santa gift!!

[Steven Tribe]

And a fraction under $700 for Andrew's/Eddy's 16/18 Graf Variable in Fair (but eminently useable) condition.
One can't avoid following the auctions of exactly the lenses in one's own collection!
There were many bidders here - not just a couple of interested parties.

On the very edge of the soft lens/pictorial concept, the increasing bid levels for ordinary magic lantern lenses and landscape seem to be continuing. I haven't any records, apart from what I paid myself a year or so ago for similar. Item 280592782731 may have set a record for a very standard size/design magic lantern objective which used to cost under £10. Looks like one of my sources for achromats has now gone for ever!

[CCHarrison]

I have been emailing with the seller (Ebay ID Amidol) of the Struss ( a great photographer ). He inherited some great SF & LF lenses and is auctioning them off. Just listed a nice Graf today. Seems like a nice guy - he offered to send me pics to help further illustrate my SF articles.

Dan

[CCHarrison]

$1613.89 for that unlabeled STRUSS lens 190471322800 from Santa Fe. Nice Santa gift!!

I love that little pouch !

Half the price of the last Struss that got $ 3250 on Nov 10, 2010.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=250721594136&si=Ux9m7PJaEqcREcNXbO0Gyz8u%252FAw%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME%3AX%3ARTQ%3AUS%3A1123


It will be interesting to see how much this just listed Struss ( from same Ebay User Amidol) will fetch:
http://cgi.ebay.com/SUPER-RARE-12-INCH-STRUSS-PICTORIAL-SOFT-FOCUS-LENS_W0QQitemZ190474019922QQcategoryZ15247QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp4340.m263QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DSIC%26its%3DI%252BC%26itu%3DUCI%252BIA%252BUA%252BFICS%252BUFI%26otn%3D10%26pmod%3D250721594136%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D5294193595777581607

Who would have thought we would see 3 Struss lenses on ebay within 3 weeks !

Dan

[Steven Tribe]

The Graf variable is the "Patent Pending" version but with different design than the one I have but with similar text layout on the front inner rim text. The soft instructions are on the front surface rather than the side and the front cell is set much deeper. I read the Serial no. as 10xxx which is a lot earlier than my 20516. Unless the first digit is some kind of code for the design? That is, 1 no. 0xxx and 2 no. 0516.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Let's not forget the Pinkham & Smith Series IV #2 he (amidol) also has for sale now (190474019444)

On a local camera fair here I met a (russian) seller who had a Nicola Perscheid 21cm (210mm) lens for sale - he wanted 3.250 for it (EUROS not USD!!!)

[Jim Galli]

Is anyone else getting REALLY frustrated with the Czech Republic seller that has the "Wanted" list in all of his sales that includes every celebrity lens name since time immemorial? My searches for Struss and Pinkham fetch 221 pieces of various overpriced junk that have nothing whatever to do with a meaningful search. I've turned him in about 90 times on the Report button but nothing happens. Emailed him but no response.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

I also got tired of "Keyword Spamming" which I usually have reported. Ebay seems not to care anymore about it and have actually removed that entry from their list of reports. Unfortunately if you search you'll find all that - good for sellers but bad for buyers.

[seven]

the czech keyword spammer is really annoying :(
also annoying is the scammer with the fake Bi- Quality auctions, i get 10 of them every day in my search results. good news is that ebay removes them pretty quick.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

....since I report those immediately ;)

[Steven Tribe]

I have filed a report too with the co.uk organisation.
I discovered that a Polish seller who posts/sells here is guilty of the same (just one item, though, in a sub-title).
Keyword Spaming still exists the UK "file a complaint" system - at least ten minutes ago.
Klaus, it is not good for sellers either. The real stuff is drowned by junk.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Well, I usually log onto the US site but thanks for the tip, so in future I'll use the UK side to report!

[Fred Heming]

there is a 6D now
http://cgi.ebay.com/Dallmeyer-6D-Soft-focus-111358-/160501536768?pt=Film_Cameras&hash=item255ea31800

[Steven Tribe]

There was a 6D then!

[Steven Tribe]

The Cooke series IIe, mentioned in another thread went for €670.
Very nice condition.
From the catalogue:

- TAYLOR - HOBSON COOKE Portrait Anastigmat 4,5 / 15 inch

Serie II E No. 393 129

The auctioneer's estimate was €130 - €180 - which may have raised false hopes amongst bidders! He was also way-out on the Voigtländers too.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Wollensak Velostigmat Series II 12" f4.5 Adj Soft Focus (280597144334)

UNUSUAL BAUSCH & LOMB PETZVAL PORTRAIT 152mm BRASS LENS (120654125023) - one of us here (biggrin)

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

The Cooke series IIe, mentioned in another thread went for €670.
Very nice condition.
From the catalogue:

- TAYLOR - HOBSON COOKE Portrait Anastigmat 4,5 / 15 inch

Serie II E No. 393 129

The auctioneer's estimate was €130 - €180 - which may have raised false hopes amongst bidders! He was also way-out on the Voigtländers too.

Could have been on purpose, though (?)

[Steven Tribe]

I suppose so!
I have noted that listings that feature poorly described objectives - but with clearly identifiable features/text just readable - do attract more punters in the early stage and last day. If this is a ploy- I have never discovered it! And, as I have said before, they may not be as rational as when as they are when faced with a starting price which is realistic and high. And reserve bid prices seem to act as a kick in the **** for all but the real "wet dream" lens.

[goamules]

Guys, I don't understand the need to "out" every lens you find on Ebay. At least wait until it's over.

[Emil Schildt]

Guys, I don't understand the need to "out" every lens you find on Ebay. At least wait until it's over.

I'm actually thankful....

[Steven Tribe]

Does this mean you ......?

[Ramiro Elena]

Does this mean you ......?

We all, I am afraid :(

[Emil Schildt]

Does this mean you ......?

now I'm lost...

(wouldn't be the first time)

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Guys, I don't understand the need to "out" every lens you find on Ebay. At least wait until it's over.

Come on, as if we all don't have our searches run daily...

[goamules]

Can you send me an RSS feed of your search daily? Any any live auctions, flea markets, and antique shops you find lenses in? You know, so everybody can get in on the fun...Competition is a good thing. For the seller, not buyers.

Sheeze

[Steven Tribe]

Sorry Emil - I (we?) thought you must have "jumped on" one of the objectives mentioned recently like the 6D, or Cooke IIe!

[Ramiro Elena]

It may seem there's only a few of us reading this post when in fact... 9,529 views! :D

[CCHarrison]

I can see both sides of the issue here. If you are looking to buy a lens and others point it out to potential bidders, it could drive up the price for all those interested (Good for seller, bad for buyer).... On the other hand, sometimes a buyer isnt aware of an auction and even if the item sells for more because its made more public via a forum, that buyer may have otherwised completely missed out on the auction (Good for buyer, good for seller).

Given there are at least two sides to this issue, lets all agree to disagree and get back to discussing some esoteric nugget about one of our favorite SF lenses. Like the fact that a direct decendant of Pinkham & Smith lives 4 miles from me! I need to call him - I believe he has a collection of P&S lenses.

Best,
Dan

[Ramiro Elena]

Like the fact that a direct decendant of Pinkham & Smith lives 4 miles from me! I need to call him - I believe he has a collection of P&S lenses.


Please share phone number and address of this fellow with us asap!:D :p


Okay, I'll shut up now :D

[Emil Schildt]

Sorry Emil - I (we?) thought you must have "jumped on" one of the objectives mentioned recently like the 6D, or Cooke IIe!

no - I havn't done this... ever.

I like to watch these auctions, and at the same time regret I havn't got the money to jump in....

[jp]

Eastman Kodak Portrait Lens 4.8/305mm (12") just went for EUR 340 + 20% commission.

https://www.westlicht-auction.com/index.php?id=197089&acat=197089&offset=1&lot_id=610

I had bid 320. I was hoping a kodak lens would not be as popular in a European auction. Just takes one person who wants it a little more than I.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Voigtländer W.Z. Objektiv 9/18cm sold today at Westlicht for EUR401 (ex premium)

http://www.westlicht-auction.com/files/71304908e9010c2d9a3d9739411c27cf980d.jpg

[papah]

A small Plasticca just sold on eBay: (250733786317)...

[Emil Schildt]

A small Plasticca just sold on eBay: (250733786317)...

crap... Missed that one...:o

[Steven Tribe]

Didn't see the Zwierzina either. This is the small version made for 9x12 (or less?) but otherwise is the same as the normal type. Haven't see one before.

The WZ is the standard 18cm enlarging lens type. They were only sold in this size.

[Jim Galli]

The return of the Struss (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190476900728&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1123) that doesn't say Struss. Curious if any one knows why it was returned.

[seven]

because of non payment perhaps...
so, who got the small Eidoscope ? (120651981449)

[CCHarrison]

Contacted Amidol and he did say that it is relisted for non-payment.

Dan

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Yes, he told me the same and listed today the "MAGICAL PINKHAM & SMITH SERIES VI No. 1 SYNTHETIC LENS" f5/7"

[Petzval Paul]

I was the winner of the "Struss that didn't say Struss" but got locked out of my paypal account for some security reasons - trying to log in from a cyber cafe in Calcutta does that sometimes :) Then simultaneously, the very same day I had my cell phone pick-pocketed and came down with a terrible fever that lasted a full week, so I was unable to get to a PC to fix the paypal problem.

Oh well... just happy enough to be healthy again!

[Steven Tribe]

Now that is really bad luck!
I am sure the lister will allow you to bid again -considering the circumstances!

[Paul Fitzgerald]

Looks like Wollensak is finally getting the respect they deserve:

Wollensak-Velostigmat-Series-II-12-f4-5-Adj-Soft-Focus (http://cgi.ebay.com/Wollensak-Velostigmat-Series-II-12-f4-5-Adj-Soft-Focus-/280597144334?pt=Film_Cameras&hash=item4154e4a30e)

[goamules]

Looks like Wollensak is finally getting the respect they deserve:...

Perhaps. But what is the average sale? There are always abberations, even with other Tessars:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&_rdc=1&item=300499726600

[CCHarrison]

Velo II's typically sell in the $ 275-450 range. That auction is not typical, although there was solid seller with a good description of the item

Dan

[Hugo Zhang]

There is a Dallmeyer 3D sold this morning for over $3,000.

[Jim Galli]

There is a Dallmeyer 3D sold this morning for over $3,000.

That's just aberrant! Maybe a case of 6 new ones is worth that much :rolleyes:

[Mark Sawyer]

There is a Dallmeyer 3D sold this morning for over $3,000.

If it was this one, :

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=230558395237&si=rL8ZYwjqaKSGAulTvTJd4xBqeAU%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3AEOIBUAA%3AUS%3A1123

then it was the f/3 3B, not the less-desireable f/6 3D. Still, a very high price, even for such a lovely lens. The seller advertised it as an 8x10 lens, although Dallmeyer catalogs listed the 1920's 3B as for cabinet size. Anyone know if the 3B underwent a focal-length change?

And GREAT GOOGLY-MOOGLY, I have a $3,000 lens sitting in my cabinet!!! :eek: I'd better get that thing out and use it! :)

[Jim Galli]

If it was this one, :

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=230558395237&si=rL8ZYwjqaKSGAulTvTJd4xBqeAU%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3AEOIBUAA%3AUS%3A1123

then it was the f/3 3B, not the less-desireable f/6 3D. Still, a very high price, even for such a lovely lens. The seller advertised it as an 8x10 lens, although Dallmeyer catalogs listed the 1920's 3B as for cabinet size. Anyone know if the 3B underwent a focal-length change?

And GREAT GOOGLY-MOOGLY, I have a $3,000 lens sitting in my cabinet!!! :eek: I'd better get that thing out and use it! :)

You've heard of poetic license?? Well, there's EBAY license and some sellers use it to the max. I've got a 3B that's coated and covers 11X14 that I'll sell to the the first guy with $2500!

[Steven Tribe]

Back to real life.
A clean Verito 11 1/2" sold at the auction house LM Sweden to-day for 3000 SEK (including commission) = USD 430.
But this included a very nice mahogany 18x24cm Tailback "Resekamera" in super condition and a full set of plate holders. So perhaps USD200 for the Verito?
Some soft lenses are still sold on cameras!

[Emil Schildt]

230558518873

same seller as the Dallmeyer. Member here....

$2,447.92 For a "SUTER RAPID PORTRAIT NO. 5 - PORTRAIT PETZVAL F/3.75"

he calls it soft focus...:
"..this Petzval delivers more like a Verito 14.5 softfocus than the Dallmeyer B -"....

[Steven Tribe]

Not a nice way to end a pleasant weekend!

- Bidding pattern and Bidder's record (?) unsettles me.
- Has taken a leaf out of the book of you-know-who's recent listings.
- Since when have Petzvals become soft lenses?

But a very nice Petzval and he has done his homework and found the right quotes.

I have discovered that he has taken complete sections out of CCHarrisons soft lens articles without any sort of quotation marks. Nasty.

[Hugo Zhang]

Is this real??

http://cgi.ebay.com/LENS-DALLMEYER-3B-PORTRAIT-MADE-LONDON-EST-YEAR-1869-/250740773462?pt=Camera_Lenses&hash=item3a61509256

Can't he try his luck like the other seller?

[eddie]

230558518873 same seller


$2,447.92 For a "SUTER RAPID PORTRAIT NO. 5 - PORTRAIT PETZVAL F/3.75"


i need to get this guy to sell some lenses for me.

looks fishy to me.....

but hey, i got those lenses. i will accept 60% of what he got!

[Steven Tribe]

For reasons which I will not go further into - the two sales made a seller based in Denmark (3B and Suter Portrait Petzval), should not be included in any statistics about sales prices achieved by Soft lenses.

[Emil Schildt]

Prices seem very high these days....:confused:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=360325507928&si=dRfQAyUDYLVqsHD9V8%252FEM1Kn7GY%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT

2000£ :eek:

I have a 4D.. Maybe that will go even higher? :-)

[vitality]

Prices seem very high these days....:confused:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=360325507928&si=dRfQAyUDYLVqsHD9V8%252FEM1Kn7GY%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT

2000£ :eek:

I have a 4D.. Maybe that will go even higher? :-)

Yeah, I was watching it aswel.
I'm looking now for petzval lens, and its unbelivable prices on ebay. :(
Is it a chtistmas time, and there will be normal prices later (in Jan, Feb), or this will be the price...?

[goamules]

All we talk about here are the amazingly high priced auctions.

Here is another 3D that went for $300: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370464687980

Here is a 5D that has sat with a buyitnow of $1000 for months: http://cgi.ebay.com/Dallmeyer-5D-Brass-lens-/120622476874

Buying wars between rich speculators does not mean it's the average price.

[vitality]

All we talk about here are the amazingly high priced auctions. Here is another 3D that went for $300: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370464687980

Buying wars between rich speculators does not mean it's the average price.

This one was for auction, but later (on the 1st day I think), it was sold as Buy It now (so looks like somebody negotiated price with seller). I think if it would be left for auction, it would go higher...

Yes I know, there is still normal prices, I think month ago 3B was sold (on German ebay) for 620 eur. But latest prices is just amazing...

[goamules]

The D model Dallmeyer has never been as popular as the faster A and B. Over the years I've seen many stagnate or sell quite low, because they are F6 and a lot of people assume an F4 or F3 is better. What I'm seeing the past few months is a "Brand Name Rush" where any Dallmeyer (especially Petzvals) goes for many times what a comparable brand does. That tells me it's speculators or people that don't know much about lenses, but must have "that brand."

Not to say the D is not a nice lens. They were made for group shots, so they have a flatter field, greater coverage, smaller size, less aberrations (very little of the ever popular "swirls") than a portrait model.

[CCHarrison]

Its hard to trust the $3007 3B Dallmeyer (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230558395237) auction as far as price trends...3rd high bidder has 79% bidding activity with the seller and drove the price to an unrealistic $ 2000. Even if the top 2 bidders are legit I dont find it to be a "clean" auction.

And on the other Dallmeyer (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=360325507928&si=dRfQAyUDYLVqsHD9V8%252FEM1Kn7GY%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT)at $ 3157- the same bidders are involved as in the above auction.

Dallmeyer B's can fetch good money for their f/3 speed, but $ 3K seems a far deviation for a 3B when a late model 2B only got $ 600
Dallmeyer D's have commanded more in auctions than most B+C lenses, but the last 3D sold for $ 1200...a far cry from $ 3157

I am in the process of updating my Soft Focus Lens Value guide, but in the meantime, over the past 9 months, Dallmeyers have sold on ebay at

2nd Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 1A Lens
$ 744
Ebay, brass, no flange

4th Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 1B Lens
$ 744
Ebay, brass

1st Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 2B Lens
$ 600
Ebay, black

3rd Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 2D Lens
$ 500
Ebay, brass, no flange

3rd Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 3A Lens
$ 909
Ebay, brass

3rd Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 3A Lens
$ 924
Ebay, brass

4th Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 3A Lens
$ 2,464
Ebay, refinished, knob replaced ?

4th Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 3D Lens
$ 1,243
Ebay, brass

4th Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 5D Lens
$ 1,307
Ebay, black

4th Qtr 2010
Dallmeyer Patent Portrait 5D Lens
$ 1,944
Ebay, brass

The only auction over $ 2000, was a 3A a few months ago and that auction was suspect.

[eddie]

on wards and upwards prancer and dancer....the sky is the limit.

upward vixen, upward comet

upward dallmeyer, upward voigtlander

higher and higher

blitzen get off that damn dallmeyer 3B or i will break your antler!

oh! this is fun! off to e bay with some very expensive lenses.....:)

[Stephane]

I tried the manual snapping, but my bid did not register...
$381 for a 305mm kodak portrait lens (140488194983).
Damn it!

Makes me feels like I overpaid for my imagon 300 (about 350 euros) that should come to me soon...

[Ramiro Elena]

I wonder how many people here were following that Kodak Portrait (I was).
Did you get any of the other lenses Stephane?

[Stephane]

No I did not. Just the meniscus. I like them. Which explains the tears in my eyes for that kodak...

[Paul Fitzgerald]

Again with the Wollensaks ::eek:

Velostigmat 12" soft focus (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=180599373908&si=KIow6qgzXwhGNWwBh3pOt5Wvi8I%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT)

Yes I was following the Kodak but already have one, very nice lens.

[Darren Kruger]

Another Wollensak Velostigmat Series II, this one a 15 1/2" in a studio shutter. It sold for $382.

360325496388 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=360325496388&si=AHL4GtZlfvPlpZn8VAL0CxnRzhs%253D&viewitem=)

-Darren

[CCHarrison]

And another Velo II (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=230561658923&si=jW8iki0Gelkycdpa9GWxUiKfbzs%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT)for $ 235 !

[Mark Sawyer]

And another Velo II [/URL]for $ 235 !

That one didn't have the dial-in diffusion option, which probably cut its value by half. But this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=360325496388&si=A0cJIhkiXlbOazEePlEwk6OG40A%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEDWX%3AIT

was a steal!

[Jim Galli]

That one didn't have the dial-in diffusion option, which probably cut its value by half. But this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=360325496388&si=A0cJIhkiXlbOazEePlEwk6OG40A%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEDWX%3AIT

was a steal!

The 12" was coated to boot. Beautiful lens for that price even without the fuzz-u-lator (a mark word :D ) And this one I meant to steal and must have fallen into a deep slumber :eek:

[Mark Sawyer]

This was a bargain for a rare and wonderful lens:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=400180558531&si=rL8ZYwjqaKSGAulTvTJd4xBqeAU%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEDWX%3AIT

($710 + s&h for a 420mm f/4.5 Goerx Hypar in a barrel, complete with flange, pictured and described as in very nice condition.)

[CCHarrison]

I believe thats a regular Hypar, not the "Portrait Hypar"

Dan

[Jon Wilson]

This was a bargain for a rare and wonderful lens:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=400180558531&si=rL8ZYwjqaKSGAulTvTJd4xBqeAU%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEDWX%3AIT

($710 + s&h for a 420mm f/4.5 Goerx Hypar in a barrel, complete with flange, pictured and described as in very nice condition.)

I was bidding on it, but with further research I came across indicated it was similar to a Wollensak Varium. I already have a 18" Varium and could not justify another lens which would be similar to the Varium.

Please correct me if I am mistaken that the lens sold is similar to the Wollly Varium.

Jon

[Steven Tribe]

CC I think it is exactly what you have in your Soft lens articles under Portrait Hypar. I note that the data/rim engraving you have, only shows those marketed in the USA. This 42cm corresponds exactly to the 16.5" F4.5 version you have listed. Perhaps the "Portrait" designation was only used on those for export? Or the American Goerz organisation insisted on it?

[Mark Sawyer]

I agree with Steven; to my knowledge (which is limited), there was only one type of large Hypar, the Portrait Hypar. (There were also much smaller Kino Hypars, made as movie camera lenses.)

How it compares to the Varium, I don't know; the Hypar was, as far as I can tell, Goerz's version of the Cooke triplet.

[CCHarrison]

The two that I have seen - and the one on my site - are marked Portrait Hypar. Maybe Steven is on to something with this being a US version?? I need to do a bit of research...

In the 1915 American Goerz catalog (http://www.cameraeccentric.com/html/info/goerz_4.html) they state Portrait Hypar throughout which was sold as a f/4.5 lens although the 12 + 14 inch lenses could be supplied at f/3.5

Anyone have a European Goerz catalog from 1912-20 listing the Hypar?

Dan

http://antiquecameras.net/images/311_hypar.jpg

[Steven Tribe]

I wasn't on sale through the usual Goerz distributor in Sweden in 1912 or 1917.
I have the feeling that the Heliar (4.5 and 3.5) and the Universal Heliar had already covered the market for a "glowing" triplet.
Our german "correspondents" must search for it!

[cowanw]

In the Goerz catalogue images of the Hypar, the "portrait" is left out on the side of the lens.
Regards
Bill

[CCHarrison]

The question is what the lens rim says.... Dan

[Jim Galli]

Even if they are the same (and they very likely are) the mindset of the wacko collectors that drive these nutty prices will be the same or similar to a Bi-Quality 14" Pinkham vss an earlier one that says Visual Quality Series IV being somehow better and worth more. Nothing to be done. If your Hypar says 'Portrait' on it, it's gonna be worth more.

[Paul Fitzgerald]

It may only be stamped 'Portrait' on the f/3.5 version.

[Steven Tribe]

No! The catalogue text in CCHarrison's show the F4.5 versions under the same heading - Portrait Hypar.
Could this be like the "Portrait" Unar I which think was only sold as such on the Americal market by B&L?
Jim, I am sure my first series Universal Heliar (but with just Heliar on the rim) would make the same as the ordinary, later, version. Not that it is coming on the market.

[Mark Sawyer]

Could this be like the "Portrait" Unar I which think was only sold as such on the Americal market by B&L?

The Unar was a four-element design that preceded Tessar; the Portrait Unar had the moving mid-element for softness, but it didn't do much. For "real" softness, the rear two elements could be used alone.

The closest B&L lens to the Portrait Hypar would be the Sigmar, also very close to the Cooke Triplet, but like the Hypar, without a moving middle element of the Universal Heliar and Cooke Portrait lenses.

[Trevor Johnson]

This just went up last night! :)

Wollensak Velostigmat, Series II f.4.5 12" in. SOFT FOCUS with original Lens Cap.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290515038946&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT

[Paul Fitzgerald]

I guess the recession is actually over viewing this thread:

Universal Heliar 300mm (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&nma=true&item=250744582559&si=o4cR9cOVTkCMpd%252FFuwi3bMkDNXI%253D&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT)

a fine and fulfilling Festivus to all :D

[Mark Sawyer]

Somebody is stimulating the economy one lens at a time!

[Emil Schildt]

I made a (high) bid on this one - didn't get it....

Good price? (950€ for Plaubel Peco Universal II m. Universal-Heliar 1:4,5 / 30 cm and Angulon 1:6,8 120 and extras...)



http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemnext&item=180601680966.html

[Steven Tribe]

Very good price for the buyer, I think. Coated. I suppose the real soft lens hungry
don't want the bother of deposing of the remainder.

[Jim Galli]

A 30cm Universal sold just a week or so ago alone for $2600+ Yes, getting most of your 950 back for the Plaubel and the accessories and the Angulon sold seperately is just too trying when it's so easy to pop the $2650 :rolleyes:

Thank goodness the world is full of those folks. It pays for my hobby.

[Emil Schildt]

A 30cm Universal sold just a week or so ago alone for $2600+ Yes, getting most of your 950 back for the Plaubel and the accessories and the Angulon sold seperately is just too trying when it's so easy to pop the $2650 :rolleyes:

Thank goodness the world is full of those folks. It pays for my hobby.

yes - sadly I wasn't able to make a higher bid... was overbid by 100€...

Crap.. but that's life...

Still a lens to really want......................

[Steven Tribe]

"Still a lens to really want......................".
-to own? Then I can't help you!
-to loan? Then I can help you - 30cm - but no coating.
Get in touch Emil when you are ready for it.

[Emil Schildt]

"Still a lens to really want......................".
-to own? Then I can't help you!
-to loan? Then I can help you - 30cm - but no coating.
Get in touch Emil when you are ready for it.

wow - I would love that....

I have the feeling the universal heliar and me are made for each other...;)

[Steven Tribe]

On a 9x9" at the moment - remember - only loan!

[Jan Pedersen]

With that kinds of offers i will be thinking about moving back to Denmark :)

[Steven Tribe]

Jan it makes perfect sense to me. I was very lucky to get hold of this Universal. It came with a Universal Studio - undetected by me before I unloaded at home. I have been similarly blessed with 3 other SF lenses in a 12 month period. I know I can't get around to all of them before 2012 at the earliest. And this is not at 8x10 coverage lens.
Perhaps lenses are like pearls - they are supposed to "shine" more when regularly used.
Perhaps Gandolfi can also loosen up the moving mechanism at the same time!

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

well, a P&S 17" Semi Achromat listed (w. a typo) for BuyItNow $3500

[Jim Galli]

well, a P&S 17" Semi Achromat listed (w. a typo) for BuyItNow $3500

I'm surprised you could even find it. There were 1598 search results for Pinkham thanks to the famous name spammer from the Czech Republic. I've reported it over and over and Ebay does absolutely nothing.

[seven]

i'm surprised nobody bought it yet...

[8x10 user]

I think that one was listed by error and is not for sale.

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

It didn't sell finally....(I expect a relist).

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

A complete Burke & James Rembrandt camera with "Portrait" lens - a Darlot-Petzval soft focus lens according to the Lens Vademecum, at a bargain price: 320636315555 but needs TLC.

[Mark Sawyer]

Klaus, are you sure that's the soft focus Darlot? They had regular Petzvals also marked as "Portrait" lenses. (BTW, everybody, it's in Virginia, local pick-up only.)