Going to Kings Canyon Tomorrow

[David Karp]

I am pretty excited about going to Kings Canyon tomorrow, as I have never been there. The 4x5 and WP camera are joining my family as we spend the week there. The 5x7 back might also join us. I just hope that I remember the film, and the tripod, and . . . .

[don12x20]

Have fun
Take a short hike up a nearly flat trail to Mist Falls. Go to the top(on the trail) and look south...

[David Karp]

Thanks Don. Will check it out.

Any other suggestions are welcome. I will be visiting the forum before we leave tomorrow morning.

Checked my 5x7 holders, 8 are already loaded, so the 5x7 back is definitely joining us!

[John Kasaian]

Have a great time---there is a lot of beauty to photograph in the Park!
I took my Scouts up there for our Pack Hike this month and had a great time. There is a great deal of variety to be seen in landscapes---from semi arid with Century plants, as well as lush, fern carpeted redwood forests to classic California granite, waterfalls, caverns, remnants of logging operations and snowy peaks.
Enjoy!

[Terence McDonagh]

Not to thread-jack, but . . . what's the park (and Sequoia NP) like in October? I might be heading out there the week of Columbus Day.

[David Karp]

Thanks John,

We are leaving in a few minutes.

It is film holder madness here. Taking 2 cameras and three formats is a bit of madness, but heck, why not?

[John Kasaian]

Not to thread-jack, but . . . what's the park (and Sequoia NP) like in October? I might be heading out there the week of Columbus Day.

October is a great time to visit KCNP/SNP! If you're lucky you'll catch some autumn colors. Mineral King would be a good bet if you don't mind the slow and curvey road getting there.

[Drew Wiley]

Actually, at least 95% of Kings Canyon Park is backcountry with no road access, and
the heart of it doesn't even have trail access. When you drive in you reach a fork in
the road between both Sequoia and Kings Canyon. A single visitor permit pays for
both. There are giant sequoia groves near the intersection. When you drive down the
hill toward Cedar Grove, there is a place near Yucca Point where you can see the
highest river drop in the country, as well as the deepeset canyon (the Middle Fork of
the Kings - about twice the depth of the Grand Canyon). Unfortunately, you can also
get smoke and haze this time of year, so a red filter would be handy with black and
white film to cut through the haze. The bottom of the road at Cedar Grove can be
hot so take plenty of water (don't drink out of the creek!). If you have extra days,
Boyden Cave and Crystal Cave are interesting, and you can take the branch road in
Sequoia to Morro Rock and a nice view of the Great Western Divide.

[QT Luong]

Actually, at least 95% of Kings Canyon Park is backcountry with no road access, and
the heart of it doesn't even have trail access.

Yes, for me the most spectacular parts of the park are those near the Sierra crest. That where Ansel Adams took the images that convinced FD Roosevelt to approve Kings Canyon National Park - although FDR knew that he would never personally get to see those scenes himself. To this effect, Ansel sent a portfolio to the secretary of the interior, who showed it to FDR. However, FDR decided to keep the porfolio for himself ! My favorite in Kings Canyon is the Dusy Basin area, which is accessed from Bishop.

[Drew Wiley]

Terence - October is a pleasant month. You do have to be aware of the possibility of
sneak snowstorms. These are very unlikely to close the highway so early in the
season, because it doesn't climb very high. But if you venture onto the trails be
certain to carry a parka and have a good jacket or sweater along. Oct and Nov are
notorious for balmy weather which can change very suddenly. The nights can be
crisp and unless you have accommodations you will want a decent sleeping bag.
The spot QT mentioned - Dusy Basin - is marvelous in the fall, but requires a
minimum of an overnight backpack and involves an 11000 pass from the east side.
The last time I was there in the fall there was a light snowstorm and a pack of
coyotes was giving a howl which just kept echoing and echoing off the sheer walls
of the adjacent Palisades, some of which are over 14000 ft. Even though I grew up
very close to King Can, there are still sections of it I have never visited. I had to
climb the Goddard Divide three separate times to get the light I wanted over the
Enchanted Gorge. Spending the night on a ledge two feet wide with the Sinar
propped up on a rock barely bigger was a memorable experience.

[Terence McDonagh]

We're looking to back-country camp. I routinely hike in Colorado and Utah year-round and the folks I'm going with live in Colorado, so we're good with pretty much any weather contingency, training and gear-wise.

Does anyone have a good recommendation on books, trail guides, preferred maps, etc for the parks? We'd probably do a three to four day backcountry hike, and a couple of day hikes. I have a couple older, hand-me-down trail guides, and a Trails Illustrated map, but nothing spectacular.

Recommendations on favorite trails, especially for that time of year, are also greatly appreciated.

[John Kasaian]

Aptly named Hell For Sure Pass, throught the LeConte Divide and above Goddard Canyon is an interesting area, but it is out of the way unless you're coming in from Courtwright Resevoir (a friend actually chased a stray cow over Hell For Sure!)

Dead Man Meadow is also an interesting, less visited area.

Mineral King Ranger Station in Sequoia will put you in the proximity of about a dozen trailheads where you won't have to be concerned about trail qoutas, unlike the John Muir or Pacific Crest trails.

Have fun!

[tgtaylor]

Does anyone have a good recommendation on books, trail guides, preferred maps, etc for the parks? We'd probably do a three to four day backcountry hike, and a couple of day hikes. I have a couple older, hand-me-down trail guides, and a Trails Illustrated map, but nothing spectacular.

Recommendations on favorite trails, especially for that time of year, are also greatly appreciated.

For a general guide to the Sierra Nevada from Yosemite to Mt. Whitney I would recommend Starr’s Guide to the John Muir Trail & and High Sierra. It's main focus is the John Muir trail but it accurately describes "laterals" i.e., trails running to the east and west from the Muir trail. It was first published back in the '30's but is still in print. If you buy it, I would further recommend you get the "Sierra Tote edition" which is similar in size to a pack of cigarettes but thicker, has an indestructible cover, and fits comfortably in a pocket. I've been hiking in the Sierra for 15 years now with my copy which I found in a used bookstore for $4.95.

You can probably access the Sierra crest more quickly from Kearsarge Pass on the eastern side. The Kearsarge TH ("Onion Valley") is located 19 miles by paved road from the small town of Independence. There is a campground and pack station at the TH. The distance from the parking lot to the top of the pass (~12,000') is 5 miles and another 5 miles down to the Muir/PCT where you can access East/Reflection Lake and the Mount Brewer area of the park. Alternatively, instead of dropping down to the Muir trail, continue north from the pass and latterly for about the same distance to Glenn Pass where you can access the Rae Lakes and Sixty Lakes Basin on its north side.

Finally, be advised that the park recently issued an advisory that the marmots on the west entrance side were chewing thru hoses to drink the vehicles antifreeze and were advising an undercarriage net be placed on vehicles left parked there.

Thomas

[Drew Wiley]

Terence - the Leconte Divide area which John mentioned is particularly nice in the fall,
and relatively safe if you go in from the West at Courtwright Res. What you don't want
to do is get behind a high pass which will snow shut, unless you're properly equipped
and experienced for more of a real adventure. About three years ago there were a lot
of rescues because people were equipped with summer type hiking gear and wearing
lightweight hiking boots. At the same time I was way back in but properly equipped for
snowstorms and having fun, even if it was damn cold at night and snowing heavily on
the passes. The secret is, don't get BEHIND a divide which can prove hazardous if
there's a serious snowfall. And don't park your car somewhere where you can't get
back over a high pass if it snows shut for the season! But you can get heavy rain or
snow any month of the year, and the fall is especially fickle - but also exceptionally
beautiful, no mosquitos, less people, and the dusty trails have usually been cleaned
by at least a few rains. Red Mountain Basin is a relatively easy destination in the
LeConte Divide area for a week or so of hiking. You can branch off cross country in several directions and there will be plenty to photograph, even though the peaks are
not as high as the eastern side of the range. Immediately over the Leconte Divide,
however, you encounter some very dramatic country; but it is largely untrailed and
very rough.

[Drew Wiley]

I should have qualified my previous post by noting, as has already been mentioned,
that east side approaches from a town like Bishop or Indpendence are much faster
than from the west, where you have to drive a lot farther to the trailheads. The only
easy passes from the east are Bishop Pass and Kearsarge Pass. Bishop Pass will get
you over the top in a single day and into Dusy Basin, with the ability to overlook the
headwaters of the Middle Fork or cross-country into Palisade Basin (if you want a good
four day workout). Kearsarge Pass leads into the heavily-visited Rae Lakes area. Both
areas are heavily photographed, on well-worn trails. Or just a few miles above the
South Lake trailhead leading to Bishop Pass you have Lake Sabrina and the trailhead
leading into spectacular Sabrina Basin area - a very desireable short trip in the Fall,
but not technically Kings Canyon Park. Bishop Pass and Rae Lakes now require bear
canisters - Sabrina doesn't. You could spend an entire lifetime in the Kings Canyon
drainage and not see everything.

[Drew Wiley]

Terence - Here I go rambling again, but now that you mention you only have three or
four days, that limits the options. What people need to know about the Kings River per
se is that it is deep! Many places all three forks of the Kings are nearly twice as deep
as the Grand Canyon, and much higher altitude at the top. So unless you start in the
bottom at Cedar Grove on the west, you're probably never going to get into Kings Can
itself on this short a trip, unless you're in exceptional shape. The days are short indeed
in the fall. From the east Sabrina Basin or Dusy Basin would indeed fit your schedule,
and allow you a lot of casual off-trail opportunities. From the West you could get into
Red Mtn Basin from Courtwright. Spectacular Evolution Valley is accessed from Florence Lake trailhead, but ferry service is suspended in the fall, so you've got at
least 22 miles of hiking in and out. Getting to Mineral King (where marmots chewing
your radiator hoses in an issue) would probably cost you a whole day of driving, and
the trails lead into Sequoia, not Kings. Just above my ranch Dinkey Wilderness is a less
strenuous objective and truly colorful in Oct, but whether or not the road is open again
depends on early snows. Florence and Edison trailsheads are both behind Kaiser Pass
which can shut early sometimes. Unlike Colorado, most of the Sierra road passes close
for the entire winter once the first heavy snow arrives. Courtwright road generally
remains open from the west, and HWY 168 above Bishop is open well into winter. This
is big country. From Dusy Basin over Bishop Pass you can at least look in, to the point
where the "real" Kings Can Park is, with very few trails at all! If you are in top shape
you could go from North Lake above Bishop over Lamark Col into Evolution country the
back way, but then you'd be behind an off-trail pass over 13000 ft high. Well worth it
if you can move quickly up steep grades, watch the weather forecast, and have
winter-quality gear if needed, including ice axes. I'd simply get a combined topo map of both Sequoia and Kings to get a general idea. Sorry to ramble, but I do know this country well. Don't fret too much about which part of it to see - it's all wonderful!

[Michael Wynd]

You'll have to get to Kings Canyon in the Northern Territory here in Australia. It's spectacular. Just ask Robert Teague. Besides Australia needs your tourist dollars.
Mike

[PenGun]

Google Earth Pics

Kings Canyon

http://209.52.170.29:90/pics/kings.jpg

Kings Canyon Australia

http://209.52.170.29:90/pics/akings.jpg

I carry a laptop with a USB GPS device and Google earth. It's useful to find my way when the roads are behind me. ;)

[tgtaylor]

According to Wikipedia, Kings Canyon in California is more than 9 times the depth of its namesake in Australia: 8,200' vs 900'. Nice looking sandstone though.

BTW, this is supposed to be an El Nino season here on the west coast. Temperatures this summer have been running close to 10 degress below normal and low pressure systems have been frequent. In SF/Monterrey Bay area and we even had some rain yesterday. El Nino translates to beacoup rain and snow so if you will be traveling in the Sierra this autumn make sure you have a well thought out escape route planned in advance in case you have to bail out.

Thomas

[Terence McDonagh]

Looks beautiful. Any shots from the ground? That looks like one heck of a cliff on the left side of the image.

[PenGun]

Google Earth ... go get it. You can zoom, fly anywhere it's killer. The blue squares are ground photos.

http://earth.google.com/download-earth.html

Here's one:

http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/1377219.jpg

[roteague]

Google Earth ... go get it. You can zoom, fly anywhere it's killer. The blue squares are ground photos.

http://earth.google.com/download-earth.html

Here's one:

http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/1377219.jpg

Been there .... and I would love to go again. The night sky is absolutely fantastic ... there is NO light pollution there (considering you are more than 100 miles from the nearest town - Yulara).

I'll take this Kings Canyon, over the one in California ... it's not overrun with tourists.

[Capocheny]

Dave,

Have a safe journey... post a few images from the trip is you're up for it. :)

Cheers

[David Karp]

John,

You are absolutely right. The variety in the parks and the national forest is amazing. We only scratched the surface a tiny bit! The park was not very crowded, and we had some nice family hikes, with very few complaints when Dad took out the big camera. The weather was great. The lower than normal temperatures plus the altitude resulted in some days where the temperature must not have gotten out of the 60s! I must get back there in the spring someday. Even though the family trip is not always the ideal situation for photography, I had a few nice opportunities, and hope that I made the most of them. I used the Seneca with the WP and 5x7 backs, and the ARCA.

I thought of you while driving through Fresno on the way to the 99 -- Two hours from Yosemite Valley and one hour from KC-SNP! We stopped at a Vons to pick up some munchies for the drive home and ate at the Panda Express. The weather was nice and cool. Then back on the road for the ride to LA. Maybe some day we can meet up and make some photos when we are in one of the parks.

[David Karp]

Hey Capocheny,

It was a great trip. The kids and the parents had a great time.

I had several opportunities for good photos - We will see if I am up to the task. I hope to have time to develop them this week. As for posting, that might have to wait until I print them. I have an Epson 4870, but so far I am not a very good scanner operator. I can scan prints OK though.

[Drew Wiley]

Robert - That spot in Australia does look beautiful, but if you think Kings Canyon in
California is overrun with tourists, you've obviously never been there. In fact, only
one road BARELY touches the park. And from this road you can look toward the park,
but what you see is so rugged that there are a number of places no one has ever
set foot. This isn't like Yosemite Valley! But it is so big that there are SEVERAL distinct "yosemites" with giant cliffs and waterfalls, and a dome larger than Half Dome in Yosemite - yet no "tourist" even knows of the existence of any of these. A major portion of the park does not even contain trails. There are a handful of popular trails which horses can also use - but crowded - never! It's just too much work getting around. This is not just one canyon, but a complex of them, each one
deeper than anything else in North America.

[David Karp]

Kings Canyon in CA is definitely not overrun with tourists. Even in the parts that roads touch, the places I was last week with my wife and two young children, are not crowded at all. There is very little traffic, and even in the "tourist spots" there are very few visitors.

That is not to say that the park is empty, but it seems very lightly used compared to other parks. And, given that even in crowded Yosemite Valley a walk of 2-5 minutes in a direction away from one of the popular spots will find you all alone, I am sure that you will find any of the remote portions of Kings Canyon quite open.

[Drew Wiley]

Glad you had an introduction to this wonderful park, David! People from out of the
area often have funny preconceptions about California. Even in Yosemite Natl Park,
outside the Valley itself, I can point to the map and show you where you could
probably walk for a week without encountering anyone else. 99% of the people go
to about 1% of the places. Last summer I had a beginner backpacker with me, so
used one of the easier, more popular trails in Sequoia. Only encountered a handful
of people, then headed for a spectacular lake just one mile off-trail. No signs of
human presence ever, downright spectacular, and my friend caught his limit of trout
in five minutes. With literally thousands of lakes in the backcountry, finding complete solitude generally isn't a problem.

[John Kasaian]

I'm glad to hear that your trip went well! Kings Canyon and Sequoia NPs are wonderful places and are real "sleepers" in the summertime when Yosemite NP (the valley anyway) is gridlocked. Grant Grove in the winter, covered in fresh snow is an especially magical place, IMHO. :D

[Don7x17]

I'm glad to hear that your trip went well! Kings Canyon and Sequoia NPs are wonderful places and are real "sleepers" in the summertime when Yosemite NP (the valley anyway) is gridlocked. Grant Grove in the winter, covered in fresh snow is an especially magical place, IMHO. :D

And even cross country skiing down to Tuolomne grove in Yosemite during winter will give you peace and solitude...

[John Kasaian]

And even cross country skiing down to Tuolomne grove in Yosemite during winter will give you peace and solitude...

Ahh, but you can drive to Grant Grove in the winter, so there's of a less chance of falling and breaking your bottle of stroh rum!:D :D

[David Karp]

Here is a scan from a 5x7 negative (Arista.edu Ultra 200). Grizzly Falls in the Sequoia National Forest.

Funny, it looks pretty darn sharp, but I just laid the negative on the glass emulsion side down - no negative carrier. I did not expect that.

[John Kasaian]

Beautiful shot, David!

[David Karp]

Thanks John.

[Capocheny]

Hi Dave,

Good to hear you had a fun and safe trip.

Very nice image... well done!

Cheers