Very basic question on sheet film

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

I know this is super basic, but I don't want to lose $25 or so of film finding out the answer the hard way.

I have a brand spanking new box of FP4 4x5 sheet film. I have a good step by step guide to what to do to put the film in the holders, but what I DON'T know is what I see when I open the box.

What I was guessing is that it would be something like opening a box of photo paper, that there would be a thick plastic bag inside, except that there will be NO safelights in use when I load the film holders.

Please tell me if I am mistaken before I do something really stupid and lose $25 worth of film.

I know it's a beginner question, but I feel no shame asking it, and yes, I did try running a couple searches. Multi-word searches return lots of stuff that doesn't really apply.

Thanks,
Adam

[Capocheny]

Hi Adam,

Peruse this link...

http://www.butzi.net/articles/filmload.htm

Cheers

[David Karp]

Hi Capocheny, good to hear from you!

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

Excellent link. I will study that. Thank you, Capocheny.

P.S. God's Country, eh? You must also live in the Pacific Northwest. (smile)

[David Karp]

Aargghh pirate,

As for the box of film, with FP4+ or any Ilford film, you will not have a foil pouch. The film will be in a black plastic bag similar to the bag that holds photo paper. Inside the bag, the film is protected by a piece of cardboard that folds around the film. This is nice, because you can reuse the bag easily just slide the film between the cardboard, and slip it back into the bag.

[John Kasaian]

If this is your first go, try this: take out a sacrificial piece of film out of the bag, carefully replace the bag and box sections and turn on the light. Practice loading a holder until you can do it with your eyes closed and...thats it! When you get ready to load for reals, place your stack of holders (dark slides partially pulled with the 'white' or 'bright' side (signalling "unexposed")of the dark slide's handles facing outwards and flaps open) and film box where they'll naturally be in position so you'll have the least wasted movement. After loading each sheet of film drive the dark slide home and twist the locking "ell" so you can't pull the darkslide out untill you're ready to expose the film.
After the shot replace with the dark side of the slide handle facing out.

[sun of sand]

just be expecting the confetti

[jwaddison]

Ilford film has a fine sheet of paper separating each film sheet, so you have to make sure you don't load the paper with the film (like I almost did the first time).

[Kirk Fry]

"know is what I see when I open the box".

Nothing I hope. :-)

The way you wipe out film is forgetting to put the unused film back into the box and close it before you turn the lights back on. Then you will see it.

K

[katie cooke]

try this video: http://photondetector.com/blog/2007/10/26/how-to-load-large-format-film-video-tutorial/

which includes a show and tell of what's in the box, as well as how to load the film into the holders.

[CG]

Smart question and smart timing!

[Sal Santamaura]

Ilford film has a fine sheet of paper separating each film sheet, so you have to make sure you don't load the paper with the film (like I almost did the first time).Ilford stopped using interleaving paper years ago.

[Alan Davenport]

Yaaarrrrrr, Matey...

Ye be seein' nothin' when yer opens the box, because ye'll be doin' it in TOTAL DARKNESS lest your $25 be donated to UHK...

(That's the University of Hard Knocks.)

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

try this video: http://photondetector.com/blog/2007/10/26/how-to-load-large-format-film-video-tutorial/

which includes a show and tell of what's in the box, as well as how to load the film into the holders.

I just watched it. Thanks for the tip.

I think I am confident enough to try this now. I lack a totally dark place at home, but after my work shift today I will load some holders in the single-seater bathroom because I can make that room totally dark.

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

Yaaarrrrrr, Matey...

Ye be seein' nothin' when yer opens the box, because ye'll be doin' it in TOTAL DARKNESS lest your $25 be donated to UHK...

(That's the University of Hard Knocks.)

Yaaarrrrr! I be a Ph.D. of my dear alma mater, the UHK!

[John Powers]

I just watched it. Thanks for the tip.

I think I am confident enough to try this now. I lack a totally dark place at home, but after my work shift today I will load some holders in the single-seater bathroom because I can make that room totally dark.

Try sitting in the bath room for 3-5 minutes with the lights out. Ignore any jokes about what you might be doing there in the dark. As your eyes adjust you may be surprised to see how much light comes in around & under the door or some other place. Remember this trick for when you build your own darkroom. I sat there waiting for my eyes to adjust with a caulking gun full of black caulk for the little surprises that came into view.

After you slide the film sheet into the holder try lifting the sheet perpendicular to the holder or even toward the dark slide. It is very easy to miss the rails that hold the film in place. If the film is not in place it may surprise you by completely disappearing when you make the first shot. My student partner did this, a pretty blond. When we developed the next several sheet of her in a head shot pose we discovered a halo reflection, which she did not deserve. The misloaded sheet of film had fallen into the bellows, gone to our amazed eyes. It then caught the light and gave a halo like reflection.

Hey, welcome to LF.

John

[Jim Ewins]

I usually place my thumb and middle fingers on the throat (or beginning) of the rails that the film will slide under. This in an attempt to keep the film from sliding on top of the rails

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

All,

Thanks for your advice on this. I feel WAY more confident now.

I went to accomplish this task and performed the test that I was going to perform, the one outlined by John Powers above, and found light leaks of one type or another everywhere I tried. If my eyes can adjust and find light leaks within 10 seconds that's no good.

I think tomorrow I may just have to wait until everyone vacates the building and then turn off the lights to the short bit of hallway outside the bathroom and try in there again. It'll be a Friday so that shouldn't take very long. Everyone seems to bolt early on Fridays.

Failing that, I have a basement room that would work as long as I find an effective way of blocking the one window it has.

[Capocheny]

Hi Capocheny, good to hear from you!

Hi Dave,

Thanks for your comment. :)

Hope things are going well with you... time sure flies by, doesn't it? :)



Excellent link. I will study that. Thank you, Capocheny.

P.S. God's Country, eh? You must also live in the Pacific Northwest. (smile)

Hi Adam,

Yup, Vancouver, BC in Canada. :)

Hope the link was useful... Paul has some great stuff on his site. :)

Cheers

[Charles Hohenstein]

Nobody ever talks about how to get the sheet film OUT of the holders, with short fingernails.

[George E. Sheils]

All,

Thanks for your advice on this. I feel WAY more confident now.

I went to accomplish this task and performed the test that I was going to perform, the one outlined by John Powers above, and found light leaks of one type or another everywhere I tried. If my eyes can adjust and find light leaks within 10 seconds that's no good.

I think tomorrow I may just have to wait until everyone vacates the building and then turn off the lights to the short bit of hallway outside the bathroom and try in there again. It'll be a Friday so that shouldn't take very long. Everyone seems to bolt early on Fridays.

Failing that, I have a basement room that would work as long as I find an effective way of blocking the one window it has.

Do yourself a favour and don't rely on rooms that can't be made completely dark. Buy a Calumet Changing Room collapsable tent thingy which will allow you to work in any type of lighting with just your arms doing the loading in darkness. I bought one and it is a godsend and can be used in the field, hotel room etc.

Here's a link: http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/RM1000/

Regards,
G.

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

Thanks to all for your advice.

My wife is convinced I need a changing bag. She looks like she is going to buy one for me as a surprise. I think she wants to use it, too.

As it is, I went downstairs to the warehouse room, and it was empty of people, so I locked the doors, set up my stuff, and shut off the light. I had to feel my way back to the dark corner. I waited about three minutes, and couldn't see a thing, so I stuck my hands inside the black plastic garbage bag I had brought with me as a precaution and started loading.

I only have two film holders so far, and it took me about five minutes to load four lousy sheets of film. BUT, I am confident I got them lined up correctly. I placed my fingertips from my left hand on top of the lead edges of those rails that we're supposed to watch so I am reasonably sure that I didn't accidentally slide the film into the space between the rails and the slide. I had difficulty closing one side of one holder, so I unloaded it and tried again. It worked fine the second time. I have no idea what was going on there.

I checked my work (by feel), and then made sure I had the bag closed and the box put back together, and I collected up my stuff and felt my way back to the light switch, holding the box of film (with 21 sheets still left in it) closed since I had forgotten to bring some tape.

I think I got it. We'll see for sure once I shoot a few sheets and process them.

Adam

[Gary L. Quay]

Invest in a can of compressed air and an anti-static brush. The hardest part of large format photography, for me, has been keeping the #@*&! dust off of the film.

--Gary

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

Invest in a can of compressed air and an anti-static brush. The hardest part of large format photography, for me, has been keeping the #@*&! dust off of the film.

--Gary

I used a clean, moisture-trap filtered stream of air from a compressor. It was definitely overkill, but it was what was at hand.

Hi, Gary!

[Gary L. Quay]

I bought an air compressor last year, and I have a filter on it, but not a moisture trap. I have to test it each time before I use it. It's not overkill. I set mine at 150 psi, and blow through a capillary nozzle at a six inch distance and a 45 degree angle to the film, and I still get dust that has been missed. I really need to get the moisture trap, though.

--Gary

[The Dread Pirate Robins]

I bought an air compressor last year, and I have a filter on it, but not a moisture trap. I have to test it each time before I use it. It's not overkill. I set mine at 150 psi, and blow through a capillary nozzle at a six inch distance and a 45 degree angle to the film, and I still get dust that has been missed. I really need to get the moisture trap, though.

--Gary

The thing about a compressor is that it can also kick a lot of dust up into the air which can come swinging back with the turbulence and get on your film holder.

The other thing I've noticed is that dust seems to abhor a vacuum - if there is a lack of dust on my film holder (or computer screen, for that matter) dust will appear. I stuffed my film holders in a plastic bag right after I loaded them in hopes of delaying this process.