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evan clarke
10-Dec-2009, 05:22
Hi All,
After the introduction of the Chamonix 4x5 cameras there was a flurry of enthusiasm for it. There have been, IMHO, an inordinate amount of used ones for sale here. To those of you who have sold theirs, is there something you didn't like??..Evan Clarke

Aender Brepsom
10-Dec-2009, 05:56
Most of all, I didn't like the fiddly way it has to be set up and packed away. So I went back to a non-folding Ebony at the time.

Larry Gebhardt
10-Dec-2009, 05:58
I bought one of the used ones. I still like it. But it is not perfect. Here are my gripes:

1) having to screw in the front standard is a real time waster. Switching focal lengths frequently requires unscrewing the standard and then redoing it.

2) also related to the front standard, is there is not detent or positive lock to keep it square to the back. I involves lining up two dots. I haven't seen an issue with the pictures, but it feels wrong to me.

3) the rear standard movements are not quick. To put on a 300mm lens I need to extend the rear standard. This requires aligning it by feel to get it all square. Setting it back to the zero position also requires operating by feeling the edges to make sure it is even to the base plate.

4) The rear focus is nice, but when the focus rail is racked out there is some play in it. It seems to be induced by the torque of the focus screw. Longer guides would fix this at the expense of some weight.

So while I am willing to put up with those deficiencies for the weight savings, I am not happy about them. I am always thinking of ways to improve the camera design. I can certainly see how people would tire of it if they don't go far from the car. Of course if I was in that situation I would get a monorail and not a field camera.

Ulrich Drolshagen
10-Dec-2009, 07:35
I too have bought a used one. Apart from the annoying focusing problem I am very satisfied with the cam. In this price range it was the only one with such a long bellows, which is a killer feature for me. Weight is an issue too and weighting up the inconvenience of the setup. It's the perfect camera for my application. If you have different needs it may not be the right camera for you. I'd say, line up your needs, weight them and look which camera fits the bill best. It's good that we all have a rich choice in cameras of different make.

Ulrich

Brian Ellis
10-Dec-2009, 08:14
I bought a new one out of the second batch and liked it a lot. I sold it because I wasn't using it. I think it's like any other camera - you have to weigh the advantages against the disadvantages to see if it's the camera for you. For me the many advantages - long bellows, light weight, extensive movements, quality construction, low price, etc. - made it an excellent choice. The things Larry mentions didn't bother me though I don't recall using a 300mm lens with mine so I don't know about #3. In fact I thought #2 was actually a nice little feature compared to some LF field cameras that have nothing to guide you in aligning the front with the rear. But it's just a question of what's important to you and what isn't or what bothers you and what doesn't.

R Mann
10-Dec-2009, 08:22
I also bought one - used it a while and sold it.

I do think it was "over hyped" on the internet - but that allowed me to sell it for what I paid for it.

1) Build quality was OK - not better or worse than other cameras I have used -
2) Ground glass was OK but I would have replaced it if I had kept the camera -
3) Did not like the focus wheel placement -
4) Did wish there were seperate back movements and I found the back "swing" hard to adjust - missed having shift on the back.
5) While it is a little lighter than other 4x5, when folded it was not smaller -
6) Did not like moving the front & its attachment screw, especially when a lens was attached - seemed like I needed three hands to keep everything under control.
7) Did not like the front & bellows floating around during set up and folding, a couple of times it was like working with a slinky - but I can be a bit of a klutz.

I would agree that it is nice to see choices in an entry level camera and the price was reasonable. But, I would also like to see it sold through more outlets - perhaps ones with a customer service record and inventory of parts & accessories, or at least a return policy.

D. Bryant
10-Dec-2009, 08:24
I bought one of the used ones. I still like it. But it is not perfect. Here are my gripes:

1) having to screw in the front standard is a real time waster. Switching focal lengths frequently requires unscrewing the standard and then redoing it.

2) also related to the front standard, is there is not detent or positive lock to keep it square to the back. I involves lining up two dots. I haven't seen an issue with the pictures, but it feels wrong to me.

3) the rear standard movements are not quick. To put on a 300mm lens I need to extend the rear standard. This requires aligning it by feel to get it all square. Setting it back to the zero position also requires operating by feeling the edges to make sure it is even to the base plate.

4) The rear focus is nice, but when the focus rail is racked out there is some play in it. It seems to be induced by the torque of the focus screw. Longer guides would fix this at the expense of some weight.

So while I am willing to put up with those deficiencies for the weight savings, I am not happy about them. I am always thinking of ways to improve the camera design. I can certainly see how people would tire of it if they don't go far from the car. Of course if I was in that situation I would get a monorail and not a field camera.

I'm pretty much in agreement with Larry, though I still find it to be a sweet camera.

Every wooden field camera I've ever used has had it's own set of gotchas, none are perfect.

For price and weight this camera performs very well. You maybe able to get a good deal on a used one.

Don Bryant

SW Rick
10-Dec-2009, 08:52
Full disclosure: I'm a happy Chamonix owner (had another field camera, sold it to buy this, like it far better- YMMV).

I did an Advanced Search on Chamonix in the "For Sale" section, and found 10 4x5s offered for sale in the past 12 months. Did a similar search for Shen Hao, and got 12 4x5s for sale in the past 12 months. Why not a post on the "inordinate number of Shen Haos for sale"? I have my suspicions, but find the focus on Chamonix very interesting....

The camera is a tool- what's right for some is not right for others. No need to impose my preferences on others. Buy what you like, use what you like. Tired of the the "put-downs" on this forum.

Rick




Hi All,
After the introduction of the Chamonix 4x5 cameras there was a flurry of enthusiasm for it. There have been, IMHO, an inordinate amount of used ones for sale here. To those of you who have sold theirs, is there something you didn't like??..Evan Clarke

evan clarke
10-Dec-2009, 09:08
Full disclosure: I'm a happy Chamonix owner (had another field camera, sold it to buy this, like it far better- YMMV).

I did an Advanced Search on Chamonix in the "For Sale" section, and found 10 4x5s offered for sale in the past 12 months. Did a similar search for Shen Hao, and got 12 4x5s for sale in the past 12 months. Why not a post on the "inordinate number of Shen Haos for sale"? I have my suspicions, but find the focus on Chamonix very interesting....

The camera is a tool- what's right for some is not right for others. No need to impose my preferences on others. Buy what you like, use what you like. Tired of the the "put-downs" on this forum.

Rick

I probably noticed the Chamonix a litle more because the hype had me interested in buying one. Inordinate because everybody seemed to be raving about it at the onset and then quite a few were sold, my conclusion was that it's not a wonderful as was hoped. I use a fully loaded Arca 141 F metric as my go to camera but agree with Aender about a non-folding Ebony, I have a 45s and it is the best wooden camera I have encountered...EC

Larry Gebhardt
10-Dec-2009, 09:43
I should add that I like it more than the Shen-Hao it replaced, except for the few things I listed. I still think it's the best deal in a field camera at the moment.

One thing people don't mention is how rigid the camera is when setup. It is far more solid feeling than the Shen-Hao HZX I was using before (not that that was a sloppy camera). And the fact that it stays solid feeling fully extended is very nice.

Frank Petronio
10-Dec-2009, 09:49
It was one of the best marketing campaigns for product I've ever seen. Brilliant and it didn't cost them anything.

evan clarke
10-Dec-2009, 09:54
I should add that I like it more than the Shen-Hao it replaced, except for the few things I listed. I still think it's the best deal in a field camera at the moment.

One thing people don't mention is how rigid the camera is when setup. It is far more solid feeling than the Shen-Hao HZX I was using before (not that that was a sloppy camera). And the fact that it stays solid feeling fully extended is very nice.

Thanks, These are the things I am curious about. There is no place you can go to see one in person and I get to be around a fair amount of LF photographers..EC

Aahx
10-Dec-2009, 13:18
I have both a 20+ year old Wista field, and the Chamonix 45n(purchased in 08). They both have their positives and negatives. The Chamonix has a stiffer back and longer bellows extension than the Wista. But I prefer the focusing system and assembling/dis assembling of the Wista. The Chamonix is lighter and looks prettier than my beat up Wista. But the Wista gives me more critical focusing (I have not replaced my Chamonix screen yet). If I did not back pack with my gear I would consider selling both and purchasing either a Toyo VX125 or an Arca F metric to replace them with. But as I do backpack with my gear, I need something that’s light and fits in my backpack. So the best option available atm seems to be the Chamonix at present. Oh.. and I shoot with a lens range from 90 to 300.

BarryS
10-Dec-2009, 13:44
I still have my Chamonix and still think it's a great camera for the build quality and stiffness, weight, and feature set. Since I purchased it, I've had a chance to try out a good number of other cameras and my opinion of the Chamonix hasn't changed. The quality is high and the accessories are reasonably priced. To me, the fresnel issue is minor and easily remedied. When there were very few cameras in circulation, it was a rare event to see a Chamonix for sale, but a couple years later there are more cameras in circulation, and everything gets bought and sold eventually. I've used my Chamonix to make lots of photographs that please me, place in gallery shows and sell--what else matters?

Michael Gordon
10-Dec-2009, 14:32
I sold my Ebony SV45Ti so that I could buy my *SECOND* 045n-1. Maybe this is about as bold an endorsement as one could make for Chamonix?

No single object in life serves multiple purposes very well (vehicles; shoes; tents; sleeping bags; backpacks; you name it), and cameras are no different. If you like to walk any distance with your kit and you like to work quickly and intuitively with a rigid and lightweight camera, I would argue that it's difficult to beat this one. This is only my opinion, but I'm sticking with it.

If you think the camera has been over-hyped and over-sold, then simply pick another camera and its compromises ;)

Michael Rosenberg
10-Dec-2009, 15:24
I have been using my 045n-1, and agree with what Brian and Michael said in their posts. I have used quite a few cameras, and think that the Chamonix is a very fine camera. I have had no issues with it that would make me hesitate buying another one. In fact, three friends of mine that had a chance to play with the camera thought enough of it (particularly the light weight) that they bought one.

A side comment, if you want critical focusing then you have to have a the best focusing loupe of at least 8x, and check often that it is focused on the surface of the gg.

Mike

Richard K.
10-Dec-2009, 15:43
Larger than 4x5, the light weight coupled with fantastic rigidity makes it noticeably better than many competing cameras. Try wiggling the back or focus bed on a Chamonix and then compare to some other good brands. Of course there's other reasons to prefer non-Chamonix - aesthetics (though this is a personal matter), bellows length, rack & pinion focusing vs centre screw, etc., etc. But they are fine cameras!:) And their holders! Without exagerration (IMO anyway), the best I've used and a lot cheaper than some other similar high end ones.

Harley Goldman
10-Dec-2009, 16:42
I had an Arca F-Line Classic and a Toho. A couple of years ago, I bought the Chamonix to replace the Toho as my lightweight travel/backpacking camera. I liked using the Cham so much, I ended up selling both the Toho and the Arca. Yeah, the front screw is a slight inconvenience, but other than that, I find it to be an amaziingly sweet camera. It is light, rigid, easy to set up and take down, etc.

I previously owned a Wista DXII and based on the Wista, thought I would never again own a wooden field camera. I found the Wista fiddly and painful to use. Buying the Chamonix changed my attitude toward field cameras.

Count me a very happy Chamonix owner.

Peter De Smidt
10-Dec-2009, 23:02
I only had a Chamonix for a little while. It's a very nice camera. In the "light, rigid and moderately priced" category, I prefer it to a Toho. (I owned a Toho FC45x for a couple of years.) That said, for the vast majority of situations, I'd rather use an Arca F, the Ebony, or a Toyo 45AX.

Clement Apffel
11-Dec-2009, 07:10
...an inordinate amount of used ones for sale here.

What is inordinate lately is this kind of threads about it: created by doubtful, misinformed, and full of prejudice people. I don’t know what they expect about those threads?
Users massively confessing “yeah this camera hasn’t a single good point, it’s total crap, I got totally scammed by those evil Chinese, I wish I could have bought instead a canham or an ebony by selling one of my kidney” so one could be reassured of having a $3K 4x5” ?
Well sorry, this camera is the best purchase I ever made regarding LF.
I won’t detail AGAIN why.
No offence meant.


It was one of the best marketing campaigns for product I've ever seen. Brilliant and it didn't cost them anything.

Frank, to me, the 45N-1 bashing, flaming and hammering made FAR more noise and ad than the threads created about praising it.
Oddly enough I can’t remember much about the later kind of thread. But maybe I haven't been on board long enough to see those so numerous hymn of praise about the 45N-1.
But maybe it’s just a matter of seeing things, isn’t it?

John Powers
11-Dec-2009, 07:20
Yeah, the front screw is a slight inconvenience, but other than that, I find it to be an amaziingly sweet camera. It is light, rigid, easy to set up and take down, etc. .

Dick Phillips tells of designing this feature in his sleep one night because he liked the rigidity of his 8x10 Deardorff, but not the 13 pounds of weight. The 8 pound reversible back result and later 6 pound horizontal Explorer were both ridged and the fore runner of a common design today.

John

Songyun
11-Dec-2009, 07:35
finally some rational discussion here.
My 045N1 was from the first batch, I had great 2 1/2 yrs with this camera, and still love it. It is not a perfect one, but it fits my need. I am spoiled by this camera, I used to think 4~5 lbs camera are light, 6 lbs are acceptable, now I won't put these cameras in my backpack anymore. I have sold my arca discovery and never look back.

redrockcoulee
11-Dec-2009, 07:36
It seems to me that the OP asked an honest question: it appeared to him that at first people really loved the camera however there seems to be many used ones on the market and is the reason due to the camera itself. What is wrong with wanting to know?

I would expect more Shen Haos to be on the used market simply as they have been arround longer. I bought mine used prior to even hearing about Chanonix for example. I would guess that the turn over of a Chamonix would be higher than an Ebony as the latter is more expensive and less likely to be a first LF purchase and we do know that LF is not for everyone hence those who buy one and decide it is not for them are likely to see the camera system.

I found it interesting and informative to find out the negatives about the Chamonix as well as the positives. I am happy with my Shen Hao and currently have no plans on replacing it however if I did I would now have things to consider if I was thinking of a Chamonix or its Shen Hao clonish model. I now that some people in the past have been agaisnt all the Chinese cameras but I do not read the OP or those who responded with some negative experiences as being of that bend.

If people are selling them due to a part of the design that does not work for them, does not mean that they are anti the company or evil people either. Clement: it may have been the best LF purchase that YOU have made but is the reason for selling because they were bought by people who no longer want a LF or are being sold by someone who thinks another brand or model would work better for THEM?

Vlad Soare
11-Dec-2009, 08:19
Frank, to me, the 45N-1 bashing, flaming and hammering made FAR more noise and ad than the threads created about praising it.
Oddly enough I can’t remember much about the later kind of thread. But maybe I haven't been on board long enough to see those so numerous hymn of praise about the 45N-1
Clement, you'll probably see such a thread pretty soon, as I've just ordered a 45n-1 from Hugo. :D
If I find it as magnificent as people use to say it is, I'll tell everybody about it. :D

Andrey Donchev
11-Dec-2009, 09:52
I had one from the first batch and sold it after only few field trips. Why?

I found it to be a big dust attractor. The synthetic bellows, the carbon plate and the thick lacquering of the wooden parts, all of them was always covered with dust.

Second, I found that the finish of the wooden parts is very soft and is damaged easily.

Third, the hinges of the rear standard was not, IMHO, strong enough to prevent the back twist when rear movements where applied on full extension.

Forth, the focusing mechanism was plastic and I'm positive that it will play after only year or two of extensive use.

In simple words, like my grandfather used to say, I'm not so rich to buy cheap stuff.

Sorry to say that, but I was disappointed.

Clement Apffel
11-Dec-2009, 09:57
Clement: it may have been the best LF purchase that YOU have made but is the reason for selling because they were bought by people who no longer want a LF or are being sold by someone who thinks another brand or model would work better for THEM?

I understand that of course. I never claimed it was the perfect camera for everyone.
But I'm just feeling weary of all those threads filled with exaggerated and untrue facts about this camera.
This time it was:
“The used market is flooded with 45n1s!!! So there IS something wrong with this camera after all!!!”
Get your facts straight.

And I am sorry but if Ebony, Canham or Richard Ritter was releasing a new 4x5” camera, you would have as much as praising thread about them. None would be whining about the free ad or the hype.
And I would be very excited to read those threads as numerous as they would be. Wouldn’t you?
Because that is our common passion: LF photography, LF equipment!
So what’s so wrong with the so called “hype”?
What’s so wrong with users telling how happy they are with their new toy?
I say nothing!
Let it be.

You don’t like the camera the thread is about for some unknown reason? Just pass by, keep the venom.
We red so many disdainful comments about the Chamonix discussions. I’m just tired about those.

Just let the users share their opinions.
Now, if a user has REAL issues with the camera because he is REALLY owning one, their comments are helpful. Because it is about how the camera IS.
And it can help someone looking for info to make their own mind about it.
That’s what a forum is about!
But those comments about the camera being Chinese, being overrated, over mentioned in the forum or any whining comments we red about all this are just plain useless.



If I find it as magnificent as people use to say it is, I'll tell everybody about it. :D

Yes, as you would with any other camera you might buy, wouldn’t you?
Grats for your purchase!

I’ll be glad to read about your opinion about it.

Michael Alpert
11-Dec-2009, 12:02
But I'm just feeling weary of all those threads filled with exaggerated and untrue facts about this camera.
This time it was:
“The used market is flooded with 45n1s!!! So there IS something wrong with this camera after all!!!”
Get your facts straight.


Clement,

No, you are exaggerating. The originating post was a reasonable question concerning what people think about this camera. Most people have been very careful to state specifically what they like or do not like.

For a short while, I had a 5x7 horizontal Chamonix camera that did not have enough vertical movement for my purposes (the bellows interfered with rise when photographing architecture with a wide-angle or normal lens. I did not expect this problem, and it would not be a problem in most landscape photography) and I did not like the bubble levels, which I thought were poorly integrated with the camera. Otherwise, the camera was very workable and quite beautiful. Although it was very light, it wasn't what I needed. Hugo was very gracious about allowing me to return the camera.

evan clarke
11-Dec-2009, 12:13
What is inordinate lately is this kind of threads about it: created by doubtful, misinformed, and full of prejudice people. I don’t know what they expect about those threads?
Users massively confessing “yeah this camera hasn’t a single good point, it’s total crap, I got totally scammed by those evil Chinese, I wish I could have bought instead a canham or an ebony by selling one of my kidney” so one could be reassured of having a $3K 4x5” ?
Well sorry, this camera is the best purchase I ever made regarding LF.
I won’t detail AGAIN why.
No offence meant.



Frank, to me, the 45N-1 bashing, flaming and hammering made FAR more noise and ad than the threads created about praising it.
Oddly enough I can’t remember much about the later kind of thread. But maybe I haven't been on board long enough to see those so numerous hymn of praise about the 45N-1.
But maybe it’s just a matter of seeing things, isn’t it?

Well, from the hysteria that was created over this camera, I expected NEVER to see a used one and I am genuinely curious about the reasons for selling them. I have around 30 modern view cameras and a number of vintage cameras and actually use most. I was contemplating a purchase without ever having seen one so I could examine it before buying an 11x14. Now why wouldn't you tell me what you like about it if it's the best camera you have ever had? The best camera I have ever had is my Arca 141 F Metric which is with me 24/7/365...Evan Clarke

R Mann
11-Dec-2009, 12:14
Interesting thread and for what its worth - my view of it.


Hi All,
To those of you who have sold theirs, is there something you didn't like??..Evan Clarke

This was the question asked - why the defensive attitude from some those who own and have decided to keep theirs? As a one time owner (and user) who then sold it - I offered my reasons for not keeping it.

I think some of the "information" or "misinformation" is based on a lack of a dealer network. Leaving you to the internet forums instead of a chance to see it and touch it before purchasing. I know I bought mine without actually touching one first. I think if I had inspected it in person, I would have decided to not buy one.

I would like my camera to not be the focus of my attention, just an easy to use tool that helps me capture an image. My choice is mine to make, and I certainly would expect others to have different needs and thus make different choices.

Gordon Moat
11-Dec-2009, 20:14
I think just as with the Shen Hao when it appeared, there was great expectations for these entry level price point cameras. While I am quite happy with my Shen Hao, I can see things I would prefer on a more expensive camera. Also, I do think the volume of sales has more to do with the low price relative to other cameras. I don't know if I would replace the Shen Hao with an Ebony, which was the often compared higher priced alternative. I do think if I got an Arca Swiss that I might not use the Shen Hao that often, but I would likely stop short of selling it.

Definitely it seemed that a casual glance of threads there was a great amount of hype to the Chamonix cameras, but the older Shen Hao posts went along similar directions. Then there was the newness of it all, but again like other gear. So I don't think the sales are surprising, nor do I see them as a let down on the implied quality. Besides, the lenses are vastly more important to the results than the box upon which we hang them.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat Photography (http://www.gordonmoat.com)

Jim Graves
11-Dec-2009, 21:33
Hi All,
After the introduction of the Chamonix 4x5 cameras there was a flurry of enthusiasm for it. There have been, IMHO, an inordinate amount of used ones for sale here. To those of you who have sold theirs, is there something you didn't like??..Evan Clarke

Simple observation and a simple question.

I followed the Chamonix entry into the market pretty closely ... in fact, it was a really fun thread as pictures were posted, people asked about features, Hugo updated everyone on the answers and factory progress toward shipping. Then as shipping started, it was like Christmas morning everyday. I'd log on and read about Santa arriving here and there [with excited package opening descriptions and photos posted] and finally ending with the last arrivals in England after an interminable wait in customs.

Although there have been quite a few offered for sale ... I think the term "inordinate" is misleading ... especially when you realize that virtually all of the original recipients had not only not touched, but had not even seen the camera except in web photos before ordering.

It looks like a very nice camera for the price and from all accounts it is just that.

Evan [the OP] asked a legitimate question ... "To those of you who have sold theirs, is there something you didn't like??" ... How the heck does that become so controversial????

ki6mf
12-Dec-2009, 05:43
While I own the Enemy, Shen Hao, I agree with Jim Graves. LF is for those who enjoy the process and if you are happy with digital stay with that. In the above posts someone said 10 have come up since introduction You may see one a month on e bay compared to the 100 other LF 4X5 out there for sale. Those who use them like them and for the most part keep them. Quality is good and in the USA there is praise for Hugo who is distributing.

gevalia
12-Dec-2009, 08:15
I'd like to say 1st off that I really like my 45n-1 and use it in the field conatantly but there are a few irritations.
1. The focus screw placement (or worm drive as I call it) is at times frustrating when you're under a darkcloth.
2. There's no focus lock-down capability. I've cocked the shutter a few times and inadvertently upset focus because there was no lock and also because the focus wheel becomes loose over time. There is a way to retighten the wheel but once it gets loose, it seems to keep getting loose. A locking mechanism would solve this completely.
3. And this is a minor gripe but the base is not carbon fiber. It is wood with a carbon fiber veneer on it. While out in the desert, my tripod shifted and fell damaging the base when it hit a rock. The corner of the base chipped revealing wood covered with carbon fiber. Like I said, really minor and totally my fault, and I'm sad every time I look at it.

All this being said, you're gonna have to pry it from my cold dead hands.

gregvds
14-Dec-2009, 07:13
Hi,

I received mine some days ago now. The camera is really nice. What I really like is its design, the holes in the baseplates are really helpful to maintain the camera while attaching it to the tripod, or having it in hand simply, I rather prefer this than a leather hand on the top or on the backside, as in a Wista or old Linhof.

Its weight also is amazing.

Now, truely, the front screw to attach the front frame is sometimes cumbersome to screw and unscrew, you need to have the frame kept perpendicular to the base, but that's minor.

I think the camera would make a near pefect hit if the Aluminium was chemically hardened and anodized, rather than coated or painted. We'll see in time how this wears off. I assume a Canham would have better looking Aluminium gear and frame.

I knew the base was a sandwich of CF/wood/CF, it seems to me perfect, but the finition of the back focusing rails, thes are not as well finished on the inside as the baseplate faces and holes. This is cosmetic, but I bought also the camera because of its eastethic qualities (YMMV on that, don't fire at me).

When the camera is built, it's really rigid and behave quite confidently. We'll see in time if this will be maintained, anyway, I'll need some time to use it, be familiar with it, and save for a next one (There will be, I know myself now, after 25 years of buying photo gear, it's not a quest of the best equipment, it's a habit, or passtime, I enjoy it anyway).

The fresnel and GG are really nice, and easy to focus. Hugo accepted to follow my request to put the fresnel outside of the GG, and the factory achieved to put GG, fresnel, and a protective glass in the usual place, at no additional cost, try this with a big brand to see...).
I followed the discussions about the fresnel placement problem, even if a lot of users never complained about the focus of their camera, nor the results they got from it. Clement reacted quite frankly because other forum member (GPS) flamed down the camera without owning one, hence the answer of Clement, and I follow him on that point.

From my small experience with the camera, my darkcloth (paramo) goes fairly well with the camera, and the focusing knob is very handy on the rear like that, you're not outstretching arms to reach the front knobs.

Finish is ok, not top notch, but heck, I paid 650 euros for it, you must consider that also.

I'm amazed by the compactness of the back, when you come back to look at ebony's back, they look big and heavy without purpose.

I fear the CF plates (base and GG protection) will quickly collect scratches from everywhere, again, we'll see in time.

The universal bellow is very well done, and useful. I still don't have the camera for long enough to judge the dust problem, but it was already the case with my Leicas, my rolleis, the Wista, every camera collect dust like no hoover could dream about it seems.

So, all in all, I'm currently happy with the camera, which has very nice features, some details I'd love to have perfected, and a very good usability for me (I like to have a camera with me in a shoulder bag, and that's exclude a lot of them).

Greg

Chuck Bradford
14-Dec-2009, 09:21
I met Harley Goldman in Colorado this past fall and he showed me his Chamonix, when I got back home I orderd one because I wanted to shoot longer lenses than my Ebony would allow. I have not had the Chamonix long but so far am very pleased with it's operations. I plan to keep my Ebony, but on long hikes I'm sure I'll take the Camonix because it is just so much lighter.

Vlad Soare
24-Dec-2009, 07:19
Clement, you'll probably see such a thread pretty soon, as I've just ordered a 45n-1 from Hugo. :D
If I find it as magnificent as people use to say it is, I'll tell everybody about it. :D
Yes, as you would with any other camera you might buy, wouldn’t you?
Grats for your purchase!

I’ll be glad to read about your opinion about it.
OK, the camera is here. All I can say is WOW! :eek:
It's not perfect, but it's close enough.
This is one buying decision I don't think I'll ever regret.

Ron Bose
24-Dec-2009, 13:48
C'mon people, let's remember one thing, the price !!

The fact that this camera is being sold on by people moving on to Ebony's is quite a feat !

IIRC my wife's 45N cost me $650 ? So she doesn't use it, that's her issue ... I paid $2,500 for a used Canham 4x5/5x7 camera. How much do used or even new Ebony's cost ?

We can all yak about how nice a Lexus or BMW are, and how crap a KIA is. But remember that a KIA will cost you $15,000 and a Lexus or BMW $50,000.

An important factor is that most here can afford the BMW/Lexus cameras and that's why many walked away from the KIA ....

Vlad Soare
24-Dec-2009, 23:56
Spot on. I can't believe what superb camera I got new for just eight hundred dollars. It is everything it is supposed to be and does everything it is supposed to do, it looks great, weighs almost nothing and comes at an unbelievable price. It may have some quirks, but under these circumstances who cares? :)

evan clarke
20-Jan-2010, 06:43
I started this so I could make a decision whether or not to buy a Chamonix 11x14 and was fairly surprised to see anybody sell their 4x5s after such a short time. After all the posts, I still had to do a mental coin-flip and bought the camera. It is at least twice as good as I hoped, an elegant, simple execution of the design and freakishly light. This weekend I'll have a chance to set it up next to a Phillips so I can see how much copying/improvement/difference there is between them...Evan Clarke

Mike1234
20-Jan-2010, 09:35
I bought a used 45N-1 despite the little focusing error with the expectation of replacing the focus screen with a Maxwell. After a very informative telephone conversation with Bill Maxwell I opted for the standard screen. He suggested I call Bill Moretz to have the screen installed because there can be other things awry with the Chamonix factory screen installation including depth variations and warpage that Mr. Moretz can correct. Having Mr. Moretz install the screen will ensure a "no worries" scenario with a precision unmatched by the factory. I'm sending Bill Moretz the whole camera to ensure it's done correctly.

dsim
20-Jan-2010, 10:04
I got the same advice from Maxwell.

Mike1234
20-Jan-2010, 10:10
I got the same advice from Maxwell.

Are you going to have it done or did you already?

dsim
20-Jan-2010, 10:14
The camera is being sent out at the end of this week. The new screen is for an 8x10.

Mike1234
20-Jan-2010, 10:23
8x10?? I'm jealous as hell!! :)

J_Tardiff
20-Jan-2010, 15:17
Guys,

Please post back when you get your cameras back from Bill, I've got a 4x5 Maxwell screen from a previous camera and have been thinking about having it installed in my Chamonix.

JT

Mike1234
20-Jan-2010, 15:19
Will do, JT. It'll be probably 2-3 weeks before mine is returned. Please post again in this thread to reminde me. My brain is quite feeble these days and I may forget!! :)

Tony Flora
9-Apr-2010, 09:58
Just curious how this worked out.

D. Bryant
14-Apr-2010, 11:26
Chamonix-Mont-Blanc or, more commonly, Chamonix is a commune in the Haute-Savoie department in the Rhône-Alpes region in south-eastern France. It was the site of the 1924 Winter Olympics, the first Winter Olympics. The commune's population of around 9,800 ranks 865th within the nation of France

Thanks. You can save time going forward by posting a link to the Wikipedia pages you are copying from.

Don Bryant

ImSoNegative
1-May-2010, 07:14
I bought a shen-hao ptb, seems very close if not identical to the chamonix, Im used to using a toyo 45gII so this camera is a bit strange to me, i love the light weight especially compared to the toyo, 3 pounds compared to 13 pounds of course it wont be as precise but the lighter weight will be worth any little fuss. seems like a well built camera