View Full Version : Graphic"22" rollback plate and Mamiya RB back?

Phil Erickson
26-Apr-2001, 15:32
Hi folks,

Here's a (hopefully simple) question. Yes, I've checked as far as Google's usen et search and this board's archives and graflex.org and .. will take me, but cou ldn't find the answer readily.

I have a Pacemaker Graphic 4x5 with a Graflok back. I might also have the oppor tunity to obtain a Graphic "22" knob-wind 6x6 back with 4x5 mounting plate.

The question: if I remove the Graphic "22" knob-wind back from the adapter plate and try to put a Mamiya RB 6x7cm roll back on, will the adapter hold it? I kno w the RB back has Graflok-like slots on it (so if I had a 2x3 Graphic it would f it right on), but I'm not sure:

a) whether the RB back will fit lighttight and hold on the adapter (or even if t he "22" roll back will come off);

b) whether the opening in the plate for the roll back is big enough to let 6x7cm through.

Thanks; hopefully you've figured out by now that a RB roll back's film transport is preferable to the older "22" rollback's technology, which is why I'm even th inking about this in the first place! (and I will echo the many folks who prais e this forum: amazing insights and info here.)

John H. Henderson
27-Apr-2001, 12:27
I was hoping that someone who knew for sure would have chimed in by now, but no such luck. I have never seen the Graphic back, so the question I have is how is the back attached to the 4x5 plate? If it attaches via a 2x3 Graflock, then the Mamiya back might attach. But since I see Graphic backs advertised exclusively for 2x3, or 3x4 or 4x5 (e.g., I've never seen and eBay listing that said, "Graphic 22 for 4x5, can also be used on 2x3."), I have a suspicion that the back is screwed to the plate.

I haven't looked around yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could find a reducing back to reduce 4x5 to 2x3 that might fit the Mamiya back.

John H. Henderson
27-Apr-2001, 12:39
Toyo has a quick-sliding roll-film/digital back adapter that will fit any 4x5 camera with the international graflock fittings. There is an adapter plate available for it that allows the use of "Mamiya RB67, Graflex, and Horseman brands in 6x7 and 6x9cm." This statement implies that the RB67 back is compatible with the standard 2x3 Graflock back, but don't hold me to that. I don't know if this adapter can be used alone on the camera, or if it can only be used with the sliding adapter. I gather from your question that you're considering this as an economical approach, and the sliding adapter is not very economical (or light...or compact.)

Phil Erickson
27-Apr-2001, 12:47
Yes, I was trying to be economical oops cheap about this. Hopefully someone with one of the Graphic adapter plates will chime in.

I'm pretty sure the Mamiya RB67 back is just the right dimensions to lock onto a 2x3 Graflok back, so I guess what I could use is a 4x5 to 2x3 reducing back with Graflok on both sides (for the 4x5 camera end and the 2x3 rollback), as John suggested.

This really is just a metal plate with the right holes and dimensions plus a set of sliding tabs for the 2x3 part - naively, that sounds pretty simple to me. Is there nothing economical out there that would do it? (Of course, I guess you also have to worry about getting the film plane in just the right spot, which may be the cost factor.)

After all, I've got a Graphic which is definitely on the low end of the cost spectrum! Right now, I'm in the playing around stage with things.

tim atherton
27-Apr-2001, 13:30
These guys have one of the Toyo things in the inventory (Large Format) for CDN$399 (which must be around $250/60 US?). I had a very brief look last time i was in the shop - don't remember the condition, but I think it was okay?


Joseph Dickerson
27-Apr-2001, 15:49

The Graphic roll holders (22 or 23) are designed to fit either a 4x5 camera, with Graflok back, or a 2x3 camera, with Graflok back, and are not interchangeable from one to the other.

The roll holder for a 2x3 camera can be adapted for a 4x5 with the addition of some sort of reducing back. As other have stated Toyo, Horseman and others have made a sliding adapter but they are bulky and expensive. Peter Gowland, you can find his address and phone in Shutterbug, makes a reducing back that, while not cheap, is easy to work with.

I ordered mine about four years ago and it was $ 300. It does allow the use of RB-67 backs on any camera with a 4x5 Graflok back. If you have Pro-S Mamiya backs it's a little tricky as the dark slide has a catch and they have to be partially withdrawn in order to lock the slides on the Graflok back. It's not too hard however as the dark slides have a v shaped notch to indicate how far the need to be withdrawn.

It might actually be cheaper to just buy the proper sized Graphic roll film holder for your application.

Hope this is the info you needed.

Joseph A. Dickerson

John H. Henderson
30-Apr-2001, 13:44
I looked about the internet, and it appears that Wista has a 4x5 to 2x3 reducing back. It seems that everyone else had some kind of expensive sliding or rotating arrangement. $213 at B&H, though.