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gchu1970
22-Jun-2009, 10:08
I have a Linhof Master Technica Classic and the bellow is aged. I would like to replace with a new one. But I learnt that the original Linhof one is easy to get aged after years of usage. I'm looking for a replacement with better durability even under very cold condition, say -30 C. Would like to hear from any good recommendations.

Bill_1856
22-Jun-2009, 10:35
My lightly used Technika IV is on its third bellows (at about $400 a pop). The bellows on my 1928 Zeiss Maximar is still perfect, as are those on my elderly Pacemaker Speed and Crown Graphics. Apparently this is not unusual.
IMO the one major improvement that Linhof could make to the Technika would be an interchangable bellows, as fitted to their monorails.

Bob Salomon
22-Jun-2009, 11:39
Bill,

Your camera is between 53 and 46 years old. How do you know how heavily or lightly it was used over all those years?

Storage conditions and use are as important as any other conditions on how well a bellows stands up.

And, as pointed out last time you made this statement, the Technika bellows handles all lenses that can mount on the camera with full movements from 35mm to over 360mm. Why would they make it interchangeable? You never answered last time .

Bob Salomon
22-Jun-2009, 11:45
I have a Linhof Master Technica Classic and the bellow is aged. I would like to replace with a new one. But I learnt that the original Linhof one is easy to get aged after years of usage. I'm looking for a replacement with better durability even under very cold condition, say -30 C. Would like to hear from any good recommendations.

The only replacement that will perform with all lenses from 35mm to over 360mm and allow all movements and permit the camera to close properly is a Linhof Technika bellows.
The Master Technika was introduced in 1972 so your bellows could be up to 37 years old. Over that time it could wear out, depending on age, storage and use.
The Master Technika Classic name came about with the introduction of the Master Technika 2000 in 1995. How old is yours?

Bill_1856
22-Jun-2009, 14:01
Bill,

Your camera is between 53 and 46 years old. How do you know how heavily or lightly it was used over all those years?

Storage conditions and use are as important as any other conditions on how well a bellows stands up.

And, as pointed out last time you made this statement, the Technika bellows handles all lenses that can mount on the camera with full movements from 35mm to over 360mm. Why would they make it interchangeable? You never answered last time .

Bob, it's true that I don't know how it was used before I got it (only a few years after it was built). But I've had two new bellows since then. It is lightly used, kept in air conditioned space with moderate humidity, and the problem was dry rot, not wear and tear. The current bellows is about 5 years old, and so-far-so-good, but the two previous bellows seemed fine one day, and then virtually crumbled.
The bellows of my Kardon-Color 45S (purchased new from Lens and Repro in the 1970s and stored on a shelf next to the Technika) continues to be in perfect working condition. I've never needed another bellows for my personal range of lenses from 90mm to 360mm, but there's a bag bellows if I do.
To answer your question: they would make it interchangeable, because it is apparently the one weak link in an otherwise bulletproof design, and could be easily implemented.

Bob Salomon
22-Jun-2009, 14:23
Bob, it's true that I don't know how it was used before I got it (only a few years after it was built). But I've had two new bellows since then. It is lightly used, kept in air conditioned space with moderate humidity, and the problem was dry rot, not wear and tear. The current bellows is about 5 years old, and so-far-so-good, but the two previous bellows seemed fine one day, and then virtually crumbled.
The bellows of my Kardon-Color 45S (purchased new from Lens and Repro in the 1970s and stored on a shelf next to the Technika) continues to be in perfect working condition. I've never needed another bellows for my personal range of lenses from 90mm to 360mm, but there's a bag bellows if I do.
To answer your question: they would make it interchangeable, because it is apparently the one weak link in an otherwise bulletproof design, and could be easily implemented.

Bill,

If we get 10 requests for a new bellows a year it is a lot. Historically it simply has not been a problem.

David Swinnard
23-Jun-2009, 08:15
I just (May 2009) replaced the bellows of my Technika V with new ones supplied by Custom Bellows in England. Apparently they make (or made) bellows for Linhof.

Cost was 120 pounds plus an extra 10 for shipping. Once the money was transferred I received the bellows a week or so later. Installation was straight forward. Camera still closes just like it always did. (I thought I'd read somewhere that some of those available from auction sites didn't compress to the same degree.)

My contact was with Keith.

keithlowe@custombellows.co.uk

Gudmundur Ingolfsson
23-Jun-2009, 10:14
I have a Master Technika that I bought used in 1993. The original camera bellowes are still very much OK in spite of heavy usage. But the bellows like stuff in the folding viewer has deterioeted into a black cloth and some black tar like rubber residue. Bob Salomon might tell us how old the camera is: serial No. 6451720

Bob Salomon
23-Jun-2009, 11:00
I have a Master Technika that I bought used in 1993. The original camera bellowes are still very much OK in spite of heavy usage. But the bellows like stuff in the folding viewer has deterioeted into a black cloth and some black tar like rubber residue. Bob Salomon might tell us how old the camera is: serial No. 6451720

1978

Frank Petronio
23-Jun-2009, 12:32
If you don't care about cosmetics or using the extreme lenses, the folding viewfinder and 12" bellows from a Crown/Speed Graphic can be adapted to the Technika by a skilled technician or careful amateur. You can still find mint Crown Graphics to use as parts cameras for peanuts.

Sideshow Bob
23-Jun-2009, 12:52
I bought one of those "make in China" bellows off of eBay for about $50 and was very impressed with the quality.
Gale

Simon Benton
23-Jun-2009, 17:03
I too bought the "China" bellows expecting they would be poor but they worked great - now been on for almost 2 yesrs.

gchu1970
25-Jun-2009, 06:01
Thanks to all your valuable recommendations. I will try out my "China Made" first. If not work, I may try the other options.

TJV
7-Sep-2011, 04:34
Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but has anyone had experience with this product?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/270703202394?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_2570wt_1165

Bob Salomon
7-Sep-2011, 07:10
Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but has anyone had experience with this product?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/270703202394?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_2570wt_1165

I would suggest you ask more relevent questions. Like how, if it is, is it different then the Linhof bellows? Is it the same length, longer or shorter? Does it have the same number of pleats, more or less? Is it as flexible so that with the 2000 and 3000 it has full movement with a 35mm focal length lens? Does it sag more or less at or near full extension?

The way you asked you may get answers from someone who does not use very short lenses or very long ones so they may not know how it actually compares to a factory new bellows.

TJV
7-Sep-2011, 22:47
Other relevant info? My specific model is a Linhof Super Technika V.

I only use lenses between 90mm and 180mm with moderate movements, usually just front rise, but sometimes combined with subtle tilt and / or swing. I'll never use shorter lenses than my 90mm, which is on a genuine Linhof recessed board. I bought the camera second hand but am pretty sure it is fitted with the original bellows. They seem okay but are starting to crack and are obviously in need of attention.

What is the part number for the genuine Linhof product?

The problem with where I live is there is no real certified Linhof support or dealer network, despite what Linhof themselves might say. It'd be easier to import the part (genuine or otherwise) myself and get my technician friend who actually used to be the chief tech for the Linhof importers to do the install for me.

While I'm at it, although I'm heading off topic, my fresnel screen is pretty scratched. Is the genuine Linhof replacement the best way to go to avoid any focusing accuracy problems? What is the part number for a Tech V fresnel?

Thanks for your reply,

Tim


I would suggest you ask more relevent questions. Like how, if it is, is it different then the Linhof bellows? Is it the same length, longer or shorter? Does it have the same number of pleats, more or less? Is it as flexible so that with the 2000 and 3000 it has full movement with a 35mm focal length lens? Does it sag more or less at or near full extension?

The way you asked you may get answers from someone who does not use very short lenses or very long ones so they may not know how it actually compares to a factory new bellows.

TJV
8-Sep-2011, 03:56
PS: I've asked the seller to give more specific details of the product. E.g. number or pleats and length of extension.

Bob Salomon
8-Sep-2011, 06:41
Other relevant info? My specific model is a Linhof Super Technika V.

I only use lenses between 90mm and 180mm with moderate movements, usually just front rise, but sometimes combined with subtle tilt and / or swing. I'll never use shorter lenses than my 90mm, which is on a genuine Linhof recessed board. I bought the camera second hand but am pretty sure it is fitted with the original bellows. They seem okay but are starting to crack and are obviously in need of attention.

What is the part number for the genuine Linhof product?

The problem with where I live is there is no real certified Linhof support or dealer network, despite what Linhof themselves might say. It'd be easier to import the part (genuine or otherwise) myself and get my technician friend who actually used to be the chief tech for the Linhof importers to do the install for me.

While I'm at it, although I'm heading off topic, my fresnel screen is pretty scratched. Is the genuine Linhof replacement the best way to go to avoid any focusing accuracy problems? What is the part number for a Tech V fresnel?

Thanks for your reply,

Tim

Where do you live?

The Linhof 45 Fresnel is 002522. Please bear in mind that Linhof has substantially brightened both the current Fresnel and the current GG since your V was made.

richardhkirkando
8-Sep-2011, 13:07
Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but has anyone had experience with this product?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/270703202394?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_2570wt_1165

I have those bellows on my V, the material looks and feels nice, seems very solid. Definitely light tight. The only issue was that I had trouble folding the camera up at first - it had a tendency to push the back movement part out. It went away after a about a month, so they may have needed a "break-in" period.

Tim k
8-Sep-2011, 15:00
Where do you live?

The Linhof 45 Fresnel is 002522. Please bear in mind that Linhof has substantially brightened both the current Fresnel and the current GG since your V was made.

Who would we contact for a quote? Now that we have a part number.

Bob Salomon
8-Sep-2011, 15:05
Who would we contact for a quote? Now that we have a part number.

Tempe camera or the View Camera Store are our dealers.

Tim k
8-Sep-2011, 15:19
Tempe camera or the View Camera Store are our dealers.
Thx Bob

TJV
8-Sep-2011, 23:03
Thanks,

I've contacted several US dealers regarding getting a price for the genuine Linhof bellow replacement but no one seems to be able to order it in for me. They advised me to contact you. I take it that you do not deal direct to the public? I understand if you don't, but are you able to advise me what the RRP might be for the Linhof bellow only, without installation?

I know this is taking the thread way off topic, but if I replace the original glass screen and fresnel with the new versions will the camera need calibrating for focus?

I live in New Zealand and Linhof is all but a distant memory to the local photographic industry. It's a hard task knowing what to do!

Thanks,

Tim


Where do you live?

The Linhof 45 Fresnel is 002522. Please bear in mind that Linhof has substantially brightened both the current Fresnel and the current GG since your V was made.

Bob Salomon
9-Sep-2011, 02:13
Thanks,

I've contacted several US dealers regarding getting a price for the genuine Linhof bellow replacement but no one seems to be able to order it in for me. They advised me to contact you. I take it that you do not deal direct to the public? I understand if you don't, but are you able to advise me what the RRP might be for the Linhof bellow only, without installation?

I know this is taking the thread way off topic, but if I replace the original glass screen and fresnel with the new versions will the camera need calibrating for focus?

I live in New Zealand and Linhof is all but a distant memory to the local photographic industry. It's a hard task knowing what to do!

Thanks,

Tim

Once again, the replacement bellows is not an accessory for a Technika. It is a repair part and that is supplied by the service center. In the USA that is Marflex Service. They can be reached at marflex@aol.com. But they are currently at the factory in Germany and will not be back till the end of the month. The service center in other countries should also be able to help you.

Here are the ones in your country and in Australia. Please contact them if you need a bellows sooner.


Australien / Australia

Australien
MAINLINE Photographics Pty. Ltd.
P.O.Box 845
68 Alexander Street, 2nd floor
Crows Nest, N.S.W. 2065
Fon +61 2 94375800
Fax +61 2 94375055
sales@mainlinephoto.com.au
www.mainlinephoto.com.au

Neuseeland / New Zealand
H.E. PERRY Ltd.
10 Minnie St
Eden Terr.
Auckland
P.O. Box 8838 Symonds St
Auckland
New Zealand
sales@heperry.co.nz
www.heperry.com
Fon +64 9 3031479
Fax +64 9 3079018

TJV
9-Sep-2011, 04:05
I appreciate you taking the time to reply. The problem with living in NZ is that although H.E. Perry may be a registered service centre, they don't get enough demand for Linhof repairs to keep even basic parts in stock. I'd be quicker and a heck of a lot cheaper to buy from Custom Bellows and install the part myself. It'd be nice to just be able to order the genuine part, but it seems this isn't able to happen. Again, I appreciate your help.

Bob Salomon
9-Sep-2011, 05:54
I appreciate you taking the time to reply. The problem with living in NZ is that although H.E. Perry may be a registered service centre, they don't get enough demand for Linhof repairs to keep even basic parts in stock. I'd be quicker and a heck of a lot cheaper to buy from Custom Bellows and install the part myself. It'd be nice to just be able to order the genuine part, but it seems this isn't able to happen. Again, I appreciate your help.

Then order it from the factory in Germany. That is still closer then ordering it from the UK. Australia is even closer. There are distributors for Linhof all over Asia as well. The factory's web site lists them all.
But you are not trying to order a Linhof accessory. You are looking for a Linhof replacement part that requires tools and glue as well as disassembly of the camera. That is why you need to order it from a service center and not a dealer.

Victor Randin
9-Sep-2011, 07:11
Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but has anyone had experience with this product?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/270703202394...ht_2570wt_1165

During last 4-5 years I replaced 4 bellows on my 2 x Linhof ST IV, MT (1978) and 8x10 Linhof Standard 1980's). All new bellows were bought from Shanghai China (ebay's Seller: buyitnow): http://www.ebay.com/itm/Linhof-4x5-Technica-Bellows-/220847173826?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item336b8470c2. It's looking like what you refer to. They seem to be from one origin.

These bellows appears to be not worse than Lingof's ones or better. I use lenses from 65mm (SA) to 360mm (Apo Ronar) with no any problem. Only one layer rough nylon bellows allows to shoot even when raining. The original Linhof ST IV's bellows were made from 3 layers: cotton fabric and paper strips (inner layers), and very thin leather - the outer layer. Linhof MT's belows are same but extremely thin vinyl instead of leather. The original 8x10 Linhof Standard' bellows are manufactured in same manner as MT' ones. It fully destroyed during 5-10 years. Meanwhile, the original bellows of my 13x18 Linhof Std from 1936 are working and looking like new.

Darin Boville
9-Sep-2011, 08:14
Hi Bob,

Do you know where the Linhof bellows is made (Germany, China, etc)?

Thanks,

--Darin

Bob Salomon
9-Sep-2011, 08:20
Hi Bob,

Do you know where the Linhof bellows is made (Germany, China, etc)?

Thanks,

--Darin

Again, we do not sell or import the bellows for a Technika. That is done by service since it is a part that requires tools and glue and experience to remove and install. So we would not know where Linhof gets them. However, we do import and sell the spare bellows and wide angle bellows for their other cameras; TK 45 and 23, M679cs, Techno, Kardan and they are all made in Germany. So the assumption would be that the Technika one probably is also. After all, the difference is one of frames. The replaceable bellows above are clipped on to their cameras while the Technika bellows has no frame system.
We also sell the Focus/Meter Bellows for Linhof 69, 45 and 57 cameras as well as the compendium bellows for all of the Linhof cameras and the bellows systems for the back of the Techno and M679 systems and they are also German.

I just checked our spare Wista bellows and wide angle bellows and compendiums and they are all marked Made in Japan.

Victor Randin
9-Sep-2011, 10:50
P.S.
The original 8x10 Linhof Kardan Std' and ST' 4x5 bellows (above said) are made absolutely equally as those delivered from Shanghai for and 8x10 Kardan Std, but inside out: cotton fabric - double weight paper strips - thinnest vinyl film (inside). It's impossible to differ the material. Apparently it is same producer.

Bob Salomon
9-Sep-2011, 11:17
P.S.
The original 8x10 Linhof Kardan Std' and ST' 4x5 bellows (above said) are made absolutely equally as those delivered from Shanghai for and 8x10 Kardan Std, but inside out: cotton fabric - double weight paper strips - thinnest vinyl film (inside). It's impossible to differ the material. Apparently it is same producer.

Victor, let's not forget that China is the home of the counterfeit Apple stores. Just because it looks the same doesn't mean it isn't a copy.

Don Dudenbostel
9-Sep-2011, 17:36
Bill,

Your camera is between 53 and 46 years old. How do you know how heavily or lightly it was used over all those years?

Storage conditions and use are as important as any other conditions on how well a bellows stands up.

And, as pointed out last time you made this statement, the Technika bellows handles all lenses that can mount on the camera with full movements from 35mm to over 360mm. Why would they make it interchangeable? You never answered last time .

Bob I purchased a new Master Technika in 1974 and owned it until five years ago. I used it regularly and stored it in a cool dry place with average humidity around 50%. I used it for regular commercial assignments mainly in the field and never abused it. The bellows started cracking much earlier than I would have expected. I also purchased a new Sinar norma 4x5 and 5x7 kit with extra extension bellows and wide bellows for both and used the as my main system from 1969 till present with much reduced use in the past ten years since going digital. The bellows are still perfect. My 1960 Deardorff belonged to another professional friend who's retired now and purchased it new in 1960. This and his 8x10 Deardorff were his main two cameras for all those years until last year. The bellows on my 4x5 have one tiny hole in the corner but other than that are perfect. This camera has had tens of thousands of sheets through it as has my Sinar. My much newer Technikardan 23 has cracking bellows as did my Master Technika.

Bob I've used many new and old view cameras over my 44 years of commercial work and the only cameras I've seen develop cracking like the two I have owned are Linhof products. I love the products but I believe in the attempt to make a bellows that works with ultra wides to tele lenses Linhof has compromised the strength of the bellows / covering. While the Master worked OK with wides it wasn't as good as a camera with a bag bellows. The same is true of the Deardorff. In my opinion this is why cameras like the Ebony are superior to the Deardorff and other non interchangeable bellows camera.

Don Dudenbostel
9-Sep-2011, 17:46
Where do you live?

The Linhof 45 Fresnel is 002522. Please bear in mind that Linhof has substantially brightened both the current Fresnel and the current GG since your V was made.

Is this true of the 2x3 GG and fresnel for the Technikardan 23? Also is it necessary to send the camera / back to Marflex for instillation of the GG?

Bob Salomon
10-Sep-2011, 04:35
Bob I purchased a new Master Technika in 1974 and owned it until five years ago. I used it regularly and stored it in a cool dry place with average humidity around 50%. I used it for regular commercial assignments mainly in the field and never abused it. The bellows started cracking much earlier than I would have expected. I also purchased a new Sinar norma 4x5 and 5x7 kit with extra extension bellows and wide bellows for both and used the as my main system from 1969 till present with much reduced use in the past ten years since going digital. The bellows are still perfect. My 1960 Deardorff belonged to another professional friend who's retired now and purchased it new in 1960. This and his 8x10 Deardorff were his main two cameras for all those years until last year. The bellows on my 4x5 have one tiny hole in the corner but other than that are perfect. This camera has had tens of thousands of sheets through it as has my Sinar. My much newer Technikardan 23 has cracking bellows as did my Master Technika.

Bob I've used many new and old view cameras over my 44 years of commercial work and the only cameras I've seen develop cracking like the two I have owned are Linhof products. I love the products but I believe in the attempt to make a bellows that works with ultra wides to tele lenses Linhof has compromised the strength of the bellows / covering. While the Master worked OK with wides it wasn't as good as a camera with a bag bellows. The same is true of the Deardorff. In my opinion this is why cameras like the Ebony are superior to the Deardorff and other non interchangeable bellows camera.

Don,

1974 to 5 years ago is 32 years of professional use. I am not surprised that a problem might develop. Linhof has told us that where and how it is stored is the problem. It has to be excercised over time, not just paced away folded. But apparently the flexibility might be one reason a bellows cracks. /but with all of the cameras sold and in use since 1946 we talk to extremely few people with a bellows problem.

Bob Salomon
10-Sep-2011, 04:37
Is this true of the 2x3 GG and fresnel for the Technikardan 23? Also is it necessary to send the camera / back to Marflex for instillation of the GG?

Yes it is and yes, on a 23 the installation should be done by service in case the gg has a different thickness then the one in there now. If you have the S version there won't be much difference.