Sinar Lensboards From China

[Richard K.]

Can someone tell me if those Sinar lens boards that are sold by a couple of sellers on *Bay are authentic? (I'm not naive just circumspect :) ) One is in Hong Kong and the other sends from Shanghai. If you look at them they are indistinguishable from those made in Switzerland (I said look not measure!) and I'm wondering: if it floats like a duck and tastes like a duck, is it really a duck or just a pigeon configured as a perfect forgery? Anyone know for sure whether these lens boards really are ducks (perhaps by measuring them?)? Is anyone else troubled by the competing considerations of value vs. ethics (possibly)?

[evan clarke]

Can someone tell me if those Sinar lens boards that are sold by a couple of sellers on *Bay are authentic? (I'm not naive just circumspect :) ) One is in Hong Kong and the other sends from Shanghai. If you look at them they are indistinguishable from those made in Switzerland (I said look not measure!) and I'm wondering: if it floats like a duck and tastes like a duck, is it really a duck or just a pigeon configured as a perfect forgery? Anyone know for sure whether these lens boards really are ducks (perhaps by measuring them?)? Is anyone else troubled by the competing considerations of value vs. ethics (possibly)?

I bought a Sinar to Technika adapter from user jinfinance in Shanghai and it is top notch. I am comparing this to all my current model Arca equipment...Evan Clarke

[Armin Seeholzer]

Since I in Swiss not anymore can buy directly from Sinar as in the past and the prices where also gone about 15% higher, because the reseller wants also see some money, I buyed all my last 3 Boards from VirtualVillage. They look quite similar to an original Sinar board, but sometimes in the beginning they a bit hard to push on the front, but I can not see a difference to a sinar one.

Armin

[Stephane]

Fit perfectly, do not have the "sinar" logo sticking out, slightly thicker and much harder to drill.

[Richard K.]

Fit perfectly, do not have the "sinar" logo sticking out, slightly thicker and much harder to drill.

The ones I'm talking about fit perfectly, HAVE the Sinar logo sticking out (and the made in Switzerland imprint and the red dot)...I don't know if they're thicker or harder to drill...

[Ken Lee]

Given the wide availability and big price drop for used Sinar equipment, I try to get the real thing whenever possible.

Here's what the rear of a real Sinar board looks like.

Note the red dimple at the bottom, allowing room for the pin of a Sinar Shutter.

Also note the other features.


http://www.kenleegallery.com/images/forum/sinarboard.jpg

[Allen in Montreal]

Richard, my one experience was opposite to that of Evan's. I bought a Linhof Tech style board made in China for about 10 dollars and had to spend another 10 dollars for a rubber mallet to make it fit.
I know in a split second with my eyes shut, which board is the made in china lensboard when I am trying to mount it.

[tbirke]

I currently use 2 copal 3 lensboards from virtual village. They look exactly like the one ken lee posted above, to the last notch and indistinguishable from the original! The first one (2008) I had to sand slightly to make the lens fit, the second one ordered last year did fit instantly. Never had any probs after mounting.

[Richard K.]

Given the wide availability and big price drop for used Sinar equipment, I try to get the real thing whenever possible.

Here's what the rear of a real Sinar board looks like.

Note the red dimple at the bottom, allowing room for the pin of a Sinar Shutter.

Also note the other features.


http://www.kenleegallery.com/images/forum/sinarboard.jpg

And here's a $29.95 NEW board I got from Shanghai...) I haven't put in red arrows but imagine them pointing to the same spots)


http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn15/RichardK47/Sinar.jpg

Was the lower real thing price lower than $30? The boards seem slightly similar to me!:rolleyes:


Richard, my one experience was opposite to that of Evan's. I bought a Linhof Tech style board made in China for about 10 dollars and had to spend another 10 dollars for a rubber mallet to make it fit.
I know in a split second with my eyes shut, which board is the made in china lensboard when I am trying to mount it.

I think that they used to be slightly thicker but that may no longer be the case!
Any comments from anybody re the competing considerations of value vs. ethics (possibly)? Or, is it at all possible that that is a real Swiss made board?!?

[Sevo]

In all probability they are China made boards. There have been Chinese (and before that, Japanese) boards, without logo, for a long time - sinar either did not patent its board mount, or licensed it for free, in any case, many other makers have made and used compatible boards for decades, undisputed.

A sinar logo on a Chinese board would be a trade mark violation, and make it a pirated product - sinar could have the customs authorities seize and destroy them. But on the other hand, sinar (and Linhof, who had a similar "board free for all" policy) owe a lot of their market dominance to pushing their lens boards to standard rank, and would be ill advised if they sue makers that step over the border between compatible product and imitation, unless they start competing at distribution level...

Sevo

[Drew Wiley]

Just try suing any Chinese mfg for a patent violation, or WalMart for that matter. They
don't care.

[Richard K.]

...................
A sinar logo on a Chinese board would be a trade mark violation, and make it a pirated product -
Sevo

What about the "Swiss made" raised lettering? :rolleyes:

The rest of your post was very interesting and presents an alternate view-point.
I wonder if Sinar knows about this? Yes distributing would definitely be a different story.

[Drew Wiley]

Richard - the Chinese pirate everything including logos. I sell woodworking equipment,
professional powers tools, etc., and the Chinese clone everything right down to the
logo. They do the same with door locks. Of course, the stuff falls apart real quick.
And places like Wal Mart get ahold of something patented in the US, clone it it China,
and then tell you go ahead and sue them - they have a legal department bigger than
your county does! No patent attorney is going to go after anyone unless there are
millions of dollars of lost sales involved and unless a big chunk can be recovered and
put into his own pocket. Once in awhile a token raid will be made on someone importing
counterfeit goods, but the odds of getting caught are rare. Probably TONS of this kind of thing are unloaded at the Ports of Oakland and Long Beach every single day. All the
big box retailers are compliant with with kind of thing; and people wonder why the
economy is going downhill??? Camera parts by comparison are a gnat on the back of an elephant. And probably something like a Sinar board patent expired long ago anyway. I prefer the real deal because I too have seen problems with aftermarket boards, at least on a real Sinar standard itself.

[Armin Seeholzer]

I do not know excatly how many million expensive swiss watches they, produce in china. But I know thad every years some tons get just confiscated and then destroyed!
Rolex, Omegas etc!

[Drew Wiley]

Armin - just come to the USA! You can easily purchase as many phony Rolex watches as you want, practical in every flea market around or out of the trunk of
someone's car in a Safeway parking lot. Probably 99% of the "Rolex" watches in this
country are phony. It's a standing joke. I wasn't exaggerating at all. Shiploads of
counterfeit goods are false-safety-labeled products come into this country routinely.
Consumers want something too good to be true, and that's what they get!

[Richard K.]

God, this is depressing! :(

[anchored]

Unsure of Chinese Sinar-branded lens boards, but I have bought 4 Linhof boards with crests from Hong Kong advertised as "used" but in fact all appeared completely new and completely identical in color of paint, materials, workmanship and usability to Linhof original boards.

If these are pirated copies, I'd have to admit they've got pirating down to a science. Everything else is made in China these days... figuring soon even bottled water from Fiji and France and Arkansas will be "Made in China" .....

[Drew Wiley]

Glenn, one of the big brands of bottled water sold around here is simply city tap water which has been run reverse osmosis and then had some taste minerals added.
I won't say which city, but it's not one considered to have the best water. The other
brand - with all the TV adds of Swiss alps and so forth - is bottled in a plant built
over an EPA superfund site where actual residences were all condemned due to extreme pollution. Doesn't mean the water is posion, because it is piped in, but I sure wouldn't want to work there! But if the Chinese start bottling water, expect some melamine or antifreeze in it. Saw a documentary the other day about scientists in China testing some of the rivers. They put on 100% hazmat suits and then duct tape between the long nitrile gloves and the suits themselves, so that when they dipped a sampler into the water, no drops could possibly touch their skin. In quite a few of the wells in agricultural counties here is Calif, the water is far more dangerous due to decades of pesticides. For the past few years my nephew has been tracing well contamination for miles around a large Calif city where a bankrupt dry cleaning chem co decided to liquidate its chemicals by adding them to the aquifier, i.e, dumping them down a well. Have I rained on your parade yet?

[Drew Wiley]

Oh, I forgot to add that out here in Calif we have the strictest environmental laws in
the country - you know, all that top-heavy govt stuff that you Texans despise. Hope
that makes you feel better. Just remember to swab your imitaton lensboard with a
paint-lead-testing pen before you let any of your kids chew on it!

[Allen in Montreal]

Aquafina was sued up here and now prints on the labels that it is tap water drawn from municipal supplies is Mississauga Ontario. And people pay 2 bucks a bottle for it! :mad:




Glenn, one of the big brands of bottled water sold around here is simply city tap water which has been run reverse osmosis and then had some taste minerals added..........

[Allen in Montreal]

Oh, I forgot to add that out here in Calif we have the strictest environmental laws in
the country........!

In Quebec we are way ahead of most of the country too,
we just never in force them.
Politicians have big press conferences to make huge announcements that never go beyond the press clipping on the bottom of the bird gage!!

At least you guys try to enforce them!