View Full Version : Iran=No trip regulations
Well I'm off for Istanbul for a few days and then a week or so in Iran in time for the Persian New Year (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norouz) (Spring Equinox) I'll be taking a handheld 4x5 and I hope to have a chance to visit Isfahan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isfahan_(city)), though most of the country shuts down for 2 weeks, and see if I can come close to some of Bill Zorn's photos (http://www.billzorn.com/iran/asleep_yazd.shtml).
Oh, guess what? No tripod restrictions at public monuments, and no laws prohibiting US travel as is the case for Cuba.
If you're interested, here (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23262513/) are some tours (http://www.intrepidtravel.com/trips/ESN)
Nathan Potter
10-Mar-2008, 19:47
Cyrus, you're right. My neighbors (US citizens) travel regularly to Iran to visit their relatives. I was there in the 1950s' as a US intelligence officer and found it a most beautiful place for photography. Even today it's not the kind of hassle you'll sometimes find setting up a tripod in Paris or even the US.
Nate Potter
Cyrus, you're right. My neighbors (US citizens) travel regularly to Iran to visit their relatives. I was there in the 1950s' as a US intelligence officer and found it a most beautiful place for photography. Even today it's not the kind of hassle you'll sometimes find setting up a tripod in Paris or even the US.
Nate Potter
Paris! Forget about it! Neat thing about iran is that I've never seen another LF photographer there. Its virgin territory, LF wise.
roteague
10-Mar-2008, 22:29
I work with someone from Iran, how is a very nice person. He still travels there, and his parents, who live in Iran, travel here. Personally, I would love to visit there someday.
Ron Marshall
10-Mar-2008, 23:50
No tripod restrictions at public monuments
here (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23262513/) are some tours (http://www.intrepidtravel.com/trips/ESN)
Do you know if one must pay fees to photograph at any of the monuments/tourist sites, if they are deemed to be a professional?
I ask because a friend had to pay a couple of hundred a day at Angkor Wat, to use his 4x5, while I did not when I was there with a 35mm and a tripod.
Please post some of your shots when you get back.
Do you know if one must pay fees to photograph at any of the monuments/tourist sites, if they are deemed to be a professional?
I ask because a friend had to pay a couple of hundred a day at Angkor Wat, to use his 4x5, while I did not when I was there with a 35mm and a tripod.
Please post some of your shots when you get back.
Nope. All you pay is the usual entrance fee if there is one. heres a med format shot from 2 yrs ago. (They're making nukes!)
Iran may be one of those few countries where a large format camera may save you trouble.
You do not want to be identified as a photojournalist. A canadian photojournalist was recently beaten to death in jail for taking pictures.
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2003/07/16/kazemi_030716.html
It is interesting given the heat of the political rhetoric, that Americans would go to Iran at all
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_920.html
Are the risks overstated?
Regards
Bill
Jiri Vasina
11-Mar-2008, 11:07
Yes, for most westernes the risks are overstated. I don't know about Americans, it might be worse than for others (I'd suppose). I have two friends that have been in Iran in the past 4 years (separately), one of them with his wife. Both said it's beautiful, welcome and friendly country. They did not have any problems traveling there.
Ron Marshall
11-Mar-2008, 12:19
Thanks for the info Cyrus. Would it be difficult for someone who doesn't speak Farsi to get around? Is is possible/avisable to travel independently, or should one go with prebooked hotels?
I guess taking photos of women in public is not a good idea?
It is interesting given the heat of the political rhetoric, that Americans would go to Iran at all
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_920.html
Are the risks overstated?
Regards
Bill
IMHO That's actually what makes travelling anywhere interesting: comparing pre-conceptions and realities. If you read any of the many travelogues posted on the web by people (american in particular) who have actually gone to Iran, they all say the 4 same things:
1- Were warned by friends/relatives not to go.
2- Once arrived, were overwhelmed by common hospitality (some to the point of being annoyed) and discovery that Iranians actually LIKE Americans and don't confuse the people of the US with the government.
3- Expressions of frustration at the realization of the total mismatch between previous perceptions and newly-discovered realities
4- Discovery that the biggest threat to them in Iran is the traffic.
Samples:
Biking across Iran (http://www.travelblog.org/Middle-East/Iran/West/Esfahan/blog-76176.html)
Conde Nast magazine (http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Base/1406/articles2.html)
Peter & Anne Smith of Sheffield, Yorkshire, are gobsmaked (http://thesmithsozblog.blogspot.com/2007_11_16_archive.html)
Travel & Leisure (http://www.travelandleisure.com/articles/iran/?page=2)
Keith literally carried a cross across Iran (http://www.kw.org/report_iran.htm)
So did another fellow (http://www.blessitt.com/iran_journey.html) (Jesus freak thing must be a trend)
Try Sunny Iran (http://www.csmonitor.com/durable/1998/06/29/fp6s2-csm.htm)
Marie Javins overland from Pakistan to Turkey (http://members.aol.com/mjavins/iranphoto.htm)
Rick & Kathy (http://www.oldflutes.com/Kathy&Rick/irantrip/irantrip2index.htm)
Pierre Flener (http://user.it.uu.se/~pierref/travel/iran.guide.html#impr):
A whole bunch of travel articles (http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Base/1406/article.html) mostly from UK/US papers
More... (http://www.dmoz.org/Recreation/Travel/Travelogues/Middle_East/Iran/)
And there are the few who are shocked to discover that yes, it snows heavily in Iran and people like to ski there on some pretty good slopes too (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYrA1RCFeAE)
As for the US State Department warning, I personally pay it no heed because it is political. A whole mess of tourists were machine gunned outside a temple in the Egyptian tourist resort of Luxor. Nothing like that has ever happened in Iran-- and yet the US STate Department travel warning about Egypt is hardly as hyped.
Thanks for the info Cyrus. Would it be difficult for someone who doesn't speak Farsi to get around? Is is possible/avisable to travel independently, or should one go with prebooked hotels?
I don't stay at hotels nor speak English there so I can't judge.
BUT you'd be surprised how many people speak English -- thanks to satellite tv. Especially the kids. (English is taught in highschools as a second language too -- but lets face it, Spanish is taught in the US as a second language, and how many of you actually speak Spanish? Didn't think so!)
But English isn't spoken nearly as much as in a European country. That's why going with a tour is really the best (at least for the first visit) Tours also get the best hotel rates -- which can be pricey. See the Abbasi Hotel in Isfahan.
I guess taking photos of women in public is not a good idea?
Depends on the woman!
You really shouldn't fall for the notion that Iranian women are down-trodden oppressed little things hiding behind burkas. Even the one who is wearing the traditional "chador" -- if not a doctor or lawyer -- is still actually the supreme ruler of the household and pushes her husband around with an iron fist - believe me! -- and isn't going to appreciate it if you shove a camera in her face.
Generally, as a matter of Persian politeness (which can be very elaborate) it is not a good idea to be overly familiar with a woman that you haven't been properly introduced to. But if you happen to be invited to dinner by random strangers (which is quite likely) you can ask to take photos, which is almost always OK.
Oh, and PS - you haven't seen anything until you've seen a 4-foot golden globe encrusted with jewels (http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Base/1406/jewel/imperialjewels.html) -- which was made just because they happened to have too many jewels lying around. Or rubies and emeralds the size of your freakin' fist.
Is the experience of Americans with Persian roots or Europeans representative enough to say that Iran is safe for common American tourists that do not have any family/friends/business connections there?
Ole Tjugen
11-Mar-2008, 15:38
Is the experience of Americans with Persian roots or Europeans representative enough to say that Iran is safe for common American tourists that do not have any family/friends/business connections there?
No.
But on the other hand - Iran has been civilised for well over 8000 years. It's a nice contry. ;)
Is the experience of Americans with Persian roots or Europeans representative enough to say that Iran is safe for common American tourists that do not have any family/friends/business connections there?
More than a few of the articles/blogs I listed were written by Americans in Iran (http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/getaways/111998/iran19.html).
There are more (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/travel/destinations/iran071998.htm)
My experience: Iranians LIKE Americans - more so than other visitors. People are busy trying to pay rent and send their kids to good universities - they've mostly got better things to do than care where you come from.
But you can always just ask on the LonelyPlanet (http://www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntree/thread.jspa?threadID=1541215) forum
(Personally, other than the traffic, I think the most dangerous thing in Iran is the little cream puff pastries (http://www.peyman.org/images/image-070522203034.jpg) with REAL creme that they have there (http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/1522/oost04shirini2lg.jpg) -- once you start eating, you can't stop. I'm coming back with at least 5 new pounds.)
copake_ham
11-Mar-2008, 16:41
There was a very good article on an American traveling in Iran in The NY Times Travel Sectiion a few Sundays ago. [ http://travel.nytimes.com/2008/02/10/travel/10Iran.html?scp=1&sq=Travel+in+Iran&st=nyt ]
That writer agrees that generally no hassles at all for photographing historical sites, street scenes etc.
But you have to bring cash! USD's are fine (see the article).
Iran is on the US Treasury's OFAC* list and you will find a "block" on credit and debit cards from US financial institutions. This "block" extends to AmEx Traveler's Checks which are denominated in USD. So Iranian merchants apparently won't accept them.
Thomas Cook or similar Euro denominated traveler's cheques are probably okay. But I'd purchase them outside the US, perhaps while you're in Turkey.
*OFAC - Office of Financial Asset Control
There was a very good article on an American traveling in Iran in The NY Times Travel Sectiion a few Sundays ago. [ http://travel.nytimes.com/2008/02/10/travel/10Iran.html?scp=1&sq=Travel+in+Iran&st=nyt ]
That writer agrees that generally no hassles at all for photographing historical sites, street scenes etc.
But you have to bring cash! USD's are fine (see the article).
Iran is on the US Treasury's OFAC* list and you will find a "block" on credit and debit cards from US financial institutions. This "block" extends to AmEx Traveler's Checks which are denominated in USD. So Iranian merchants apparently won't accept them.
Thomas Cook or similar Euro denominated traveler's cheques are probably okay. But I'd purchase them outside the US, perhaps while you're in Turkey.
*OFAC - Office of Financial Asset Control
Oh yes that's MOSTLY true. New $20 or $100 bills used to be welcome - now Euros! Iranian carpet dealers, however, are not terribly upset about this. They all have a merchant credit card account based out of a company in Dubai or Qatar. However the OFAC rules also prevent you from even checking your bank account balance from an internet connection in Iran. THAT'LL SHOW EM!
By the way, if you want fantastic persian rugs, you can't go wrong by visiting there and picking up a few. There used to be a US embargo like Cuban cigars, but no more. I bought a rug there for $2000 -- saw the identical one at a US department store for $7000. Now I have more rugs than floor space.
Terence McDonagh
11-Mar-2008, 19:40
From what I read, Tehran is just like Albany:
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/03/another-prostitution-ring-busted-in.html
Just kidding . . . sorta.
Barry Trabitz
11-Mar-2008, 20:59
What about American tourists/photoggaphers who happen to be Jewish?
Is the experience of Americans with Persian roots or Europeans representative enough to say that Iran is safe for common American tourists that do not have any family/friends/business connections there?
No.
But on the other hand - Iran has been civilised for well over 8000 years. It's a nice contry. ;)
OK, let's not exaggerate - not even China has been civilized that long! In that part of the world, Greece began some time between 1700 and 1600 BC (Minoan/Mycenaean Kingdom) and Persia has been civilized "only" since the Median Empire (8th-7th century BC).
:)
roteague
11-Mar-2008, 22:23
What about American tourists/photoggaphers who happen to be Jewish?
From what I've read, Iran's Jewish population is the second largest in the Middle East, after Israel.
From what I read, Tehran is just like Albany:
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/03/another-prostitution-ring-busted-in.html
Just kidding . . . sorta.
AKI is a cheezy Italian news agency that repeats whatever "news" a particular Iranian Marxist dissident group feeds it. A lot of atrocity news -- then gets picked up an promoted by right-wing US blogs like gateway pundit. There's enough real atrocities that you don't need to resort to such sources! If you're going to travel to a member of the Axis of Evil, you'll have to develop a finer sense of political drama -- which I suppose makes the trip that much more interesting.
That said, if you want some sexy news from Iran...why not read about temporary marriage (http://www.newstatesman.com/200802070021)?
Zach In Israel
12-Mar-2008, 01:58
From what I've read, Iran's Jewish population is the second largest in the Middle East, after Israel.
Iran has a large Jewish population, and there are a lot of Iranian Jews here in Israel*. Many of them go back and forth to visit family etc from what I am told. You just have to change planes in Turkey or the like. That being said as an Israeli I would still be twitchy about going, even using a "clean" passport.
* Including our former and disgraced president.
OK, let's not exaggerate - not even China has been civilized that long! In that part of the world, Greece began some time between 1700 and 1600 BC (Minoan/Mycenaean Kingdom) and Persia has been civilized "only" since the Median Empire (8th-7th century BC).
:)
Archeologists have found 7000-year old wine in Iran (http://www.archaeology.org/9609/newsbriefs/wine.html) so if wine=civilization, then they have been civilized for at least 7000 years!
The world's first artificial eyeball (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article1415400.ece) was found Burtn City (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shahr-i_Sokhta) - 5000 years ago
(BTW: World's first electric battery (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baghdad_Battery)!)
The ziggurrat at Choga Zanbil (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chogha_Zanbil) was built in 1250BC - popular tourist destination btw.
They're digging up stuff all the time -- who knew about the other Great Wall (http://www.iranaffairs.com/iran_affairs/files/redsnake.pdf)?
(3 AM and I'm developing film...is this a sickness?)
I think the Medes are when a political entity called Iran ("Land of the Aryan") came about, but there was human civilization there before.
What about American tourists/photoggaphers who happen to be Jewish?
I'm not Jewish so I can't speak from first-hand experience, except that after 3000 years, Jews aren't exactly a rarity, and all the Iranian jews I know are pretty proud of being Iranian (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5367892.stm) (which has caused problems for them when they live in the US in LA or Long Island and prefer to speak Farsi instead of learning Hebrew etc.)
There remains a large enclave of Iranian Jews (http://www.sephardicstudies.org/iran.html) cannot be convinced to move to Israel (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/jul/12/israel.iran) - and some would rather move back home (http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1131043721479&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull) to Iran.
Visit the tomb of Daniel (http://www.pbase.com/howardbanwell/image/71112784) in Susa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susa), the shrine of Esther (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Esther-mordechai.jpg) & Mordechai in Hamedan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamadan), or one of the synogogues in Tehran.
I suppose that you can't travel there on an Israeli passport however they don't have diplomatic relations.
Again, most people in iran are busy going to the office or raising their kids too -- they don't have time to care where you're from.
ok-must finish packing no more breaks!
Archeologists have found 7000-year old wine in Iran (http://www.archaeology.org/9609/newsbriefs/wine.html) so if wine=civilization, then they have been civilized for at least 7000 years!
[...]
I think the Medes are when a political entity called Iran ("Land of the Aryan") came about, but there was human civilization there before.
Well, yes, human communities existed everywhere across that region since before prehistory ;), but when talking about being "civilized", as Ole put it, we are mostly talking about combination of two aspects: political entities AND written records. And that means organized society with written laws and regulations, the very basis of the distinction between being "civlized" and being "barbarian".
Besides, the purpose of the comparison here is to compare the two societies and 7th century BC is more than long enough for that particular purpose. If you keep sharpening the knife past a certain point, you'll start dulling it. :)
Well, yes, human communities existed everywhere across that region since before prehistory ;), but when talking about being "civilized", as Ole put it, we are mostly talking about combination of two aspects: political entities AND written records.
I think you'd enjoy a visit the ziggurrat at Chogha Zanbil (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choqa_Zanbil) built in 1250BC, beause you'd see both elements of civilization: written official government records are baked into the bricks that are used to make parts of the structure. This was a major city of the Elamite civilization (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elam) with its capital at Anshan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anshan_%28Persia%29) that goes back to about 3000 BC.
But frankly I don't buy the notion that laws and goverments make one civilized. Far from it! Wine, on the other hand...
Bye all!
Terence McDonagh
12-Mar-2008, 10:41
AKI is a cheezy Italian news agency that repeats whatever "news" a particular Iranian Marxist dissident group feeds it. A lot of atrocity news -- then gets picked up an promoted by right-wing US blogs like gateway pundit. There's enough real atrocities that you don't need to resort to such sources! If you're going to travel to a member of the Axis of Evil, you'll have to develop a finer sense of political drama -- which I suppose makes the trip that much more interesting.
That said, if you want some sexy news from Iran...why not read about temporary marriage (http://www.newstatesman.com/200802070021)?
Now that's a great idea. I've always said marriages would work better if they were an initial three-year contract that came up for renewel every year or two years after that.
I knew AKI is pretty bad. I was more impressed with the shear number of ladies. Makes American politicians seem even weaker.
Now that's a great idea. I've always said marriages would work better if they were an initial three-year contract that came up for renewel every year or two years after that.
Considering how many celebrity babies in Hollywood are being born with their mothers already divorced from their biological dads and married to the first in the long line of their stepfathers (sometimes even to the second), three years might seem like an eternity and overly constraining. :D
Ron Marshall
12-Mar-2008, 14:08
Considering how many celebrity babies in Hollywood are being born with their mothers already divorced from their biological dads and married to the first in the long line of their stepfathers (sometimes even to the second), three years might seem like an eternity and overly constraining. :D
For Hollywood, a three month contract would be more suitable.
jwaddison
12-Mar-2008, 17:16
I worked in Iran for a couple of months in 2000. Not only is there a large Jewish population, but also Christians. I was in a couple of restaurants with a large print of "The Last Supper" prominently displayed. Iran is also the home of the world's oldest monotheist religion, the Zoroastrians.
My understanding is that the Iranians, including the government, is tolerant of all religions as long as they don't try to convert Muslims. Doing that will land you in serious trouble.
I enjoyed my stay and the people. I only saw the north of the country, near the Caspian Sea.
I was going to bring home some caviar, but although plentiful was expensive. Instead I bought Saffron, which was plentiful and inexpensive.
Well, I am back and sad to say that my trip was a bust. Illness in the family (most members are well over 70 or 80) precluded me from travelling to Isfahan (http://www.bamjam.net/Iran/Esfahan.html), my intended target. However I left a camera, film, slightly damaged tripod and a few grafmatics there for future trips to lighten my load next time. I did manage to take a few MF shots and even fewer LF handheld 4x5 shots in/around Tehran, which is a modern metropolis (and so not terribly interesting) but we'll have to see how/if these shots ever come out since they may have been zapped to oblivion by all the airport security scanners. Normally this is not a problem but on the way back, at the newly-built Imam Khomeini airport, the security guard seemed genuinely flustered that I had not told him about the film in my bag before it got zapped. The young man said that he remembered getting some training about film and the zapper machine, but didn't know the details since he never expected to actually encounter any film, and why didn't I just take digital photos like everyone else or at least have the film developed in Tehran prior to departure? Oh well...
The young man said that he remembered getting some training about film and the zapper machine, but didn't know the details since he never expected to actually encounter any film, and why didn't I just take digital photos like everyone else or at least have the film developed in Tehran prior to departure? Oh well...
Now that's interesting! Did they all switched so quickly to the digital there? Or was the film photography so rare before?
Now that's interesting! Did they all switched so quickly to the digital there? Or was the film photography so rare before?
Film photography was not rare in Iran - Tehran university has one of the oldest photography departments in the world (started when a particular Shah caught the shutterbug (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=26277) in the mid 1800's)
Like everywhere else, they go nuts for the latest technology I guess, and electronic stuff is slightly cheaper there (closer to China & SE Asia, I guess) - laptops, digital cameras, etc. . I noticed that even the itinerant photographers who used to sell shots of tourists had switched to digital (printer powered by a battery.) One of them complimented me on my film camera and bemoaned the death of Polaroids. We spent a time chatting. A young cousin who was with me was left scratching his head about why anyone would still want to use film -- and black & white at that! The photographer and I just rolled our eyes at him and shook our heads. I suspect the feeling was mutual.
I noticed that even the itinerent photographers who used to sell shots of tourists had switched to digital (printer powered by a battery.)
.
Oh men, where is the world going...?
sorry it did not go as planned. sounds like it could have been great.
i want to go. next time maybe i could tag along?!?
cheers
eddie
Love to have you come along, Eddie. If we get enough people, maybe a LF photographers tour would be doable.
Robert Hall
1-Apr-2008, 09:50
IMHO That's actually what makes travelling anywhere interesting: comparing pre-conceptions and realities. If you read any of the many travelogues posted on the web by people (american in particular) who have actually gone to Iran, they all say the 4 same things:
1- Were warned by friends/relatives not to go.
2- Once arrived, were overwhelmed by common hospitality (some to the point of being annoyed) and discovery that Iranians actually LIKE Americans and don't confuse the people of the US with the government.
3- Expressions of frustration at the realization of the total mismatch between previous perceptions and newly-discovered realities
4- Discovery that the biggest threat to them in Iran is the traffic.
Just what I found last week in New Orleans. Very different than what I have been told and what I have seen on the TV. Very different.
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