Mad Artist takes on Lf with a view to kill!!! [Archive]

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cosmicexplosion

27-Jun-2010, 00:11

Kill what! Well, mediocracy first. Then All the naysayers who say i cant take risks, I might even kill that part of my self that doesn't finish projects. (or the dishes). Hello every one My Name is andrew Nichols, I am An artist from sydney Australia, Living close to the coast. I am on a quixotic adventure to take on the landscape, with a twist. Whilst i will be learning all i can to make me as skilled as i need to be, My usual approach is half skill and half intuition, enabling me my own little thrill of discovery as i venture into the unknown. My current mission is a long term goal that merges landscape photography with installation art. Let me say though I am honoured to be here as part of the collective 'mastermind'. I am pretty loose and not to uptight, I am a vegetarian, who reads stiener, and practices meditation and some yoga. Althou not the most regular. I have a vegi garden. I love painting oil on canvas and have done so for 22 years. i am 36yo, tall and lanky. BY day i build for cash, as well as design. Also by day when i am not working, i play music, read and study. But now I am learning to take pictures instead of painting them. Painting has taught me composition. So it comes naturally. Well, It can do when i get out of my own way! As part of my usual risk taking strategy I bought a 19" and a 14" dagor from eBay 6 days ago for $3500au, it was expensive but i think they are good. And as i am doing art, i want something unique. so i will buy some more unique lenses but i have already 5, 3 that i got with my horseman 6x12. (see profile) I am yet to fire a shot! but i have bought all of Ansell's books, and am keen to learn, so if any one wants to teach me how to use a horsman go right ahead. Maybe we can swap something, i have many skills. but first i am trying to get a camera for my dagor 19" i want an 8x10, but am not sure which. I dont always have alot of money as i have given up full time work to be an artist. And I have never used a LF, so I am looking for The ideal learners one. Does any one think deardorff and ebony look similar? I would absolutly love some feedback, or an offer of a camera if i come over and fix your porch, or give you a painting or a mural, or ccccccash. THank you for your time and welcome to the me you see....Andrew Nichols

Ross Chambers

27-Jun-2010, 00:55

Heavens, what can I say? Probably best to say nothing, I guess.

Best of luck.

cosmicexplosion

27-Jun-2010, 02:09

Thank you for your reply ross and mdm, Who is Julia, and do you think any one who does not fit the mould should take medication? mmmm... but what i find to border on an insult is the idea that i should buy a holga and be done with it! done with what!, why don't you buy a holga and be done with it. I suppose the same reason that you and every one else has come to the craft, and put up with years of learning and expense, for passion, for the love of nature, the human being, and art. I am also not quite sure that as a welcome to a forum i should be suggested medication. Nor am i sure that you are qualified to make the call. And any way what do you suggest, some thing that numbs me down, so we can then relate? Or have you become accustom as i have noticed some, to use this place to vent their spleen and take pot shots from their trench of anonymity. But I thank you for taking the time out of your busy day to at least offer a reply. Lets see what sort of people call them selfs so.

mdm

27-Jun-2010, 03:08

I apologise for that and good luck with your quest. I did not mean to cause offence.

It is a wonderful passtime this and I am shure you will go on to great things in the future.

David

Ash

27-Jun-2010, 03:14

Welcome to the forum.

Pleeeease use line breaks! It makes it a lot easier to read!!!!

I don't think kit, or cost, or enthusiasm, can make someone an artist, or a 'director'...and if they did, I'm not sure it makes them a good or memorable one.

Just as any true artist could make a masterpiece with the cheapest pencil & scrap paper, a person with the most expensive kit doesn't make them a better photographer than the person without.

Painting is vastly different from photography.

I recommend you go out & enjoy taking photographs & learn how to as an 'enthusiast', remaining a painter/vegetarian/yogi/etc.

Read books on the theory of photography, not just the technique.

Do you have a concept for the installation? That should have dictated your image format.

Take some photos. Post some pictures, get some responses.

cosmicexplosion

27-Jun-2010, 04:06

Thank you Ash,

I am a line breeeeeeeeeaker from now on.

I understand how annoying it is to accommodate the freshman. But like a puppy i hope my enthusiasm pays for my spills.

(break)

Thank you for your advice on theory, i had not really thought about it.

I do however have some set ideas, or visions of what i want to achieve and i am very encouraged to see them real.

I understand that money does not buy talent, I grew up in a poor family in tasmania, with a single mum and 5 brothers and sisters. I know poor.

I have spent my whole life pursuing art, and been interested in commercial success, only when i have artistic merit, and could have gone commercial years ago and made a good money. so i am actually true to my self. even though it has been hard and i have had some usually insurmountable obstacles that many never get through.

I like the saying 'enthusiasm is genius of honesty', not sure who said it, but i think we need to muster all the force at our disposal to get things done, lest we sit around and watch.

I spent time in prison for chaining myself to tractors to protect the rainforest.

I have bush walked all over tasmania. I have spent years in australian bush and desert getting to know her. I have painted her. I am half country half city.

But I have a deep convinction of my vision, as i have carried it for 2 years and am now kitting up to go to stage one.

I dont mind spending up to 3000 on a second hand camera that i know will hold its value, as i will be spending alot of time with it, and want it to be my friend. I want to look at it and smile. not think what a dumb ugly bastard who wont work!

But I am taking LF on as a career move not as a hobby or enthusiast. I don't do things by half's.

Thank you ash for you'r reply, I now have something to think about. any good theory books on your shelf?

darr

27-Jun-2010, 05:36

Good Luck on your Quest Andrew!

brian mcweeney

27-Jun-2010, 06:42

More power to you Andrew. Go for it.

Heroique

27-Jun-2010, 06:57

...I spent time in prison for chaining myself to tractors to protect the rain forest...

You must be one of the “good guys” – thank you!

And look forward to your LF photos of the rain forest … Hope it’s still there.

David Hedley

27-Jun-2010, 07:18

I have bush walked all over tasmania. I have spent years in australian bush and desert getting to know her. I have painted her. I am half country half city.

But I have a deep convinction of my vision, as i have carried it for 2 years and am now kitting up to go to stage one.

Are you able to share some examples of your paintings? I'd be interested.

Winger

27-Jun-2010, 10:02

I also say more power to you! LF doesn't have to be a hobby just because someone's new to it, btw. Just make sure you have fun with it!

kev curry

27-Jun-2010, 10:33

Why 8x10 over 5x4 Andrew? Not to be at all negative;-) but have you considered the practicalities of carrying an 8x10 plus all the other related gear around in the landscape...film holders, lenses, tripod/head etc etc. All that kit can get heavy very quickly...exhaustion kills inspiration dead. That was my journey.... but thats me.

Many people dont see any significant difference in prints made with 8x10 and 5x4 unless the goal is big prints. Saying all that, 8x10s an intense itch, it was for me and gear can usually be resold without much if any loss if it doesn't 'happen'.

You dont mention if you have a preference for B/W or colour film. The cost of 8x10 film needs to be considered...its not cheap. If you want to shoot colour you need to factor processing costs...again not cheap.

How do you intend to print the negs...traditionally with an 8x10 enlarger, contact print with a simple bare light bulb or scan and print digitally? These thing need to be considered.

Many notable photographers recommend/ed one camera one lens and one film.
Not everyone agrees with that philosophy, but.....simplicity has its own power.

Vick Vickery

27-Jun-2010, 10:52

Welcome to group therepy! You may need it! :) Most of us do from time to time!

You're starting out with good equipment, but remember not to expect to do you best work from the start...there is a definate learning curve in LF and we all have had to go thru it. It makes you slow down and think about what you're doing more than smaller formats which tend to encourage a "shoot lots and see whats good" attitude among a lot of folks.

Hope you enjoy the camera snd lenses. Have fun with 'em!

Michael Graves

27-Jun-2010, 16:01

In spite of the flack I'll probably take for suggesting this, I think that if you can get your hands on Fred Picker's Zone System Workshop you will get off to a magnificent head start. I boils down the basics of Ansel's Trilogy into a short and very understandable book.

Kirk Gittings

27-Jun-2010, 16:12

Michael Graves

27-Jun-2010, 16:22

Andrew, the editor in my head wouldn't stop mumbling, so I went into my office and pulled Picker's book off the shelf. It is Zone VI Workshop, and not Zone System Workshop. Forgive my error, and for inspiration check out some of Mr. Gittings' fine work. I was showing his book Chaco Body to one of my colleagues, who commented, "So...does this guy make you feel bad or what?" Guess I should pull the prints from my cube at work, huh?

Lachlan 717

27-Jun-2010, 16:34

Kirk Gittings

27-Jun-2010, 17:31

Michael Wynd

27-Jun-2010, 19:08

Hi Andrew,
yes 8x10 is harder in Australia, but I have found that my work has improved since I went up from 4x5, not in quantity, but quality. I shoot mainly landscapes and all in black and white, so I wish you good luck and have lots of fun. Don't let anyone tell you you're an idiot for choosing the big format, because the results are worth it.
Here's a link to my flickr page. All except one or two are shot on the 8x10.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/40218037@N05/

cheers
Mike

cosmicexplosion

28-Jun-2010, 00:42

Thank you every one for your supportive words and practical advice.

I will respond individually, but for now I must look some of the things 'you' said up.

I want to go large, both colour and black and white, as i want to make large prints.

I saw a place called blanco negro here in redfern that do large printing. They look expensive, but thats art.

I will Just have to sell my work for allot to make up for it... smirk!

sun of sand

28-Jun-2010, 14:54

Lachlan 717

28-Jun-2010, 15:16

mdm

28-Jun-2010, 18:53

Nice new line spacing

I find it comical how this guy states about himself everything 60% or better of the site would over time
in one post
and is told to get medication
when the only difference between them is that this guy doesn't write very well

it isn't shocking, though.

I dont think he was told to get medication. What was stated was that he may soon be under medical supervision, with the political direction his country has taken. That was stated tounge in cheek by someone who understands what it is to be ruled by a politically savvy but apparently sexless politician. Welcom to the club Australia. Cosmicexplosion, Andrew, did not understand that and took offence, note that the post in question was deleted before he responded, though he would not have known that unless he refreshed his window. Sarcasm, they say, is the lowest form of wit.

I would like to point out in the nicest possible way that Andrew, the original poster, does not seem to be very methodical, that Ansel Adams who he cites as an example may have been the most methodical photographer ever born. Aiming high is no crime and some who do, and succeed, change the world we live in.

Read before you write.

David

Ben Syverson

28-Jun-2010, 19:18

Andrew seems super excited about LF, so I don't see the problem. I say go out and shoot as much as you can, and post pictures so we can see what you're doing!

sun of sand

29-Jun-2010, 04:12

Heavens, what can I say? Probably best to say nothing, I guess
I don't understand the point of that response but it makes me wonder a lot
deleted for being unkind ..i can only assume that something was unkind and not just misunderstood
I apologise for that
for what I don't know
I am shure you will go on to great things in the future.
geez lol
Pleeeease use line breaks
yes ..cause I had SUCH! a difficult/impossible time reading the post
I'll read more into that myself
I don't think kit, or cost, or enthusiasm, can make someone an artist
that really cuts into the forums then
It's true but half the site is built on this stuff yet I don't hear statements like these anywhere NEAR half the time -except- for when a newbie steps into the fold asking about gear or techniques of the masters etc

It's almost as though some people -once theyve posted here for awhile- begin to believe their site reputation makes them an artist
allowing them to ask such things
and that everyone needs to respond
and do so helpfully
to keep their own delusions going

I just look at the quotations people choose to associate themselves with
I estimate 7.9/10 this points to a faker/con artist

What was stated was that he may soon be under medical supervision, with the political direction his country has taken. That was stated tounge in cheek by someone who understands what it is to be ruled by a politically savvy but apparently sexless politician.

I don't even know
it's largeformatphotography.info right

how does that post even make it in
however it was meant
that just leads to more questions for me

Cosmicexplosion, Andrew, did not understand that and took offence
HOW could such a post be misunderstood on a photography site?
I think I understand what the apology is for now

"Aiming high"
that's more questions

Ash

29-Jun-2010, 05:03

Sun of sand, you sound like a troll. You are stirring up trouble where there is none.

There is a method to successfully communicate with online forums. You don't seem to understand this.

Heavens, what can I say? Probably best to say nothing, I guess
I don't understand the point of that response but it makes me wonder a lot
deleted for being unkind ..i can only assume that something was unkind and not just misunderstood
I apologise for that
for what I don't know
I am shure you will go on to great things in the future.
geez lol

If I were to respond to you like so,
"It shure is difficult to understand your criticism here geez/lol/rofl."
That is ad hominem. Instead, your criticisms are uncalled for. Nobody asked for your defense.

Pleeeease use line breaks
yes ..cause I had SUCH! a difficult/impossible time reading the post
I'll read more into that myself

Possibly because of your own monitor & browser setup you find it easy to read, but a constant stream of text sans-serif is less easy to read than something with line breaks.

I don't think kit, or cost, or enthusiasm, can make someone an artist
that really cuts into the forums then
It's true but half the site is built on this stuff yet I don't hear statements like these anywhere NEAR half the time -except- for when a newbie steps into the fold asking about gear or techniques of the masters etc

The difference being that a new member has introduced themself, and provided a platform for discussion. Anybody on this forum that wishes for critique or constructive criticism need only ask. Possibly you don't understand the layout of this board, that it is divided into gear-based discussion as well as image related.

It's almost as though some people -once theyve posted here for awhile- begin to believe their site reputation makes them an artist
allowing them to ask such things
and that everyone needs to respond
and do so helpfully
to keep their own delusions going

You may wish to either direct more insulting remarks at someone in particular, or keep them to yourself. Nobody here has provided any remark close to delusion, nor would anyone consider an online forum having the power to label any person an 'artist'.

I just look at the quotations people choose to associate themselves with
I estimate 7.9/10 this points to a faker/con artist

I estimate 9/10 consider you a troll.

What was stated was that he may soon be under medical supervision, with the political direction his country has taken. That was stated tounge in cheek by someone who understands what it is to be ruled by a politically savvy but apparently sexless politician.

I don't even know

Knowledge is a subjective concept.

it's largeformatphotography.info right

Yes

how does that post even make it in
however it was meant
that just leads to more questions for me

Start your own thread in the Lounge, ask all the questions you need answering.

Cosmicexplosion, Andrew, did not understand that and took offence
HOW could such a post be misunderstood on a photography site?
I think I understand what the apology is for now

"Aiming high"
that's more questions

Once more, start your own thread, as I may not be the only person here that feels your remarks deserve a topic of their own. They clearly require attention that should not be diverted from the original poster's.

Toyon

29-Jun-2010, 05:36

If you are going to spend a lot of money, do it on exposing lots and lots of film, hold off on purchasing more lenses. You'll gain much more from experience and repetition than you will from new equipment.

cosmicexplosion

30-Jun-2010, 04:30

Hey every one have a baby.

I didn't really go to school, am dyslexic, and self educated, so thats why i appear not to be able to write.

BUt i write more from gut.

Any way, some things are constructive here, but can we please move in a different direction.

I have never been in a forum before, and find it really exiting that people from all over the world, actually care enough to have site to help each other out.

SO I finally paid for my 14 and 19 dagor today, it was an impulse buy two in the morning.

I don't yet have a camera, but i am talking to people, and i think i will end up with a dorff as my first as they seem good and simple and cheap.

As a painter i have longed for a good photo of my work but could never afford a pro.
well i did once, but she ripped me off, with some dud shots.

So when i learn, i will shoot my own!!!!

I hope we can be friends as we are like lions, proud but endangered.

Or maybe not, maybe there will be enough of us to keep the industry that serves us alive forever.

But i do think that the inner reflects the outer, and that the world will reveal it self to you, as a photographer in a creative way if you are in tune with it, or at least trying to be. I don't think you can be closed minded and take great shots.

BUt It is going to hard for me to be methodical, and learning all the technical stuff, it will be a challenge, but you have all met me at the very beginning of my journey, when i am a mere glint in the eye of Ansell Adams.

Even that sounds egotistical. but funny.

shots welcome.

I

kev curry

30-Jun-2010, 04:58

Andrew, it sounds like you've done yourself a favour by self educating and staying away from main stream schooling...power to you.

It would be interesting to see your paintings...hope you get that camera soon to start photographing your art and your landscape.

I heard a dyslexic joke recently....

Two dyslexic skiers...One says... come on lets zig zag down that slope.
No... the other one says... its zag zig.
Tell you what says the first, lets ask this fella.
Excuse me sir... when going down the slope do you zig zag or zag zig?
Guy says...No idea I'm a tobogganist.

Oh great says the first.... can I have 20 Marlboro!

Scott --

30-Jun-2010, 05:14

I don't yet have a camera, but i am talking to people, and i think i will end up with a dorff as my first as they seem good and simple and cheap.

Deardorff's are cheap?! I must be living wrong.

Lachlan 717

30-Jun-2010, 05:30

I heard a dyslexic joke recently....

Two dyslexic skiers...One says... come on lets zig zag down that slope.
No... the other one says... its zag zig.
Tell you what says the first, lets ask this fella.
Excuse me sir... when going down the slope do you zig zag or zag zig?
Guy says...No idea I'm a tobogganist.

Oh great says the first.... can I have 20 Marlboro!

Rippa joke, Kev!!

Lachlan 717

30-Jun-2010, 05:36

I don't yet have a camera, but i am talking to people, and i think i will end up with a dorff as my first as they seem good and simple and cheap.

Have you looked at a Toyo 810M field camera? Not cheap, not the lightest, but it's the one that I lust after...

David Hedley

30-Jun-2010, 05:40

As a painter i have longed for a good photo of my work but could never afford a pro.
well i did once, but she ripped me off, with some dud shots.

It would still be interesting to see some examples of your paintings, particularly if, as you say, they are the product of the same experiences that will underpin your photography. It may also help you to get the best from this forum - much better to share images than trade words.

cosmicexplosion

30-Jun-2010, 06:05

ok ok i will post some paintings on a photo site!

JoeV

1-Jul-2010, 16:46

Cosmo:

I'd recommend a bit different starting point. First, set up a simple darkroom for processing photo paper (red safelight, simple trays, etc.) Doesn't have to be fancy or expensive. Use plastic food storage containers, from the market, rather than photo-dedicated trays; and measuring cups instead of laboratory-grade beakers, etc.

Second, start out by shooting paper negatives in your camera. You will learn all the essentials of camera use in the field, and basic processing under red lights, prior to commiting to panchromatic film that has to be processed in pitch darkness. There are a number of threads here, at APUG, and on F295, about shooting with paper negatives. The short story is to either use variable contrast paper with a yellow filter, or use grade 2 paper and/or preflash to control contrast. The paper is typically rated around EI=6-12 in speed for use as a pictorial "film", and it's basically UV/blue sensitive, so the sky gets blown out white, and reds/browns under-expose. And anything that reflects blue/UV easily, like water, are brighter than you may think.

You may find, after using paper negatives, that they may be adequate for your personal vision and artistic exploration. You also have the advantage with paper of easily finding sizes larger than 8x10, should you desire to explore ULF.

Also, there are alternative methods, like pinhole cameras, that lend themselves to large paper negatives.

Good luck, keep us posted.

EDIT: Forgot to mention, you can easily contact print RC paper negatives onto fine, fiber-based paper.

~Joe

Bill_1856

1-Jul-2010, 16:54

Talk is cheap.

Michael Graves

1-Jul-2010, 19:06

Have you looked at a Toyo 810M field camera? Not cheap, not the lightest, but it's the one that I lust after...

That's a good one to lust after. I've owned one for about 25 years now. An Arizona Highways photographer sold me his when he retired, and I have enjoyed it immensely. It is an amazing camera.

cosmicexplosion

2-Jul-2010, 00:39

there is a toyo m on ebay right now, 1600-200

I am fumbling with decision. I suppose the ideal is having one for your pack, for everest etc, and the other for near the car.

so with this logic, the death star toyo looks great.

I say death star, as its clearly Darth vedas LF choice, All black and beasty lookn, not like those pretty red and gold ones.

so 25 years michael, thats along time!!!!

And does it do every thing well? does it have any hang ups, dont care about weight that much. In fact weigt seems like an advantage to a point.

cosmicexplosion

2-Jul-2010, 06:02

hi every one after seeking wisdom from the great council of all beings, (you) i have bought myself a good cheap toyo 5x4.

THis is due to the obvious: cost, cost and cost. oh and availability.

I can learn LF on the 54 and then get the big picture later.

(dont worry i will explore all the puns, old and new)

I actually had no idea that film cost so much!!! "heavens"

So now i can relax, put on my war paint, and plan my first mission.

I would rather be hated for who i am than loved for who i am not ---Kurt Kobain

THanks again for all your advice, it worked!

Jay DeFehr

2-Jul-2010, 10:04

Lachlan 717

2-Jul-2010, 10:36

Unfortunately, you still need a lens, film holders, and a tripod, at a minimum. If you plan to process your film, you'll need some apparatus for that, as well, though that can be as simple as a single tray, or container. If you plan to print your negatives, you'll need a few simple items for contact printing, or an enlarger and accessories, and some dark place to do the printing. Personally, I think the 4x5 is a mistake.

You already had lenses for 8x10, and if you plan to use them some day, you'll have to buy another camera, different film holders, a sturdier tripod, etc. 8x10 is a great format for keeping things simple, and reducing backs would allow you to shoot any smaller format without buying another camera, tripod, lens, etc., just film and holders.

You should think of your system as a whole, from exposure through printing. If you're going to shoot 4x5, how will you print your negs? I like small contact prints, but many photographers don't. I think landscape photos want to be printed larger than portraits do. I find 8x10 contact prints luxurious, yet intimate, and there is a whole world of beautiful printing processes open to contact printers.

4x5 might be a false economy when you factor in printing, unless you intend to contact print.

You're obviously not from Australia, are you? Or, if you do, you're not doing it as tough as the Mining Magnates. Do Andrew a favour and look up 8x10 cameras and equipment on Aussie eBay. Don't look at lenses; just look at cameras and associated (non-lens) equipment.

Then Google film development companies in Australia, including 8x10 development.

Once done with that, try to actually find some 8x10 film on-shore.

I think Andrew's made a great decision in going with 4x5.

He'll be able to do something we like to call "take photos". And, being new to the whole game, he's likely to find people willing to help him with 4x5. 8x10 Shooters will be thin on the ground. Bit like many Forum Members who have gone out of their way to make Andrew feel welcome.

Jay DeFehr

2-Jul-2010, 11:57

Wow, Laclhan. Why so hostile? I'm just trying to be as helpful as I'm able. Our new member has bought two nice lenses he won't be able to use with the camera he bought to use, so no, he won't be able to "take photos" until he buys another lens, among other things. Since Andrew's on a budget, I suspect he'll do his own processing sooner or later, and probably printing too. Buying a 4x5 camera essentially means starting over, for Andrew. Maybe he can afford to keep a few 8x10 lenses in reserve until he decides to either move up to that format, or sell them off, but based on his posts, I don't believe that's the case. So, he'll either have to sell the lenses he just bought, or the camera he just bought to make a kit he can use to "take pictures" with. Other posters have written they get film from Freestyle shipped to Australia reasonably, and another has recommended an Australian seller from ebay for economical film. LF isn't cheap, anywhere. Andrew should know this, and the sooner, the better, that he might make informed decisions about how best to proceed. I think, given his investment in fine 8x10 lenses, recommending he stick with that format and contact print his negatives, during his initiation, is sound advice, open to debate, but not worthy of your sarcasm. Are you having a bad day, Lachlan?

cosmicexplosion

2-Jul-2010, 15:53

A few years ago, i was involved as a director of an artists run gallery in sydney called space three, it was a hoot!,
One of the gallery friends gave me his complete darkroom as he went digital, and as it was his job, all the gear looked pretty good, and alot of it.

I then lent all the gear to some one as i was still a full on painter with only wistful desires to print in the dark room, though i talked about it.

So now i am in the process of clawing it back, not even sure if it does 4x5

Jay, i am with you, i am going to do 8x10 in the future but As yet i am no where near a photographer. so i need to burn film. I am only here to learn 8x10, so i can do large prints. but your description of small an intimate sounds alluring.

I was just a bit shocked by the price of 8x10 film! As i will be learning, the camera i bought was only $150 with 10 film holders for an extra $15 shipping.

I have a manfrotto tripod with a three way head,

Lenses:
a 14" and a 19" dagor goerz, rodenstockf=75, schnider5,6/58 xl 110 w/centerfilter, nikon 200.
dont know what all those numbers mean, but i will one day soon.

so maybe one of the above lens's will work>nikon 200?

I have a customised horsman that a melbourne photographer spent 20k building (with lens's and centerfilter etc).

any way, the 4x5 is only a learner camera. and only 200 odd bucks. ( i am a little broke after buying lens's) (woops)

But i promise, i am going to go 810, in less than 6 months. maybe three.
the sooner you make your first thousand mistakes the better right.
so i just have to get cracking those film canisters. they will fall like spent shells on the battlefield...

Jay DeFehr

2-Jul-2010, 17:00

Andrew,

you have some world class glass to get started with! Is the Horseman a Medium Format camera? Either way, I think you're ready to go! It will be very handy if you can get a darkroom set up. The collective wisdom here is staggering, and I don't believe there's anything photography-related that isn't known by someone here. I'm a hands-on learner, but I supplement my field work with lots of reading, and I highly recommend the practice. Learning is exciting and inspirational, and I think you'll enjoy this experience very much. Good luck, and I hope you'll keep us all posted on your progress.

cosmicexplosion

2-Jul-2010, 17:26

Thank you Lachlan, for your comradeship.

Australia is one small city divided up over the worlds biggest island.
and in the numbers game of supply and demand we lose.

SO while i am getting my spider web of contacts, comrades, friends, adversaries, printers, suppliers and raging fans who turn up to my exhibition like Beatle fans,
I will quietly set up my enlarger and invite disaster!!!

yes Jay horseman is medium format.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200473845096
its worth a look at this camera as it is custom made.

Vaughn

2-Jul-2010, 22:56

I am enjoyably confused! You are a MAP (Mad Aussie Photographer) and you are all over it!

Good luck in your endeavors and I hope we all can be of some service!

Vaughn

sun of sand

5-Jul-2010, 13:53

Sun of sand, you sound like a troll. You are stirring up trouble where there is none.

There is a method to successfully communicate with online forums. You don't seem to understand this.

If I were to respond to you like so,
"It shure is difficult to understand your criticism here geez/lol/rofl."
That is ad hominem. Instead, your criticisms are uncalled for. Nobody asked for your defense.

Possibly because of your own monitor & browser setup you find it easy to read, but a constant stream of text sans-serif is less easy to read than something with line breaks.

The difference being that a new member has introduced themself, and provided a platform for discussion. Anybody on this forum that wishes for critique or constructive criticism need only ask. Possibly you don't understand the layout of this board, that it is divided into gear-based discussion as well as image related.

You may wish to either direct more insulting remarks at someone in particular, or keep them to yourself. Nobody here has provided any remark close to delusion, nor would anyone consider an online forum having the power to label any person an 'artist'.

I estimate 9/10 consider you a troll.

Knowledge is a subjective concept.

Yes

Start your own thread in the Lounge, ask all the questions you need answering.

Once more, start your own thread, as I may not be the only person here that feels your remarks deserve a topic of their own. They clearly require attention that should not be diverted from the original poster's.

maybe some trouble needs to be found
people edit but dont edit well enough to make it clear what has happened to cause the edit
im sure some dont really care and can easily pass things by
id rather respond and be wrong -not saying i am here- than just walk happily along enjoying MY day not giving a sht about anyone elses

Funny how the first thing out of your mouth is "troll"

didn't you just in another thread talk of politeness and etiquette
where does "pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease" fit in with that?
where does "troll"

i don't care if you say "welcome to the forums" when you then proceed to slam a dude
isn't there a PM function on here?
Can't you simply say .. your post can be a little confusing to keep straight while reading
something
why PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESE
does it really need that?
that kind of exaggeration leads me to believe what youre truly saying might be something like
hey, I know youre half dumb so i wont expect more of you but would you at least
..let us take a break every once in while during your post to digest all this crap youre saying?

what makes me believe it more so is all that followed

I don't think kit, or cost, or enthusiasm, can make someone an artist, or a 'director'...and if they did, I'm not sure it makes them a good or memorable one.

Just as any true artist could make a masterpiece with the cheapest pencil & scrap paper, a person with the most expensive kit doesn't make them a better photographer than the person without.

Painting is vastly different from photography.

I recommend you go out & enjoy taking photographs & learn how to as an 'enthusiast', remaining a painter/vegetarian/yogi/etc.

Read books on the theory of photography, not just the technique.

Do you have a concept for the installation? That should have dictated your image format.

not only do you state the obvious in that an artist creates art using whatever he has available to him but you recommend he start reading books to learn
not that learning is bad but it comes off like you believe he has no clue whatsoever
photography is so vastly different from painting
i dont even know what photographic theory is but im sure there are 10 of em

He did ask you for advice on a theory book
you probably didn't bother to read his posts anymore thinking you'd done your job well
i understand

image format for the installation? No idea where that came from
what installation? what format conundrum was he experiencing? i missed it. He said he had one camera and looking for another ..8x10 or whatever for his new lenses
you essentially tell him that hes so dumb he -should have- answered his own "question"

I read he's interested in finding a way to blend installation art and landscape photos
which means he's just starting off experimenting
i don't know how he intends to blend the two but im pretty sure he doesnt either yet
so image format?
seems just a bit premature

"There is a method to successfully communicate with online forums"'

can you post the rules or link?
should be able to since you seem to be expert

seems you failed yourself, though
all you have to do is read his followup to your post to see that

anyway, i'll wait

ad hominem
I swear people copy and past this stuff out of some internet manual
maybe it's the same one with your so called guidelines for successful communication

I found what i thought to be a fault/s
I posted em ..in this thread cause that is where they occured
i said he's posted what most have or will in the future yet HE gets called out
i found what i believe are inconsistencies
those need to be pointed out imo

i don't know if that qualifies as an ad hominem attack but I'd think ad hominem is more like
your opinion is wrong cause youre a nazi

I don't know why you itilicized "shure" ..it was a quote. my fault for not quoting it!
I forget sometimes people dont read the tread nor remember it
but that itself seems ad hominem
purposefully making fun of grammar instead of making a real argument

I was pointing out that "I'm sure you will go on to do great things in the future" was/seemed a bit backhanded
was it meant to be? Who knows
but who says that? It's awfully suspicious when there is nothing to go on cept for ..one or two post on an internet forum?
completely uneeded to say the least.

"a constant stream of text sans-serif is less easy to read than something with line breaks"

Perhaps

However, i recommend to you again the OPs following post
it's pretty easy to see your "harmless" pleading did more than just get him to use line breaks

it made him feel ostracized ..if even just a little bit its bad enough
was the nonuse of line breaks worth that?

"that it is divided into gear-based discussion as well as image related."

it is
but if its rude to go into the gear section and diss people looking for magic bullets it should be considered rude anywhere
right?
I don't recall you or many others doing any such thing inside those subforums but will not hesitate to do so outside of them

"You may wish to either direct more insulting remarks at someone in particular, or keep them to yourself. Nobody here has provided any remark close to delusion, nor would anyone consider an online forum having the power to label any person an 'artist'"

i was speaking of what i see as a group/family mentality that creates/contributes to these instances of "harmless" social exclusion
youre outside the group till you prove you can conform to it and represent it with abandon

Im sure some will remember a popular members calling some newbie a "temporary" member of the site till those in prominence decide whether they fit in well enough to be seed as a full fledged member

It's quite prevalent and excuse me if i think its wrong

"I estimate 9/10 consider you a troll"

maybe they do but i don't care
seems to me calling me a troll is a case of ad hominem attack itself

was my 7.9/10 needed? no
was it used in any way to show proof of anything
very loosely and exaggerated for effect
was it trolling?
for my definition of trolling it wouldnt be

"Start your own thread in the Lounge, ask all the questions you need answering"

nobody would open such a thread
its whiny
its telling the bus driver/teacher when someone punches you in the arm

in fact
telling the nerd to go tell the teacher is exactly what those who wish to cement the nerds status as a whiny "troll" nerd do

so i wont be doing that.
i post where i want

"Once more, start your own thread, as I may not be the only person here that feels your remarks deserve a topic of their own

give me that link that states when one must form a new thread
if you feel so deeply you start your own thread on it
I'd rather speak directly to the person/imo offender rather than start a thread the "offender" would steer clear of

if a 15 year old girl gets pregnant i'd speak to her not create an abstinence program
someone experiments with drugs id talk with them not post a Just Say No billboard

eddie

6-Jul-2010, 04:49

get an 8x10. buy film form the USA in a big lot and ship it down. i use arista.edu.ultra from freestyle. great stuff. re branded foma100. i have been using it for 5 years or more. i love it.

people say 8x10 is hard down under...maybe. but i got a friend (craig tuffin a member here) that is doing wet plate collodion down under! now THAT is hard!

i will give you the same advice i gave him.....get off that damn island! har har har! ;)

i think your lenses even cam from another member here as well....small community for sure.

welcome.

eddie

Lachlan 717

6-Jul-2010, 05:15

i will give you the same advice i gave him.....get off that damn island! har har har! ;)

eddie

Yep, pretty funny punchline, Eddie. Trouble is, I think you forget the intro to it.

cosmicexplosion

6-Jul-2010, 05:42

wet plate collodion looks amazing and i will give it a go just so there is two ozzies doing it here, and just to be difficult. and just to be like you eddie.

my lenses came from phoenix arizona, they havent arrived yet, hope they make it unbroken.

might just get a cheap studio 8x10 to begin, cambo 810=$400

Jim Galli

6-Jul-2010, 07:28

1 Kings 20:11 comes to mind.

Still, I wish you very well and hope you're still here posting work 15 years from now.

My advice is to put a large dumpster near the darkroom door. You may not make art the first year, or perhaps even the second. Good luck to you.

eddie

6-Jul-2010, 13:23

might just get a cheap studio 8x10 to begin....

i know that one just went right up the road from you a few days back......the hunt continues....

Ash

6-Jul-2010, 14:08

Sun of Sand now added to my ignore list.

Andrew, look in your local bookshop for anything by:
Roland Barthes
Victor Burgin
Graham Clarke
Charlotte Cotton
Susan Sontag
Liz Wells

Or anything published by 'Aperture' as they do a good series of collected essays etc.

It's not light reading, mind.

rdenney

6-Jul-2010, 14:42

Lenses:
a 14" and a 19" dagor goerz, rodenstockf=75, schnider5,6/58 xl 110 w/centerfilter, nikon 200.
dont know what all those numbers mean, but i will one day soon.

Here's a couple of hints to get you started:

Normal is when the lens's focal length is the same as the diameter of the film. Provides a similar magnification to normal sight. Thus, the 200 Nikkor is closest to normal on 5x4. The 110 is wide, the 75 is very wide, and the 58 is profoundly wide. The 14" is a good general long lens, probably just about right for portraiture when you want something a little more tightly composed than with the 200. The 19 moreso. But you probably won't be able to focus the 19" on your camera. No matter--just set it aside for when you make the switch to 8x10.

The next issue is coverage. I don't know the coverage of all these lenses, but I think it safe to say that these were made for 5x4, so they may not cover 8x10, except for the 14" and 19" lenses, which were made for 8x10.

For processing, you don't need anything but a dark room, a few measuring cups, chemicals, perhaps a thermometer, and some 8x10-size trays. Learn to develop film in those trays starting out. A light bulb and a piece of glass will allow you to lay one of those negatives onto photographic paper to make a print, and that print will be big enough to see what you have. Everyone has to start somewhere, and we've all done it.

If you are willing to take on books, there is no substitute for Adams's trilogy: The Camera, the Negative, and The Print. These three books provide a good basis for technique. Buy them; you'll read them again every year or two for a while.

You might also look into the availability of a Fuji PA-45 instant-film-pack holder and a supply of FP100C45. That is color instant print film that will give you a way to learn the basics of the camera without having to learn the basics of the darkroom at the same time. It's not that cheap, but it will save you a lot of time.

What you have plus what I'm suggesting will give you enough to see whether this is all really what you want to do. If your 4x5 contact prints or Fuji instant prints don't look good to you, then making them 40x50" won't make them any better.

It's a long trail, but there are a lot of footprints in front of you. That's both good and bad. Good in that you can find stuff out; bad in that finding a unique and personal mode of expression will challenge your artistry. No less true for painting, of course.

Rick "ignoring the noise" Denney

cosmicexplosion

6-Jul-2010, 16:00

thanks Rick, Ash and eddy.

I am first going to do paper negs on a 4x5. sounds pure and simple. just expose and develop. It seems the cheapest way to make the first 1000 mistakes.

I have a dark room set up i lent some one in 2003, they have gone digital so dont mind me having it back.

the best thing is the paper drier, which was from a hospital, it's basically a tall metal box with shelfs, a door and a small heated fan at the bottom, it dries photo's with out warp. and keeps the dust off i guess.

I saw a great idea in the link 'build your own enlarger' on this site, where a guy made an 8x10 enlarger out of his camera. he just hooked it up and presto. a really good idea for something portable. Altho i want to do colour as well.

As my first real expedition is planned for alice spring area, where 'uluroo' or 'airs rock' is, in the center, i want to take a big trailer or maybe a tent dark room, so this idea of the camera as enlarger is brilliant.

There is so many amazing spots in australia. and you can own them all with a camera. (the beginning of my) ocd

I have purchased ansells books 1,2 and 3 plus schaefers books; the ansell guides 1 and 2. plus a book on the view camera of amazon, so my stuff is there,

i will look up the others thank you very much Ash.

Jim you have some wonderful and very soulful pictures. I am learning alot from your site about lenses, and most so far about the value of cheap gear. i like

Tim Meisburger

6-Jul-2010, 21:34

Rick, in your first sentence above I think you meant "diagonal", not "diameter".

Tim "also ignoring the noise and pointlessly nitpicking when I should be appreciative, which I am" Meisburger

rdenney

7-Jul-2010, 05:06

Rick, in your first sentence above I think you meant "diagonal", not "diameter".

If you draw a circle that includes the four corners of the image frame, then the diagonal and the diameter turn out to be the same value.

Rick "who uses those words interchangeably in this application" Denney

mdm

7-Jul-2010, 12:59

This thread is interesting. There must be a mad australian wanabe artist with dollars to burn in most keen photographers, suppressed to some extent or other. Perhaps we should let him out more often, might be good for the soul.

David

Steve M Hostetter

14-Jul-2010, 09:22

Hello Andrew,

Your enthusiasm is infectious and to me lays the groundwork for great accomlishments.

I wish you the best with your new endeavor and welcome to this forum..!

regards
steve

cosmicexplosion

13-Sep-2010, 05:29

Ok every one who has invested some quality time into the strange dream i have awoken into,

Yesterday i received my SINAR 8x10!

I decided to get a mono rail as i want to learn all the movements, and also do studio work.

ARtistic work not products.

the first disapointment was: Glass broke in transit, so my first lesson is in how to make GG.

I dont like grids any way

I am a painter so an image with grids all over it seems stupid,

why not look at a clean image?

I am sure that grids are only sort of good. in a certain sense, for some one on occasion.

But as i know nothing, my contributions will mostly be humor and pathos.
(oh and bad spelling.)

So i sold my horseman 612 to john schnieder whom i purchased my lens's off.

he offered me a 24" dagor just to complete my collection, and some cheap darkslides.

nice fellow john.

I am also waiting on my lensboards. so a bit of a wait.

I did pick up my dark room today. i lent to some one in 2003, as i had no real interest in using it then.

and as it turns out, it has grown, and now includes a dark proof ventelation fan, and boxes of strong smelling chemicals, and an 8x10 contact glass thingy with hinges.

so i am so close i can smell the paint on the finish line.

I have also been sweet talking an ex who is a double of audry hepurn into posing.

so hope fully that will be my first LF shot.

Ps I have bought many of the books mentioned above, and not read them, i have sort advice and looked into courses, today i found out that there is a small cluster of Lf people that look like normal people doing buisness and working/teaching in sydney.
Which means i am a means away from glory, when my first image appears in the dark room tray. What will it be?

D. Bryant

13-Sep-2010, 05:59

What will it be?

Don't forget to order film. I suspect when you start doing that on a regular basis your nightmare will be over.

Don Bryant

JBAphoto

2-Nov-2010, 02:36

Hello Andrew,

A 10x8" Sinar in the bush - I get tired wheeling my old Norma to the car

A question I will ask is how are you going to control exposure time on a bright day if you don't want subject movement with the long exposures dictated by uncapping the lens by hand? - I know you have small apertures and for the price you paid your lenses will include a set of solid gold Waterhouse stops for f128, f180 and f256 - Does your Sinar come with the Sinar-Copal Shutter? - This is one device which can change your working methods completely, provided your DDS don't have curved corners (true)

Alternatively there are oddities like the Shanel 5a Shutter, one came with my 420mm R Claron, but it is an oddity

I am currently getting used to Foma 100 asa, from Chris at Blanko Negro Supplies - This film should allow you longish enough exposures if you use a filter to partly cut the light entering your equipment

All the best with your endeavors, let me know how you get on

My 10x8" Sinar saga is on http://www.jbaphoto.com.au/snapshots.html and Process and Equipment pages

John

cosmicexplosion

2-Nov-2010, 03:21

hi john,

thanks for your post, i had a look at your site and you have some great shots. i would i would like to own some of the tree shots, so send me a quote and i will snap one up when i am flush with the readys.

i plan on getting a field camera at a later date, (possibly a chamonix with an extra 4x10 back. or a toyo field?) (form over function)

but as i plan on learning to 'ride the horse' near my nearly finished darkroom, ie at home, which is also at the studio, i dont need a field.

a sinar 8x10 is also a beautiful camera.

i just bought one from england but it was not as described on ebay so i sent it back and bought another this time from the states. so i have spent about 700 on postage.

i also bought about 20 dark slides. (just in case) and a 24 artar. and bibs and bobs.

that will have to do me for the moment, as i have spent over 8k and have not as of yet made a single physical shot.

so my new camera will arrive in a week.

i have all my lens boards arriving from china @$20ea
but i will have to cut the hole out my self, as it was a 15 day wait for custom.

i have been looking at the sinar shutter and like it very much as i dont need to be near the camera

and in fact can be in the photo. or talking directly with the model or the sea.

as i live in vaucluse i am surrounded by wonderful coast, and today after heavy rain when the sun comes out, the clouds and the sea look majestic beyond words.

the morning also is very special. it is gods country here.
so some of my first shots will be cliffs and sea.

maybe horizons and clouds.

and as many de-robed goddesses as i can fit in my camera.

dont ask me about f stops as i am still learning.

i plan to learn on the.

i have also surrended to my sorroundings and will start my artistic journy where i am.

that is here. in sydney. i cant wait till i get to the future.

ps what is a dds?>

pps what do you mean by solid gold water house stops, was that a joke or real.

i am still ignorant so jokes can go sailing over my head.

andrew

Joe Forks

2-Nov-2010, 16:41

Welcome Andrew! One of the most entertaining threads I've read in a long time! More power to you, good luck, and keep posting. There's a ton of helpful folks here along with some grumpy old men - but you knew that already. (I fit in either category :)

JBAphoto

2-Nov-2010, 17:37

Hello again,

Firstly, don't spend any more money 'till you have done a bit more research, shot some film and processed it or taken it to Blanko Negro, or whatever Chris calls his company - I have put his card on my office desk, big mistake!

Secondly glossary stuff -

Aperture is the hole in the lens that lets the light through, like a curtain on a window the smaller the hole the less the light intensity in the room/camera - The aperture also affects depth of field, the amount of your subject's depth that is in focus (not depth of focus, that is the stuff at the film plane) and also corrects some lens aberrations, but not all

Aperture is named f, little f to differentiate it from upper case F which is the focal length, 'though some 1920s manufacturers like Voigtlander got it wrong - The smaller the whole the higher the number as the f number is the ratio between the effective diameter and the focal length F - A two inch lens with a diameter of 1" is f2 and so on

Waterhouse stops are thin plates of metal, not gold, that can be inserted in some lenses to take the f stop smaller than that which is mechanically possible with an iris diaphragm, also the thin sheets of metal will give less diffraction, but that is another chapter

DDS is double dark slide, the film holder with sheath

Before you venture out to photograph a woman with your Sinar, get well used to it so you can operate it easily and efficiently - With photography it is important to have the whole of your attention on the subject with the technical aspects so well under your belt that you operate the camera automatically

Have fun
John

JBAphoto

2-Nov-2010, 18:19

PS

Shutters,

In terms of sheer simplicity is the Jim Galli shutter

http://www.apug.org/forums/forum44/22200-jim-galli-shutter-barrel-lenses-drum-roll-please.html

Secondly, my Sinar came with a SHANEL 5a shutter, a slight oddity which I will need to keep until I get a flat bed 10x8" camera and know if I can mount the Sinar shutter on that, a simple modification that could save a great deal of money

My Voigtlander Heliar came with an LPL roller blind shutter, a "mouse trap" shutter copied in metal from the old Thornton Pickard shutter - This is currently in use as a lens flange for the Heliar but if I obtain a mounting flange for it you are welcome to borrow the mouse trap 'till you get something of your own - Its speeds are 1/15 to 1.90th, at first everything was 1/10th, but now is getting to sound accuratish - I don't know its real value, but I doubt if it is high

In terms of dreams, I will get a new Cooke XVa lens when I win Lotto, but as I never waste money on Lotto tickets that will take a while or a few print sales

Keep in touch
John

lenicolas

2-Jan-2011, 11:18

hey!
Sorry to dig that "old" thread out in the open, but i'd realy like to hear from Andrew...
How are you doing?
Are your pictures anywhere to be seen yet?

mdm

2-Jan-2011, 13:18

He has a picture on his profile page.

I believe there is a good reason for him not to share his photos, and his persistence suggests he will get where he wants to go. You dont have to be a good shopper to be a good photographer. I am shure we will all know how it is going when he is ready.

cosmicexplosion

3-Jan-2011, 03:23

Hi leni i am still alive and doing well.

thanks for asking.

my fridge is filled full of film, my dark room is as good as built, i have done a stoopid course that was more for slr people and drove me nuts so i did 2 classes of five and wasted 480 bucks!

i have just found a guy in sydney at a place called 'point light gallery' who does large format, prob the only one in sydney. so i will be doing a course end of jan.

i have bought 2 reducing backs for my sinar advertised as sinar p but were sinar f so i cannot use all the polaroid i bought, have just bought another after a long wait and $300 then one came up for $150!... when it rain it pours.

i have been reading books and reading articals on this web site.

i have been redesigning all the images in my head. i have completely immersed my self in the images of light recorded by other artists.

But as of yet i cant really report any images, as my 8x10 kit has only just come together.

MDM

that is a peter gowland photo on my profile page! i thought she looked hotter than me.

the millennium falcon will be taking off soon.

dlamkey

3-Jan-2011, 08:26

I appear to be a little late here, having joined only less than an hour ago. That said, I do have some recommendations for books.

You have the Ansel Adams series, excellent start. He will get you started not only on technique for exposure, development & printing, he will also help your photographic eye, which, as an artist, you already have a head start there. My technique, if you want to call it that, is to study the works of the great masters, which includes Ansel Adams, Minor White, Edward Weston, and so on.

Another book that will get you started with using a view camera is "View Camera Technique" by Leslie Stroebel. It will teach you so much, you'll be able to make a view camera sit up & beg for mercy!

Take a look at the (now out of print, last I checked) the Time-Life series on photography. I got a complete set at a second hand store. And almost got a hernia lugging them back home. But I digress....

In Australia, you have a wealth of scenic places to photograph. My best suggestion is to go out and take lots of pictures, then sit down and figure out what you like about each image, what you dislike, and learn from these.

Best of luck to you!!!!

mdm

3-Jan-2011, 12:33

Thats ok, I am shure she is. Anyway Australians are all fat.

Lachlan 717

3-Jan-2011, 13:03

Thats ok, I am shure [sic] she is. Anyway Australians are all fat.

Probably because they don't burn calories shagging sheep.

I'm assuming, therefore, that you're quite slim.

mdm

3-Jan-2011, 13:05

Probably because they don't burn calories shagging sheep.

I'm assuming, therefore, that you're quite slim.

Slap another shreemp on the barbie mate.

lenicolas

6-Jan-2011, 14:20

the millennium falcon will be taking off soon.

godspeed!

Xuereb

10-Mar-2011, 02:13

It is untrue that Australians are fat. Look at our Prime Minister, she is gorgeous and she had a hundred Americans weeping in Congress yesterday. So, there!

munz6869

10-Mar-2011, 02:38

New Zealand is practically Australia anyway :p

Marc!

mdm

10-Mar-2011, 07:00

It is untrue that Australians are fat. Look at our Prime Minister, she is gorgeous and she had a hundred Americans weeping in Congress yesterday. So, there!

Did she change her accent for them or do they like hick accents too.

Lachlan 717

10-Mar-2011, 12:18

New Zealand is practically Australia anyway :p

Marc!

It was in the first drafts of the Australian Constitution back in the 1890's.

cosmicexplosion

11-Mar-2011, 01:45

the old mdm and lachlan eh, at it again. giving the bait taking the bait. wiggle wiggle little worm...

we should get a thread for you two under the juvenile delinquent section.

oh. they dont have one,
its assumed a certain Iq intelligence bravery maturity. good looks and creativity is needed for this forum,
none of which i am seeing out of you two buffoons.

but would you kindly stop hacking my thread.

this thread is about me. glorious me, wonderful marvellous me.

not your old jokes from primary school about rooting sheep.

now apply a little concentration, yes thats right the stuff cordial is made out of on the fruity poppers

and start espousing my magnanimity or peas orrf.

Eric Rose

11-Mar-2011, 08:37

my word has charlie sheen taken up LF? ;)

mdm

11-Mar-2011, 13:00

Fantastic thread, it never dies. I agree though, I am tired of smashing Australians. Good luck with your 8x10.

cosmicexplosion

11-Mar-2011, 19:34

Thanks David, I noticed you are into kundalini meditations.

I met a lady from the states with an interesting story, her site is peacehope.com

her story is there. she is very smart, and quiet brilliant, and has gone through kundalini, and is now a healer.

basically an american indian shaman dispelled the cancer that she had, in a sweat lodge, which set her on her current path, but the story is worth a read.

my father is a swami and runs his own yoga school.

i have been looking into kundalini of late. I am thinking of going over to the states for a bit of the old shaktipat from said healer.

mdm

11-Mar-2011, 19:52

Oh yes, I am obsessed with Ana Brett DVD's.

Ross Chambers

13-Mar-2011, 00:35

Heavens, what can I say? Probably best to say nothing, I guess.

Best of luck.

As I said in June last year. Unfortunately it didn't stop the flow of verbal diarrhea.

Will we ever see a picture? Or is torturing Gordon and Chris better sport?

mdm

13-Mar-2011, 00:42

Conventional people seldom do anything unconventional or extrordinary or interesting. Just be patient.

cosmicexplosion

13-Mar-2011, 06:41

As I said in June last year. Unfortunately it didn't stop the flow of verbal diarrhea.

Will we ever see a picture? Or is torturing Gordon and Chris better sport?

i understand your enthusiasm in wanting to see one of my pictures.

i share it to.

but as you have been so patient, i will promise that soon you shall see one.

so just relax knowing that what is yours is coming to you.

and a single man cant move the heavens or the earth,

but a single squirrel can gather his nuts for the coming winter.

cosmicexplosion

13-Mar-2011, 06:44

ps that is one of my photo's below. it was taken from a moving bus, on the way to alice springs, in the australian outback.

i like it as it kind of foretells of the inspiration i had out there.

i think i was guided by angels.

kev curry

13-Mar-2011, 10:57

Andrew are u an advocate of Stork Theory too by any chance?

cosmicexplosion

14-Mar-2011, 01:43

Andrew are u an advocate of Stork Theory too by any chance?

well if that was your post number 666 i had better mind my words.

i have also heard that some germans are into more than stalks!

but we wont go there...or is it to late?

i have heard of the worm theory.

may be the stalk theory relates to stalkers?

oh boy, i have had experiences that make me believe that there is a parallel universe, much like thought is independent of reality, as in my case, to a point were people are worried, that my thought in fact has
nothing to do with reality.

and that i am in a living example of where madness and genius say by by's!:o

but any way, thanks for checking in on me Doctor Curry

i have to go, god wants to tell me some thing...

kev curry

14-Mar-2011, 02:37

Haven't heard of ''stalk'' theory Andrew, that's a new one on me. I was referring to Stork theory....but anyway it doesn't matter.

I find that people who are susceptible to believing in ''angels'' and such things are generally highly susceptible to believing in Stork theory too. Its all very amusing. Even more amusing are the schools of thought that think and preach that thought can exist independently of reality and the material brain.

Still... the flat earth society still exists too;-)

cosmicexplosion

14-Mar-2011, 02:59

Still... the flat earth society still exists too;-)

well kev old chap

going any where from here would be a long journey, but let me just say that the only way to make sure that you are not in the flat earth society is to really look, and keep the mind open, as a mind that has drawn conclusions, shuts out the possible right?

life is still mind blowing and awe inspiring even in its mundane.

and thats why you take photo's right to; revere in natures majesty, and to get to know your own?

to see the universe in a grain of sand, (or silver)

i draw no conclusion, I listen read and expose my self.:D

Lachlan 717

14-Mar-2011, 03:42

i draw no conclusion

How did you come to the conclusion that you draw no conclusions if, indeed, you draw no conclusions?

kev curry

14-Mar-2011, 04:33

Andrew, of course, your right on many things old bean, and I wholeheartedly agree!

But, and this is my but...we must also be ever mindful not to be so open minded that our brains fall out;-)

mdm

14-Mar-2011, 12:46

The concept of 'the brain', as we understand it, is untrue and responsibe for a lot of flat earth thinking in our world. Like the concept of a perfectly compettitive market and all the economic theorys built on it. That is not to say that it is not a useful concept.

kev curry

14-Mar-2011, 14:25

Sounds just like another layer of mystical hogwash to me David.

The brain isnt a ''concept'' its a complex composition of matter, matter in its highest form...matter that has its origins in the material world.

mdm

14-Mar-2011, 15:40

Not at all. The human chimps foraging for deep fried mars bars in edinburugh probably have the same brain mass as the chimpanzees in the edinburugh zoo. Possibly less. Dunno.

Aparrently the brain didnt evolve all at once, we still have bits of reptile in there, and this and that, aparrently thats why we have dreams about snakes even if we have never seen one. There is more to brain than meets the eye. Lots that they dont understand. Thats all I am saying.

kev curry

14-Mar-2011, 16:36

The brain still isn't a concept and I dont think there's any correlation between intelligence and brain mass otherwise elephants would have replaced physicists long ago;-)

Nothing evolves ''all at once''. Complex evolution takes place in very slow incremental steps over long periods of time.

Dont knock deep fried Mars bars they taste better than McDonald's...and just as effective if your up for premature death!

Mike Anderson

14-Mar-2011, 19:29

...
Aparrently the brain didnt evolve all at once...

Nothing evolved all at once. Otherwise it wouldn't be evolved. :)

...Mike

Revolucion Artistico

15-Mar-2011, 00:24

Wow.
I can't believe I just read that entire thread in one sitting.

I can't wait to see some pictures cosmic, hope all is going well on the Millennium Falcon front and if I ever make it down to Sydney we need to hang out : )

kev curry

16-Mar-2011, 05:24

If any of you good God fearing people want to buy some cure absolutely all -including radiation sickness- snake oil I'm now taking orders!

At a heavily discounted price of $1000 for a 10ml bottle I'm sure you'll agree its a steal!

Cheques, Cash through the mail and bank transfer accepted. Strictly no paypal they're just crooks.

Hurry while stocks last!