how to contact print

[Steve M Hostetter]

Hello,,

I have some 11x14 negs now and I will be getting the paper soon. Can anyone tell me how I can contact print with limited tools..

I don't have a contact printing frame. I do have an 11x14 enlarging easel and an enlarger. Can I get there from here? I don't and can't spend more $$
I suppose I will need a sheet of glass,,,? not sure

Also, how do I process the paper,, chems, temp, time, ? is it the same as the film or will the paper instructions state the process..?

Thx for all the help

Kind Regards
Steve

[Mark Woods]

Buy a premixed developer, like Clayton. Read the instructions. Buy a good paper. Read the instructions. Buy the acid stop. Read the instructions. Buy the fixer. read the instructions. An RC paper will limit your times in the chemicals and the wash, but it's not archival. Good to learn on. If you don't want to buy trays, raid the kitchen for some Pyrex casserole dishes.

[J D Clark]

Steve,
The key thing for your contact print is to have the negative flat on the paper. RC paper is more flat that fiber paper, and if your negative doesn't have any curl to it, may lay flat enough on the RC paper to make a contact print without glass. RC paper will also be quicker to wash than fiber paper.
For fiber paper you would probably want a piece of glass. I would also go to a craft store and get a piece of foam (should only be a couple of bucks) just larger than 11x14 to put the paper/negative sandwich on to expose it.
You can probably use your enlarger to expose the paper, assuming that it can illuminate an 11x14 size piece of paper. You don't actually even need that -- my first contact prints were made using a bulb with a switch hung 3-4 feet above the paper.
For processing, I assume you have some trays if you're developing your own negatives -- you can use the same stop and fix that you use for the negatives. The least expensive paper developer will be a powder like Dektol -- for my own convenience and time to prepare, I use a liquid developer (BW-65 from Photo Formulary), but that's not the most economical paper developer. The developer will have instructions as Mark suggests; most concentrations of paper developer typically result in about a two minute development time. Paper is developed "to completion", so you'll find the time/temperature somewhat less critical than with negative development.

John Clark
www.johndclark.com

[J D Clark]

Steve,

I just looked at your profile, and that you mostly use transparency film -- are the 11x14 negatives black and white, or color? I wrote my answer assuming that you've got black and white negatives...

In any case, try it, it's easy!

John Clark
www.johndclark.com

[PViapiano]

Get Tim Rudman's Master Printing book, OOP, but found many places.

Google for printing B&W photos, darkroom techniques, contact printing, etc...

Hang out at APUG...and photo.net

Man, you could learn more in one day than you could in a one year course at any school, but don't expect to get spoon fed...it's all out there waiting for you!

[Steve M Hostetter]

Hot damn , you guys are awesome..! Mark ,John, and Pviapiano

I feel like Rocky Balboa (in his lean years of course) :D I will do this

[Steve M Hostetter]

ps... John I'm using Ilford HP5 B&W film and I processed it in FG-7 and RC paper is on the way..

[Jim Galli]

If you don't get a decent printing frame you'll quickly waste more in the cost of paper and chemicals than one will cost. Just for s**ts and grins check out the stainless steel 14X17 xray film holders on ebay in the medical section. If you can get one of the old ones with the black phenolic front, you can knock the phenolic out of it and replace it with a piece of glass and have the best 11X14 print frame on earth.

[Steve M Hostetter]

Interesting .. Thanks Jim :)

[Allen in Montreal]

To hold you over until you have a proper contact frame, for only a few dollars you can make one. This is not perfect, but will hold you for now.

Buy a heavy sheet of glass about 13x17'' for an 11x14 neg. Buy this from a window shop and ask him to pick from the best sheet he has, have him buff the edges nicely.

Buy a think piece of foam core, thicker the better.

Duct tape several layers over lapping to make a hinge along one of the long sides. Use flat black duct tape is possible.

For a few dollars you now have a very heavy piece of glass that will lay flat and "suction stick" (sort of anyway) to the foam core and allow you to get a decent contact print until you have a better setup.

good luck.

[Steve M Hostetter]

I'm pretty handy with a saw ,,, is there a diagram anywhere on how to make a contact frame??

[Steve M Hostetter]

by the way thx Allen I may have to go that route

[Jim Fitzgerald]

I'm pretty handy with a saw ,,, is there a diagram anywhere on how to make a contact frame??

Steve, go to the Pellum website. I think this is how you spell it. This guy makes great frames and there are diagrams of his frames on the site. I made an 8x10 contact frame by looking at his. For my 11x14 and 8x20 negatives I use a vacuum frame. You can use some heavy glass first but it is nice to have some good contact from the vacuum frame.

If you can find some contact paper in 11x14 you can have some fun. I have a bunch of Azo in 11x14 and it is great stuff. Try some Ansco 130. Easy to mix and it lasts a long time and gives great results. You can use any printing paper to contact print on and if you want to get your feet wet you should try some RC paper. have fun with 11x14. It is a great format. If you need more help just ask.

Jim

[David Vickery]

I second Jim's suggestion about the vacuum frame. A sheet of glass will work fine to get you started, but if you want the sharpest images possible from your negatives then the best answer is the vacuum frame. Try contacting local printing companies to see if any of them have an old frame that they want to get rid of. After a while you may get lucky and find one for free.

[Steve M Hostetter]

can't find anything on Pellum other then origin of name etc.

[Joe Forks]

Steve,
Try this:

http://www.pellandphoto.com/

[Steve M Hostetter]

Thank you Joe

[Jim Fitzgerald]

Steve sorry about the spelling. The frames are not that hard to build. I use my 8x10 all the time. I would still look for a vacuum frame for 11x14 as it does make a difference in sharpness. I got mine off of e-bay for cheap. Just keep an eye out for them. If you find a local one more the better as they are heavy. Another alternative would be to find a used NuArc 26-1K plate burner. They all seem to be in your state or very close to you. It is a table top model that has a vacuum frame built in. It is a Mercury Vapor unit that you could hang a light bulb from for silver printing and then use it for alternative process printing like carbon or PT/Pl. You will get into alternative processes eventually. Trust me on that one! I wish I had thought of this when I built my 11x14. I would of had less equipment and more versatility for my printing. Oh well, good luck.

Jim

[gbogatko]

The cheapest pre-made contact printing frame in the world is a plastic picture frame. Get one with the 4 swivel-type back locks. It will hold the negative plus the paper very easily. You should be able to find one in a surplus/odd-lot store near you for about $3 or less. Some use plexiglass -- avoid those, get one with real glass. It'll hold the paper and negative nice and tight enough for you to get a feel for what the work flow is like, and unless you are used to viewing your photos using a microscope, will be satisfyingly sharp.

The whole thing might even come to less than the price a sheet of glass.

As a light source, for VC paper, hang a 7w bulb about 3 feet over the frame -- start with 5-7 seconds exposure. For Fomalux silver-chloride paper, start with a 25w bulb at same distance and around 13 seconds exposure.

By the way, Fomalux tends to be real contrasty. If contrast is over the top, try a water-bath: expose for 5-10 seconds more, put the paper in the developer, and when you see the first dark parts appearing transfer the paper into a tray of plain water. This will result in contrast compensation. You want to up the exposure to get something in the highlights.

Why Fomalux? It's affordable.

You can start with Dektol as the developer. It's also affordable and available. If too agressive, the water-bath trick will calm it down. I tried D76 at first, but the wait time is awful.

You can get away with double use of the other chemicals to see what the whole process feels like, but it's not really advisable. Better to have two sets of chems.

[Steve M Hostetter]

Jim, gb thank you !

[Steve M Hostetter]

does anyone have an example of a vacuum table,,,? do they use glass? thx

[Steve M Hostetter]

If the first layer (the neg) is put on the vacuum and the second layer(the paper) is laid down how is it the neg doesn't block the suction from pulling down the paper to be flat..?

[Steve M Hostetter]

I just noticed I got that backwards paper first then neg

[Don7x17]

If the first layer (the neg) is put on the vacuum and the second layer(the paper) is laid down how is it the neg doesn't block the suction from pulling down the paper to be flat..?


I regularly use a vacuum frame integrated into a stand with light source for printing alternative processes (and could use AZO/Lodima paper). I use 12x20 negatives. There is no issue of removing the air - the negative does not block any suction.

[Don7x17]

I second Jim's suggestion about the vacuum frame. A sheet of glass will work fine to get you started, but if you want the sharpest images possible from your negatives then the best answer is the vacuum frame. Try contacting local printing companies to see if any of them have an old frame that they want to get rid of. After a while you may get lucky and find one for free.

Vacuum frames will solve the Newton Ring problem inherent in large negatives against glass.

But you may be able to get by with two sheets of heavy glass -- get the edges sanded or pencil-polished(ask the glass cutter) -- put the negative and paper between the two sheets and you most likely won't see Newton rings.

[Steve M Hostetter]

thx Don,,, I have an old copy stand I drilled holes in and made a vacuum attachment for it.. I can convert it to an 11x14 contact frame I'll just have to drill a few hundred more holes.. drill area now measures about 8x10"

[D. Bryant]

does anyone have an example of a vacuum table,,,? do they use glass? thx

Search eBay for the phrase - NuArc and you will see some examples.

[Andrew O'Neill]

When I contact print my 8x10 negs, I just use a piece of plywood with two strips of wood screwed on which serve as "L's". A piece of black foam rubber and 1/4 inch glass (which is slightly bigger than the negative) sit on top of the plywood, up against the "L's". Everything is spray painted black...except the glass of course. I've been doing it this way for years. I also have a piece of anit-newton ring glass just incase of newton rings.

Developing the print is easy. I like Ilford's Multigrade developer which comes as a liquid. You dilute it. For stop, just use good old vinegar. Fixer, again Ilford's Rapid Fix is great as it's a liquid that you dilute.
As far as washing prints go, just use trays. Go to Ilford's website to read up on how to wash. Their way saves water and is a really effective wash. Don't forget to use a hypo clearing agent before the wash as it cuts wash time in half. If you are using RC paper, washing times are short anyways compared to fibre paper (you should use fibre paper eventually because it's beautiful).
Good luck. Lots of stuff out there to help you. Internet is a great resource.

Andrew

[Steve M Hostetter]

Thx Don, Andrew

They sure aren't giving those vacuum tables away ... I'll make something like what Andrew uses I suppose..

[Noeyedear]

Excuse my ignorance on this, but how does a vacuum frame work. I can see it would hold the printing paper flat, I can't figure out in my head how it would hold the negative to the paper. Unless it's some kind of sealed box and the pressure of air above pushes the negative flat, so instead of sucking it flat it pushes it flat. Any pictures of one anywhere, I have no idea what they look like?

Kevin.

[jb7]

Unless it's some kind of sealed box and the pressure of air above pushes the negative flat


Now you're suckin diesel-

j

[Joe Forks]

Excuse my ignorance on this, but how does a vacuum frame work. I can see it would hold the printing paper flat, I can't figure out in my head how it would hold the negative to the paper. Unless it's some kind of sealed box and the pressure of air above pushes the negative flat, so instead of sucking it flat it pushes it flat. Any pictures of one anywhere, I have no idea what they look like?

Kevin.

Don't forget there is a plate of glass on top of the negative. The vacuum pressure sucks the glass down as well and helps distribute even pressure to the whole "sandwich". That's my understanding anyway, if I'm wrong please feel free to beat me senseless :)

[Steve M Hostetter]

I would think the plate of glass would defeat the purpose of the vacuum...?

[Joe Forks]

I would think the plate of glass would defeat the purpose of the vacuum...?

How so? If the glass were between the vacuum and neg + paper sandwich it would indeed defeat the purpose, but it's not. Vacuum applies negative pressure from underneath, so it sucks down everything on top of it.

I used vacuum frames on process cameras for 20 years, but never with a contact printing application, that's why I said it was "as I understand it".

[jb7]

As I understand it,
atmospheric pressure is around 14psi-

So if you can reduce the pressure underneath by a tenth,
let's say, for the sake of argument,
then you've got a pressure of 112 lb on top of the glass for an 8x10-

j

[Colin Graham]

I made a vacuum frame drawer that slides into a pizza oven style exposure unit. The glass seals against a raised gasket 'curb' beneath a layer of thin foam and rubber. I used only two 1/4 holes for vacuum ports. A thin piece of muslin creates a buffer and distributes the pressure evenly. Only need to draw about 5" of mercury to make great contact, which is only a 1/4 of what most medium-duty vacuum pumps will draw.

http://www.colinflanarygraham.com/DIYmedia/vacuumUV.jpg

[anotherJoe]

That's sweet!! Thanks for including the photo.

Joe

[Steve M Hostetter]

I understand why a vacuum would work for a copy camera as I stated I made a vacuum platform with an old Belser copy stand .. I did this so that I wouldn't need a plate of glass to hold down my copy work...

I just don't see how it's going to do a better job then just a conventional contact print frame would since you can't do away with the plate glass

[Don Hutton]

Conventional printer's vacuum frames works by sucking a rubber blanket which has a multitude of slightly raised dimples on it, onto the glass - when you place a negative and sheet of printing paper in between the blanket underneath very evenly and efficiently pushes the printing paper against the emulsion side of the negative (which is then in turn pressed against the glass) in a very uniform and consistent way. It is extremely convenient and you are always assured of excellent, consistent contact between the negative and paper as well as more convenient registration than using a flip over contact printing frame. For big negatives (11x14 and up), I wouldn't consider using anything else. Conventional contact printing frames rely on a couple of springs which exert very high pressure at the point of contact with the back of the frame. The further you go from the points of contact the more room there is for flex in the wooden back to relieve this pressure and create uneven registration. I believe that the varying pressure is also a cause of many issues with Newton rings on spring frames. Compared to a nice vacuum frame they are incredibly clunky to use at best, although they do seem to perform just fine for small prints (8x10 and smaller).

[Joe Forks]

I understand why a vacuum would work for a copy camera as I stated I made a vacuum platform with an old Belser copy stand .. I did this so that I wouldn't need a plate of glass to hold down my copy work...

I just don't see how it's going to do a better job then just a conventional contact print frame would since you can't do away with the plate glass

When working with a large surface area you have a greater potential for less than perfect flatness. The idea is to distribute the negative pressure more evenly than the conventional steel spring method. It's just that simple.

[Steve M Hostetter]

I got ya .. thx Don ,, Joe and everyone else ! guess I got some holes to drill