Film processing in a small apartment

[harlekin]

I am fairly new to LF, but I am considering trying out some processing. I live in a fairly small apartment and have nowhere to put a real darkroom. I think I might be able to do well with a daylight processing tank, which I could load in the bathroom and then move to the kitchen to do the processing.

Does this sound like a workable plan? I'm curious as to what sort of tank would be best for me. The Combiplan is easy enough to find, but there are a huge assortment of rotary type tanks on ebay for fairly cheap. I have my eye on an old Color by Beseler set with the motor base and a pair of tanks. Would these be suitable for my purposes? There are plenty of Jobo tanks floating around too. Unless I get lucky and find one of the small Jobo processors for cheap, I'd probably have to float the Jobo.

I plan to process mostly 4x5, but possibly some medium format in the future. I'm considering getting an enlarger and trying to do some printing (though the size of 4x5 enlargers looks problematic), so that might be a future concern.

[BetterSense]

I live in a 700sqft apartment with woman and all her possessions. My darkroom is a walk-in closet. I process on the shelf in there in trays and in open tanks and hangers. When we lived in a 500sqft apartment, I did it in the bathroom. I've never tried daylight tanks but they sound like more trouble than they are worth.

[Paul Kierstead]

For just film processing, a daylight tank and a changing tent will allow you to process film in just about any space without difficulty.

Enlarging is a different beast, especially with larger formats. You could consider going 8x10 and contact printing :)

[harlekin]

I suppose my real problem isn't the size of the apartment itself, but that the bathroom and closet are especially small (the closet is behind a sliding door in the bathroom). There is no space to set trays. I suppose I could lay trays in the bathtub, but that seems like it would be a pain. There's plenty of room in the kitchen, but it would be difficult to get it dark enough.

Doing all of my processing work in the dark seems tough, but if it's really the best way to go then it might be worth figuring it out.

[IanG]

Daylight tanks are ideal, I bought my first Jobo back in 1976, and it's still in regular use, I have a 2nd in the UK.

Here in Turkey there's no room for a darkroom in our apartment so I load dark-slides and the dev tank in the bathroom, which has no window, and a convenient virtually light tight door.

Ian

[harlekin]

I'll probably start with some sort of contact printing, even at 4x5. I tend to like 4x5 because it's still pretty easy to drag a cheap folding camera around and still get a nice big negative. :)

If I get a Jobo drum, is there anything in particular I need to watch for? The drums seem to have a number of parts that I don't yet know the purposes of. There seem to be a lot on ebay at various prices and it seems like I could get one pretty cheap.

[David de Gruyl]

Processing: For little dough, the HP Combi Plan works fine. All you need is a darkbag.

For enlarging, you need a darkroom. If you can darken your bathroom, you could print, but you would probably tire of moving the enlarger in and out (I know I would).

[Michael Gordon]

My instructional video (http://michaelegordon.wordpress.com/2009/11/05/how-to-video-daylight-sheet-film-4x5-development-2/) on daylight development may be useful to you. Good luck.

[Mike Anderson]

I just developed my first film a couple days ago in a combi-plan. I practiced loading it a couple times in daylight with junk film, then tried it with my eyes closed, then loaded the the good film in a changing bag (kind of cramped but doable) and then did the wet work in the kitchen sink. It turned out OK!

...Mike

[harlekin]

On a related note, what do I need to know about the standard B&W processing chemicals? Are they safe to wash down the sink? Will they stain the sink or counter? (my sink is stainless)

[BetterSense]

They should be safe to wash down the sink and they won't stain the sink. Some other chemicals like bleaches, reducers or toners might, though.

[Roger Thoms]

My instructional video (http://michaelegordon.wordpress.com/2009/11/05/how-to-video-daylight-sheet-film-4x5-development-2/) on daylight development may be useful to you. Good luck.

Micheal, I especially like your film drying cabinet. Great solution that take little space.

Roger

[Ed Richards]

If you need to do it on the cheap, the HP Combi Plan is workable, but a pain to load. The Jobo Expert drums are great. The 3006 only does 6 sheets, but it is really easy to load. The 3010 does 10, but it poses the risk of an improperly loaded sheet screwing up another sheet. I have one of each, and only use the 3010 when I have more an 6 sheets. Put it on a cheap bessler or uniroller base from ebay, and do not worry about temp control. Xtol is the least toxic of the developers. I have done 4x5 with a changing bag and a Jobo drum for a long time, with no problems. I then scan and print digitally, so I do not have to worry about darkroom issues. Showers make great drying areas - just use some coat hanger wire on the shower curtain rod to hang the film on.

[Brian Ellis]

It's very feasible, for several years I loaded film while sitting on the floor of a closet, then took the loaded film into the kitchen for processing. I did this only at night after closing the blinds to the outer room and putting a towel at the bottom of the closet door to block any stray light. I'd suggest trying something like that rather than using a changing bag if you can. Changing bags are a PITA.

[harlekin]

How are the Jobo 2500 series tanks or any of the other smaller looking tanks (Beseler, Paterson, etc)? They're available for quite a bit cheaper on ebay. I don't know what sort of quantity of negatives I'll be developing, but I'll probably start with small quantities as I learn my exposures and process.

[tgtaylor]

I also live in a small (~900'^2) apartment in which I found it very easy to set-up a full B&W/Color darkroom by utilizing various areas for each process.

For example my 4x5 enlarger sits on an enlargement table in one corner of the bedroom. Since the bedroom walls are white, I taped-up two black 3-mill contractors bags to the wall directly behind and to the side of the enlarger to absorb any light leaking from the carrier stage. Installed this way, the enlarger is completely out of the way.

I process 135, 120 and 4x5 B&W by the "hand immersion" method using Jobo 1500 and 2500 tanks and reels (2509N reels for 4x5) in the bathroom which is situated at the end of a hall directly across from the bedroom. As the bathroom doesn't have a window or opening to the outside and is further away from such openings, the ambient temperature remains fairly constant throughout the day and is where I store my film and print developers in Arkay floating lid tanks. All graduates, chemistry, etc are stored in the cabinet below the sink and an Premier print dryer sits on an old heavy end table between the toilet and the counter. When I print B&W I'll walk the exposed sheets across the hall to the bathroom where I have the trays set-up and air dry them on large screens on the kitchen table that I purchased from Calumet.

For color, I set-up the Jobo CPA processor on the kitchen countertop which is level and the perfect size for the processor. I expose in the bedroom, insert the paper in a Jobo print drum and walk it to the processor. When processed, I walk the sheet back to the dryer in the bathroom and then place it on the coffee table in the LR to cool while I wash and dry the drum. An 11x14 print viewing station sits next to a computer printer in the LR for determining color casts. When not in use, the Jobo processor is stored out of the way in a walk-in closet.

All film loaded into Jobo 1500 and 2500 tanks using a Harrison 8x10 tent placed on top of the coffee table I load the Jobo 3010 Expert Drum in the bathroom by placing the drum and holders on a black towel and light proofing the doorway with 3-mil black contractors bags. Once assured that there are no light leaks to plug, I load the drum placing the unloaded holders out of the way and on top of the print dryer. Processed film is hung to dry with Arkay film clips in a womens wardrobe that I purchased from WalMart for $6 and/or an Arkay film/print dryer that I bought off e-bay for $70.

Piece of cake!

[Daniel_Buck]

I live in a small apartment too, I use a changing tent and rotary drums/daylight tanks on the kitchen counter, and empty/wash in the sink. My bathroom is to small to really do anything in, so I opt for the kitchen sink.

[IanG]

How are the Jobo 2500 series tanks or any of the other smaller looking tanks (Beseler, Paterson, etc)? They're available for quite a bit cheaper on ebay. I don't know what sort of quantity of negatives I'll be developing, but I'll probably start with small quantities as I learn my exposures and process.

Only the Jobo tanks will do 5x4, I use 2 2000 series tanks but these are pre-Jobo motor bases etc, but very easy, the later 3000 (various numbers) series are designed for rotary processing but can be used like my 2000 series for Inversion agitation.

My tanks take 2 spirals, each holding 6 sheets, which is very practical. So I can process up to 6 or up to 12. There plenty of the newer type about but try to get one that takes 2 spirals at least.

Ian

[gevalia]

I live in a small apartment. I develop 4x5 using a Combi and 120 in SS tanks. I have a plastic cat box that I put in the sink to use as a water bath to keep the temps on target. My kitchen is really small and this works out just fine - been doing it almost 5 years. I've even taking this setup on driving vacations and set up in motels.

[Robert Hughes]

I live in a small apartment. My bathroom sink and adjacent countertops allow me to do tray processing. I use D76 and rapid fixer, and sometimes filter the fixer through steel wool prior to dumping it down the sink. I also contact print in the bathroom - one 60W bulb for about 5 seconds is in the ballpark for my needs. Just this past weekend I installed my Omega enlarger into my bedroom closet; needless to say I'd only be able to use it at night. :)

[Brian Stein]

I think you can see its quite possible to do this in your apartment. I have not got a windowless/ easily darkable room so I use the harrison changing tent. This is worth its weight in gold compared to a change bag. For chemicals I mix my own: pyrocat, water for stop bath, and ole tjugens fixer of-1 (recipe on apug). All go down the sink. I do alt process because SWMBO nixed the enlarger idea.

[Jay DeFehr]

I'll preface my remarks by saying I agree with the posters above who recommend a changing tent and daylight tank as the most practical and convenient method.

That being said......the following method works very well and costs almost nothing. Films and papers are packaged in black plastic, light-proof bags. I use these bags for stand development of sheet film, as follows:

Prepare developer

Lights out

Load 1 sheet of film into the bag, emulsion side towards me

Pour in developer

lay bag down, open top away from me, emulsion side of the film up

hold the open top of the bag in my left hand, and with my right hand, push most of the air out of the bag

Fold the open top of the bag

Lights on

Still holding the open top of the bag, folded back to make a light trap, squeeze out the remaining air by running my hand over the surface of the bag, pushing the developer towards the open end of the bag

Double fold the top of the bag, and secure with binder clips

Run my hand over the bag to move developer over the film for one minute

Let stand for remainder of development

Lights out

open bag, pour out spent developer

pour in some water, lay bag down and run my hand over the bag with my right hand while holding the top with my left hand

Dump water, repeat

Pour in fixer, close bag

Lights on

agitate fixer by running hand over the bag, continuously

pour fixer out

wash in bag with several changes of water

Hang to dry

It's a lot more complicated to describe it than to do it. I do this in my DR sink, so the solutions that get pushed out with the air, during changes, etc., don't bother me. By this method I can stand develop several films (in separate bags), in minimum solution volumes (more important for 5x7 and 8x10 than for smaller formats), for various times, and work in room light while they develop.

hardly a convenient all-purpose method, but it's very practical and reliable. I've never scratched a film by this method, or made finger print marks like I have shuffling sheets in a tray. I won't go into the benefits of stand development, except to say that negatives developed by the above method are bitingly sharp, and easy to print. Obviously, there's no reason other agitation schemes can't be used, from stand to continuous.

[Chris Strobel]

I develop my 4x5 and 8x10 film in trays in my small bathroom.What I do is lay 2 20x24 trays across the bathtub creating my 'sink' In these I place either either 8x10 or 11x14 trays depending on film size.Under the 2 20x24 trays, sitting on the floor of the bathtub, is another large tray with a hose I tapped into the toilets water supply that is used for final washing.On top of the bathroom sink sits yet one more tray with photoflow.The negatives are dried by hanging them from the shower curtain rod via those circular gizmos you hang the shower curtain on with small bulldog clamps from office depot hanging on them.

My bathroom is an inside bathroom with no windows, so with a piece of opaque plastic hung over the door to seal out light leaks, I can process anytime day or night.I develop mostly with PMK, so the bathrooms overhead fan is always on, and the houses central air always blows fresh air in via the vent above the bathroom door.I also wear a respirator mask, goggles, and nitrile gloves since it IS pyro :)

I actually have a real darkroom with an enlarger that was built in the garage in 1970, but since I scan my negatives now, I actually prefer the bathroom.Its warmer in the winter and cooler in the summer, more dust free since I can crank the shower to hot for several minutes before developing to help immobilize dust, and when nature calls no more having to suffer till the developing is done :D

[Robert Hughes]

I use these bags for stand development of sheet film
Wow, what a great idea! I've never heard of bad development before. Sounds like it should work. Thumbs up! :)

Erp. I meant "bag" development. I've got that bad dev- thing down already...

[csant]

Films and papers are packaged in black plastic, light-proof bags. I use these bags for stand development of sheet film, as follows:

I would be worried about scratches on the emulsion, which can be very delicate when wet - any trouble with that in your experience?

[tgtaylor]

Where there's a will, there's a way!

[Jay DeFehr]

I would be worried about scratches on the emulsion, which can be very delicate when wet - any trouble with that in your experience?

No, never. As long as the bag is clean inside, there's nothing there to scratch the film. Imagine the film inside the fluid-filled bag; when I run my hand over the bag, there is always a layer of fluid between the film, Which settles to the bottom, just as it does in a tray) and the bag. I think this is among the safest ways to handle sheet films. I've developed a lot of Arista APHS film this way, which is very thin and delicate, and have never seen a scratch or other development defect. Try it on an unimportant neg sometime, and see for yourself.

[Dirk Rösler]

Have a look here for ideas:

http://www.flickr.com/groups/darkroomportraits/

Some people posted from Japan, and if you thought your apartment/bath are small...

[David de Gruyl]

That being said......the following method works very well and costs almost nothing. Films and papers are packaged in black plastic, light-proof bags. I use these bags for stand development of sheet film

How much solution does this take? (my guess is somewhere between 250 and 350 ml for 8x10, rodinal 1:100.) Also, which developer are you using?

I assume you put the film in with the emulsion side up (when resting on the table) and the liquid mainly on top of that. Do you have problems with streaking and not clearing the negatives? (I would guess not, since you use this method).

[Jay DeFehr]

Hi David,

I have used this method with very small solution volumes, but only with continuous agitation, just to see if it would work, and it does. In practice, I only use this method with stand development, because I have a Jobo for continuous agitation, and it's much more convenient/precise in this application. On the other hand, it's not much good for anything else. As long as all the air is squeezed out of the bag, I think one could use very small solution volumes for stand development, but I've not tried that.

If you want to visualize the process without committing important film, put a waste negative in a clear plastic bag with water in room light. This will show you exactly what's going on in that black bag during agitation and stand development.

For stand development, I use GSD-10 (http://gsd-10.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2006-12-21T12:51:00-08:00&max-results=7)/ 1:10, 500ml/ 8x10.

Yes, the film is oriented emulsion side up, and lays on the bottom of the bag during development. I've never had any problems of any kind with this method, and I consider it gentler, and safer than tray development, with the advantage of working in room light during development, and with development times up to an hour, that's important to me. I could use a tube, and have, but solution volumes are 3X what I use in a bag, and that adds up when developing 8x10.

[David de Gruyl]

For stand development, I use GSD-10 (http://gsd-10.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2006-12-21T12:51:00-08:00&max-results=7)/ 1:10, 500ml/ 8x10.

Yes, the film is oriented emulsion side up, and lays on the bottom of the bag during development. I've never had any problems of any kind with this method, and I consider it gentler, and safer than tray development, with the advantage of working in room light during development, and with development times up to an hour, that's important to me. I could use a tube, and have, but solution volumes are 3X what I use in a bag, and that adds up when developing 8x10.

Tube developing does use quite a lot of solution for stand developing. I have found that that is mostly water... (I have reduced my rodinal ratio considerably, and I am not really through yet).

This method sounds very interesting, though. I suspect that I will try it as soon as my next batch of paper is done. It sounds better / even less likely to scratch compared to tube developing.

Thank you for the info.

[Jay DeFehr]

David-

I have scratched negs with tube development, when one corner of a neg curls around and scratches another; usually when removing the wet negative from the tube. I've had no problems with this method.

You're right about dilute solutions being mostly water, but I find it wasteful to use 150ml of stock when I only need 25ml to develop my film. Using 50ml seems to me an acceptable compromise, but 3X that is just too much, for me.

Have fun!

P.S. Are you Dutch, by chance?

[David de Gruyl]

David-

I have scratched negs with tube development, when one corner of a neg curls around and scratches another; usually when removing the wet negative from the tube. I've had no problems with this method.

You're right about dilute solutions being mostly water, but I find it wasteful to use 150ml of stock when I only need 25ml to develop my film. Using 50ml seems to me an acceptable compromise, but 3X that is just too much, for me.

Have fun!

P.S. Are you Dutch, by chance?

Me too, on the scratched negatives from tubes. That is part of my fascination with this method. I have had some success with hardening fixer, but I still remove the negative to wash, which can scratch the wet emulsion. In fact, I have been touching up the same spot on my 8x10 negatives and wondering exactly how I am going to fix this mishandling problem.

What I really want to see is an 8x10 light tight box which is 10 mm deep (8 in x 10 in + some margin x 10 mm) with a light light tight lid for stand / inversion developing of a single sheet. That is 500 ml + margin, by the way.

Since I do not mix from stock, and I am using about 1+150 - 1+200 dillutions, the amount of chemicals is in the ml range. Not enough for me to get worked up over.

Yes, my father is dutch. I was born in the US (and if pressed, will self identify as dutch).

[Jay DeFehr]

David,

I think a paper safe (http://www.freestylephoto.biz/81185-Premier-8.5x11-Paper-Safe?cat_id=1603) would meet your criteria. It costs more than a bag, but it does offer some advantages, such as ease of opening/closing.

DeFehr was once de Veere, Germanized in Gdansk, en route to Ukraine. My kids are more Dutch than I am, because their mother is Dutch. I'd love to visit the Netherlands one day.

[David de Gruyl]

David,

I think a paper safe (http://www.freestylephoto.biz/81185-Premier-8.5x11-Paper-Safe?cat_id=1603) would meet your criteria. It costs more than a bag, but it does offer some advantages, such as ease of opening/closing.

DeFehr was once de Veere, Germanized in Gdansk, en route to Ukraine. My kids are more Dutch than I am, because their mother is Dutch. I'd love to visit the Netherlands one day.

That is brilliant. (I have that exact model, actually).

I think I will try it, since I do not actually use a papersafe in my printing workflow. I thought I would, but it turns out that I don't. Of course, I'll do it with test shots, first.

Interesting story about your name, thanks for sharing.

[Jay DeFehr]

Good luck, David, and it's nice to "meet" you.

[Robert Hughes]

What's the point of a paper safe? I mean, you could cut one of those open with a knife. I'd rather go with a solid steel safe - you'd need dynamite to open it.

[Jay DeFehr]

Robert,

I've always preferred heavy meters to light meters, too; the latter just feel cheap.

[Robert Hughes]

Robert,
I've always preferred heavy meters to light meters, too; the latter just feel cheap.
Typical - I bet you use black lights, too! Wadda loser... :D

[Jay DeFehr]

Well, I have to since my bounce light didn't..........