Is the Yankee tank the Antichrist? [Archive] - Large Format Photography Forum

Jehu

8-Oct-2008, 13:52

I've been trying for the last couple of months to figure out how to use the Yankee daylight tank. A quick search will yield a plethora of opinions on this critter. About 85% are strongly against but there are some that say that they've never had a problem.

Has anyone perfected a procedure with the Yankee tank?

I just read something that may help. I've never tried presoaking before. Maybe that will help. I'll try that this afternoon.

Glenn Thoreson

8-Oct-2008, 14:22

I've perfected a procedure but I'm not sure everyone would agree with it. I have a rather low opinion of those tanks but if you get three of them and only use one rack, they make a good dip-n-dunk setup. In the dark, of course. I would leave the lids in the cupboard. Forever. Since the rack holds so many sheets, you could load them all and really get a rhythm going to do a lot in one sitting. One man's opinion and worth about what you paid for it. :D

David A. Goldfarb

8-Oct-2008, 14:28

Take the two parts of the rack apart and shine a flashlight into the inside of the outer tube in the center of the rack to check for the sign of the beast. If you find the number "666," then indeed, the Yankee tank is the antichrist.

vinny

8-Oct-2008, 14:32

If you take the lid off I believe it'll work well as a desktop trash can.

Michael Graves

8-Oct-2008, 15:13

If you take the lid off I believe it'll work well as a desktop trash can.

I'm using mine as a planter. It looks great in the window holding a begonia...or whatever that thing is my wife planted in it. And no, it is NOT the Antichrist. Everyone knows that's Bill Gates.

Jon Shiu

8-Oct-2008, 15:59

What is the specific problem you are having with the tank?

Jon

EdWorkman

8-Oct-2008, 16:12

Hmmmm
47 years ago I took my Yankee and 2x3 speed off to collitch.
I made a few shots, mixed chemicals in jugs from the dining hall trash, loaded the Yankee in a closet and never looked back- Callow youth doesn't know it's hard to do.
I didn't have problems I could pin on the Yankee.
For the last 40 years tho' I've beeen a 120 kind of guy. I use the yankee as the last dip of 120 in photo-flo. How's that for faint praise?

Jehu

8-Oct-2008, 16:13

Hey, a serious response!

Thanks Jon. My problem is mottling.

Jon.
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z95/Jehu10842/LF_BW/Donner/Donner05a-5.jpg

Andrew Tymon

8-Oct-2008, 17:33

W K Longcor

8-Oct-2008, 17:50

I guess I am just different. Years ago, before I could afford the fancy automated equipment in my studio, I used several Yankee tanks for 4x5 sheet film. Though my fingers always got wet from chemical spashing out -- I never had any real problems.. I used them for B&W, color negative (I think back then it was C-22???) and E-3
(pre E-6). REsults were even and MORE THAN acceptable. I never had mottled negs or uneven processing. To those having those problems, I would guess they didn't read the instructions as to proper aggitation. But that was 40 years ago or more. Maybe they changed the design and added mottling to the tank.:eek:

Jehu

8-Oct-2008, 17:52

Yankee tanks are really useful for washing your negs or using them as a bath for your final rinse. I too had the mottled negs and it's not worth risking all the hard work you put into shooting the negs. Get yourself a unicolor drum and agitator of ebay-beautiful evenly developed negs- the savior of film development sanity.:)

I've come close to bidding on drums. I'm just not knowlegable enough to be sure I'm buying something that will work. I'll research that some more. In the mean time I'm going to try developing with a presoak. I've got nothing to lose.

Glenn Thoreson

8-Oct-2008, 18:03

Uneven development is their claim to fame, as is splashing stuff all over the place. Some folk can get good results out of them. I followed their agitation method to the letter and used a couple of my own methods. One time it works, next time it doesn't. I just couldn't count on the thing. I got better things to do. Unicolor print drum and motorized roller. The only way to go. Especially if you're counting pennies, like me.

D. Bryant

8-Oct-2008, 19:11

Hey, a serious response!

Thanks Jon. My problem is mottling.

Jon.
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z95/Jehu10842/LF_BW/Donner/Donner05a-5.jpg
Your problem is the Yankee tank. Make a film washer out of it!

Don Bryant

Don Hutton

8-Oct-2008, 19:21

Yankee tanks make ideal floor fodder for darkrooms - stuff that you never should use, but keep on the floor, theoretically under counters, but when the lights go out, it sneaks out so you can trip over it.

Michael Graves

9-Oct-2008, 05:56

The problem with the Yankee, as I see it, is that you can't invert it because it will leak out the top. The design of the slots is so poorly conceived that trying to slosh the developer around inside won't give even dispersion of fresh solution across the surface of the film. Back in college, one of my friends and I experimented with a device we made. It consisted of one of those vibrating pads they used to sell for mixing chemistry. We glued a rectangular platform onto that and essentially gave the film constant agitation by leaving it on the platform. The results were a little better, but even tones, such as skies and skin, were still mottled. Get a Jobo.

Scott Davis

9-Oct-2008, 07:42

Initially I had good luck processing in a Yankee. Then, when I got serious, and started making negs for alt process printing, I found I was having mottling and worse, noticeable density build-up on the edges of my negs. The design of the film rack insert is to blame - the rails that hold the negs by the edge cause turbulence agitating, and you end up with overdevelopment. I switched to Jobo Expert drums and haven't looked back. My Yankee serves as a holding bath now for bottled chems.

Jehu

9-Oct-2008, 09:02

Michael Graves

9-Oct-2008, 09:26

One of these?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=330276816821

With one of these?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=110296653996

If I have a Jobo 4x5 reel and a 2500 series tank can I just process it just like the 120 that I'm used to?

That setup will work quite nicely. One tip, based on experience. You'll get much better results if you only load five sheets. I got a trace of uneven development with this setup if I had all six slots loaded, which completely disappeared if I only loaded five. Of course, it could have just been me. But with the inversion cap, you can get excellent results with this setup.

Jehu

13-Oct-2008, 09:22

So I decided to give the Yankee tank one more try. This time I presoaked for 30 seconds and used a VERY aggressive agitation. Here is the result:
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z95/Jehu10842/LF_BW/Still%20Life/gretsch2-1.jpg

I don't believe that there's any mottling on this shot. I've compared it to a 35mm shot I took at the same time. The tone of the wall is the same in both. The lighter area on the right was really there. I consider that to be a mistake in the composition but the film processing seems to be correct.

Andrew O'Neill

13-Oct-2008, 10:30

I was going to say that it's an agitation issue and to give constant agitation and try. Which film/developer are you using? Most modern films require a vigorous agitation regime...

Michael Graves

13-Oct-2008, 10:34

Jim Rice

13-Oct-2008, 12:01

Aside from not working all that well, they also require gobs of chemestry.

Jehu

13-Oct-2008, 13:19

Aside from not working all that well, they also require gobs of chemestry.

You've got a point there.

domenico Foschi

13-Oct-2008, 13:58

They are wonderful only for one thing and I use mine a lot .

Colin Corneau

14-Oct-2008, 21:21

They just don't work. Period.

I tried, every possible agitation method. Even taking the film out and dunking it in the dark..nothing ever worked.

I had some priceless negs ruined by that &$#@@!! thing, and learned some LF lessons the very hard way.

There's just too many reports on that thing. Get a Jobo, or even a slosher tray. Anything but that damn tank.

Tintype Bob

15-Oct-2008, 05:35

I use mine to hide my extra cash from my wife - I close the lid and mark it EXPOSED FILM DO NOT OPEN - and she never has.

Michael Graves

15-Oct-2008, 07:47

I use mine to hide my extra cash from my wife - I close the lid and mark it EXPOSED FILM DO NOT OPEN - and she never has.

You have extra cash? How'd you GET it without your wife finding out?

NiallPhoto

15-Oct-2008, 14:53

I use the 4x5 Yankee tank, and recently had a mottling problem when I used Diafine.

Prior to that, I have not observed mottling so I attribute it to the high-concentration developer.

I use 56 fluid ounces of solution, which guarantees coverage of the film, because
some of the solution spills over the top.

I use weak concentration developers: FG7+ 1+15, Rodinal 1+50 & 1+100, HC110-B.
(Though the counter example, Microphen 1+3, worked fine for me)

I agitate by resting the tank on a level surface and moving back and forth. If you
hold it in the air, the tendency is to rock the tank. This may be why the
guitar image above has a parabolic shape. Move back and forth 4 times per 5 seconds,
really slowly, not more than 2 inches left, 2 inches right.

I pour in the solution using a 5 inch funnel, I never let the funnel fill to the top,
I keep the poured solution about 1/3 the way up from the mouth of the spigot. If
you pour too rapidly, I think the developing action increases. Also make sure the
film rack is seated securely. It takes about 15 to 20 seconds to fill the tank this way.

I agitate continuously for the first minute, slowly. Then for 5 seconds, every 30 seconds.

Hope this helps.

Kirk Keyes

15-Oct-2008, 21:29

I've only heard of one guy that was able to tame the Yankee tank. I've never met him, but I heard a couple guys down the street at the Catholic parish talking one day about a guy named Father Damien. I guess he was able to get an even tone out of that tank, but a lot of fighting with it and a lot split pea soup was spilled in the course of it...

I decided to go with Jobos. First with the 2500 tank, and now with a 3010 tank.

Pete_6109

3-Nov-2008, 14:52

I use a Yankee 4x5 tank and I got some spots (airbells) at first so now I presoak the film with a little photo flo. Now I get spots only once in awhile. When I shoot something that I think is worthwhile I send the film out for processing and get it back with no spots at all.

Don7x17

7-Nov-2008, 10:58

Here's the method I found useful back in the 1980's when I tried this tank and got mottling:

1) remove lid. Drop in trashcan
2) remove film holder, save for film washing until you got something better. Also use in clearing tank for old Polaroid 55 negative clearing. No more with the demise of Polaroid, so drop in trash
3) Take base, drop kick it into trashcan. Extra points for richochet off walls if not damaged(walls)

Worked well for me. I've never regretted it. No one I know ever had much success using this tank for development if they were doing fine art

(Probably this device was useful back in the 1940's when newspapers were still using speed graphics and 4x5 film. Deadlines trumped negative quality each time).

Colin Corneau

10-Nov-2008, 21:37

To answer your thread title:

"Yes."

dsphotog

13-Nov-2008, 08:40

I used one for a long time. now I have the Jobo.
I really hated using 1/2 gal. of chemistry.

...If thats all you have, and you must use it......
Here is what worked for me.
Tape the lid on.
Tilt the tank slightly when filling (drain up).
Use a presoak, use a development time over 5 min., frequently rap the tank to dislodge air bubbles,slide the tank to agitate.
Use it in the sink to contain the spillage...... start saving for a Jobo expert set up.

Renato Tonelli

13-Nov-2008, 14:58

I used mine for getting the gunk out of the Polaroid 55 negs and it sucked at that too when all the slots were loaded. I loaded very other slot from then on.

Gottfried Sandow

14-Nov-2008, 09:35

I gave the Yankee a chance for I had dark developing stripes on the rim of my negs developing them in a JOBO drum. So I´m using the Yankee for half a year now. Most of the negs ( ca. 150) came out fine. Only just the last time, already thinking I´m used to it now, I had the "mottling-problem".

I usualy presoak negs for 1 min then agitate them the first minute and 10 sec every minute after.
Developing times ranged between 10 to 23 minutes which didn´t have any effect so far, normal development or push-process, no matter. So I guess time is not the issue here.

I´d say it is more the way you agitate the tank. The slower the worse the mottling. The first times trying the Yankee I was pretty rough as I´m used it from the JOBO drum. Trying to be not so abusive to the negs resulted in mottling.
Still this is only a guess and not confirmed yet... will have to try that next time.

...btw I find 12 negs per developing process much better than only six in the Jobo drum. And 40ml chemicals going togehter with 1600ml water don´t seem to much to me either. But it will spill, oooooh yes it will...

Jehu

17-Dec-2008, 15:08

Three hours ago, I went to the hardware store with an idea. I bought an 8' length of 1.5" ABS drain pipe, two couplers and four caps. I cut 1" lengths to put a cap on each of the couplers. Then I cut a six inch length and capped one end. That's my new processing tank. I put three ounces of ID-11 in the cap (the coupler and cap assembly), turned off the lights, curled up a sheet of exposed Tmax 100 emulsion side in and stuffed in into the tube. Then I put the cap with the developer on it, turned the lights on and floated the pipe bomb (that's what I call it) in a tray of water and kept it turning constantly for about 7 minutes.

The result seems to be better than the Yankee tank and it only uses 3 ounces per sheet. It's drying right now. I'll scan it in an hour or so. Hopefully, I'll be making a planter out of the Yankee tank.

jordanstarr

19-Dec-2008, 14:35

I've been using the Yankee Agi-tank (a different model than this thread?) for about 5 months, since I started Large format. I've had almost 100 negatives run through it. No issues with it at all. I've even loaded it full with 12 sheets once (capacity) and had no problems.

Bazz8

30-Dec-2008, 18:05

Mine is just perfecccctttttt,for drying washed film turn base over sit film holder on top and leave overnight yep does a great job

Jehu

31-Dec-2008, 10:20

The home made sewer pipe developing tubes seem to be working:
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z95/Jehu10842/LF_BW/VC/windmill03.jpg
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z95/Jehu10842/LF_BW/VC/cemetery08b.jpg

Donald Qualls

1-Jan-2009, 08:44

Jehu, you've rediscovered processing tanks like those I've been using for several years. In mine, I added a baffle inside the cap made of 1/8" ABS sheet (glued in with ABS pipe cement) and a filler neck and inversion cap made of smaller PVC pipe (glued to the ABS cap with "transition cement", made specifically for joining ABS to PVC) to allow daylight fill and drain. I love mine, though I occasionally wish they used a little less developer. When filled completely, I can let them stand like I do my roll film, they never scratch (I lightly chamfered the inside of each end of the tube and the interior is shiny-smooth), and they're impervious to anything I'd subject my film to. And, they're modular -- additional sections of tube and couplers allow me to process one to three sheets in a single unit (though three sheets is a little precarious to stand on end), and with a little preparation I can process up to three units at the same time.

If you use foreign film stocks like I do, you might find dye marks on the film after processing; if so, a couple minutes soaking in 2% sodium sulfite solution in a tray will decolor the dye and the sulfite will wash out in a minute.