View Full Version : Clear Neg-No Edge Markings
tgtaylor
8-Dec-2009, 21:59
I just developed 3 holders (6 negatives) of Fuji 160S color negative film shot yesterday using a Jobo3010 Expert Drum and Kodak C-41 chemistry. 5 came out as expected but the 6th was crystal clear with no edge markings. I'm certain that I pulled the dark slide and exposed all. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Thomas
Usually when that happens to me, I have a double exposure on one side of the holder and a blank neg in the other!
And then there was the time I did an hour exposure at night and spent a long time looking for the darkslide -- I never pulled it. Other possibilities -- lens not cocked (but usually we hear the shutter fire), darkcloth accidently drooped in front of the lens, gremlins, mental farts, etc.
tgtaylor
9-Dec-2009, 10:29
Thanks for the reply Vaughn.
When I awoke this morning and placed them in their storage sleeves, I noticed that the notches on the clear negative didn't match with the others. It turns out that it was a TMax 100 negative! The only way that could have happened is if I loaded one side of that holder with color and forgot to notate that in my notebook that I carry with me when photographing, or Fuji mixed it in the box. Can't imagine the latter so it must be the former. I always load one film at a time in the holders so it's impossible that I reached for the wrong box in the Harrison tent because it wouldn't be there.
After I posted last night I did a quick search online. The only posting I ran across was that a clear negative with no edge marking meant that you ran the negative thru the fixer first. That was not the case here as the other 5 came out well.
So the lesson is: If you run an exposed B&W negative thru the C-41 process, you get zilch! Nutin!
Thomas
Thanks for the reply Vaughn.
When I awoke this morning and placed them in their storage sleeves, I noticed that the notches on the clear negative didn't match with the others. It turns out that it was a TMax 100 negative! The only way that could have happened is if I loaded one side of that holder with color and forgot to notate that in my notebook that I carry with me when photographing, or Fuji mixed it in the box. Can't imagine the latter so it must be the former. I always load one film at a time in the holders so it's impossible that I reached for the wrong box in the Harrison tent because it wouldn't be there.
After I posted last night I did a quick search online. The only posting I ran across was that a clear negative with no edge marking meant that you ran the negative thru the fixer first. That was not the case here as the other 5 came out well.
So the lesson is: If you run an exposed B&W negative thru the C-41 process, you get zilch! Nutin!
Thomas
That just recently happened to me, as well!!!
I'm taking my right closed-fist and putting it against my right temple... forearm at a 45d angle and upper arm parrallel to the deck. I'm giving you the knuckle-head salute!!
Louie Powell
9-Dec-2009, 11:13
The larger the format, the more ways there are to screw up (and the more painful each error is).
That's all part of the fun.
Ahhh...well, the mystery is not totally solved, but somewhat explained. I thought what you meant by "edge markings" was the rebate, not the burned-in identifiers.
Interesting, C-41 films developed in B&W chemistry does produce an image.
You should print the clear neg -- you could title the print "The Non-latent Image Revealed".
Vaughn
dave_whatever
9-Dec-2009, 14:15
You should print the clear neg -- you could title the print "The Non-latent Image Revealed".
If John Cage was a photographer........
Diane Maher
9-Dec-2009, 14:34
A lab accidentally developed a roll of HIE in E-6. At first, they told me that the film wasn't exposed and wanted to charge me, but I realized there was a discernible image present. I got a free replacement roll of HIE film. I was glad that I had asked to see the negatives.
keith english
9-Dec-2009, 15:02
Fortunately with large format it's only one image not 36! I hate to admit that when working in a local lab I ran a roll of BW through the c41 machine. The temperature just melts the emulsion I believe.
James E Galvin
9-Dec-2009, 15:12
Its not a mystery. Color film starts out with silver halide, developed similar to B/W. Its the spent developer that couples to the color dye. Then the silver is bleached out, and the remaining silver halide fixed out. But b/w film doesn't have the chemistry to couple to the color dye. So you have developed the b/w image, removed the image with the bleach, and removed the remaining silver halide. That's the hard way to make clear plastic sheets!
tgtaylor
9-Dec-2009, 19:59
Its not a mystery. Color film starts out with silver halide, developed similar to B/W. Its the spent developer that couples to the color dye. Then the silver is bleached out, and the remaining silver halide fixed out. But b/w film doesn't have the chemistry to couple to the color dye. So you have developed the b/w image, removed the image with the bleach, and removed the remaining silver halide. That's the hard way to make clear plastic sheets!
I think this is correct. The process sequence steps in the Jobo manual describes the sequence as:
"In the bleach, the metallic silver is converted to silver to be removed by the fixing bath (which also removes) all remaining silver salts...from the film." In the B&W sequence the "Exposed silver salt in converted to metallic silver...(and the) fixer removes the unconverted silver salt."
Film is more fun than a barrel of monkeys!
BTW, it sure did make a beautifully clear sheet. I stabilized it, hung it to dry with the others, and put it in its own sleeve. Maybe I'll take Vaughn's suggestion - sounds avant-garde to me!
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