favorite b&w paper

[mike fitzgibbon]

with the shrinking number of papers out there what are the new favorites? I still have
some kodak fine art and and trying some oriental vc but have some work to do there
yet. Orienta graded of years ago used to be a favorite of mine, tones to a beautiful
color. Any thoughts would be nice. Thanks

[Eric Biggerstaff]

You might want to set up a poll for this and list several papers, but I do to majority of my prints on Ilford FB Warmtone which I find to be a lovely paper. Also, I use a lot of the Arista version of the Forte FB Polywarmtone but I only have about 500 sheets of that left. Other than these, if I want cold tone I print with Ilford MGFB IV.

[John Kasaian]

I still have a stock of AZO, Galerie (in it's Arista Classic Fiber Graded incarnation) and Kentmere Bromide. While I plan on experimenting with Emaks and Slavich (and I'd really like to try Fomabrom 111 if anyone in the US carries the stuff now that J and C is gone) my all time favorite is AZO.

[domenico Foschi]

The increasingly more expensive Ilford Warmtone.
I also like the neutral tone a lot.

[SamReeves]

Oriental Seagull is my favorite at the moment. Who knows when it may dissapear?

[David Karp]

Depending on the image, I use Ilford MG IV FB, Oriental VC FB, and Kentmere VC. The Kentmere has an absolutely beautiful surface texture.

For a slightly warm tone, I used Agfa MC Classic. Since it disappeared, no warm tone for me.

[Mattg]

If you haven't tried Ilford Galerie it might be worth buying a box of 8x10 and seeing what it can do. I have tried quite a few VC papers recently and don't think any of them have the richness of shadow tone nor the subtle highlights that Gallerie does.

[domenico Foschi]

Depending on the image, I use Ilford MG IV FB, Oriental VC FB, and Kentmere VC. The Kentmere has an absolutely beautiful surface texture.

For a slightly warm tone, I used Agfa MC Classic. Since it disappeared, no warm tone for me.

David have you tried Foma warmtone classic?
Not like agfa, I admit, but a nice warm paper.
D.

[domenico Foschi]

I still have a stock of AZO, Galerie (in it's Arista Classic Fiber Graded incarnation) and Kentmere Bromide. While I plan on experimenting with Emaks and Slavich (and I'd really like to try Fomabrom 111 if anyone in the US carries the stuff now that J and C is gone) my all time favorite is AZO.

John can you tell me more about the Fomabrom?

[Marcus Carlsson]

I agree with David about Kentmere VC Fiber. The glossy surface is wonderful (I airdry it). It is also the most flat paper I have ever used.

/ Marcus

[John Kasaian]

John can you tell me more about the Fomabrom?

domenico,

I saw it on J and C's website.It only came from J and C in, IIRC 9"x12"---a fiber paper in grades medium and hard. Retro Photographic in the UK carries it, perhaps with more options, but the last time I was at Freestyle they had just about every Foma paper but that one.

I've heard good things about it. How good? If I ever get my hands on some I'll let you know!;) OTOH, perhaps it is just another magic bullet I'm chasing.

[Colin Graham]

Emaks graded is worth a try. Great stuff in ansco 120 & 130. Has a very slightly warm base, but it can go cool- or warm-toned very nicely.

[Bill_1856]

Basically, I stopped printing when Agfa Portriga Rapid disappeared. Agfa MCC was a nice paper, and is said to be "coming back on the market."

[David Karp]

David have you tried Foma warmtone classic?
Not like agfa, I admit, but a nice warm paper.
D.

Domenico, thanks for the tip. I have not tried it. I liked the Agfa due to its slight warm tone without the cream base. Is the Foma similar?

[domenico Foschi]

Domenico, thanks for the tip. I have not tried it. I liked the Agfa due to its slight warm tone without the cream base. Is the Foma similar?

Uhmm, no David, FOma is cream based, more than Ilford WM.
Good luck, it's getting a bit hard....

[David Karp]

Thanks. It is not much of a problem for me (losing Agfa MCC). Mostly I prefer neutral or colder toned prints for my stuff. I do have a few that seemed more appropriate in a warmer toned paper, and the MCC was perfect for me. Well, I have heard those rumors that MCC is coming back over on APUG. Great if true.

[GSX4]

Agfa MCC111 paper is likely going to be brought back to the table with ADOX in the driving seat. On APUG, Adox has managed to solicit a large number of folks to participate in a paper test (of which I was part of). They have recreated the original MCC111 recipe after they acquired some of the Agfa MCC staff, and equipment. Paper base is cooler than original MCC, but the paper responds very well, and is still warm toned. So far, the paper is on a colder base as they cannot get supplies form the original manufacturer. The paper reacts almost identically to the original spec though, albeit about a 1/4 grade more contrasty. This large scale test will be the first of a series of potential reintroductions of Agfa paper, and maybe even APX100 film emulsions will re-emerge. ADOX has stated for the record, that the success of MCC111 is their primary focus, and if it works well, they will look into re-introducing APX100 and maybe even some of their other older papers. So it is not all doom and gloom. It will mean that we will have to support their paper once it is brought to market around July of 2008. Rumor has it that an RC version will be made available sooner.

As for other current remaining papers. I am enjoying Oriental WT VC paper, and Fomaborm Variant 111, which was touted to be an Agfa MCC111 replacement. It does not even come close to MCC111 though and it is a lot cooler.

[David Karp]

Andrew,

Thanks for the update. The new MCC sounds like it would be the ideal warmtone paper for me! I hope it all works out.

[Ole Tjugen]

If you haven't tried Ilford Galerie it might be worth buying a box of 8x10 and seeing what it can do. I have tried quite a few VC papers recently and don't think any of them have the richness of shadow tone nor the subtle highlights that Gallerie does.

I second that. A graded paper has a very different tonality compared to VC, and Ilford Galerie is the best of the lot (in most cases).

[Jan Pedersen]

I second that. A graded paper has a very different tonality compared to VC, and Ilford Galerie is the best of the lot (in most cases).

It's been more than 15 years since i last used Gallerie, how is that responding to selenium toner.

Ilfords WT is my favorite WT paper, especially after the base was changed to a more neutral white.
Kentona is another favorite and recently i have used the Slavich in single weight for contact printing, it is a great paper and is beautiful after a couple of minutes in 1+9 selenium toner.

[Colin Robertson]

My current paper is Ilford FB warm-tone multigrade. Overall, it is a very fine paper, but I do find toning it difficult. With FB multigrade 'normal' tone, Selenium enriched the shadows and brought up fine highlight detail. It also gives the paper a beautiful cool purple-blue colour. Fantastic. Unfortunately, warm tone paper in selenium is less predictable. A short toning 'crisps' the image, but then the deeep shadows will start to chang to a coppery-red. This colour NEVER appears in the highlights, and can leave the print with a (for me, too) dramatic split. I tone each print carefully and snatch it from the selenium at the first hint of colour change.
Agfa Multi-Contrast Classic was great. It too would sometimes tone with a split, but it was far more subtle and, to me, attractive. Right now in the darkroom I have a box of Adox Fine Print Vario Classic neutralton. Came last week and I haven't broken the seals, but since this is the first day of a weeks vacation ( :) yee-hah!) I'll let you know what it looks like soon. This stuff is billed as having a very high silver content for extra rich blacks. For details, see www.retrophotographic.com in the uk.

[Ole Tjugen]

It's been more than 15 years since i last used Gallerie, how is that responding to selenium toner.

It gets warmer and "deeper", not "plummy" like many other papers.

I believe.

I'm far from home now, or I would find a toned print, an untoned print, and the same of some other paper to compare directly. I had hoped someone else would have answered by now...

[Gary L. Quay]

I really liked the Forte Polywarmtone FB until it disappeared. I haven't tried the Ilford Gallerie or the Oriental Seagull, but it's only a matter of time.

I don't have an absolute favortie at this moment, but I like certain film / developer combinations. I like the Fomabrom with Formulary Amidol. I like Anything Ilford in Ansco 130. And I'm saving up the last of my Polywarmtone for some Fotospeed Lith developer that I just bought.

Lastly. I have a few packages of various Kentmere papers that I haven't yet opened. The possibilities await...

--Gary

[j.e.simmons]

I really like Kentmere's Kentona in my own variation of MAS amidol. It's only one grade, but it responds to water bath and to extended development. The paper also responds to KBr and benzo to vary the tone.
juan

[Ralph Barker]

FWIW, Harman announced today that they have acquired Kentmere.

http://www.ilfordphoto.com/pressroom/latest.asp

[fstop]

I'm really surprised after 3 pages of thread, nobody has mentioned Bergger papers. Higher price aside, both the neutral and the warm tone are favorites of mine. Especially when I under expose a neg and have to use a 4 or 5 filter for any contrast. The tonal range on these are perfect for almost all my printing. I usually buy a bit of stock and keep in fridge being that it can go in and out of stock.

Just to add...Bergger in Defender is a great combo!

[Jim Galli]

Is Bergger still viable after the demise of Forte? I have loved Bergger and fear it is gone. If I've learned anything at all in the last 4 years, it is to not have a favorite.
favorite = death wish. I picked up some no-name arista this past weekend at Freestyle. 2 previous favorites that are now gone: Freestyle used to have this lovely paper called Europe's Finest Warmtone in grade 2. It was a gorgeous warm-black and with selenium the black would trip the densitometer at about 2.2. Gone. Then J & C had some no-name "museum weight" stuff in 12X16 that was identical to the Freestyle stuff. Gone.

[SAShruby]

I currently use Ilford FB IV Multigrade in Ansco 130 as a substitution for Azo/Lodima in Amidol. I like the combination. But I'm a printing beginner.

So far I learned, if I stick for a while to one combination and learn how to print, then I'd look for something else to compare if what I perfected until now can be better or not. Until then, I personally like just what I said - Ilford in Ansco.

Hope it helps.

[mcfactor]

It gets warmer and "deeper", not "plummy" like many other papers.

I believe.

I'm far from home now, or I would find a toned print, an untoned print, and the same of some other paper to compare directly. I had hoped someone else would have answered by now...


You are right. That is one of the reasons i like it so much, it simply becomes richer with selenium (and a tiny bit warmer) without really changing color.

[Richard M. Coda]

#1 - Kodak Elite Fine-Art (anybody have any they want to sell me ;^)

#2 - Oriental Seagull graded

[Robert Skeoch]

I still like Ilford Galerie and Kentmere bromide the best. I just like a grade paper. For a warmtone I've always loved Agfa Portriga and never found anything to replace it.
-Rob Skeoch

[chilihead]

If you liked (loved) Forte Warmtone toned in Selenium you will realize what a loss it was when Forte shut down...

[evan clarke]

You might want to set up a poll for this and list several papers, but I do to majority of my prints on Ilford FB Warmtone which I find to be a lovely paper. Also, I use a lot of the Arista version of the Forte FB Polywarmtone but I only have about 500 sheets of that left. Other than these, if I want cold tone I print with Ilford MGFB IV.

Ditto on the Ilford Warmtone FB, I develop it in Ansco 130 with benzotriazole replacing the bromide for a nice tone..Evan Clarke

[Gary L. Quay]

Ditto on the Ilford Warmtone FB, I develop it in Ansco 130 with benzotriazole replacing the bromide for a nice tone..Evan Clarke

I'm going to try this.

My favorite, currently, is Forte Polywarmtone FB. 'Tis a shame. I still have a box of 50 11X14 repackaged as Arista, Made in Hungary. Once this is gone, I have some Kentmere Kentona waiting in the wings. I'm eager to try Ilford Gallerie, as well.

--Gary