Does Kodak inside envelop enough to prevent fogging ?

[Thalmees]

Happy new year to every body.
I have received an opened pack of TMX 4X5, 50 sheet pack. One of the external stickers has been completely cut, but the inside envelope is still intact.
Does Kodak inside envelop enough to prevent fogging of the films ? as opposed to Ilford inside envelope ?
Thanks so much.

[Mark Sampson]

I don't know about Ilford films, but the foil packet enclosing Kodak film should not be considered light-tight. Nor is it meant to be; the triple box serves that purpose. Of course the only way to find out if the film has been fogged is to develop some, preferably from both the top and bottom of the stack inside the envelope.

[Thalmees]

Thanks so much Mark.
I’m going to develop few sheets from the first envelope.
Unfortunately, the TMX pack has two foil envelopes inside, each with 25 sheets.
Ilford has one side open plastic envelope. The open side is folded beneath the envelope.
Thanks.

[Steve Goldstein]

A slight tangent, but to Mark's point...

Some months ago I bought a few boxes of whole-plate TMY2 from another lister. This was from a special-order run from Kodak, it had EK labeling but was in a "natural" (grayish/brownish) double box rather than a tripled yellow one, and of course a black plastic inner bag. Film from the first box, at least, is fine, which leads me to question the whole triple-box ritual.

[JRFrench]

I don't know about Ilford films, but the foil packet enclosing Kodak film should not be considered light-tight. Nor is it meant to be; the triple box serves that purpose. Of course the only way to find out if the film has been fogged is to develop some, preferably from both the top and bottom of the stack inside the envelope.

I have read on this forum the complete opposite, that the envelope is the light tight part, and the boxes aren't light tight at all. It was in a thread where people were discussing using old film boxes to store exposed film.

Using logic alone, I would suspect a sealed envelope would be light tight, and that is probably how they are handled in the factory, the box is probably also light tight, but only becomes required once the envelop has been opened.

[J Ney]

Not trying to digress (especially if this is covered on other threads) but I've never had issues using the triple-boxes to store exposed film... though I definitely do not leave the box on the dash of my truck in direct sunlight :-)

[Maris Rusis]

The Kodak white+foil inner packets from my last 100 sheet box of 4x5 TXP were definitely not light tight.

I cut a foil pack along the edges to turn it into a flat sheet, held it over my face, and stared at a light bulb. Yes, I could see through it near the crimp lines. Apparently the crimping process cracked the aluminium layer enough to leave small areas where the translucent white paper was the only thing between the TXP and the light when the packets were out of the triple box.

The triple box, on the other hand, was superb; perfectly light-tight even in full sunlight.

[Allen in Montreal]

I have not read all the responses, so please forgive if I repeating others here,
the foil bag is designed more to control humidity and dust.
The triple box design is the main light trap.




Happy new year to every body.
I have received an opened pack of TMX 4X5, 50 sheet pack. One of the external stickers has been completely cut, but the inside envelope is still intact.
Does Kodak inside envelop enough to prevent fogging of the films ? as opposed to Ilford inside envelope ?
Thanks so much.

[Thalmees]

Thanks so much, appreciate all posts.
Have just finished testing three sheets. Two belongs to the new opened pack of TMX 4X5, and one belongs to an older patch of the same film kept for long time in an open foil envelope inside the triple box.
Results: All three sheets came clear from any density that may indicate film fogging.
Films was developed together around 30% longer than the recommended time.
Hope the rest of the 75 sheets all save from fogging. Any further suggestions ?
Thanks all.

[IanMazursky]

All of the kodak and fuji triple boxes i have ever used are 100% light tight.
The big problem is how they age. Over time the opening, closing, storing, moving...the corners can start to come apart and leak light.
Not a big problem just something to be aware of. I find that 8x10 boxes tend to go a lot faster then 4x5.
The bags i have found are light tight also. When i bring film to the lab, i usually just put it in a 3 part box without a bag. I have never had a problem.

[BrianShaw]

Both experience and education has led me to believe that the Kodak inner envelope is light-tight until opened (as with the tripple-boxes). Maybe someone should consider reviewing some of the educational docs on the Kodak site to see what they say... or consider calling their help line to get an authoritative answer.