Best Road into Chaco Canyon

[John Hennessy]

It has been years since I have been to Chaco Canyon, Then I came in from US 550 in an rental RV and remember a washboard road that was not too bad. I just checked the NP website for Chaco and, despite have some facilities for RV's, they mentioned that RV's are not "recommended" on the roads into it.

One difference is that now now I have my own RV (a small, high MPG Mercedes Sprinter based C class) which has been known to lose various parts on washboard roads shorter than the one into Chaco.

So my question is: are the county roads into Chaco about as always and the NPS being its usual over-cautious self or have the roads gone to hell in the last few years?

Thanks.

[Kirk Gittings]

John,

The road in fro the Nageezi side is the only "official" entrance these days. It is the best maintained but its current state is hard to predict. After years of getting my teeth rattled out of my jaw, I learned how to drive washboards from the locals.....at about 50 mph they smooth right out.

[steve simmons]

Is the road up from the south still open?

steve simmons

[John Hennessy]

Thanks Kirk

[Bruce Schultz]

The road from the south was open a little over a year ago.
Just be aware that the road can get dicey. Attached is an example of what my vehicle looked like after driving that road when it's covered with snow and mud. We didn't see another vehicle for 40 miles.

[Kirk Keyes]

My parents drove thier 30 ft motorhome in from the Nageezi side in 2005 and they had no problems. My wife and I were in a Jeep Grand Cherokee and it took them about 20 minutes longer to get there than we did. But nothing fell off the RV.

I took the road to the SW out (which goes past Khin Klitzen ruin) and comes out near the Bisti Badlands - it was not a road for big RVs. It was not really, really bad, but I'd still take the main entrance in an RV.

[Toyon]

John,
I learned how to drive washboards from the locals.....at about 50 mph they smooth right out.

They may be smoother inside, due to resonance frequencies, but it's hell on your suspension.

[EdWorkman]

Say I just noticed a Sprinter at Grand Canyon and it occurred to me how handy all that headroom would be when changing film etc.
So
What do you get for MPG????

[John Hennessy]

Ed,

My RV is a Itasca Navion (a Winnebago by another name) and it gets 15 to 20 miles/gal of diesel. Sprinter-based class B RVs can do somewhat better than that. There is plenty of headroom but I usually sit down to change film!

[John Berry]

They may be smoother inside, due to resonance frequencies, but it's hell on your suspension. I have 210,000 on a 98 Dakota, that has at leas 30,000 on logging roads. Kirk is right, it is smoother. As a heavy duty mechanic, I just checked not too long ago, thinking about wear, and was surprised to find everything still in good shape. Try it at 70, it gets real smooth if you can't get to the bottom of the hole, ... till you get to the washboards at a curve. That'll cinch yer drawstring.

[Kirk Gittings]

John, Yeah, those curves will make you sweat. I've noticed my passengers with white knuckle grips on the frame. I don't do this once a week but maybe twice a year on various SUV's or small pickups. It doesn't seem to hurt my suspension much. I drive vehicles into the ground with usually 200,000 plus miles and no suspension problems other than shock replacement about halfway through those miles.

[Wayne]

I can tell you how the road is after tomorrow, though I may not be back to internet for quite some time. Its been dry so it should be nice and hard.

Has anyone camped near, but outside the boundaries of Chaco? I'm not much for campgrounds but I may want to hang around a few days. My New Mexico Gazeteer shows the surrounding land is Navaho Rez, but I'm pretty sure thats wrong.

I'll probably regret that I dont have my 4x5 with me, huh...;)


Wayne

[Michael Jones]

They may be smoother inside, due to resonance frequencies, but it's hell on your suspension.

Yes, that's true. But the last time I did, I rented a Cadillac from Hertz and didn't care. And the faster you go, the less you feel it.

Mike

[Kirk Gittings]

I can tell you how the road is after tomorrow, though I may not be back to internet for quite some time. Its been dry so it should be nice and hard.

Has anyone camped near, but outside the boundaries of Chaco? I'm not much for campgrounds but I may want to hang around a few days. My New Mexico Gazeteer shows the surrounding land is Navaho Rez, but I'm pretty sure thats wrong.

I'll probably regret that I dont have my 4x5 with me, huh...;)


Wayne

All of the surrounding land is Navaho reservation and I would not camp outside the park. You will certainly miss your 4x5 IMO.

[Wayne]

The park told me it is checkerboard ownership, which means about the same-I'm not going to camp there without knowing if I'm on public land or not (and it means all my maps are wrong, not surprisingly). Since I'm waylaid in Santa Fe for another day or two with probable food poisoning anyway, maybe I can scrounge up a better map of the surroundings.

Wayne

[Chauncey Walden]

Wayne, stay in the campground. Explaining (arguing?) to some Navajos the finer points of checkerboard ownership may be task you won't really want to undertake. Besides, there is a nice ruin in the campground which is great for early morning shots!

[Kirk Keyes]

Besides, there is a nice ruin in the campground which is great for early morning shots!

Get up early and be at the gate when the ranger opens it. Check with the Park Headquarters and see what time they open the road. (They opened it at about 6:40 when I was there in October a few years ago.)

[Nathan Potter]

Wayne, I go there often, and not quite all of the surrounding land is indian reservation - but you'll not be able to identify what isn't - it's just a semi desert landscape of indeterminate ownership. I've camped (slept in my 4 runner overnite) in the Da-Na-Zin wilderness some 20 miles north of the Park by pulling off into an Arroyo. I've not been bothered by anyone while doing this. The road in from Nageezi is fine even for a passenger vehicle but due to an occasional giant pothole I wouldn't recommend high speed to reduce the washboard effect. A chance snowstorm or heavy rain could make it messy.

Nate Potter, Austin TX.

[Kirk Gittings]

I can't find all my old topo maps of Chaco, but when I worked a summer on archaeological surveys at Chaco back when I was an undergraduate, I am pretty sure that all of the immediately surrounding land of the main park (not including the outliers) was all Navajo. Regardless, I would not take the chance of camping outside the park. The Navajos are much less tolerant of trespassing than when I was a kid, and I don't blame them. Respect.

Regarding the high speed......those of you who have been to the workshops that Steve Simmons and I used to do there for the Santa Fe Photographic Workshops, know my driving habits. I grew up up in New Mexico on roads like these and am quite comfortable driving them fast enough to smooth out the washboards. But I never suggested this technique in wet weather. In my 60 or so trips to Chaco over the years, weather has led me to some very challenging (and life threatening a few times) adventures and weather this time of year is pretty unpredictable. So motor on at the level you feel safe.

[Wayne]

I got all the ownership info I needed from BLM, and it looks like there are some possibilities near by though not many. I will gauge the situation as I find it, and will not camp anywhere near places I expect local residents to come by,and I will leave if any problems arise. I'm pretty good at avoiding problems (with one exception), as I really dont want problems. Problems suck. But I have my dog with me and camping in campgrounds with a dog is a PIA for myself and other campers, and I prefer solitude. Because of the dog I will only be able to do the backcountry hikes in Chaco, but I'm here mostly for hiking anyway.

I just spent $500 on new struts last week so I wont be doing 50...and I'm in no hurry, I've got supplies for at least a few days. I might only spend a day at Chaco on this trip, then head further north where nobody will be bothered by me...

I will now mention my one exception: I was at the south side of the mouth of the Hoh River on the Hoh Reservation (Olympic Peninsula) last fall, and foolishly followed some obviously oblivious tourist types past a NO Trespassing sign onto the beach. I was able to justify it somehow in my mind, feebly, probably because the surf was crashing just a few feet away and eroded my common sense which I usually have a lot of. I never follow idiots, and this time I did. Well as I walked back to my car I saw this truck pull up and talk briefly to other people who were leaving ahead of me. The truck left, and I sensed something amiss (having seen the beach, my common sense was coming back) and I quickened my step. Just as I arrived at my vehicle the truck returned and an extremely angry native man yelled "If your dog ever shits on my beach again, I'm gonna shoot him. Now get the fuck otta here"!! And there was no doubt in my mind that he was capable of following through on his threat. I said nothing because this guy was obviously a loose cannon, nodded my head and got in my car and he tore away. I felt pretty stupid, because it went against my normal good judgment to go out there in the first place. Lesson learned.






Wayne

[Kirk Keyes]

Washington doesn't have public access to all ocean beaches. You should come to Oregon and spend your money here - The entire Oregon Coast is open to the public.

But please, if you come to Oregon, do pick up after your dog...

[Wayne]

Yup, I am a former resident and DNR employee and know that. It was the most idiotic thing I've ever done, but thought I should mention it for the benefit of others because I know a lot of people photograph the coast. I was doing some other work and didnt give photographer's a bad name, just people in general.

There is park access on the north side of the river. I highly recommend it, as this fellow wasn't joking. Its one of only 2 times in my life where I felt in imminent danger of being hurt.


Wayne

[steve simmons]

Kirk has shown me on several occasions that driving a washboard road at 50-60mph does indeed smooth them out. I have tried to get to that speed myself and don't have the -------- to actually do it. Driving at that speed certainly does make stopping quickly or going around a curve an adventure. I would absolutely not drive that way if the road were wet, damp, or muddy. Then it would truly be an unsafe thing to do.

There is a campground at Chaco. I have stayed several times and generally sleep out under the bazillion stars. It is an amazing experience. I agree with Kirk, don't just pull off the road and camp. It might not be safe and the land may belong to someone else who may not appreciate your trespassing.

steve simmons