Speedotron

[neil poulsen]

I've been having trouble locating commercial lighting that I can justify price-w ise. I considered Norman, but I learned from this site that Norman isn't a very efficient light source, when compared to other brands. (light per watt-second. ) Dyna-lite was also recommended, but reduction in weight of these systems is r elatively expensive.

Although some models are heavy, what is the performance of Speedotron? Are they as efficient as other light systems? It appears from their web-site that one c an obtain all the w-s ratio, combined/uncombined options that one would typicall y need.

Any other comments or advice regarding speedotron?

As an enthusiast who took this really terrific workshop from Norman McGrath, I w ant to take interior shots. But, I can't afford to put $4000-$5000 into lightin g equipment.

[Ellis Vener]

My experience is with Speedotron Blackline equipment.

Speedotron makes terrific gear. Well built (heavier duty than almost anything else except Broncolor, Profoto pro 5, Pro 6, Pro 7 (not Acute) and Balcar, excellent performance , terific value for the money. My comments aboutthe inefficiency of Norman equipment was based on the following direct test: I had a cable made that allowed me to use a Speedotron 102A head (it is a very slight modification that has to do with the diference in how the internal cooling fans work on Speedo heads vs the way they work on Norman heads) on a Norman P2000X pack. The Speedo head put out twice as much light ( i.e. an additional f-stop) at all power levels and with the head configured in all sorts of ways: bare tube, umbrella reflector, normal reflector, into a soft box, in to an umbrella and with the head pointed directly at the meter or with the head aimed at the 11ft. high ceiling in my house. I measured using a Minolta Flash Meter IV.

if you are buying new, look at the 2405 packs. If you are buying used just be aware that the xx01 and xx03 packs are very big and very heavy.

[doug_2325]

Here in chicago the home of speedo's they are everywhere. They aren't as efficient as some high end lights ie profoto. but they are real battle ships they can take an amazing amount of abuse and keep on working. They do have a problem arcing so always make sure you turn them off before unplugging heads. Since you want to go on location with lights really consider the weight of these pack they are real heavy. Personally I use a combo of dyna-lite and profoto's. If you are going on location consider the dyna's I really love mine check out some used packs I've seen 1000 wt packs for around $500 in the back of photo distric news. Speedo's are great in the studio but tough to lug around.

good luck doug

[Carl Weese]

My experience is a bit out of date, but I don't think the Speedo design has been changed. Some dozen years ago I compared one of my 800 watt second Dynalite units to a colleague's 1600 watt Speedotron and the Speedo, which was about four times the size and weight, produced less than a quarter stop more light output in a softbox. He always worked in the studio so the black line stuff was fine for him. I almost always worked on location so the Dynalites were worth every penny.

[Ben Calwell]

In the For What It's Worth Dept, a few years ago, I bought a brand new blackline 2405 pack and two fan-cooled heads from Calumet. As I recall, about the third time I used it, I fired it off and then waited for it to recycle. I waited and waited and waited. Then I got nervous; then I heard a soft sizzle-wooshing sound, followed by a cloud of smoke coming from the pack. That was immediately followed by a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. Wide-eyed and slack-jawed, I quickly turned it off and unplugged it. I sent it back to Speedotron, and they fixed what they called a "blown capacitor." There was no charge for repairs and the pack has performed flawlessly since then.

[Carl Weese]

Correction: (memory going)

It was a 2400 watt Speedotron, and it produced just under half a stop more light than the 800 watt Dynalite from the same softbox.

--

[Wayne_6692]

A Calumet catalog a few years back had a multipage spread comparing the Real-life output of many different flashpacks and heads, along with the color-temperatures. I don't know the origin of the information, but I seem to reall coming across it again on the web. Maybe Calumet or someone else can direct you to it.

[tedkaufman]

You can't go wrong with the Speedotron Black line. It is the workhorse of the NYC studios. In fact, I don't even know anyone who uses another brand, except for location shooting. Speedos are admittedly heavy, but they are incredibly reliable and a great value. I might only recommend another brand if you have to cart them airport to airport, or if you can get by with lesser output, then something like Dynalite might suit you better.

[Wayne_6692]

Thinking about it further I believe that it was information supplied by a soft box manufacturer, and I later found it again either on their site or in manufacturer's catalog. Ring a bell anyone?

[Jonathan Brewer]

What are your power requirements? The Profoto Acute2(fan-cooled) puts out 2400WS assymetric. The basic difference between the Acute2 and Pro-7 is flash duration.

Having said that, a twin-head with the Acute-2 gives you 2400WS through one head w/short flash duration and if you wish, the Profoto ringlight which is the best, is available.

Profoto which is distributed by Mamiya is always having promotions, a while back they had the Acute or Acute2(I can't remember which) with 3 heads for $2400, which is half of the figures you mentioned. I beleive that's with the UV outer covers for the bulbs.

You can definitely wait for a deal, for any of these packs, but I've usee Profoto for years, and their ringlight, and just can see life without it. When the new models w/their bells and whistles come out the dealers just stamp some of their units 'demo', with a lower price to move them

[Jonathan Brewer]

I forget the reason I mentioned the Profoto ringlight. You mentioned interiors, no matter how cramped, this ringlight will get it in no matter what(like love or sex).

[Ellis Vener]

All of that the Profoto heads put out some of the nicest quality of raw light of any flash I have ever used, this is why several photographers in the New York and Chicago area (according to repair techs in both markets) have Profoto Pro heads adapted to work on Speedotron packs.

"... The basic difference between the Acute2 and Pro-7 is flash duration. "

uh, no that isn't the basic difference between the Pro 7 units and the Acute line. The Pro 7 units have much heavier duty internal components than the Acutes. Talk to a repair tech about this. And as I understand it from an independant source the efficiency at turning watt seconds into lumens (light) is about the same for the Profoto heads as for the Speedotron 202VF head. Repair costs for Profoto are also notoriously high because of what Profoto charges for components.

[Eric Blevins]

One thing no one has brought up about the Speedotrons is their appetite for power. I've used black line Speedotrons for the past 15 years (2400's and 800's) in the studio and on location and have experienced many a tripped breaker. This is'nt too much of a problem in the studio (just a nuisance) but on location, it can cause problems. At the fast recycle rate, I've had electricians measure the power they were chewing up and was surprised to find that sometimes it can be in excess of 20Amps (2400 pack). Most peoples home circuits are 15amps (especially older houses)so this is something one needs to think about. Can you imagine doing a shot in an office and tripping their breakers and shutting off someones computer before they saved? This would not be good. Other than that problem, I would highly recommend Speedotrons. They seem to be almost unbreakable and have performed like champs for me. Just my opinion.

[Jonathan Brewer]

The biggest difference between the packs is Flash duration, the bigger packs are beefier, and you're going to pay for that, but that's not to say the Acute can't handle anything you throw at it.

It was mentioed by Neil that he couldn't afford $4000-$5000, which is what a Pro-7 is going to cost, so I didn't go into specs on the big pack. The Acute2 is a solid and dependable p

[Jonathan Brewer]

The Acute is a lighter and more portable pack than the Pro-7, having said that, you'll drop from exhaustion before the pack does.

Most areas have the code for a wall outlet in a house to deal with a load of @15 amps nominal, ususally this outlets can really deal with 16.5 amps, a heavier amp draw can pop your breakers. A steady diet of pops with an amp draw that is more than the wiring is set up to deal with and you get a lot of heat, too much heat for too long a time and you're talking fire.

[Ellis Vener]

have you lookedat eBay.com. I have gotten some great deals on Balcar equipment there and imagine the same is true for Speedotron, etc. Since you mention Mr. McGrath I assume your interest is in architectural work. You might want to consider 2-3 800, 1200 or 2400 w/s packs and four or more heads.

[David R Munson]

FWIW, we use Speedotron's in the studios here at Ohio University and I can vouch for their ruggedness. The strobe heads and power packs in the studio are probably used by about 25 different people per week at least, and the only head I've ever seen broken was one that had been dropped onto concrete. We seem to go through a good number of modeling tubes, but with that many people constantly jarring them around, I'm not terribly surprised. Though I admittedly really don't have any real experience with other strobes, in my experience I've found Speedotron's quite nice to work with.

[ARMANDO CONTI]

Hello,

I own 2 Speedotron packs and 3 heads. For product shots I picked up a 4800 watt second pack for 700.00 last year! How can you beat that when you know the stuff is nearly indestructible, the company fixes anything they built, and they just work.

I had a used head have a problem with the cable, and Speedo replaced the wiring very quickly at a very reasonable price. I can't say enough for the company or the products, they are built to last in the old-fashioned way, and supported superbly, again, in the old- fashioned way!

[John Kasaian]

For cheap lighting try hot lights. You can get a used 2,000 watt Mole for a hundred and fifty bucks on ebay. There are used 5,000 even 10,000 watt Moles for (comparatively) very little money.For maybe $500 you might get enough second hand wattage to illuminate the famous Hollywood sign and brown out eleven western states! ;-) You can also use it to warm a sandwich faster than a George Foreman grill.

[Yuri Saniko]

Is it possible to use black line heads with brown line pack?

[Ellis Vener]

Is it possible to use black line heads with brown line pack?

Yuri, Speedotron will have the definitive answer on this one. Have you been to the Sppedotron website?

You can get a used 2,000 watt Mole for a hundred and fifty bucks on ebay.

And that will be equivalent to about 100 watt-seconds of electronic flash unless you like really long exposures.

[Kirk Gittings]

Speedotron has never impressed me for location work. I've used Norman for twenty plus years. I only shoot architecture. So it is all location work some by air. It is very rugged and heavy, but dependable. Luckily I don't have to carry it now. I have assistants do that. I current own and use 4 2000 packs and 3 800 watt packs (the old versions) and 8 heads (seven of the old metal ones and one new plastic piece of junk). All my shutters are press for multiple exposures to build strobe power. I never considered jumping to Speedotron-more of the same and even bigger and heavier. It is a little more powerful though, but at what weight cost? I had an assistant who used Speedotron but preferred to borrow my Normans. If I was to buy new (which I won't, I will retire using the Normans) I would buy Dynalight. They are durable and light.

[neil poulsen]

Neat! Two years after starting this thread, it's still getting responses. Thanks.

As it turned out, I purchased 3 2040 dyna-lites and two 1000er's on a student buy plan. They have a three-year guarentee. I bought two factory checked m2000's at $325 apiece, so have 6000 watt-seconds total power. I like the dyna-lites. They have decent color balance, and they're convenient to carry.

I still need at least two more heads. I've been thinking about two Dyna-Lite 4040's, with the 7" reflectors. I have Lowel DP hotlights (also 7" reflectors), and I'm thinking that this would allow me to double up on barn-doors and other accessories by using them for both systems. I think the 4040's give more even results for soft-boxes.

Or, I could get two more 2040's and swap the DP's for Omni-lites. I know that I can double-up on accessories for these two systems. I'm not sure which would be the best route for architecture and other general uses. I guess it's size versus flexibility, since the 2040's and the Omni-lites are a quite a bit smaller. This isn't a life-death decision, but input would be appreciated.

[Frank Petronio]

You're using soft boxes for architecture work? Wouldn't a combination of 2040s for bounce lighting and general purpose work, with a couple of bare-tube heads for lanterns and room-filling broad light be the more economical and compact choice?

I'd love one 4040 for portraits and such, but I'd hate to buy a series of them.

My outfit consists of all old D-series Dynas - slightly larger and less powerful than the new stuff, but for only $1500 invested I have 3 800-ws packs and 6 blower heads with UV tubes. Pretty hard to beat for a part-time shooter...

[Ellis Vener]

Ellis Vener won't answer the Speedotron Brownline /Blackline cross compatability question because Ellis Vener believes it is better for you to find out from manufacturers than to take the word of anyone on an internet forum.

[Kirk Gittings]

I agree with Timber in that the Normans are much better for location than the Speedotrons. I have used both and opted for the Norman for the last 20 years. Having said that if the choice was between Dynalight and Normans......

As for Ellis Vener, I think you will find that he is one who speaks only from careful investigation and actual personal experience, a reference point for commentary on this forum that some could learn much from.

[Ellis Vener]

I have been shooting practically all digital except for an increasingly light amount of medium format work and fairly consistent level of LF work for the past four years. My experience is similar except that digital, especially high rez "medium format' digital backs used in 4 or 16 multi-shot modes really needs consistent 1/1oth of a stop accuracy from exposure to exposure and this kind of consistancy also really helps the post shoot processing crunch if you are doing batch processing of "similars" from an assignment.