This is the slowest site I visit/use [Archive] - Large Format Photography Forum

IanG

1-Jan-2010, 14:00

Bill_1856

1-Jan-2010, 14:05

After all, it IS the Large Format Site. That's one of the beauties of the process.

Vaughn

1-Jan-2010, 14:16

Seems fast enough to me, but speed is relative. Sometimes it slows down a bit, true, but I don't mind -- I am not paying by the minute to be here.

Vaughn

Kirk Gittings

1-Jan-2010, 14:18

We have had ongoing issues recently with the posting speed for sure. It is still not resolved, but IMO the rest of the site seems no slower than sites like Luminous landscape?

Mike1234

1-Jan-2010, 14:35

For Pete's sake. Let the tech guys catch up. It's the holidays for crying out loud. They've heard enough complaining from us already. This is by far the best LF site on the net. Also, keep in mind that it's free... no donations asked for nor even accepted. And does anyone ever see any advertising here? No... it's all free, no ads, and it's all voluntary.

As my father often said, "Ahh... quitcher bitchin".

David Karp

1-Jan-2010, 14:45

If you are talking about content on the static Home Page, then feel free to add new material. All of that information was volunteered. Just contact Tuan with your idea and then go for it. It is a nice way to give back for all of the information made available to all of us over the years, with no expectation of something in return.

If you are talking about content on the forum, it seems that it is up to us to post stuff that is not ten years behind.

Rick Moore

1-Jan-2010, 14:57

We have had ongoing issues recently with the posting speed for sure. It is still not resolved, but IMO the rest of the site seems no slower than sites like Luminous landscape?

As someone who runs a large IP network with quite a few busy web sites, I agree that this site performs well most of the time. Posting has been slow lately, but otherwise I have not had response problems.

Also, one must keep in mind that there are often quite a few network hops between a given site and one's browser. I just did a traceroute and there were 13 hops between my host and LFF. Any one or more of these can be slow at a given moment

YMMV.

resummerfield

1-Jan-2010, 15:12

....this site performs well most of the time. Posting has been slow lately, but otherwise I have not had response problems......
Agreed. This site is one of the faster loading photo sites I visit.

Frank_E

1-Jan-2010, 15:15

In saying "This is the slowest site I visit" I'm not exaggerating. It's appallingly slow.

That may be due to poor site maintenance or other issues but it's a great site, perhaps it needs some radical re-thinking, it's ten years behind in being updated content wise.

Ian

don't disagree that it takes a while to post some times
but it is a free site
we are not "paying the freight" here
and to improve it will likely cost money

I'm sure some will volunteer to pay for usage (ie subscription site)
but I fear that will drastically cut the participation rate of the site
which would seriously diminish the value

since I am an LF "newbie" personally I value and appreciate the advise I receive when looking for certain answers
and would be happy to make a Paypal contribution in a "tips jar"
has anyone ever thought of setting this up
I suspect that there are other like minded individuals who would gladly make a small contribution...

also I am personally not opposed if advertising was discretely carried

jnantz

1-Jan-2010, 15:15

i have noticed when it hangs after posting, if you just hit the unified view button
the post is there ... even seconds after the reply button is depressed.

happy new year btw ..

Michael Rosenberg

1-Jan-2010, 15:41

I have not had a problem with the speed of the site. It always loads up fast, and posts have been fast for me. If it does not seem like it is posting fast I just do what jnanian suggested above - and the post is there.

Mike

Jim Michael

1-Jan-2010, 15:54

Due to the new security restrictions all bytes have to be hand inspected before being allowed onto the network.

Richard K.

1-Jan-2010, 16:09

i have noticed when it hangs after posting, if you just hit the unified view button
the post is there ... even seconds after the reply button is depressed.

happy new year btw ..

Ah, so it doesn't take long to post, just to let you know it's posted! Good to know! :D

BrianShaw

1-Jan-2010, 16:23

I am extremely satisfied with, both, the site and it's speed, contents, and members. When the site slows down it is a benefit to me since it reminds me that patience is a virtue that I don't always have and that a slightly slower pace will likely lead to a much better lifestyle.

p.s. I hope I can keep this up... my New Years Resolution is to be kinder and gentler this year with a more positive outlook on life in general. 15.5 hours into the new year and I've managed to keep the resolution so far. Wish me luck!

Greg Lockrey

1-Jan-2010, 16:46

I'm in no particular hurry, but when it seems that the posting of comments seems to be running slow, I usually go to a different site and then reboot back to LFPF. By the time I get back, the comment is posted and I can peruse the rest of the forum.

Mike1234

1-Jan-2010, 18:26

...my New Years Resolution is to be kinder and gentler this year with a more positive outlook on life in general. 15.5 hours into the new year and I've managed to keep the resolution so far. Wish me luck!

Me too, Brian. Life all too often sucks. It's better that we be patient and caring for one another rather than critical and cruel.

Scott Knowles

1-Jan-2010, 18:29

The Website isn't slow, the network is the cause. Check the speed your getting to here and do a traceroute to find the delays. You might be running throughd busy routers or firewalls. I'm on a ~5 Mbytes DSL and it loads in a few seconds. As for the design, it's running vBulletin 3.6.4, but on version 4.0 is out, so it's not that far behind.

As for content, what do you expect with large format photography and this forum? It's not photo.net or similar Websites or forums. This one is focused, ok, minus the occasional tangents, content rich, user-experienced, and full of great wisdom, some humor and everything human.

I'm ok with it. If only John Layton would get his 10 cameras made. I'd be happy, minus writing the check.

Vick Vickery

1-Jan-2010, 18:42

I, too, have noticed the site has been a little slow posting lately, but that seems to come and go over time...if that's the worst problem that comes along, I'll be very happy! Great site, worth waiting a few seconds when posting...and, besides, like Bill said, this is large format, everything takes longer in large format!! :)

Ivan J. Eberle

1-Jan-2010, 18:51

Yeah, yeah-- it hangs sometimes on the uploading of a post or reply for me as well, it's hard to read and slow to load on my Blackberry Storm-- but it's presently the forum I find myself visiting most often.

It never ceases to amaze me how I've gotten responses within minutes or days about the finer points of a 60+ year old vintage camera from halfway across the globe. Compare this with how information about LF was disseminated as recently as 20 years ago (Shutterbug Magazine, anyone?) this is just freakin' amazing.

Scott Knowles

1-Jan-2010, 20:27

I've also noticed the responding slow to finish at times (not this time), which seems relatively new, but for me it's just a short walk to the kitchen to refill the coffee cup (home office). The responding is something wiht the server, software or database, and maybe worth looking into updating vBulletin? But it's the owner choice.

csant

2-Jan-2010, 02:13

Generally speaking it feels fast responding. There are some long posting times sometimes. But what I find most annoying is that sometimes it "drops out" completely, the servers do not respond. That happens for some 10-15 minutes, and then everything is back to normal. I know it is not at my end, and I know it is not some generic connectivity USA-Europe, since other US sites work just fine. Just this server doesn't respond.

percepts

2-Jan-2010, 02:24

99% of all web site slow responses are not due to the webserver application being slow. They are caused by network routing problems which are easy to check yourself.

Just go to the windows command prompt and type:

tracert www.largeformatphotography.info

or

Start/Run and type in tracert www.largeformatphotography.info

this site is hosted on: server3.reid.org so you should see that as last entry.

if you get any * showing then you are getting timeouts along the route and that will be where the problem is and not with this site.

from the UK i get typical ping times of upto 100+ once is goes stateside but reponse on the site is good (except for the posting problem which is something else).

If you are on a MAC then unlucky cos I haven't a clue what the equivalent check is.

Jim Michael

2-Jan-2010, 06:51

Some devices in the path such as a firewall or other device are set to not respond to pings so not all points produce a reply. The -n argument saves an address name lookup at each point so things run faster giving you a better assessment of performance. It's traceroute on the Mac (man traceroute lists all the options).

Since the site's performance appears slow to me only when posting I suspect a database performance issue, such as a need for an index on a table.

Scott Knowles

2-Jan-2010, 07:01

Traceroute on a Mac is two ways. First, in a unix window type in:

traceroute www.largeformatphotography.info

or use the "Network Utility" in your Applications/Utility folder for the ping or traceroute options. It runs the same program inside the utility window. You can also use the man command with Mac to get the full list of options.

The only problem is that many servers are now using firewalls which prohibit either of the two from entering the server, which is where you may see, eg. "3. * * * *, which means it can't get there yet or it's denied access to trace through the server. The first listing in the program is your modem assigned by your ISP. From there it's the hops to get to the destination.

If you can get a tracerouote, then the hop with the astericks is the problem, which is the one after the last one with an IP number. You can then use the number to identify the server with any DNS lookup.

Mike1234

2-Jan-2010, 09:45

Okay, the site is a bit slow lately. But we're beggars, not choosers. It's a no fee, no ad site. I've tried to donate and it was refused.. the mod quoted Tuan's intention of this being a free gift to LF shooters everywhere. Give the tech guys some time to deal with it. :)

Preston

2-Jan-2010, 10:21

My posts are slow to render once in a while. Otherwise, the site renders quickly in Fire Fox, IE 8, and Opera. (I'm on a DSL connection)

On some of the forums that contain images hosted on other servers, it take a bit of time, but its not a big deal, as I expect that to occur.

This is a great site! I really appreciate the work the moderators do in minding the store, the excellent images, and information.

Happy New Year!

--Preston

Jim Michael

2-Jan-2010, 10:59

Go spend a few minutes on keh.com ;-)

Peter York

2-Jan-2010, 11:29

Go spend a few minutes on keh.com ;-)

I can't - "Due to a server error we were unable to process your request" :mad:

Daniel_Buck

2-Jan-2010, 11:41

I've not noticed much slowness, I'm on a decent connection though.

(edit) oh I see it now, it's when you make a reply to a thread. Browsing and searching seems to be just fine though. (and editing posts!)

Glenn Thoreson

2-Jan-2010, 13:02

I'm on dial up out in the middle of nowhere and this is one of the better sites I visit. No complaint here. :D

Roger Thoms

2-Jan-2010, 13:10

Yes posts are a bit slow to load, I just open another tab on my web browser (Firefox) and keep on surfing. Otherwise I haven't noticed any problems. I'm on a cable internet.

Roger

rguinter

2-Jan-2010, 20:59

I might ask, since we are (I should think mostly) large format film photographers here, why would we be the type to be concerned very much with speed? My philosophy is to take things slowly in life as much as possible. So a little internet delay doesn't bother me. And I plan even to be late to my own funeral someday. After all... not something I want to check in early for or even on time....

3-Jan-2010, 06:10

Normally, I have been just opening another tab and doing something else while the post goes through. This morning, I posted, and after ten minutes of surfing, the post hadn't succeeded! THe rest of the site is nice and fast.

I would suspect there is some sort of anti-spam network/content checking going on in response to the post that is timing out or unreliable. Just a hunch from someone in the Internet business. Watching the log files during a post and turning on debugging might help track it down too.

percepts

3-Jan-2010, 06:57

I would suspect there is some sort of anti-spam network/content checking going on in response to the post that is timing out or unreliable. Just a hunch from someone in the Internet business. Watching the log files during a post and turning on debugging might help track it down too.

Hmmm, dangerorus hunch since if you close the browser or surf away from page as soon as you have sent post even though server hasn't responded, the post is still made. T'would be pretty crap spam protection if that were the reason for the response delay. Just a hunch ;)

Brian Ellis

3-Jan-2010, 08:34

Mike1234

3-Jan-2010, 09:31

^^^ Tom... the greedy so-and-so. :D

Sal Santamaura

3-Jan-2010, 09:34

In saying "This is the slowest site I visit" I'm not exaggerating. It's appallingly slow.

That may be due to poor site maintenance or other issues but it's a great site, perhaps it needs some radical re-thinking, it's ten years behind in being updated content wise.

IanIan, I find it appalling that you'd complain about this phenomenal, free, rich archival resource.

First, to reiterate what others have already written, with the current temporary exception of confirming new posts, it's not slow at all. Any latency when accessing the site or reading threads originates elsewhere in the network.

Second, radical re-thinking is the last thing needed for a site dedicated to photography using camera designs more than a century old.

Finally, the home page content, like forum threads, conveys information posted since site inception. It has all been written by volunteers and documents what was current at the time. This archive is invaluable for anyone who seeks to understand the evolution of large format photography during that period. New articles which describe ongoing changes are always welcome. Feel free to contribute to the community...

Kirk Gittings

3-Jan-2010, 11:23

Better today No? Tom ran some kind of optimization procedure.

Mike1234

3-Jan-2010, 11:34

It's been better for the last few posts. :)

eddie

3-Jan-2010, 12:12

i have trouble sending e mails and pm through the pull down menu. posting also is very slw.

i have noticed that the post does go through but my current tab is still "thinking" i have a PM and a e mail that has been "thinking" for 8 minutes. (it appears that the pm was sent as it shows up in my sent box when i open a new window)

eddie

edit. this message posted right away....

Kirk Gittings

3-Jan-2010, 12:28

I'm having the same problem again on large posts more than a couple of sentences. If i hit refresh right away after posting I get the duplicate post message.

Mike1234

3-Jan-2010, 12:34

Kirk... how full/old is the server RAID array?

Kirk Gittings

3-Jan-2010, 16:25

You are asking the wrong person. Ask Tom Westbrook.

percepts

4-Jan-2010, 03:23

I'm having the same problem again on large posts more than a couple of sentences. If i hit refresh right away after posting I get the duplicate post message.

Refresh on any form page in a browser will resend the post and cause a duplicate message. That is not a fault with the software.

The problem is that the response from the server after hitting submit is delayed for some reason. As I suggested before, it could be a database problem. Any new post has lots of database updates to do. Since the post seems to be inserted immediately I suspect that it may be the search indexes that are causing a problem when they are updated. But that is pure speculation on my part.

If you just hit the send button and then surf to another page(not refresh) you save yourself the wait.

Kirk Gittings

4-Jan-2010, 09:59

You missed my point. Two weeks ago there was no wait, all posts were uploaded instantaneously and you could hit the refresh button and just see the uploaded post.

BradS

4-Jan-2010, 10:05

Refresh on any form page in a browser will resend the post and cause a duplicate message. That is not a fault with the software.

The problem is that the response from the server after hitting submit is delayed for some reason. As I suggested before, it could be a database problem. Any new post has lots of database updates to do. Since the post seems to be inserted immediately I suspect that it may be the search indexes that are causing a problem when they are updated. But that is pure speculation on my part.

If you just hit the send button and then surf to another page(not refresh) you save yourself the wait.

You missed my point again. Two weeks ago there was no wait, all posts were uploaded instantaneously and you could hit the refresh button and just see the uploaded post.

No...he did not. He, in fact, addressed your point exactly.

Kirk Gittings

4-Jan-2010, 10:08

All, for your information, if you really want to contribute technically to a solution, you should contact Tom Westbrook. Posting your ideas here are not likely to be seen by Tom and I am a complete idiot in these matters and do not work on the software (nor do I have any desire to). I have just been listening to peoples complaints and passing them on. Tom has been making adjustments without much apparent success.

Ken Lee

4-Jan-2010, 11:23

What is the best way to contact Tom ?

My hosting company implemented a server-side caching feature which slowed things down dramatically. It was great from the $ perspective of the company, but rotten from the user perspective. Once I found out that they had no plans to remove it, I changed providers immediately.

percepts

4-Jan-2010, 11:42

from this page probably

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showgroups.php

Ken Lee

4-Jan-2010, 12:20

Thanks. I sent him an email with a suggestion.

csant

8-Jan-2010, 01:28

Just some 5-10 minutes ago I had the no-response thing again: traceroute to the LF server was speedy and fine, but the HTTP server would return nothing when trying to load a page.

Emmanuel BIGLER

8-Jan-2010, 03:55

Ian : did you check for the speed of this site from Aegean or from the UK ?

From France I've always found the speed of this site very good (no surprise, now that the relationship between the US and the French governments are warmer than it used to be, with taxes on Roquefort cheese and other customs fights).
As far as the UK is concerned, I' heard those days that many Eurostar high speed trains could not cross the Channel Tunnel very fast : may be it IS the reason : frost in the electronic channels connecting the UK to the US LF Forum ?
You should re-check either from Aegean or from the UK in Spring ! ;-);-)

percepts

8-Jan-2010, 04:58

RPNugent

9-Jan-2010, 15:05

I don't know if today is unusual, but it is really fast today. Maybe Tom figured out the problem.

percepts

9-Jan-2010, 15:11

I don't know if today is unusual, but it is really fast today. Maybe Tom figured out the problem.

Test...

Yes quicker for now at least

JRFrench

9-Jan-2010, 15:14

Most of the time its fast, occasionally it missed a post or something, but it doesnt seem speed related, more packet dropping or something.

percepts

11-Jan-2010, 07:47

Test...

Yes quicker for now at least

Spoke too soon. It's back to very slow as normal now.
The solution is to adjust ones perception of what normal is. If we all take very very slow as normal then it won't be a problem. I think the web techies must be taking this approach.

brian mcweeney

11-Jan-2010, 20:36

I have no problems with this site. Works fine for me.

Nathan Potter

11-Jan-2010, 21:01

The speed is intermittent for me. I measure 2 to 20 sec. per line of text during the last week.

Nate Potter, Austin TX.

Michael Jones

13-Jan-2010, 12:42

It may run slow at times, but I get what I pay for... :cool:

Mike

Tom Westbrook

16-Jan-2010, 05:14

OK, so I've checked the servers (http, dataabse) every which way and don't find any problems there.

So, from what I've heard, is this ONLY an issue while posting or is it bad generally (page load time)?

Performance will never be super-fast: we only run on a middling Unix box, but it shouldn't take more than 5 secs (use your watch to time things) to load a page or post to a thread.

bobwysiwyg

16-Jan-2010, 06:36

Tom,

Routine browsing is quite fast, almost instantaneous for me (Win XP, Safari, Comcast). However, posting a reply is v-e-r-y slow. I've never actually put a watch to it, but I would estimate it easily exceeds 30-40 seconds. The next couple of times I will actually time it and note the TOD. I know these things can be a bear to track down. :(

Edit: Just timed this post, it took 40 seconds to respond.

Another edit: If it helps any, the initial reply took 40 seconds, editing and updating and already existing post (this one) is virtually instantaneous.

eddie

16-Jan-2010, 08:50

what bob said above. i experience the same thing. (vista and XP) and it happens with the PM as well.....

IanG

16-Jan-2010, 11:38

Tom, I posted the original comment because it frequently times out on page loading, whether here in Turkey or when I'm in the UK.

It's just as bad at times when most of North America are asleep/offline and it's the only website I have constant problems with.

EDIT: 31 seconds to add post

EDIT 2 Almost instantaneous to post the edit

Perhaps it's a databse/SQL problem rather than the webserver itself

Ian

eddie

23-Jan-2010, 05:13

seems to go in and out.. today is better

edit: i spoke too soon....

Jim Michael

23-Jan-2010, 08:25

Read time is very fast for me. Always great performance. Only when posting do I see latency, so that appears to point to the database. If you have access to the code then it might be useful to place some timing code to see where the latency exists. Sure acts like an index issue. Or maybe tablespace having to be incremented?

Edit 1: post took 37 sec.
Edit 2: edit took 1 sec.

OK, so I've checked the servers (http, dataabse) every which way and don't find any problems there.

So, from what I've heard, is this ONLY an issue while posting or is it bad generally (page load time)?

Performance will never be super-fast: we only run on a middling Unix box, but it shouldn't take more than 5 secs (use your watch to time things) to load a page or post to a thread.