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Matus Kalisky
19-Sep-2007, 02:18
Hello,

I am lusting for some time after a "classic portrait" lens that my Tachi 4x5 would be able to handle. The are two Velostigmats Series II in the outer space, one is 240 mm and the second 210. Both are f.4.5 . The 240 comes in Alphax #4 shutter and with the dial-in soft focus. The other one are jsut lens cells (no barrel) of 210mm which sould also directly screw in Aphax #4. My preference would probably go for the 210, but it would come without a shutter.

Now my questions - would the Tachi handle the 240 one? If not - how much would a shutter (the metioned Aphax #4 or other) that would allow a direct fit for the 210mm Velostigmat cost?

thanks

Darryl Baird
19-Sep-2007, 05:12
I have a 9-1/2 VII with a Betax 4 shutter on a Wista board. The shutter extends beyond the edges of the lensboard just a little. That might be a problem depending if it clears the sliding locks, but I'd say yes with the qualification of Betax vs. Alphax outer dimension.
If you're asking about weight, that may differ from my metal Wista camera to the wooden Tachi. Also you will probably be at the maximum bellows with the longer lens.

Matus Kalisky
19-Sep-2007, 05:19
Thanks. I am avare of the bellows problem - that's also why I would probably prefere the 210 version. I find it also more suitable for general use.

Also - more practical question - how much might such a lens cost (the one with shutter) ?

Darryl Baird
19-Sep-2007, 17:45
Search fleabay for completed auctions, prices range from $50 (steal) to over $200. It depends on the phases of the moon I think.:p

Jim Galli
19-Sep-2007, 18:57
Bad news is the 210 does not go directly into any of the shutters without adapters. It usually gets found in an Ilex 4 with adapters.

cowanw
20-Sep-2007, 04:45
Bad news is the 210 does not go directly into any of the shutters without adapters. It usually gets found in an Ilex 4 with adapters.

I just bought an 8 1/4 velostigmat series 11 in a Betax 4. I don't have it yet. I dont suppose the Alphax 4 is the same size as the Betax 4.
Regards
Bill

cowanw
20-Sep-2007, 07:47
Actually, I have also bought a barrel 9 1/2 inch soft focus velostigmat II. From the camera eccentric literature I am hoping that the lens will drop into a Betax 4 as well. I tried to read table 5 of the 1919 catalogue to compare shutter sizes but it is hard to read. We will see.
Regrds
Bill

Jim Noel
20-Sep-2007, 09:02
Go for the 240. I have one and the dial-in softness is a great asset in my figure work.

Matus Kalisky
20-Sep-2007, 09:21
thanks to all your answers.

So - should the 210 (or 8 1/4) fit in Betax#4 for or not? Actually - how large/heavy it such a shutter?


Go for the 240. I have one and the dial-in softness is a great asset in my figure work.

It is tempting but starting price is $360 ...

cowanw
20-Sep-2007, 09:41
I hope Jim Galli replies and clarifies his reply, but as I say the lens was marketed as fitting a Betax 4 and mine seems original. But an alphax 4 is not the same.
I also wonder if the specs for all the lenses marked velostigmat ll over all the years were necessarily the same size for size.
Wouldn't be nice if we generated a list of lens that fit whichever shutters.
Regards
Bill

Jim Galli
20-Sep-2007, 10:41
I had an 8 1/4" Velostigmat S II in barrel. When you take the cells out of the barrel they are not a direct fit in any shutter. I tried Alphax 4 Betax 4 and Ilex 4. I now have a different 8 1/4" Velo SII mounted in an Ilex 4 shtter. Same cells and threads but the shutter has adapter barrels that the cells fit into. You're money and grief ahead to just buy one in a shutter if you want a shutter. I have a nice old 7" Series II in some kind of Auto shutter if interested. Without the fuzz-u-lator they really aren't soft focus. Just a wide open Tessar, which is a fine lens for portraits and very like a Heliar in look, but not soft with fuzz on the highlights.

Darren Kruger
20-Sep-2007, 10:52
So - should the 210 (or 8 1/4) fit in Betax#4 for or not?

I have an 8 1/4" Velostigmat II in a Betax #4. It appears that it has a factory installed adapter to make it fit. My 9 1/2" Velostigmat II seems to be a direct fit into a Betax #4.

You might have problems finding a Betax #4 shutter to buy separately. You need to make sure the shutter has aperture blades. I have run across several that appear to have come from the factory without the aperture blades or scale on the shutter.

I do have an Alphax shutter about the same size. I will check tonight to see if it's a direct fit for either of the lenses.

-Darren

Darren Kruger
20-Sep-2007, 22:57
I do have an Alphax shutter about the same size. I will check tonight to see if it's a direct fit for either of the lenses.

I checked my Alphax (#4?) and it has the same thread size as my Betax #4. Both shutters have the same speeds (1/50 through 1/2.) The biggest difference I see is the Alphax is silver in front and the speed is rim set vs a slider on the betax.

Of course, i don't know if any of this helps with your original question on which lens to buy.

-Darren

Matus Kalisky
21-Sep-2007, 00:40
Thanks to all your answers. This bussiness with older lenses and shutters and their compatibiity seems to be a complicated one ...

- Jim -
thanks for your offer, but 7" would be a bit too short. The 210mm would be a sweetspot concerning the focal length and camera bellows.

Could one compare the look of Velostigmat withouth the soft-dial and let's say Xenar/Tessar 210/4.5 as these sell a bit cheaper?

Mark Sawyer
21-Sep-2007, 09:13
Could one compare the look of Velostigmat withouth the soft-dial and let's say Xenar/Tessar 210/4.5 as these sell a bit cheaper?

The Velostigmat Series II lenses are Tessars, I believe, though different Tessars behave differently. Velostigmats without the diffusion adjustments tend to be pretty reasonable in price.

If a Velostigmat originally came in a Studio shutter, it won't go into a Betax shutter without major surgery, as the Studio shutter has male threads and the Betax shutter has female threads.

goamules
21-Sep-2007, 10:13
Hi, I have a Velostigmat Series IV that is seldom mentioned on the boards. It is a f6.3 and 7 1/4 in a Betax 2.

I'm shooting it wide open for wetplate. It doesn't seem very "soft". But I like it.

Is this similar to the type II?

(Newbie)

Ernest Purdum
21-Sep-2007, 15:44
The Series IV was found on lots of hand cameras but was also made in larger sizes. At f6.3, it was lighter and smaller than a Series II, so more practical for hand cameras. I am guessing that it was also a Tessar design. Can anyone confirm or clarify?