First Tripod Advice

[b.cipolla]

Hey there. So I finally bought my first 4x5 after extensively using a Horseman Field Camera in college. I wound up buying a Wisner Traditional from John Wilton through this forum. Now, I need to track down a tripod. I literally have no idea where to start except for having very limited budget. I also know I want it to be able to be fairly versatile in terms how high or low it can get (0'-6'?). Other than that I am clueless. Does anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!

[Brian C. Miller]

Look for a used tripod. I bought a Bogen 3036 many years ago, and it has been consistently sturdy. I replaced the levels on mine and a couple of parts, and it has always been reliable. Get yourself a good head that will take the weight of your camera. I use a heavy duty pan-tilt head because I also use that tripod with my 8x10.

[Bill_1856]

Used TILTALL (made by Leitz). Under $100. 6 pounds with an excellent built-in pan/tilt head. Will last a lifetime. The best combination of price/weight/quality.

[Hector.Navarro]

another vote for Tiltall, it supports my cambo SC 4x5.

[Steve Barber]

FEISOL Three-section tripod CT-3371 with Tripod Bag

[Wade D]

This may be overkill for a 4x5 but an old Majestic tripod is built like a tank. Weighs 12 pounds and extends to 7.5 feet. Will hold the camera and photographer too! They come up cheap on craigslist and ebay once in a while. I've had mine for 40+ years and love it.

[ki6mf]

I use a wood Berlebach. It works and weighs like carbon without the cost. My back up is a used Bogen 3021 I found for $60 or a used Tiltall.

http://www.berlebach.de/?bereich=firma&sprache=english

[Frank Petronio]

The older Tiltall tripods are the best value, look for an American-made one in good condition. Parts are available here:

http://www.plumeltd.com/tiltall.htm

Other brands can be good, but for example, I've found that some of the Bogen-Manfrotto products can simply wear out and get loose with time. Anything with plastic parts can get wobbly, etc.

Baring that, the next significant step up is a mid-level Chinese Carbon Fiber tripod like a Fiesol.

On the higher end, Ries makes the best wooden ones and Gitzo makes the best modern ones. Sometimes an older used metal Gitzo is a good value but do your research as they made hundreds of models and some are too big or little for your set-up.

[Toyon]

An important consideration is whether you want one with a center brace. I find them extremely useful for stabilizing the camera on strange slopes, boggy ground or other unusual surfaces. On the other hand, they limit how low you can go with your camera and how much you can spread the legs, and they add weight. Overall, however, I would go for the center brace type. I have had a Manfrotto for 10 years, they are robust and well made. But, you should check nuts every once in a while as they loosen over time.

[ljsegil]

Very happy with my Fiesol, prefer it over the Manfrotto that preceded it.
Larry

[ki6mf]

The wood Berlebach is half the cost of a Reis!

[John Kasaian]

If price is the driving factor, a used Tiltall wins hands down. If you have the money a woody like the Berlebach looks snazzy and does a great job supporting a field camera. I'd take a used Reis over a new Berlebach for the same price however. My 2-cents.:)

[Matus Kalisky]

I have one of the Feisol tournament models (4 sections per leg - fits in carry on luggage). It is just perfect. Light and sturdy. Together with Photo Clam PC36 ball head it is one of the lightest full size setups that can support a light 4x5. Total weight just above 3 pounds.

I guess Gitzo is even better, but I just could not spend that much. Surely the Fesiol is much better than the Benro I had before (also carbon tripod).

I got both from http://reallybigcameras.com/ . Kerry was very helpful upon selection of the right model.

[Greg Miller]

A good quality tripod will give you many years of good service. A crappy tripod will be of no value at all. Same for the head. I regret buying a series of cheap tripods and heads early on. If I had to do it all over again, I would just bite the bullet and spend the money necessary to get a good tripod and head. It would have been cheaper in the long run.

If you can, handle as many other peoples tripods to see what features you like or not. And ask the owner what they like or not. Then you can buy a tripod that you will use and like for a long time.

Whatever you do, do not buy a cheap wobbly tripod - total waste of money.

[36cm2]

Greg Miller got it 100% right. Someone gave me the same advice when I started, I followed it and have been happy ever since. I've seen several people not follow it and be miserable for a good while before finally admitting defeat and buying a susbstantial tripod.

[SAShruby]

My advice...

There are some items you have forever, one of those items is tripod. Buy either used or new, go for carbon fiber tripod. You do it only once. And you're good to go for any type of photography, ever. Otherwise it's a waste of precious greenbucks.

There is one rule I always follow. If you're poor, buy the best on the market (not necessarily the highest priced), because you probably can buy only once in a while. It'll cost you less than having junk replaced all the time.

I bet I'm not the first one to say it, didn't check previous posts.

[b.cipolla]

Greg, 36cm2, and SAShruby I see all your advice and it makes sense. Would Feisol be a good choice or should I be looking at something else?

[SAShruby]

I personally settled for older Gitzo 1548.

http://media.the-digital-picture.com/Images/Other/Gitzo-GT5540LS-6x-Carbon-Fiber-Tripod-with-G1548.jpg

[b.cipolla]

So I've definitely decided on going the route of buying a more expensive tripod that will stand the test of time. I would also like something that I would be able to use with other cameras such as medium format or 35 mm cameras. I'm currently looking at the Feisols. Any thoughts on this?

[b.cipolla]

I'm feeling the Feisol CT-3402 with center column kit.

[Matus Kalisky]

I'm feeling the Feisol CT-3402 with center column kit.

Drop a mail to Kerry T. He will gladly help you and will answer any questions you may have. I would not hesitate to buy form him again.

[KyledeC]

Look for a used older Gitzo. Series 2 or 3. This tripod will last you a life time. Easy to repair, and easy to find parts for. I bought mine which was used and older for about $300. If you can afford to get a newer one than don't get one made out of carbon fiber! If you drop it in the field there is a good chance it will shatter, look for aluminum. There is a reason these tripods are expensive, they are very well built and solid! If you are serious about LF you are gonna need a good solid tripod. And in my experience, Gitzo is the way to go.

[Greg Miller]

Greg, 36cm2, and SAShruby I see all your advice and it makes sense. Would Feisol be a good choice or should I be looking at something else?

Sorry, I have never handled a Feisol so i cannot comment.

[Greg Miller]

Look for a used older Gitzo. Series 2 or 3. This tripod will last you a life time. Easy to repair, and easy to find parts for. I bought mine which was used and older for about $300. If you can afford to get a newer one than don't get one made out of carbon fiber! If you drop it in the field there is a good chance it will shatter, look for aluminum. There is a reason these tripods are expensive, they are very well built and solid! If you are serious about LF you are gonna need a good solid tripod. And in my experience, Gitzo is the way to go.

I have used a carbon fiber tripod for many years, and I am pretty tough on my gear. I have never seen a carbon fiber tripod shatter (mine or anyone else's). I would worry more about gouging the carbon fiber on a rock. But the low weight and high dampening attributes of the carbon fiber make it far superior to aluminum for my type of usage. And in colder weather carbon fiber is much warmer to carry around than heat sucking metals.

[Greg Miller]

I'm feeling the Feisol CT-3402 with center column kit.

This is subjective, but I hate 4 section tripods. Other people don't mind it and like the smaller collapsed size, but I want a tripod that is as easy and fast to set up and take down as possible. A 4 section tripod has 50% more extensions (9 vs. 6) to do when setting up and taking down. A 4 section tripod may sacrifice a little bit of stability too.

If you have a chance play with 3 section and 4 section tripods before you buy, to be sure a 4 section tripod is something you can live with.

[Frank Petronio]

If you can afford to get a newer one than don't get one made out of carbon fiber! .... And in my experience, Gitzo is the way to go.


Dude, a couple of days ago you were asking, "What camera to buy?" questions, did you get experienced that quickly?

[Richard Wasserman]

A couple years ago I couldn't resist the low prices and bought a couple used Linhof aluminum tripods and think they are a great product and value. I have a Twin Shank that goes to about 80 inches, is like a rock, and doesn't weigh much more than my Gitzo 1325 CF tripod. I also have a smaller one that I can't remember the name of that would be a wonderful fit for a field camera. They are not the most compact, but they are easy to use–not at all fiddly. I don't know what I paid for them, but it wasn't a lot.

[Eric Brody]

Everyone seems to love whatever they have... duh. Unless I missed it, the op never mentioned if he's using it right next to his car or hiking 20 miles with it. That kind of thing matters. Large metal or wooden tripods start to get heavy after a mile or so, especially if you're going up a mountain or walking on sand dunes. I have a couple of old aluminum Gitzos that work really well... if you have a llama or never carry them.

I finally got a 3 series Gitzo carbon fiber, 3 section, no center post (fewer parts, fewer joints, arguably more stable than a 4 section unit- though if you're a traveler and want to stuff it in a bag..., perhaps consider the 4 section) and a used Arca head. I'll likely never buy another tripod, unless mine is stolen. I too have never heard of carbon fiber shattering. Perhaps the only problem I've ever had with carbon is that it almost blew over in a serious wind...with my Arca on it!

Good luck in your quest.

[b.cipolla]

In regard to where I shoot, I kind of go all over, so it could be anywhere in between shooting next to my car or a 20 mile hike.

[jim kitchen]

Now, I need to track down a tripod...

Dear b.cipolla,

I have two different tripods, one for indoor work, and one for outdoor work... :)

That said, the carbon fiber tripod works well indoors, because the spiked feet on my outdoor surveyor's tripod would surely upset the owners of any home. My modified outdoor surveyor's tripod has a central eye-hook below the center point of the tripod head's flat plate, and occasionally I must place a dog pound screw into the ground below the center point of the tripod, as required when the wind is howling above sixty kph, but only when the ground temperature allows me to do so, and there is not a fourteen-foot egg shaped boulder just below the surface and, or the tripod's spiked feet cannot penetrate the rocky or frozen soil. I can loop a strong rope through the tripod's base plate eyelet and wrap the rope through the dog pound screw located directly below the tripod's center, where I pull on the rope, forcing the tripod's legs and the tripod's head closer and tighter to the ground before I click the shutter. This method is very successful, compared to looking for fifty pounds of rocks to load into a bag, and when you find the dead weight to hang from the center of the tripod, the image has left the building.

A wooden tripod, and a real heavy wooden tripod that can absorb most vibrations, happens to be your best friend for success. The absolutely God awful flimsy carbon tripod might be pleasant to look at and extremely easy to carry into the field for most image makers, but they are an absolute, absolute piece of crap in a real strong wind, and a real world environment. You should try to close a frigging carbon tripod when it is minus 40 degrees Celsius, compared to a wooden tripod that closes in seconds, even when it is wrapped in ice. I would cringe if my Gitzo shattered into a scrillion pieces, just because I thought it was lighter that my heavy wooden tripod, when I had to carry it into the field for more than ten kilometres.

Many folks will tell you that their light and excellent carbon tripod can do the job effectively, but I do not buy that crap for a second, because I have used both, and I made my choice several years ago to use a heavy, easy to collapse wooden surveyor's tripod, even if my son must carry it.

Just my two pennies...

jim k

[Frank Petronio]

You know what I hate? When my Carbon-Fiber B1-b bomber gets cold and it shatters over Afghanistan. I much prefer my Wooden aeroplane.

Seriously, I use a lowly Tiltall but I've owned some of the CF tripods too. Carbon-Fiber is not like your everyday plastic. I can't rationalize investing in the CF Gitzo I prefer, but I have no doubt they are the ultimate-best, and the Chinese knock-offs are awfully good as well.

I will concede that putting a heavy camera on top of a spindly flyweight tripod puts things off balance and is more of a compromise for those seeking weight savings above everyday practicality, but if you anchor or weight the tripod as recommended and per the laws of physics, then why not go that route for backpacking situations?

There are some fairly ridiculous posts from photographers who say they put their 8x10s on tiny Gitzo 12xx-series tripods. Which might work if you only make level shots between 22- to 48-inches high. But the second some wind comes up or you tip the camera down or try to shoot over the tops of the weeds, I think you'd having troubles. A better match is the 13xx-series for moderate 4x5s and the 15xx-series for 8x10. Those aren't going to blow away....

I wouldn't blame stupidity and lack of judgement on Carbon-Fiber... after all I've seen plenty of people attempt to use 4x5s on their metal $29.95 Promaster Coast Walmart tripods.

I'd love to see an example of a cold- or otherwise shattered Carbon-Fiber tripod.

[b.cipolla]

Again, thank you everyone for all of the great advice. Thanks to your suggestions I have slightly narrowed my search to a used, 3-section gitzo. I'm thinking aluminum because I do sometimes set up in some sketchy places and would not want to break a carbon fiber tripod. I shoot in all kinds of places, from indoor to outdoor. I am shooting for a tripod around $300 I think at this point.

[Ron Marshall]

Again, thank you everyone for all of the great advice. Thanks to your suggestions I have slightly narrowed my search to a used, 3-section gitzo. I'm thinking aluminum because I do sometimes set up in some sketchy places and would not want to break a carbon fiber tripod. I shoot in all kinds of places, from indoor to outdoor. I am shooting for a tripod around $300 I think at this point.

Carbon fiber is tough. I also put foam pipe insulation over the legs so I can beat it up and not worry. Spend the extra and get the CF, otherwise in a couple of years you will be in the market again.

[b.cipolla]

Yeah, I guess you're right I should just bite the bullet.

[Greg Miller]

Carbon fiber is tough. I also put foam pipe insulation over the legs so I can beat it up and not worry. Spend the extra and get the CF, otherwise in a couple of years you will be in the market again.

Ditto this. And nobody has ever called my Gitzo GT3530LS flimsy. It is well capable of supporting 4x5 in all conditions; or a pro DSLR with a long f4 prime lens. And still light enough that I backpack with it.

[SAShruby]

I use my CF gitzo from 5Mp digital to 8x20 ULF. And I mount is as 20x8!!! Sideways... Don't forger to buy good geared head ;) (another $150 or so)

[Eric Brody]

It might be pretty hard to find a carbon tripod, even used, with a head, for $300 but if you look at a Feisol (Kerry Thalmann is reputed to be honest, even if he is an Oregonian :-) or a used 2 series Gitzo you might make it. I know nothing of the Feisol's but have had Gitzo's, aluminum and carbon for over twenty years.

Heads are another matter. You'll interact more with the head than the legs. Some like pan-tilt, some like ball heads. I used the Gitzo pan-tilt heads on the aluminum tripods with 4x5 and they work well. When I went to carbon, I got a used Arca B1 and never looked back, YMMV, see which you prefer, it's pretty personal. If possible spend a few days playing with each before you commit.
Have fun.

[b.cipolla]

Anyone have any experience with a Gitzo G1228, GT2330 or GT2530? I thought the G1228 might look a little too flimsy. Again, I have a Wisner Traditional.

[Ron Marshall]

Anyone have any experience with a Gitzo G1228, GT2330 or GT2530? I thought the G1228 might look a little too flimsy. Again, I have a Wisner Traditional.

That is what I use with my Toho and Sinar F1. It is fine for the Sinar, but that is about the limit in my opinion.

[Kermit Burroughs]

I use a 1228 with a Z1 head for my Zone VI. Seems ok, if a little shorter than I'd like.

[Wally]

...
I'd love to see an example of a cold- or otherwise shattered Carbon-Fiber tripod.

I broke my Feisol's head. I had the tripod splayed out to get it low to the ground, and after the shot I tried to use it to help me stand. Stupid, stupid.

The carbon fiber legs are fine. But the metal cap on one of the legs cracked and the head, where this leg cap was attached, broke into three pieces.

Before my bone-headed move the Fiesol served me well. Now I'm back to my trusty (and forgiving) Tilt-All.

[Steve Barber]

Anyone have any experience with a Gitzo G1228, GT2330 or GT2530? I thought the G1228 might look a little too flimsy. Again, I have a Wisner Traditional.

Earlier, I mentioned a Feisol CT-3371 and that is still what I would recommend. I have the G-1228 MK II and it is too light to be a reliable tripod for a Wisner 4x5.

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?p=531288#post531288

[Kirk Fry]

I have a 40 year old Tiltall. Still going. I also have a Majestic, overkill for 4X5 but great for that 8X10 you will eventually get.

[b.cipolla]

Earlier, I mentioned a Feisol CT-3371 and that is still what I would recommend. I have the G-1228 MK II and it is too light to be a reliable tripod for a Wisner 4x5.

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?p=531288#post531288

Are the RAL Anti-Rotation Legs necessary?

[Really Big Cameras]

Are the RAL Anti-Rotation Legs necessary?

No. It's a convenience feature that makes it faster and easier to set-up and collapse the tripod legs. You can read more on the advantages of RAL Anti-Rotation Legs here (http://reallybigcameras.com/Feisol/Feisol%20Rapid%20Tripods.htm#RAL).

Kerry Thalmann
Really Big Cameras (http://reallybigcameras.com/)

[Steve Barber]

Are the RAL Anti-Rotation Legs necessary?

I do not have them, so I really do not know enough about them to say. Main thing is to always start at the bottom and go up to loosen and at the top and go down to tighten the collars on each leg and not to over tighten them.

[b.cipolla]

OK, I've settled on the Traditional Feisol CT-3371 with center column now I just need to pick a tripod head. In the past, I've only used a 3-way head. I'm thinking about a geared head to cut down on the size of a pan-tilt head. I've never used a ball head before but I like being able to adjust each axis independently. Any recommendations?

[b.cipolla]

Also, I definitely want a quick release system too.

[b.cipolla]

the manfrotto 410 looks nice but maybe a little too expensive?

[aduncanson]

I use the Manfrotto 410 on the 3771 legs (but no column) and it works very well for me. There are a couple of concerns.

1) The pitch knob quickly interferes with the top plate of the tripod as you tilt the camera up and soon limits that movement. To get around this limit, I shorten the rear tripod leg to point the platform itself up. This problem may not occur with the Feisol center column.

2) Much of the weight of the 3771 is at the top of the legs. The not insubstantial weight of the Manfrotto 410 makes the combination fairly top heavy. Except to make it a little awkward when carrying it, I have yet to have this cause any real problem.

I love the 410 head and will happily put up with these problems.