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View Full Version : 5x7 camera, new to LF, advice please for lenses



rwestbrook
26-Feb-2009, 09:49
I have a 5x7 camera that I recently fetched out of my dad's attic.
It's really old, but the bellows are in great condition and I'd like
to use it.

I have posted photos of it and lenses I found.

http://robertowestbrook.com/client/5x7_camera/

I appreciate any info you may have about this, like how old the camera and lenses are. Most of the lenses have no shutter attached. How do I buy one and attach one?

The lenses are:

Rodenstock - Weitwinkel - Aplanat 1:12 f - 12cm No. 505145
Busch Anastigmat Omnar Ser. II F: 5,5 No. 2 1/2 F=150 mm D.R.G.M. Emil Busch A-G Rathenow
G. Rodenstock Munchen Rekti-Aplanat 1:8 f = 21cm No. 105986
Koehler Optical Co. New York 5x7 Extra Rapid Anastigmat F:4.5
C.P. Georz Berlin No.203674 DOPP - Anastigmat. Serie III. Dagor F=180mm 1:6,8
an old lens with no markings


Also, the lens board is wood with unique cuts. Who can cut a new one for me?

The only issue with the bellows is that it is slightly coming apart
from the front wood element. Only noticed this when I shined a flash
through. How should I reattach it?

The film holders were definitely designed to take glass plates. If I decide to try this down the road, can you recommend a resource. I understand it is chemical intensive and very difficult.

Thanks for your help!

venchka
26-Feb-2009, 10:12
Wet plate: I haven't produced one. I did watch two gentleman working with wet plates one Saturday. Chemical intensive? sure. Very difficult? It didn't seem to be terribly difficult. I'm sure that practice reduces the degree of difficulty. Suffice to say, several wet plate images were made in a period of a few hours. Some folks would have spent that much time making a similar number of exposures on film and then they would have to process the film.

Your dad had flawless taste. Use the equipment. GOOGLE Western Bellows and also search this Forum for Western Bellows.

Walter Calahan
26-Feb-2009, 10:14
You can make your own lens boards. Go to Home Despot or Lowe's to find the wood and drill bit for the lens opening.

venchka
26-Feb-2009, 10:16
If the Big Box stores don't have what you need, Lee Valley Tools online will have the correct drill bits. You may have to visit a real lumber yard to find decent hardwood for the lens boards. Richard Ritter may be able to copy the lens boards for you.

Michael Mutmansky
26-Feb-2009, 10:29
The holders are not for wet plate. They are for dry plate negatives. Look into what is known as 'whole plate' size, as I think that's what you have there.

You can get a metal insert made to hold sheet film, and you can find whole plate sheet film if you look around.


Good luch,


---Michael

venchka
26-Feb-2009, 10:34
10 boxes of fresh whole plate film for sale on this Forum.

aduncanson
26-Feb-2009, 10:34
Measuring the aspect ratio of the film gate in the photo with the back swung open, I get approximately 1.6:1. A 5x7 format gives 1.4:1. Are you sure that this is not a 5x8 camera?

Are you interested in finding film holders for this camera?

Michael Mutmansky
26-Feb-2009, 10:41
Well, looking again, that's not whole plate. You are going to have to measuer the glass size carefully and figure out what it will fit. it may be 5x8 as was mentioned, but even that looks too long for the holder.

You can get an insert made to hold a 5x7 inside for sure. Talk to AWB Enterprises about them; there may be others that can make an adapter.


---Michael

sanking
26-Feb-2009, 10:49
I believe this is a half plate camera, 4 3/4 X 6 1/2.

Sandy King

Bill_1856
26-Feb-2009, 10:52
What an absolutely lovely piece of photographic ephemera! I hope you have a thoroughly great time working with it.

Michael Mutmansky
26-Feb-2009, 11:18
Sandy,

That looks too large for half plate. It looks like the long side can hold a 7-1/2" piece of glass?

I don't know a common format that has that dimension, unfortunately.


---Michael

sanking
26-Feb-2009, 11:31
I think you are right. I don't have a good idea of scale here but I measured the ratio of length to width and it comes out to be about 1.54, which is a lot more than the 1.40 or so you get with whole plate. It is in fact very close to what one would get with 5X8, which would be 1.6.

So if it is not 5X8 I have no idea what it is, except possiblly 7X11.

Sandy





Sandy,

That looks too large for half plate. It looks like the long side can hold a 7-1/2" piece of glass?

I don't know a common format that has that dimension, unfortunately.


---Michael

rwestbrook
26-Feb-2009, 17:33
The response so far has been really helpful. I measured the holder and the opening is exactly 7.5in x 5in which is 19cm x 12.5cm. Was that a format in Europe? I include the metric measurements b/c dad got this from my Italian family while living in Italy. I don't know if it's Italian but the woodwork indicates it's a possibility. Have you seen holders with inlaid wood numbers?

If I drop in regular 5x7 film, will it sit funny and get odd distortion?

jnantz
26-Feb-2009, 18:15
you can coat your own glass plates for whatever size your holders hold.
it isn't hard, and is kind of fun.
the hardest part is subbing the glass ( making a layer of something the emulsion will anchor
itself too ) then getting some emulsion in a bottle ( or making your own! )
coating the plate a few times, and when the emulsion is DRY you stick it in your holder
put that in your camera. rate it somewhere between 1 and 6 ...

http://www.alternativephotography.com/process_dryplate.html

have fun!

john

Frank Petronio
26-Feb-2009, 18:28
You can probably patch rather than replace the bellows, from the photos they appear to be in great shape so why replace them? You can try various tapes -- I've had good luck with a plastic rubberized coating used for "dipping" tool handles -- it is sold next to spray paint at the big box stores and if you search "bellows repair" you'll find a lot of information.

I would be the one who would opt to have some expert make me an adapter or even an entirely new back (it should be interchangeable so you wouldn't be destroying anything...) so I could use readily available and commercial lab-processed film. But I am a sacrilegious slothful cad.

rwestbrook
26-Feb-2009, 18:53
Thanks Frank. Do you use that rubber coating to fill holes? you are right. The bellows are in great shape. It's just that the bellows has separated a little from the front standard and needs to be reattached. You think that rubber coating would do the trick?

Allen in Montreal
26-Feb-2009, 19:36
I have a 5x7 camera that I recently fetched out of my dad's attic.
It's really old, but the bellows are in great condition and I'd like
to use it............



Your dad was pretty cool to have a camera like this, I hope you get it and running, make some nice pictures and enjoying shooting with it, please post a picture when you can.

I inherited my dad's old Speed Graphic and there is something special about making pictures with your dad's old gear!
:)

eddie
26-Feb-2009, 20:14
where are you located?

i have several of these holders. i am trying to figure out what to call them so i can sell them. does the camera have a name on it?

anyway i the one set takes 5x7 plates and they have an insert to accept 3 1/2 x 4 3/4 inch plates. the overall outside dimension is 6 1/2 x 8 1/2. i also have two different style holders that are the same out side dimensions but have kodak 5x7 film holder sheath inserts in them.

anyway. have fun with what you have. if nothing else those lenses will serve you very well....even without shutters.

have fun.

eddie

eddie
26-Feb-2009, 20:25
okay, i looked again at your holder pictures. you could use them for wet plate. they have a small locking lever so you could stick the plate in there and lock them in with the lever. it would be easy to use for wet plate i think. they area bit different than the ones i have.

wet plate is not all that hard. it is easier if you could get some one to show you the 1st time...after that it is easy.

eddie

Frank Petronio
26-Feb-2009, 20:28
Most people use good old contact cement to attach the flat flap of the bellows to the wooden frame, with pressure of course. I was surprised but it works well with the paper/leather bellows materials.

Really Big Cameras
26-Feb-2009, 23:04
I appreciate any info you may have about this, like how old the camera and lenses are.

The lenses are:

Rodenstock - Weitwinkel - Aplanat 1:12 f - 12cm No. 505145
G. Rodenstock Munchen Rekti-Aplanat 1:8 f = 21cm No. 105986
C.P. Georz Berlin No.203674 DOPP - Anastigmat. Serie III. Dagor F=180mm 1:6,8


Robert,

You've already gotten quite a few responses about the camera, so I'll provide a little info about some of the lenses.

Based on the serial number, the Weitwinkel (Wide Angle) Aplanat was made in the early 1930s, around 1931 or 1932. The Rekti-Aplanat was made about a decade later, around 1941.

The Goerz Doppel Anastigmat is older. Based on the serial number, it was made around 1906 or 1907.

I suspect the camera is even older, as glass plates started to fall out of favor as sheet film became more readily available.

Kerry Thalmann
Really Big Cameras (http://reallybigcameras.com)

Rafael Garcia
28-Feb-2009, 18:16
If it is half plate, it can be made a dual-format film camera by easily building 5x7 and 4x5 backs, using the parts from old backs. I have one such camera, and have done this. I have uploaded the photos of the camera several times here: I'll do it again for convenience.

The back you have is for book-form holders, which were not standard, but made for specific cameras. I have adapted some for my original half-plate back, but you need a table router to do it...


http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h285/ragc01/eager.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h285/ragc01/4x5.jpg
4x5 back (inserted as left-handed)
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h285/ragc01/5x7.jpg
5x7 back
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h285/ragc01/myholder.jpg
The original half-plate back with a bookform holder inserted

rwestbrook
1-Mar-2009, 08:17
where are you located?

i have several of these holders. i am trying to figure out what to call them so i can sell them. does the camera have a name on it?

eddie

I'm in Norfolk, VA. The camera does not have a name on it, nor does it look like it ever had any kind of label. I might be interested in the holders suited for film. Do you have any photos of them?

rwestbrook
1-Mar-2009, 08:22
If it is half plate, it can be made a dual-format film camera by easily building 5x7 and 4x5 backs, using the parts from old backs. I have one such camera, and have done this. I have uploaded the photos of the camera several times here: I'll do it again for convenience.


Rafael,
That's a beautiful camera! What material did you use for the 5x7 back in white? Did you use any particular online resources for guidance in making the new backs?

Rafael Garcia
1-Mar-2009, 20:31
Minimum work was involved with that one: It's a 5x7 Burke & James back that I adapted with my router, making the lightrap edge wider. I believe I also cut it down in size a bit. I got lazy and decided not to strip the gray paint, so I painted it white instead. I also removed the metal door and hood combo because it got in my way. The 4x5 back I built almost completely, and adapted a GG screen that I had around to it, from an unknown camera.

The parts I got from eBay, pretty inexpensively.

I am presently building an 8x10, and that one is totally from scratch, including the back. I am adapting concepts from several cameras and trying some of my own ideas.