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Winger
1-Aug-2008, 09:35
Newbie alert! Newbie alert! I currently have a 210mm on my 4x5 (Cambo monorail). I'd like to have something a little wider, but how do I decide whether to look for a 135mm or a 150mm? I don't really have the money to get both and see. I don't have anyone nearby to rent from or borrow from (as far as I know). Can I equate one or the other to a 75mm on 645? How much difference is there really between the 2 anyway? Yes, I know I'll get about 10 opinions from 8 people, but I'm asking anyway. :)

BradS
1-Aug-2008, 09:47
It kinda depends upon your subject matter and shooting style but, there really isn't much difference between the two focal lengths. I have tended to shoot with the 135mm much more than all the rest but, the 150 does, generally speaking, offer slightly more coverage.

I have both and tend to use the 150 for people and the 135 for just about everything else. If I were forced to choose just one, I think I'd probably go with the 150...but, I don't think it really matters too much.

Kuzano
1-Aug-2008, 09:56
Newbie alert! Newbie alert! I currently have a 210mm on my 4x5 (Cambo monorail). I'd like to have something a little wider, but how do I decide whether to look for a 135mm or a 150mm? I don't really have the money to get both and see. I don't have anyone nearby to rent from or borrow from (as far as I know). Can I equate one or the other to a 75mm on 645? How much difference is there really between the 2 anyway? Yes, I know I'll get about 10 opinions from 8 people, but I'm asking anyway. :)

Others may correct me, but 75 on your 645 is normal focal length, as is 48mm on 35mm film, and I think that normal on 4X5 is either 180 or the 210 you now have.

I would think a good lens to get would be 135 for a slight wide angle and then when you are ready for another lens and you want very wide angle, to look for a 90-110. On the other hand... The 150 would break the focal lengths more evenly, if you do get a 90 in the future. If you don't see yourself getting a wide angle or third lens, I'd opt for a good 135.

BradS
1-Aug-2008, 10:03
150mm is generally accepted as "Normal" focal length for 4x5. 210mm is the "a little long" focal length on 4x5.

drew.saunders
1-Aug-2008, 10:18
Newbie alert! Newbie alert! I currently have a 210mm on my 4x5 (Cambo monorail). I'd like to have something a little wider, but how do I decide whether to look for a 135mm or a 150mm? I don't really have the money to get both and see. I don't have anyone nearby to rent from or borrow from (as far as I know). Can I equate one or the other to a 75mm on 645? How much difference is there really between the 2 anyway? Yes, I know I'll get about 10 opinions from 8 people, but I'm asking anyway. :)

The biggest problem with comparing formats is when the formats have a different ratio, and you're comparing 4:5 vs 3:4. The diagonal of 56x41.5mm ("645" for some, but not all, 6x4.5cm cameras) is 70mm, so your 75mm is a "long normal" while my 80mm on my Mamiya is a "teensy bit longer normal." The diagonal for 96x121mm is 154mm, so 150mm is a teensy bit "short" normal for 4x5.

Of course, some folks don't think along the diagonal. By using several formats, it seems I like to compare along the long dimension of the film, so for me, the comparison between 35mm, 645 and 4x5 is 36mm vs. 56mm vs. 121mm. In each case, as it happens, my preferred wide angle is just about the same fl as the long dimension (35mm on 35mm, 55mm on 645, 120mm on 4x5).

All that boils down to a 150mm on 4x5 being closer to your 75mm on 645 than a 135 would, and a 180mm probably is too close to your 210, unless you really want just a wee bit wider.

Confused less or more? More? Well, then, my work here is done...:rolleyes:

Drew

Ken Lee
1-Aug-2008, 10:20
If you plan to shoot images close to 1:1, then the 135mm lens will require less bellows draw than the 150mm lens. At 1:1, the difference will 30mm, over an inch.

Winger
1-Aug-2008, 10:43
I probably should have added that I shoot mostly landscapes when the weather is good and the occasional still life when the weather is bad.
What I'm getting is that there won't be a huge difference between 135mm and 150mm, but that I might get more movements with the 150mm?
I already know that I like slightly different focal lengths in different formats, so I can't quite go by that. But there's this tree root system that I shot with my 645 / 75mm that I'd like to reshoot with the 4x5. I tried with the 210mm, but I can't back up far enough to get enough in the frame. I also like to shoot in the woods where I usually need a shorter focal length.
So I guess the upshot is that I'll sorta look for both, but I'm thinking more the 135mm for now.
Thank you!

Bill_1856
1-Aug-2008, 10:59
Using a 135 gives you more negative for cropping, as well a wider view when you need it.

Winger
1-Aug-2008, 11:07
Using a 135 gives you more negative for cropping, as well a wider view when you need it.

Yeah, good point and another reason I'm leaning that way.

Bruce Watson
1-Aug-2008, 11:15
I've been watching this stuff for years now. Not that I'm looking for anything for myself; I'm pretty much done buying lenses. Rather, it's because I'm interested in the psychology of how people approach buying lenses.

It seems that people either favor closer spacing or wider spacing. Two spacings that have good followings are 1) 110mm, 150mm, 240mm (roughly 15 degree angle-of-view spacing), and 2) 90mm, 135mm, 210mm (roughly 20 degrees). Don't know why -- both seem to work just fine. Depends on how you see, how you work, what makes you comfortable I suppose.

As to 135 vs. 150, you are right that there's not much difference. The angle-of-view for each, along the 5 inch axis of 4x5 film, is 50.4 degrees and 45.9 degrees respectively. Or a difference of 4.5 degrees. Not a lot.

OTHO, the image circles are more significantly different. For the same design, you'll get more coverage from a 150mm lens. Unfortunately in this size range that can be significant. All I can tell you about that is that I've never run out of coverage with my Sironar-S 150mm lens.

Really, it's whatever makes you most comfortable.

Ron Marshall
1-Aug-2008, 11:19
You would get more image circle with most 150s, but most 135s will have more than enough for landscape and still-life.

But, it's always nice to have the extra front rise for shots of tall trees etc.

Ole Tjugen
1-Aug-2008, 13:50
I have both, but I usually end up using either a 150mm or a 120mm. The 135mm is just a little "too inbetween", unless I have a very good reason to use that particular lens independent of focal length.

I perfer even tighter spacing: 47, 65, 75, 90, 120, (135), 150, (165), 180, 210, 240, 300, 355, ...

Scott Rosenberg
1-Aug-2008, 13:57
i recently rebuilt my entire lens kit replacing a 110 and 150 with a 135. i was pretty skeptical at first, but the 135 is working BRILLIANTLY. really, i wish i would have made the change sooner. it's a fantastic focal length... if i could only carry one lens, the 135 would be it.

Ron Marshall
1-Aug-2008, 16:32
I have both, but I usually end up using either a 150mm or a 120mm. The 135mm is just a little "too inbetween", unless I have a very good reason to use that particular lens independent of focal length.

I perfer even tighter spacing: 47, 65, 75, 90, 120, (135), 150, (165), 180, 210, 240, 300, 355, ...

Ole, soon it will be easier just to list the focal lengths you are missing!

John Kasaian
1-Aug-2008, 17:39
I'd go with a 120MM ---more "wide" for your buck! ;)
There just isn't a whole lot of difference between a 210 and a 150 IMHO.

BrianShaw
1-Aug-2008, 18:31
if i could only carry one lens, the 135 would be it.

Ditto (except I would capitalize the "i"). :)

neil poulsen
1-Aug-2008, 20:20
How do you like the 210mm? Would you like to exchange the 210mm for something "a little wider?"

goodfood
1-Aug-2008, 20:45
I have one 135mm and two 150mm. I don't know why i always put the 135mm on the camera most of the time. I like it.

IanG
2-Aug-2008, 05:57
Over the years I've always preferred a 150mm for 5x4 work, as my normal lens. I also use a 90mm and a 65mm, and recently began using a 210mm.

However for hand-held work with a Speed/Crown Graphic I find a 135mm more practical.

Ian

Geert
2-Aug-2008, 06:44
I almost exlusively use 210mm and 120mm on 4x5" format.
I'd suggest you go for the 135 if that's the only choice you have besides 150.

G

Winger
2-Aug-2008, 08:06
How do you like the 210mm? Would you like to exchange the 210mm for something "a little wider?"
Not at this time, but I have a 105mm I'd trade. I keep going back and forth between 135 and 150, but today I'm leaning towards 135. I do want to use movements, but I don't know that I'll use extreme ones.

Ernest Purdum
2-Aug-2008, 08:24
Whether 135 or 150 is not all that important as long as both have enough image circle. If the 135 is an f4.5 type, that leaves insufficient room for use of your movements. Some 150's are inadequate, too.

Focal length choice is a very personal matter. There is a happy aspect, though. If you buy used, and find out it is a little wide or a little long, you should be able to sell it and consider any loss as cheap rent. Who knows, you might even make a profit.

cjbroadbent
2-Aug-2008, 09:53
....Focal length choice is a very personal matter.....
And usually boils down to how near or how far you want the viewer to feel he is from the subject. The bee in my bonnet tells me to use 120 or 135mm on 10x12 (4x5) - like using a 35mm on 24x36 - where the focal length equals the longest side of the film. The subject gets to show off it's own perspective and thus gives clues to the viewer about where he is. It's hard to model the subject with a 150mm lens or longer. Moving the camera up or down doesn't change thing much, The subject comes out plain vanilla and lacks what I call tangibility. Though , as Ernest wisely says, it's a very personal matter.

Ron Marshall
2-Aug-2008, 10:11
i recently rebuilt my entire lens kit replacing a 110 and 150 with a 135. i was pretty skeptical at first, but the 135 is working BRILLIANTLY. really, i wish i would have made the change sooner. it's a fantastic focal length... if i could only carry one lens, the 135 would be it.

I made the same change last year and it has worked out just as well for me. 90-135-200 is the right combination for what I like to shoot and how I like to shoot it!

neil poulsen
2-Aug-2008, 10:38
Ernest makes a good point about buying used. (I have quite a few lenses, and I've never bought new.)

I've not used a 135mm, but some people find it a good solution. They're also reasonably priced.

If it were me, I'd be heading towards a 120mm, 121mm, or a 125mm super-wide that would provide all the movements one could want. It's sort of, if you need a wide-angle, get a wide-angle. The focal lengths aren't too much different from 135mm, but the available movement is huge. The 121mm is an older style, single-coated Schneider that Ansel Adams used a lot. (I have a 121mm.) The 125mm is made by Fuji, and the first was made by all manufactures.

john borrelli
29-Aug-2008, 09:02
Recently I was trying to decide on the purchase of either a 240mm lens or a 300mm lens.

I went out to do some photography with the 150mm I owned. I set up my camera for the 150mm, then took out my composing card with a string that had two focal lengths marked off 240mm and 300mm. I then looked to see the different compositions possible through the card. After doing this at some of my favorite locations, the difference between the two focal lengths was much less abstract, so it became an easier decision that the 300 would be more useful for me.

You might want to give this a try if you are having a difficult time deciding which focal length would be best for you.

Hany Aziz
2-Sep-2008, 16:37
Go for 135 mm, it is one sweet focal length, a gentle "wide normal". If I had to use only one lens then the 135 would be it.

Sincerely,

Hany.

sparq
2-Sep-2008, 17:55
Whenever I am limited to a single lens for landscapes, it is a 5.6/135 Symmar-S.

Colin Corneau
2-Sep-2008, 18:04
A general rule of thumb is that in 4x5 format, you divide the focal length by 3 to get an approximate equivalent in 35mm format.

If that makes it any easier....it did for me.

Eric James
2-Sep-2008, 18:31
A 135 and a 210 is a nice two lens landscape set; a 150 and 210 is a bit cramped. I suppose much depends on what your future holds - will there be a 3rd lens? Scott R. is a brave man, swapping a 110 and a 150 for a 135. I can see myself letting my 110 go, but the 150 is my most used focal length for landscapes. Google: "thalmann cold dead hands".

Allen in Montreal
2-Sep-2008, 21:35
but how do I decide whether to look for a 135mm or a 150mm? I don't really have the money to get both and see.......

Can you rent both for one day? Play with them on the same subject, shoot a few sheets, return the lenses, soup the film and digest the results?

One of my best friends (who is now out of LF) is a driven and unbelievably talented photographer. Many of my favorite images from his work were done on the 135. It was his "go to' lens.

I on the other hand did not enjoy it when I played with his 135 and settled on a 110 ( I actually preferred the 120 but dumped a Nikon 120 SW for a Symmar 110 for size).

So I guess that means given the caliber of his work vs mine, you should get the 135! :)

Lightbender
4-Sep-2008, 00:57
For some reason, 135's tend to go for a premium over 150's of the same lens type, even though you get more coverage with a 150 and are more like;y to be in the center of the sharp coverage. WEIRD, but i myself do not have a lens in this focal range, and if I was to get one i would buy a 135. WEIRDER

Winger
4-Sep-2008, 05:58
Update! I got a 135. I haven't used it much, yet, but it gave me enough field of view for one shot I wanted. I need to practice with movements anyway, so then I'll see how much I get with it. I also think that 135 and 210 is a better spread than 150 and 210.