Jobo 2509 vs. 2509N

[David Karp]

Hi all,

Does anyone know how to tell the difference between the Jobo 2509 and 2509N 4x5 developing reels? I know that the N version is improved. What were the improvements?

Thanks.

[Sal Santamaura]

The "N" version has small studs molded in to which the "wings" attach. That's the only difference.

[David Karp]

Thanks Sal.

[David Karp]

Does anyone know whether the "wings" were a real improvement?

I am thinking about using one of these tank/reel combinations for daylight inversion processing of 4x5 film.

Thanks.

[Mick Fagan]

David, I have the original reel that doesn't have the improvement. I use it pretty much all of the time for rotary processing, I have used it with inversion processing as well and there are differences.

With rotary processing it is possible for the outside sheets to be dislodged slightly. Meaning the end of a sheet (short side) can be extended about 10mm or so outwards at the end of a processing cycle. I have not seen any deleterious effect on any of the sheets that this has happened to, in C41, E6 and B&W.

With inversion processing, I have never seen a sheet out of it's correct position at the end of a processing cycle. I only have one tank and one reel.

Just as a matter of interest, I have always only developed 4 sheets at a time, two on the inner slots and two on the outer slots, perfect processing always.

Earlier this year I was testing four new lenses I acquired with a camera. As these were test shots I decided that I would for the first time ever, develop 6 sheets at once. Not a good idea at all!

I had uneven development on 4 sheets. Upon inspection of the sheets, and knowing where they were on the reel during development, I worked out that the outer two sheets and the middle two sheets were closer together on one end, thereby making tight space between the sheets.

This is the only explanation I could come up with. Another worker came and looked at the film on the light box, looked at the sheets as they were put on the reel, and came to the same conclusion as I did.

Jobo did mention more than once on their literature, for critical work, 4 sheets is better than 6 sheets.

Mick.

[tgtaylor]

FWIW, I routinely process 6 sheets at a tme by inversion with the 2509-N reel without any problem at all. Load the sheets into the slot from the inside slot (from the reel) out with the emulsion side facing inwards towards the reel. The only thing that you need to be careful of is to be sure that both sides of the 2d sheet is in the second slot. Jobo puts a small plastic nipple on each side of the reel at the 2d slot. After you have loaded the 2d sheet, run you finger lightly around both sides of the sheet. If it's loaded correctly you will feel the nipple just outward (towards you) from the sheet. Also there is a plastic nipple at the end position of each sheet on the reel to keep the sheet in place. Lightly tug each sheet to see that it properly placed. Also, run you finger lightly along the edges of the sheets. There should be a slight but even space between the sheets. To remove each sheet, just lightly lift the edge over this nipple and slide it straight out.

I believe that the improvement of the 2509-N over the 2509 is the addition of plastic retainers on each side of the reel which is designed to improve circulation within the tank and to prevent the sheets from becomming dislodged. It's a good and reliable system.

I have read where reputable photographers have advised to insert the loaded reel at once into a tank pre-filled with developer rather than pour the developer over the film from the top to prevent uneven development. True, the tank fills from the bottom to the top but, conversely, empties from the bottom up. So the two times should equal out. This is especially true if you use diluted solutions and, therefore, longer development times.

Shoot, posting this gives me the needed impetus to develope the 16 sheets of Acos I shot this weekend. Xtol 1:3 for 14.5 minutes. Harrison tent and bathroom here I come!

[darr]

I use the Jobo ATL 1000 with 2509N reels. I load 6 sheets as tgtaylor describes in his above post only I leave out the plastic wings. Reason is, I had the lid on the tank pop off two different processing times with them on. After I tried a run without them, the problem was solved. I experience no problem with even development.

[fhovie]

Some films are more tolerant than others as well. I find that 6 sheets of TRI-X in Pyrocat will always process ok but when I use FP4+ I some times limit it to 4 sheets because of the possibility to uneven development. I do use FP4 a lot. I can think of no better small tank system than the Jobo. I used to rotary process but found that semi-stand or regular hand agitation seems to give better accutance and I prefer that look.

[Mick Fagan]

Interesting, I used FP4+ for the 6 sheet on one reel run.

I might try 6 sheets of Tmax and see what happens.

Mick.

[David Karp]

Thanks to all for the information. I appreciate it.

I am now the owner of a 2521 tank with 1509N reel and loader base that I purchased off the forum from Len Metcalf. (Smooth and easy transaction I might add.)

Now I have another question. The Jobo literature on-line describes loading the film perfectly. I have no questions regarding this. Loading film with or without the loader base seems straightforward. However, the instructions regarding the film retention plates ("wings") are not so clear. I think I know how to use them, but want to make sure.

Thanks in advance.

[David Karp]

I am sure I have it now. I was just too timid to push hard enough on the wings to get them to snap in place.

Thanks all.

[Ginette]

The "N" version has small studs molded in to which the "wings" attach. That's the only difference.

A very old topic but can someone post a closeup of theses small studs that I know if my 2 reels are N version. I don't have the retaining panels but can buy if I have the N version.
Thanks

[Sal Santamaura]

The "N" version has small studs molded in to which the "wings" attach. That's the only difference.


A very old topic but can someone post a closeup of theses small studs that I know if my 2 reels are N version. I don't have the retaining panels but can buy if I have the N version.
Thanks

The first image shows three studs associated with the end of one "wing." There are four sets of three studs, two on the top flange and two sets on the bottom flange.

Nearly ten years later, while taking these pictures for you, I realize there's one other difference, at least between the 2509 and 2509n reels I have. The 2509n has one black and one clear flange (see the second image). My 2509 has two clear flanges. I don't know whether that's another indicator of which version one has or if it was just a running change. The 12 studs, however, are definite determinants.

[Ginette]

Thanks Sal for the pictures, same fast answer like 10 years ago!
No studs on mine but black and clear parts.
Do you use sometime your 2509? Do you load less sheets on this model?

[Sal Santamaura]

Thanks Sal for the pictures, same fast answer like 10 years ago!...You're very welcome.


...Do you use sometime your 2509? Do you load less sheets on this model?Both reels and the tanks have been part of my photography "museum" ever since I bought some 3006 Expert drums. I don't use those reels/tanks at all now. The even results from Expert drums cannot, in my experience, be duplicated any other way, regardless of how few sheets one loads in a 2509. Perhaps nitrogen burst? I haven't tried that. :)