Where do you buy your 32X40 mat board?

[Ben Hopson]

Up until now I have ordered custom cut mats from Light Impressions. I am in the process of buying a Fletcher 2100 mat cutter and will need to order 32X40 inch sheets of mat board in 25 sheet packages. Any recommendations for quality 4 and 8 ply mat board at good prices would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Ben

[Tri Tran]

Up until now I have ordered custom cut mats from Light Impressions. I am in the process of buying a Fletcher 2100 mat cutter and will need to order 32X40 inch sheets of mat board in 25 sheet packages. Any recommendations for quality 4 and 8 ply mat board at good prices would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Ben

Hi Ben,
www.valleymoulding.com .Last time I paid arounf $26 8 ply Crescent rag mat 32x40. Hope this helps.

[anchored]

Ben, I would suggest making an accessment of how many boards and other sundry mounting/matting products you might buy over a course of a year or so, and approach different companies and get price quotes based on that approximation. Savings can be substantial if you are able to order in sizable quantities (we order boards minimum quantities of 25, tapes and odds and ends in case quanties, etc.).

I would also suggest getting prices from both local and national companies. Some items (ie: glass) cannot be easily shipped... and on some items (such as mounting boards) the shipping costs can eat up any savings you might find by ordering via internet.

Most of our supplies are purchased through Cash Moulding Sales of Alabama.

http://www.cashmoulding.com/

[bsimison]

I've been using Archival Methods: http://www.archivalmethods.com/Product.cfm?categoryid=41&Productid=86

Their pack of 15 32x40 4-ply Museum Board is $179.95. Everything I've received from them is well-packed. No dinged corners.

[Jim Galli]

www.unitedmfrs.com

[BarryS]

Last time I bought my 100% rag mat at http://www.framingsupplies.com/index.html They had some great prices and you can combine 32x40 mat boards and archival foam core to fill a complete shipping box. So you can buy 25 mats or combine any number of mats with the equivalent width in foam core sheets to make sure you have a full shipping box. They pack the box with very thick and dense L-pieces that protect the corners and edges and everything arrived in pristine condition.

[darr]

Ben,

I am not familiar with where you are, but you might try a frame supplier that you can drive to. Shipping is not only expensive these days, but the boards can get corner damaged. I no longer buy the boards in bulk, but when I did I used a local frame supplier. As long as I purchased the same color in boards of 25, they sold them to me prepackaged. Just my .02 cents worth.

Darr

[Ben Hopson]

Thanks for all the input. Gives me a place to start looking.

Ben

[Mark Sawyer]

I would also suggest getting prices from both local and national companies. Some items (ie: glass) cannot be easily shipped... and on some items (such as mounting boards) the shipping costs can eat up any savings you might find by ordering via internet.

I searched the internet high and low, and found that after figuring shipping, the local art supply store (Sarnoff's) could beat them all at just over $12 a sheet for 4-ply museum board with a 10% discount if you buy a full box (25 sheets) and no shipping charges.

And it's nice to support a local business where I can always pick up a quick roll of linen tape, mat cutting blades, rag paper...

[Merg Ross]

Ben, you will love the Fletcher 2100! Be sure to order a squaring arm, you probably know that already. I purchased mine from United Mfg. about eight years ago; I think Jim mentioned them above.

[Merg Ross]

Ben, further to your question, here is another one to check out:

http://www.talasonline.com

[Ted Harris]

Another vote for Framing Supplies, I buy all my framing supplies from them except wood frames and glass.

[David Karp]

Hi Ben,
www.valleymoulding.com .Last time I paid arounf $26 8 ply Crescent rag mat 32x40. Hope this helps.

I use Valley Moulding too. Good source.

[v gese]

You might want to try Jayeness Moulding in Seattle. They are a wholesaler so you'll need to have a Wash business license to purchase from them. They have Bainbridge Artcare matboard (and glass, moulding, etc, everything else you'll need). They actually deliver to the Bremerton area once a week (for additional 10.00). There website is lousy (and they admit it needs work. www.jayeness.com) but you can give them a call and see if they can help you out with your framing needs. You'll love the Fletcher 2100; great mat cutter. Vance Gese

[Ben Hopson]

So many great recommendations. Thanks all!

The Fletcher 2100 I am getting does have the right squaring arm as well as measuring stops. From what I have read this will be a very good mat cutter.

Ben

[efanmatboard]

Up until now I have ordered custom cut mats from Light Impressions. I am in the process of buying a Fletcher 2100 mat cutter and will need to order 32X40 inch sheets of mat board in 25 sheet packages. Any recommendations for quality 4 and 8 ply mat board at good prices would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Ben

hi, Ben, I can supply you matboard, did you still need it?

[Jerry Bodine]

Check out www.documounts.com, they're in Portland Oregon and have a store (address per website) you could pick up your orders and save shipping $$$. I get all my framing supplies from them, they're really good to work with. I'm in Issaquah, WA.

[Michael Gordon]

Another plug for Valley Moulding. I also love the fact they do their own local deliveries at very reasonable rates. United Mfgrs. used to be a good supplier for me, but they never seem to have my items in stock and they closed their west coast warehouse. Shipping cost from NY on a box of 32x40 boards is quite high.

[MIke Sherck]

I buy Crescent at Hobby Lobby when they have 50% off deals -- usually at least once a month. Dirt cheap for the thinner stuff. If I need thicker board I go to a local frame shop which is happy to sell me sheets, but it costs a bit more. I don't use very much thicker than ordinary Crescent board, though.

Mike

[mrladewig]

Check out www.documounts.com, they're in Portland Oregon and have a store (address per website) you could pick up your orders and save shipping $$$. I get all my framing supplies from them, they're really good to work with. I'm in Issaquah, WA.

I used documounts for a series of precut mats for a show. The cost to have them cut mats for 11X14 or 10X15 in 16X20 was about $0.20 more than for me to just buy the board locally and I think the foam core cost less cut than for me to buy whole sheets and cut them myself. I was buying 32 mats at once, but I'd definitely order from them again.

[Ben Hopson]

Almost one year ago, after starting this thread I ordered a supply of Crescent Board and a few accessories for the Fletcher cutter from Framing Supplies. I have been very happy with the mat cutter.

Ben

[stawastawa]

With Documounts now closed... where are folks going in the Portland area?

[Tom Monego]

Blick Art Materials, free shipping over $59. I use framing Supplies for frames but their shipping costs are high, they are slightly less expensive for the board, the shipping cost over rides that. I generally buy 10 board at a time, the packing is very good.

[Darin Boville]

Dick Blick. Wait for a 20% off sale with free shipping. Stock up. They are a big outfit and are good about damage issues.

--Darin

[photonsoup]

I've found most university bookstores have a decent selection of full size mat boards in the art supplies. Usually at a better price than any other local source.

[Darin Boville]

Just checked and Dick Blick is having a sale now at $12.50 a board + free shipping (http://www.dickblick.com/items/13007-1026). If you see better prices elsewhere post them here.

--Darin

[brian mcweeney]

Hmmmm... It's not showing up at $12.50 a board. It's over $15. each.
Still looks like a great resource. Thanks.

[Darin Boville]

Hmmmm... It's not showing up at $12.50 a board. It's over $15. each.
Still looks like a great resource. Thanks.

Type in the 20% discount code. Orders over $79 ship free. Note, the quantity discount and code discount won't go together--you just get the bigger discount.

--Darin

[brian mcweeney]

Got it! Thanks for the good info.

[vinny]

Great deal! I wish I'd known about this 2 months ago. The best deal I could find (for alpharag arctare) was $14 something and $50+ shipping. I had them hand pick my order but still have been cutting around all the defects. Bainbridge quality has gone to hell.

Does this cresent stuff have the same finish on both sides?
I've used some rag board that had a logo embossed on the back and others that had a front/back texture difference.

[Darin Boville]

Great deal! I wish I'd known about this 2 months ago. The best deal I could find (for alpharag arctare) was $14 something and $50+ shipping. I had them hand pick my order but still have been cutting around all the defects. Bainbridge quality has gone to hell.

Does this cresent stuff have the same finish on both sides?
I've used some rag board that had a logo embossed on the back and others that had a front/back texture difference.

Finish is about the same on both sides--but double check to be sure. All the rag variations get confusing. HOWEVER, there are often marking on the back. Not only embossing but manufacturer codes, etc.

There is always some degree of edge damage or not quite really true 100& straight sides or right angle corners--always best to make your own cut. In my experience with Dick Blick they have been very good about real damage--smashed corners of boxes, etc. But please don't hound them over minor stuff--they may change their policy! :)

--Darin

[John Olsen]

Portland folks might want to try Daniel Smith in Seattle. I get my orders within a day or two and I'm almost the same travel time from Seattle, out here on a friggin' island.

[tgtaylor]

Placed an order for 4 and 8 ply Rising. If the shipping containers are similar to Archival Methods then I won't have to worry about corner damage.

Thomas

[Stephen Willard]

I buy my mat board by the case of 25 sheets (minimum order) from http://www.bdmatboard.com. Prices for 4-ply are as follows:

32x40 cream core $2.95 per sheet - acid free
32x40 white core $3.45 per sheet - acid free and lignin free
40x60 cream core $6.50 per sheet - acid free

I have been buying their mat board for years now and probably framed well over 300 prints without any problems or returns. I have sold world wide and know my prints have found homes in places where there can be lots of humidity and pollution. In fact, I had a customer just email me to tell me that his house was flooded the past summer, but the five framed prints of mine he had on his wall survived the flood in perfect condition. I attribute that in large part to the mat board not warping under extremely high humid conditions.

Hope this helps...

[Rafal Lukawiecki]

Where do you buy your 32X40 mat board?

But of course from Glenwood Mouldings in Newtownmountkennedy, Co Wicklow, or from The Photo Shop, Co. Meath, Peter provides good service. Naturally, you could also order directly from Arquadia or LionPic.

Sorry, couldn't resist. Anyway, great choice of a mat cutter, Ben, I like my F-2200, very much. Take time to square the squaring arm, though.

[Jim Becia]

I don't mean to step on any toes but the mat boards mentioned by Stephen are not archival in any sense. Both the cream core and white core mats will discolor over time, both in their cover sheet material and their bevel cut. I had a framing business for many years and know for a fact these mat boards are not archival. I can assure you the bevel cuts will turn yellow in a matter of years. If you want to stay archival, stick with Artcare by Bainbridge, Rag Mat by Crescent, or the offerings by Rising and there are a few others that slip my mind. These mats are will stand the test of time.

[vinny]

What Jim said. You don't get archival boards for $3/sheet

[Drew Wiley]

I buy all my board wholesale, in full 25 sheet packs. I can't imagine paying double in an art store for dog-eared, fingerprinted board, even if they carried what I want,
which they don't. I prefer Rising.

[Stephen Willard]

I don't mean to step on any toes but the mat boards mentioned by Stephen are not archival in any sense. Both the cream core and white core mats will discolor over time, both in their cover sheet material and their bevel cut. I had a framing business for many years and know for a fact these mat boards are not archival. I can assure you the bevel cuts will turn yellow in a matter of years. If you want to stay archival, stick with Artcare by Bainbridge, Rag Mat by Crescent, or the offerings by Rising and there are a few others that slip my mind. These mats are will stand the test of time.

Hey Jim, you have not stepped on my toes, but I do have have lots of of framed prints in my house. Several of them are close to ten years old, and the white core has not yellowed. Please note, I live in Colorado and the climate here is very dry. Whether a dry climate keeps them from yellowing or not is unclear to me. However, there is now a lot of atmospheric pollution in the area from the 80,000 fracking wells just east my town. It will be interesting to see what impact they will have on my framed prints. More importantly, I have never had any of my customers return any of my framed prints for any reason, and 99% of everything I sell is bought framed.

[Stephen Willard]

I would also like to note that I hand developed an 8x10 chromogenic print from one of the first home kits every offered close to 40 years ago. It hangs on my wall framed in the cheapest acidic materials one could ever imagine including a dust cover on the back recycled from a grocery bag that has completely yellowed. I made it when I was a kid and living in Vermont which has lots of humidity. Chromogenic prints at that time were supposed to be incredible unstable. Yet it is still in perfect condition.

Go figure. Perhaps all of this archival science is nothing more than a scheme to extract additional revenue form the public at large.:)

[Jim Becia]

Hey Jim, you have not stepped on my toes, but I do have have lots of of framed prints in my house. Several of them are close to ten years old, and the white core has not yellowed. Please note, I live in Colorado and the climate here is very dry. Whether a dry climate keeps them from yellowing or not is unclear to me. However, there is now a lot of atmospheric pollution in the area from the 80,000 fracking wells just east my town. It will be interesting to see what impact they will have on my framed prints. More importantly, I have never had any of my customers return any of my framed prints for any reason, and 99% of everything I sell is bought framed.

Stephen,

I hope your matting stays fine. And you are right in that humidity can play a big part in degradation, as is the case here in Wisconsin. With nearly 20 years in the framing business, I did see problems stemming from non archival mats. However, like most things, there is no hard and fast rule why some mats look fine while others degrade. Jim

[Drew Wiley]

Stephen is dealing with color chromogenic prints, not fiber-based ones. There is a bit of risk of yellowing right where the bevel of the mat contacts the image, but
this might not happen within the life of the print under dry conditions. If conditions are humid, mildew is a much bigger danger. I personally use whitecore Alphamat for color prints, but it's around ten bucks a sheet even wholesale. What is more important in this case is the nature of the mounting substrate; but even here, the nature of the adhesive foil tends to form a significant barrier. My credo regarding all such things is to test, test, test.

[James515]

Whenever we visit a sister in law I am amazed that colored prints and drawing I matted still hang after forty years. Of course the cut edge on many is yellow to brown now, but it has not bleed into the print. Mat is in colors, mostly gray. Now that I am learning digital printing, testing begins anew. Moisture as noted is the worst issue, much of even my archival stuff has small brown spots from too many years in the basement and not being sufficiently sealed. For digital I've already ruled out optical brighteners, just too unpredictable.

http://www.lumierephoto.com/Knowledge-Base-&-Case-Studies/Choosing-the-right-mat-board.php

http://56x56.com/for-photographers/buffered-vs-non-bufferedunbuffered-materials-for-digital-pigment-prints/

[Stephen Willard]

Stephen is dealing with color chromogenic prints, not fiber-based ones. There is a bit of risk of yellowing right where the bevel of the mat contacts the image, but
this might not happen within the life of the print under dry conditions. If conditions are humid, mildew is a much bigger danger. I personally use whitecore Alphamat for color prints, but it's around ten bucks a sheet even wholesale. What is more important in this case is the nature of the mounting substrate; but even here, the nature of the adhesive foil tends to form a significant barrier. My credo regarding all such things is to test, test, test.

I agree with you that testing is important, Drew. All of the mat boards I have noted are buffed PH neutral, and I have used them for years. Many of my extended family has had my prints on their walls for years also. Vermont, Flordia, New York, and Virginia are just a few. When I have visited them I have inspect the prints and everything seems fine. I have not noticed any yellowing or bleeding of the mat board or any color shifts in the print. Perhaps Fuji Crystal Archive papers are more durable than we may think.

In any case, my point is that I have been selling my prints with this mat board and photographic paper for a long time now, and that this constitutes a rather large body of testing with excellent results.

The company that sells this mat board makes this mat board. There is no middle guy overhead. Hence, the inexpensive prices. In general, I do believe that price is a reflection of quality, but I have complete confidence in their white core line despite it is only $3.45 per sheet. I only use the cream core for my larger prints because they do not offer 40x60 mat board in white core.

Try it. You may be very surprised at the quality of this stuff.

[Drew Wiley]

The nature of the media has a lot to do with it. My aunt gave away a lot of her watercolors to various extended family members, many of whom lived in the humid
NW, and it's a pity to see how they got framed over cardboard and with ordinary matboard (often attached with masking tape - a common custom once, even in
professional frame shops) - and seeing all those papers now yellowed and almost crumbling to the touch. Since her painting are almost nonexistent on the resale or
auction market, and might realistically sell for tens of thousands of dollars apiece, it's a shame to see them degraded to the point of being literally worthless. I took
very good care of my own collection, but it all got stolen - if it hadn't, I could have paid off my house about twenty years sooner! I figured out the train of possession, but the last known fence of the work was turned into swiss cheese by a swat team, and never talked again, so I'll never realistically recover those paintings. Watercolor paper is highly absorbent and very fussy about framing conditions, just like these rag papers that people make platinum prints on.