Had your organs done, anyone? Leaks?

[svlindbe]

I was searching the net for possible material for camera bellows, and ran across information from Steve's Piano Service, who also supply parts for "pump organs". I'm a little puzzled as to which organs we talk about here - the topics of 70% of spam mail these days or musical instruments.

Anyway, http://www.stevespianoservice.com/player.htm shows this description of a 0,005 inch thin, rubberized fabric: "Nylon Sheeting Rubberized Cloth- Coated with natural rubber 55 inches wide and approx. .005 thick. Very thin-- Can sell half yards
very flexible, very durable. Also, can be used to rebuild camera bellows.
Must use PVC glue SH387 see down the page DA1046 $ 29.00 / yd. np"

Apparently, this cloth is used to make airtight bellows for organs. Would it be suitable for camera bellows, as they mention? Is this about the same as Porter's blackout material, or maybe even exactly the same? Has anyone tried it? Would PVC glue be wise to use for our purposes?:rolleyes:

Have a blessed Easter, every one of you!
S

[David A. Goldfarb]

Camera Bellows UK certainly makes other kinds of bellows for things like organs, blowers, and flexible shields for machinery, so there's no reason there might not be some materials used in common.

[Tom Perkins]

I have had this problem, but solved it with a visit to the urologist.

[Glenn Thoreson]

I would double check to see if natural rubber will stand up to UV light. Sunlight has an adverse effect on natural rubber if it doesn't contain inhibitors. Rots it.

[svlindbe]

I would double check to see if natural rubber will stand up to UV light. Sunlight has an adverse effect on natural rubber if it doesn't contain inhibitors. Rots it.

Some recommend the use of rubbers only where the sun don't shine :-)

To be more serious: If a rubberized cloth is used as internal lining of the bellows, it wouldn't see much sunlight. What are the experiences of you who used blackout cloth in bellows in terms of durability/aging properties?

Has anyone ever tried to take apart one of these huge bellows from a repro camera, so you have external and internal layers + stiffeners - if they generally are made that way? Is it possible to salvage the material and reuse it for a smaller bellows?
Svein

[erie patsellis]

Some recommend the use of rubbers only where the sun don't shine :-)

To be more serious: If a rubberized cloth is used as internal lining of the bellows, it wouldn't see much sunlight. What are the experiences of you who used blackout cloth in bellows in terms of durability/aging properties?

Has anyone ever tried to take apart one of these huge bellows from a repro camera, so you have external and internal layers + stiffeners - if they generally are made that way? Is it possible to salvage the material and reuse it for a smaller bellows?
Svein
No, but the do make a nice, simple to build 20x24 camera!

erie

[walter23]

I tried making a trial fold with porters darkroom cloth, some generic thin cardboard, and 3M 77 spray adhesive, just a couple of days ago. It seems like it will work fine, though I am going to do a trial with contact cement (disadvantage: instant fixation, can't be repositioned) before I start, as my only reservation is that it's possible to peel the layers apart. I think the 3M will work fine, but I'd ideally like something that tears the fabric before separating.

My only reservations for using porters darkroom cloth for both layers are that it isn't as attractive as leather, and that it's a bit shiny for a liner and may give some unwanted reflections under the right circumstances. I may look for a suitable liner material, but I'm kind of sick of putting this project off for want of materials. I may just suck it up and build a damned belows this weekend. The porters seems like it will be stiff enough in a double layer with stiffeners, which was one of my concerns as it is fairly thin.

One other material to consider is bonded leather used for bookbinding (I saw something called "taratan II" which looked promising) as well as various bookbinding fabrics.

[athanasius80]

There's a variety of different rubber cloths used in pump organ and player piano restoration. I would consult with restorers in those fields because sometimes you just need to find a sample to see if it'll work.

[ic-racer]

For the outside of the bellows, it was pointed out to me that bookbinding cloth could be used. It has a nice texture and is very thin.

If I did another bellows, I would try this stuff for the outside:
( http://www.hollanders.com/supplies/BrowseSubCategory.aspx?CategoryID=f0ca807c-ebac-4530-bd5d-0b3fc3e308ff )


That .008" Bellows material seems like another good option for the inner layer. Someone who is building a bellows should get some and check it out. It would be good to have a sticky thread to keep all this bellows building info.

[big_ben_blue]

If I did another bellows, I would try this stuff for the outside:
( http://www.hollanders.com/supplies/BrowseSubCategory.aspx?CategoryID=f0ca807c-ebac-4530-bd5d-0b3fc3e308ff )


Theoretically, it looks like a nice alternative; but did you notice the size? 21 x 24 inches make only for a midget sized bellows.

Somewhere over the rainbow, err... mean over at fleahbay..., some fellow was selling a restored Carlton 11x14 folder a couple of months ago (went for a good fortune), and the new bellows were described to have been made of Hypalon (yup, the stuff they make inflatables out of). It doesn't appear to be an over-the-counter product though for regular Joe's like us :rolleyes:.

[walter23]

Theoretically, it looks like a nice alternative; but did you notice the size? 21 x 24 inches make only for a midget sized bellows.

Somewhere over the rainbow, err... mean over at fleahbay..., some fellow was selling a restored Carlton 11x14 folder a couple of months ago (went for a good fortune), and the new bellows were described to have been made of Hypalon (yup, the stuff they make inflatables out of). It doesn't appear to be an over-the-counter product though for regular Joe's like us :rolleyes:.

I found a supplier that sells it in 48" rolls (and shorter cuts from same), but I can't remember what the supplier was right now.

[big_ben_blue]

I found a supplier that sells it in 48" rolls (and shorter cuts from same), but I can't remember what the supplier was right now.



OK, let me get this straight... you CAN remember that the answer to the deleted question was dreiundzwanzig, but you CAN'T remember the supplier to the bellows material? WRONG ANSWER!!! You are stretching my patience, cowboy, and that's not a wise move if ya know what I mean, eh! Do I have sent Luigi for a physiotherapy session to refresh your memory? He's also very good with getting the organs done. I WANT A BETTER ANSWER, AND I WANT IT NOW. So for the last time: WHO IS YOUR [I]/*bleep*/ SUPPLIER?

[/INTERROGATION_MODE=OFF]
:D :D :D (I should really watch fewer movies)

[ic-racer]

Theoretically, it looks like a nice alternative; but did you notice the size? 21 x 24 inches make only for a midget sized bellows.


I see that now.

Here is another place that sells larger pieces, but the thickness is not indicated. http://www.covermaterial.com/leather.html

[big_ben_blue]

I see that now.

Here is another place that sells larger pieces, but the thickness is not indicated. http://www.covermaterial.com/leather.html

We should come up with a comprehensive list of suppliers one day - seemingly everyone needs a source for bellows material someday.

BTW, there's a small/midsized bookbinding operation here in my town - I have to pay them a visit to find out more soonish (they hinted to being open to the idea of selling the occasional amount to the public).