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awldune
16-Mar-2010, 11:11
Got a Nikkor-W 135mm in Copal 0 today, and have never used a Copal shutter before. The timings sound right, but at slow speeds the shutter makes sort of a whining sound, as opposed to the more "buzzy" Compur and Graphex shutters I'm used to. Is this normal?

Also, the back side of the shutter has a screw sticking out that seems like it would prevent the shutter from mounting flush against the lensboard. Do I need to make a dent for the screw? I want to mount on a Cambo board, which doesn't seem like it would "self-dent" very easily.

Oh -- when I got the lens it had a bit of masking tape on the aperture lever. Any thoughts on what this was for? Maybe to make the black lever easier to see against the black shutter?

Thanks

IanG
16-Mar-2010, 11:38
Japanese trickery that sound, long term Compurs are far more reliable.

The screw allows the shutter to seat in a mount and not rotate as it's tightened up, there's usually a little cut out on a lens board to correspond, if not just file one.

Ian

Peter K
16-Mar-2010, 11:39
Got a Nikkor-W 135mm in Copal 0 today, and have never used a Copal shutter before. The timings sound right, but at slow speeds the shutter makes sort of a whining sound, as opposed to the more "buzzy" Compur and Graphex shutters I'm used to. Is this normal?
The shutter needs a CLA.

Also, the back side of the shutter has a screw sticking out that seems like it would prevent the shutter from mounting flush against the lensboard. Do I need to make a dent for the screw? I want to mount on a Cambo board, which doesn't seem like it would "self-dent" very easily.
With the screw, together with a notch in the lensboard, is for aligning the shutter. So you can either make a notch in the new lensboard or remove the screw.

Oh -- when I got the lens it had a bit of masking tape on the aperture lever. Any thoughts on what this was for? Maybe to make the black lever easier to see against the black shutter?
Don't know, ask the former user.

IanG
16-Mar-2010, 11:42
Peter, all my Copals make that noise, all my Compurs purr, even the pre-WWI shutter I use :D

It's the BMW like build quality ;)

Ian

awldune
16-Mar-2010, 12:16
The shutter appears perfect, no marks or residue on the blades. It seems to function perfectly, it just sounds weird. Unless this is a well-known symptom of shutter trouble I would prefer to avoid paying for a CLA.


With the screw, together with a notch in the lensboard, is for aligning the shutter. So you can either make a notch in the new lensboard or remove the screw.

So the screw can be removed without affecting anything inside the shutter? I might just do that rather than drill my metal Cambo board.

I bought the lens from an ebay seller associated with a camera shop, so I guess the tape will remain a mystery.

Jim C.
16-Mar-2010, 13:11
You can remove that screw/pin without messing with the shutter innards
it's only screwed into the case of the shutter, if memory serves correct
it's a itty bitty shouldered screw.

Peter K
16-Mar-2010, 13:18
So the screw can be removed without affecting anything inside the shutter? I might just do that rather than drill my metal Cambo board.
The thread for the screw is only in the shutter case and don't affects the shutter's mechanics. You don't need to drill the lensboard only to file a little notch. Such a notch doesn't interferes if the board is used with another shutter without such a screw.

Peter

Sevo
16-Mar-2010, 13:51
Oh -- when I got the lens it had a bit of masking tape on the aperture lever. Any thoughts on what this was for? Maybe to make the black lever easier to see against the black shutter?


To make the black lever not show up in a reflection on a close-up shot. Much of my studio gear is taped black or sprayed matte black for that reason...

Sevo

awldune
16-Mar-2010, 14:02
The thread for the screw is only in the shutter case and don't affects the shutter's mechanics. You don't need to drill the lensboard only to file a little notch. Such a notch doesn't interferes if the board is used with another shutter without such a screw.

Thanks, I'll look into it. I think my #1 board has a factory notch so I'll look at that and see if it's something I would want to try to replicate.

Sevo, it was white masking tape, so I'm guessing that's not it ;) I guess it was to make it more visible or to make it easier to handle somehow.

awldune
16-Mar-2010, 14:04
About the shutter noise -- somehow I had thought that Copals were supposed to be higher-quality than Compurs, and this one sounds "cheaper". Could just be an issue of expectations.

I'll try to do a more rigorous testing of the timings later to make sure they're correct.

Peter K
16-Mar-2010, 14:47
About the shutter noise -- somehow I had thought that Copals were supposed to be higher-quality than Compurs, and this one sounds "cheaper". Could just be an issue of expectations.
Here (http://lensn2shutter.com/shutters.html#link2) some thoughts about shutters.

IanG
16-Mar-2010, 22:20
Thanks Peter, the comments on that page are similar ro my experiences.

This is what two of my shutters sound like, the Compur (http://lostlabours.co.uk/Uploads/Compur.mp3) is from 1931 and the Copal (http://lostlabours.co.uk/Uploads/caltar_copal_ shutter.mp3) about 10 years old.

The MP3 files were made to check the slow shutter speeds and the Compur runs a touch fast about 10% at 1 second a little more at faster speeds, while the Copal is just a fraction slow.

Ian

awldune
17-Mar-2010, 07:32
Wow, thanks Ian! That is basically what my shutter sounds like, maybe mine is a little whinier.

I do like the features of the Copal shutter, especially the large and user-friendly preview lever.

awldune
18-Mar-2010, 10:48
Uploaded a recording:

http://www.filexoom.com/getfile-18648.wav

(Sorry, the hosting site seems to require a wait before you can access the file.)

The timings are slightly fast for the slow speeds (1s = .9s, 1/2 = .45s) and spot on for the fast ones.

David McNiven
18-Mar-2010, 16:40
The Copal is quite a bit simpler than the Compur and I've repaired many more Compurs than Copals. Can't say for certain that the Copal is more reliable because I don't know how many of each were in use at the time.
If you were to remove the front cover & speeds ring from one of each you would see a surprising amount of empty space in the Copal - which makes them easier & quicker to repair, so I like them for that reason.
My 75 & 90 SA Compurs both failed in the last two weeks so I guess I'm unretired again...