PDA

View Full Version : Rodenstock Apo-Ronar-CL 1200mm 47" f16, information?



Math
19-Jun-2010, 07:47
http://img571.imageshack.us/img571/2310/aporonar.jpg
This monster has found it's way to me! :) I'm still not sure on how to use this beast, but it sure is an intriguing lens, with pristine glass!
However, it's also one I can hardly find any information on! I've never seen a Ronar this big on eBay (Can't blame me for being interested in it's value), and haven't read much about them. I did find some information on this forum however, saying that there are various 1200mm versions, namely 4, 6 and 8 element versions. The 4 is an f14, if I recall correctly, but this is an f16. How many elements would it have, and what is it's design?
Anyone ever used this lens? It's serial is 10 726 ***.

Walter Calahan
19-Jun-2010, 08:18
Wow, makes me appreciate how small my Nikkor 600|800|1200 is. Congratulations.

Gem Singer
19-Jun-2010, 08:55
Apo-Ronar lenses have 4 elements in 4 groups.

Idealized for 1:1 reproduction.

Was probably used on a process camera (lithography).

Math
19-Jun-2010, 09:51
Apo-Ronar lenses have 4 elements in 4 groups.

Idealized for 1:1 reproduction.

Was probably used on a process camera (lithography).
Not all Apo-Ronars are 4/4 in construction, that's also one of my questions. There is a Apo-Ronar-CL 1200mm / 47" f14, which is the 4/4 lens I think, since it's smaller.(One was listed here, a some time ago (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=37764)), but apparently there are also six element and eight element lenses, and I was curious as to which version mine is.

8x10 user
19-Jun-2010, 12:20
Yours is an eight element version I believe... It looks just like my 1000mm Ronar.

Photomagica
23-Jun-2010, 21:19
What a great lens! Let us know how it works out for you when you do use it. E-mail me and I'll send you the Rodenstock catalog pages for this lens. They are too big to attach here.
Cheers,
Photomagica

Joerg Krusche
24-Jun-2010, 07:36
Hi,

your CL-version is the 6-element all air-spaced version .. superb lens .. just too heavy for me .. at that focal length I prefer the 16/1000 which due to less weight I can still manage on a Sinar with front and rear elements mounted on a 5FS shutter .. thus reasonably balanced .. and the standard can take it.

joerg

Bob Salomon
24-Jun-2010, 07:58
1200mm f16 Apo Ronar CL (CL means that it has a linear aperature scale).
Effective focal length = 1200.1mm; Max. Recommended film size at 1:1 = 40 x 50", Recommended scale = 1/10x - 10x (1x); Minimum aperture = f128, Filter thread = 135mm x1; Overall length = 243mm; Flange focal length at infinity = 1171.5mm; Maximum lens diameter = 150mm, Screw thread = 145mm x1; Contact area to rear edge = 93mm.

Designed for jobs like map making. Rodenstock made 6 element 600, 800, 1000 and 1200mm Apo Ronar CL lenses. Coverage is 40 to 46 on Apo Ronar CL lenses longer then 480mm.

For the 1200mm f14 the specs are as follows:
1200mm f14 Apo Ronar CL (CL means that it has a linear aperature scale).
Effective focal length = 1199.8mm; Max. Recommended film size at 1:1 = 40 x 50", Recommended scale = 1/10x - 10x (1x); Minimum aperture = f128, Filter thread = 100mm x1; Overall length = 129.5mm; Flange focal length at infinity = 1185.3mm; Maximum lens diameter = 135mm, Screw thread = 120mm x1; Contact area to rear edge = 39.9mm.

The catalog shows them as both being 6 element.

Joerg Krusche
25-Jun-2010, 01:57
Bob,

the f=14 versions are definitely 4-element artar-type .. the CL f=16 1000/1200mm versions are 6-element .. the 6-element versions build "almost" twice as long .. the f=16 versions did cost quite a bit more than the 4-element cousins and do offer higher performance as can be seen by their MTF-curves.. higher resolution of the 6-element lens with fine structures .. as commented by a Rodenstock guy they were individually assembled with paired lens elements on an optical bench .. at the expense of higher cost and weight..all of this is history for quite some time now..whatever you shoot both f=14 and f=16 do offer significant performance .. and can be had for a fraction of their selling price 15 years ago .. ,

joerg

Bob Salomon
25-Jun-2010, 02:19
Bob,

the f=14 versions are definitely 4-element artar-type .. the CL f=16 1000/1200mm versions are 6-element .. the 6-element versions build "almost" twice as long .. the f=16 versions did cost quite a bit more than the 4-element cousins and do offer higher performance as can be seen by their MTF-curves.. higher resolution of the 6-element lens with fine structures .. as commented by a Rodenstock guy they were individually assembled with paired lens elements on an optical bench .. at the expense of higher cost and weight..all of this is history for quite some time now..whatever you shoot both f=14 and f=16 do offer significant performance .. and can be had for a fraction of their selling price 15 years ago .. ,

joerg

Joerg,

I only quoted from the Rodenstock Repro catalog booklet. And the only reference they made to the number of elements is as I printed in my post. This catalog lists every different Rodenstock process lens made in the 80s and they only referred to the 1200 as being 6 element. However typos are not impossible and this book has no schmetics.

Emmanuel BIGLER
26-Jun-2010, 00:05
Hello from France !
Regarding The Holy German Bible, uncompromising Euro-Patriots like me always need to refer to the Gutenberg version:
Die Urtext ist hier ! (http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201006/cijzXZ8TH9.pdf)

Now the problem is : The Holy Apo-Ronar Bible does not say all ! Hence, various controversies among various ministers faithfully serving the Holy Apo Ronar, and the controversial question is : how should we read the Holy Text !
;)

Peter K
26-Jun-2010, 01:36
Der Urtext lautet

Erreur interne - Erreur 500

Peter

Dan Fromm
26-Jun-2010, 06:39
Hello from France !
Regarding The Holy German Bible, uncompromising Euro-Patriots like me always need to refer to the Gutenberg version:
Die Urtext ist hier ! (http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201006/cijzXZ8TH9.pdf)

Now the problem is : The Holy Apo-Ronar Bible does not say all ! Hence, various controversies among various ministers faithfully serving the Holy Apo Ronar, and the controversial question is : how should we read the Holy Text !
;)Rev. Dr. Bigler, theologians read the Holy Text. Scientists ask the lens what it is.

Math
26-Jun-2010, 08:04
Wow, thanks for all the information! :) Six-element it is, very clear.

@Emmanuel: I'm not that religious, but lenses like this make you doubt... Thanks for the manual! ;)

Now to find a way to mount this on my Busch Pressman. :rolleyes:

Joerg Krusche
26-Jun-2010, 08:12
Math,

as I wrote somewhere above .. the question is not how to mount the lens onto your Busch.. but rather how to mount your camera onto the lens !

good luck !

btw I mounted the f=16/1000 on a 5FS shutter onto a Sinar Norma ..

joerg

Math
26-Jun-2010, 08:18
Math,

as I wrote somewhere above .. the question is not how to mount the lens onto your Busch.. but rather how to mount your camera onto the lens !

good luck !

btw I mounted the f=16/1000 on a 5FS shutter onto a Sinar Norma ..

joerg

True! If you put it that way it sounds slightly easier, even. I don't have the budget for a 5FS shutter though, so it'll probably be a darkslide shutter.

Joerg Krusche
26-Jun-2010, 08:40
Math,

the 5FS shutters are not that expensive .. but whatever works is fine !

@ Emmanuel,

I talked recently to George from Lux .. and we thought of meeting on the "Butte de Mousson" to play/test also the 16/1000 shooting at a distance of almost a mile onto the old "centre ville" .. date still uncertain .. but will do it during the next 4-6 weeks .. weather and light of course permitting ... should know then more about this lens .. there may be other options in this focal length range .. but likely none if focal length/image cercle and performance are needed. I very much look forward to that date to visit Pont a Mousson again to renew old memories .. some even very old ones.

A+

joerg

CP Goerz
26-Jun-2010, 09:07
A page from the catalogue...Mr S is correct. I sold one of these on Ebay a couple of weeks ago.

Joerg Krusche
26-Jun-2010, 10:42
Hi,

the one you sold was the CL-version ? .. if so that was the 6-element version .. the one on the document is the older 8-element version from the seventies .. sorry for my nitpicking .. Rodenstock made 4-element and 8-element versions .. there was also an 8-element version in a 5FS shutter .. the 8-element versions 1000mm and 1200mm were then replaced by the 6-element design .. the very few last ones also with multicoating.

best

Joerg

CP Goerz
26-Jun-2010, 11:22
Here is the F16 1000mm CL, do you by any chance have a cutaway of the six element 1200/1000mm lens? The difference between the barrel shapes is pretty distinct as you mention but I've only ever seen an eight element design in the F16's and would love to see the other version.

Joerg Krusche
27-Jun-2010, 06:14
Andrew,

if you enter below link into Google it will take you to a thread at the end of which you will find a .jpg showing the 8-element version sitting on a brochure which shows the 1000/1200 CL versions .. thread from 2002,

<http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/00495z>

enjoy it!

joerg

Sal Santamaura
27-Jun-2010, 08:55
...a .jpg showing the 8-element version sitting on a brochure which shows the 1000/1200 CL versions...Here's a direct link:

http://static.photo.net/attachments/bboard/004/004A4K-10492584.JPG

CP Goerz
27-Jun-2010, 09:30
Hey J,


Do you have a link to the six element version cutaway/design of 1200mm CL you mentioned? I've only seen 8 element versions and would like to see what the six element version looks like.

Joerg Krusche
27-Jun-2010, 10:52
Hi Andrew,

sorry no cutaway of the 16/1200 CL .. it was not fun to do it on the 8-element .. just the brochure which gives the schematic but no actual spacing.

best,

joerg

Math
27-Jul-2010, 03:52
Thanks everyone for all the information! I ended up deciding I'd sell it instead, it's just too big for me right now. (link (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=64849)) Let's just hope I don't regret the decision.