Ideas on 45 cameras for traveling

[otzi]

I am seeking opinions on various currently available 45 camera body types ideal for overseas travel. Some of the prime requisites I envision in order are quick take down, put up is not such a problem but should a blue shrek :eek: loom on the horizon a quick exit can prove expedient. Weather, dust and sand(?) capable. Bump and bother resistant, as much as possible anyway. After that movements and finally weight. lens range from say 75 to 360.

There is a lot of very good equipment on the market but only use in the field reveals their various idiosyncrasies. A look through various threads posts a lot of info but not so much on the points listed. I haven't listed my own ideas as I am seeking unbiased impute if that's possible on this subject.

Although we all love our present and precious equipment I am seeking specific information as a working tool rather than a loved and admired marvel.

[Jim Rice]

One word: Graphic

[David A. Goldfarb]

I like my Linhof Tech V for travel. Setup is quick, the camera is rugged, it stands up to the wind when I'm in Hawai'i, and I can switch between view camera mode and press camera mode at will, and all the pictures will be in the same format with the same lenses, which provides some visual unity for images made with different techniques.

[davidb]

Toyo 45CF

[Bill_1856]

Busch Pressman model D 4x5. Bulletproof all-metal construction, with speedy press camera type setup. Light as a Crown Graphic, smaller than a Technika. Has revolving back, and lens tilts/shifts/rises. Rangefinder for focusing and (crappy) optical finder for composition if you're using it hand-held. Plain ground glass for tripod (no Fresnel).
Only drawbacks are a small lens board, and no Graflock back for roll film holders.

[Jack Flesher]

Weather, dust and sand(?) capable. Bump and bother resistant, as much as possible anyway.

After that movements and finally weight

I envision in order are quick take down, put up is not such a problem

lens range from say 75 to 360



No view camera I know of likes rain, dirt or sand falling directly on it since there are so many entrance points for said crap to get inside... However, many allow for easy disassebly to clean it out, and are not going to be damaged from exposure to the elements.

More sophisticated movements almost always = more weight.

Once you are accustomed to your camera's quirks, this is probably not an issue for any field camera choice you're likely to make.

360 will eliminate most of the basic wooden folding cameras, but most can do 300...

Given your list of requirements, I'd do searches for:

Gowland and Toho as simple, basic ultra-light monorails;

Just about any wooden field folder if you decide you can live without a 360 or are willing to use one in a top-hat board or a tele;

And finally Walker, Carbon Infinity, Phillips, Chamonix, Ebony and Gandolfi as more specialized field cameras. This set is generally going to be more expensive and/or harder to find.

Cheers,

[Kevin Crisp]

Two words: Crown Graphic.

For the long lens you could get a tele-raptar and have enough bellows.

[Doug Dolde]

I'd not take a 4x5 traveling...a Mamiya 7 gives exceptional results with much less bulk.

[Dave Aharonian]

I now shoot primarily 5x7, but I kept my Toyo 45AII because I do a lot of sea kayaking on the west coast and like to torture myself by packing it with me. Like Jack said, no cameras are very good for dirt and rain, but I really appreciate the Toyo due to its rugged build (its seen lots of abuse and has stood up very well - no problems at all) and fairly light weight. The metal folding box is a very sturdy unit when packed. I've certainly had mine wet and dusty and I've learned how to clean it up without too much trouble. It is great for wide angle lenses - I use a 75mm regularly and in the past have had a 55mm on a recessed board. Its a bit of a stretch for a 300mm but a Tele. 360 works fine. Hope this helps.

[Richard Wall]

I use a Linhof Technikarden 45S for LF stuff. It folds up nicely and has plenty of movements. I am able to carry 10 film holders, 2 lenses, light meter, darkcloth, bag/standard bellows, filters and a few other goodies in a backpack. I speed up set-up by trying to keeping the bag bellows on as much a possible and by using a quick release tripod head. The camera folds easily with out removing the lens with the bag. I can usually shoot up to a 150 lens with the bag bellows. If I don't have to change bellows setup/tear down only takes about 3 minutes. Add a minute or two to change the bellows.

If I really want to be mobile I shoot a Mamiya RB 67.

[Brian Ellis]

Most of the cameras mentioned wouldn't allow you to use your 360mm lens (which I assume isn't a tele lens). The Technikardan would do it but one of the reasons I got rid of mine was the time it took to take down - lots of movements to zero out, then turning the little knob multiple times and gettng the bellows into position took me a good bit of time though that may have been more me than the camera, I've read of others who say they can do it quickly. For all your different requirements I'd look at a used Wisner Technical or a Zone VI as among cameras that are readily available used and not too expensive when compared say with a Canham, Ebony, or Walker. Both have enough bellows for your 360mm lens and are pretty easy to set up and take down. Since they're clam shells they're reasonbly well protected from dirt, dust, etc. Only drawback is both will likely require a bag bellows and/or a recessed lens board for your 75mm lens. It's pretty hard to find a camera that's going to have a bellows long enough for your 360 and also be easy to use with your 75mm.

You'd greatly increase your range of choices if you compromised on the lens length and substituted a 300mm for a 360. Then among other cameras a Linhof Technika IV, V, or Master would be feasible - super fast to set up and take down, sturdy and well-protected from dirt and dust when folded, 75mm lens is very feasible especially with the Master and 300mm is very usable.

[KenM]

I'm with David - I love my Master Technica when I travel. yes, it's heavy. But, it folds up into a box that you could use as a step-stool when pressed.

Very quick setup/take down as well. Small lens boards too.

[Ted Harris]

The Toyo AII mentioned earlier (and its sister camera the AX with largely the same specs) is built like a tank and is among the fastest to setup and take down. I regularly take mine on planes and shove it in its bag under my seat. The bellows won't get you quite to 360 but with a tophat you are there. Even more indestructible is the Walker Titan which you can wash in the shower if it gets too grimy and it will give you 360 and more. Only problem with the Walker is that it has a bit of a large footprint and is not the fastest to takedown.

The Technika mentioned by several is also built like a tank but I hate the way its rear movements work (many don't mind). There is also the Horseman FA but a 360 will likely be very top heavy even with a tophat board ont aht camera and finally the Wista metal fields.

My presonal feeling is that I would stay away from the older cameras such as the Speeds and Busch Pressman unless you are going for a real budget rig. They get the job done, don't get me wrong, but they are going to be 35-40 years old and older and I wouldn't want to rely on them in a critical situation.

[Herb Cunningham]

Find a used Arca Misura.

[David A. Goldfarb]

On the Technika, I use a 360 Tele-Xenar at the long end, 55 Apo-Grandagon on the short end.

[Ron Marshall]

Technika, or Mamiya 7.

[archivue]

i'm travelling with an arca swiss compact field 140... rigid, extensive movements, and fit in a quite small bag !
With one bellow you can use 47 to 360 lens... and even a 450 télé.

Folding camera are too restritive (nearly no movements with wide angle lens !)

[Ole Tjugen]

The "Ultimate" is of course the Carbon Infinity.

But if I don't need unlimited movements (or very short or very long lenses), I will use a speed Graphic instead. Or a Gandolfi as a "compromise", but mine are 5x7" and 8x10", and I don't have a 4x5" back for the 5x7".

[Jason Greenberg Motamedi]

When travelling "light" I use an ancient Linhof Technika III and two lenses; a 135 and a 210 convertible. I removed the non-fuctional rangefinder which would have cost more than four times as much as the camera to have repaired and cammed. When I can find an affordable one, I will probably replace it with a newer cammed Technika, but until then I am pleased with my selection.

[roteague]

I'd not take a 4x5 traveling...a Mamiya 7 gives exceptional results with much less bulk.

I take my 4x5 to Australia every year. In fact, I take it almost everywhere I travel.

[otzi]

Interesting inputs. To expand, I presently use a Sinar made up from parts gleaned from assorted used finds. Probably the worlds most retro compatible marque. OK for car etc. but I've decided to acquire something more manageable for travel. Over the years I have arranged a collection of leica RF glass. So the snaps are covered.

Tripping over the years has shown me that holiday shots like a wedding albums are great for the next few months but invariably gets regulated to some secluded cranny for storage. My idea now is to selectively acquire/create purposeful compositions that speak volumes of the locale in question. I think that 8 to 10 shots of Venice carefully done will render better recall if well blown and hung than a cache full of 'snaps'.

*I agree with the 6x7 ideas but reckon the Leica will suffice. Travel with an RB ???
*I would rather buy new or at least currant used if available. AU offers less options here.
*I often wondered if plastic/CF would work. The comments were what I wanted to hear. I didn't realise that the Walker titan was slow to fold. Why? Any other Toyo CF comments. A thread on the currant runway beauty Ms. Chamonix lead posters to comment that the CF parts would render this camera less conducive to sand etc. Why? is CF soft?
*300 lens would probably suffice. Would this alter the collective comments to any meaningful degree?
*Some good metal Toyo suggestions, any disadvantages?
*The Technika Master seems to get the popular vote. Having not used one I wondered about the rear standard adjustments. Easy, awkward or what. But the point is taken. On a $ reckoning I would be happy to consider something easier on their hip.
*Take-down most important, weather-wise second, bump and bruise proof third.

[Lightbender]

Another alternative would be a 2x3 graphic with a roll film holder or two, one for color one for bw. Pick one lens to set the rangefinder with and a wide-angle lens marked for the hyperfocal distance. The whole kit will takes up less space than a 4x5 camera alone.

[Randy H]

Check out the "getting excited" thread. I haven't seen one in person, but the Razzle looks like the ticket for 4X5 travel-cam

[Steve Hamley]

Second the Mamiya 7II as a travel film camera. I agree you have or very close to, 4x5 quality - certainly you do except for maybe the very best cutting edge 4x5 lenses. The camera, 3 lenses, and a few accessories+some film will fit into a large LowePro belt pack. And it can be used, at least in theory, hand-held. No ND grads though, being a rangefinder.

If you're bent on 4x5, then the Ebony RW45. Simple, sturdy, intuitive, and light for the features.

I almost threw a Leica M6 in a trash can at Dachau in 2001. I had a M6 and of course, it was never changed to use short leader film which was introduced in the 1960s. Leica folks think this is "quaint" and any problems are the results of the unclean using the camera. Anyway, I had loaded film, watched the rewind knob turn as I cranked the lever, then "shot" a teenage couple holding hands with Dachau's barbed wire and guard towers in the background. A truly Cartier-Bresson shot. Except that the film came loose from the take up spool and was no longer advancing. I threw the roll in the trash and sold everything with Leica on it upon my return.

I bought the Mamiya 7II (the Texas Leica) and never regretted it for a single moment. The lenses or lens/film flatness are simply unequaled. The Leica does have faster lenses, which was nice in dim light.

Steve

[David A. Goldfarb]

I've seen a Littman in person, but basically, if you've seen one of those old clunky Polaroids in person, you have an idea of how big the camera is and what it looks like.

[otzi]

I had loaded film, watched the rewind knob turn as I cranked the lever, Except that the film came loose from the take up spool and was no longer advancing.
Steve

Yep. It's happened here too. I now habitually keep a finger on the crank as I wind on. Alternatively wind on an extra frame, with finger on crank, before starting. Strange but true, part of using quaint retro machinery I suppose. Some types of film seem to 'unravel' and unhook? instead of staying tight.

[Jack Flesher]

Any other Toyo CF comments. A thread on the currant runway beauty Ms. Chamonix lead posters to comment that the CF parts would render this camera less conducive to sand etc. Why? is CF soft?


IMO the Toyo CF is not worth the material it's made from, pretty rough and crude. It's a shame, because every other Toyo I've ever used was really nice. You'd be far better off spending twice the money and getting the 45AR or AX, whatever the metal version is.

As for the Chamonix's CF being soft, I found just the opposite. I could barely mark the sheet of CF the GG protector is made from with a scratch awl. It made a slight mark that disappeared when I wiped it with my finger -- seriously hard finish. I have not taken out into the sand yet, but I have no fear doing so. Plus it is easy to disassemble and clean right in the field. Only problem with the Chamonix right now is there is a 6-month wait to get one.

Cheers,

[roteague]

Tripping over the years has shown me that holiday shots like a wedding albums are great for the next few months but invariably gets regulated to some secluded cranny for storage.

Depends upon your point of view. Everytime I look at my pictures of Australia's West MacDonnell National Park, I want to go back and explore more. It is an area I am fascinated by.

[David A. Goldfarb]

The Technika mentioned by several is also built like a tank but I hate the way its rear movements work (many don't mind).

Rear movements are a bit less intuitive on a Technika. The key I find is to release the back, tighten two knobs and loosen two knobs, so I'm only doing one movement at a time. For instance for a rear tilt, I'd tighten the top two or bottom two knobs and tilt, and then if I wanted to swing, I'd tighten the left two knobs or the right two knobs and swing.

[Frank Petronio]

I think it is pretty nice to take a handheld shot with my Technika when I have good light, and a few minutes later I can mount it on the tripod and twist it into a pretzel to make a shot I could not otherwise do without movements. Of course you can do this with a lot of cameras that weigh less, but none are as precise or as robust, in such a small package.

Really weight is the only significant drawback for me but if I am able to handhold and use a couple of Grafmatics and one lens (as I tend to do) then I am not carrying a tripod, lenses, dozens of holders, or even a loupe. So for doing quick walk abouts -- as Venice would be -- it could work nicely so long as you have decent upper arm strength.

Really, it is great fun to walk to the cafe with a pretty ~camera~ in one hand and not much else in the way of photo gear. Six shots from the Grafmatic is good discipline.

[Nick_3536]

My idea now is to selectively acquire/create purposeful compositions that speak volumes of the locale in question. I think that 8 to 10 shots of Venice carefully done will render better recall if well blown and hung than a cache full of 'snaps'.

*I agree with the 6x7 ideas but reckon the Leica will suffice. Travel with an RB ???


You want to set up a tripod in Venice? :eek: Venice USA? Or Venice Italy? :D

A RB/RZ isn't going to be any lighter then a light weight or even average 4x5 camera. Worse the lenses will weigh more and take up more room. While I like my RZ when I look at how low the carry on allowances are for some airlines I can't imagine choosing it.

OTOH while my 8x10 body is heavier then my RZ body it fits a messenger bag just fine. If you're taking more then just a normal lens the 8x10 actually ends up lighter overall then a multi lens RZ kit. :rolleyes:

OTOH if you can live with just one lens why not a Fuji rangefinder?

[Scott Davis]

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the Canham DLC, or the Canham 4x5 woodfield. The DLC is extremely compact, light weight, but it still has lots of bellows for those longer lenses. I've travelled with my Canham 5x7 woodfield internationally and enjoyed the experience.

[cyrus]

If you want movements etc I suggest the Gowland Pocketview 4x5
If you can live without that range of movements, nothing beats a press-type camera, such as a Superspeed Graphic - which was designed to be carried and bumped (all metal body etc) and you don't need a tripod.
Nothing beats it ...except for a Polariod 4x5 conversion which is smaller and lighter. Add a couple of grafmatics and a lightmeter, and you're set.
If you're using medium format, well, lots more choices there. An old Rollei would be great, or a new Mamiya 7II.

[Arthur Nichols]

I regularly use my Canham DLC for traveling and hiking. I have backpacked it extensivley in the mountains in southern Switzerland. It is a great compromise between functionality and weight. I can use my 420 Repro Claron with no problems at all.

[Wilbur Wong]

Another vote for Linhof, mine is MT 2000 it supports 65SW to 300M plus 500 tele. I've watched one of my friends Master Technika tumble from his car trunk and bounce 6 feet across the pavement, unfortunately the Linhof crest emblem fell off. (teehee) Other than minor scuffs, it was just fine. I don't think many cameras can withstand that treatment (understand it was closed).

If you understand rear movements, the MT simply took me a little practice to work out a practical work method. It's pretty easy to do tilt only, or swing only. If you are combining both of these movements it gets a little more tricky because they are not two independent controls.

BTW: I came from a couple of decades use of Sinar F which I back packed etc. I agree it is not a convenient world traveling outfit.

One final thought, anything from the tech V will handle 90mm up. If you want to use that 75, the best bet is the MT3000 (about 6 grand I think . . . I would upgrade from my MT2000 if it wasn't so much, I paid around 3600 a few years ago. Still, the latest version of focus for short focal lengths has been improved and is much easier to use while watching the ground glass.)

[Jon Shiu]

My Tachihara wooden folding 4x5 has been in sand and salt water with no ill effects. Weighs about 3.8 lbs and folds up small. Only takes up to a 300mm lens, though.

Jon

[Thomas Greutmann]

Linhof Technikas have been mentioned here a couple of times, and I can support that. Built like a tank, flexible, but a bit heavy of course. Works fine when traveling.

Two other options:

1. An old Graflex/Toyo Super Graphic. They are very lightweight, fold down very small and still offer some decent movements - more movements than the Speed or Crown Graphic, and less weight. With the proper cams (you may be able to make them yourself) you can even use them handheld. I had nice results with a Symmar 135mm and handheld operation. Compared to a Linhof: not so robust, not so flexible, but you save weight and $$$.

A converted Polaroid 110A/B. Easy to carry around, good for quick handheld shooting, but of course you are limited to only one lens (usually a 127mm).

Greetings, Thomas

[Darryl Baird]

If the Linhof Tech is getting high praise, the Wista RF and SP should get a mention too. All metal, micro-gear controls, rock solid and plenty of accessories. I owned a Tech III system and loved it, my Wista is its equal and cheaper. I went from two Fuji rangefinders, a Razzle-Roid, and a Tachihara into a Wista with a lot of accessories so I could travel with the system. Previously I had to make a decision on which cameras to take along, now I grab one (large-ish) bag and a smaller bag for film rolls and holders and a 6x17.

[Dean Jones]

I've seen a Littman in person, but basically, if you've seen one of those old clunky Polaroids in person, you have an idea of how big the camera is and what it looks like.

C'mon David.....this just ain't 'clunky'...... Then it ain't a Littman either :D

http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~razzle/index.html

[lithophotos]

I have a Walker Titan and a Linhof Technika. I once owned a Zone VI - a bit too glitzy with gold plated brass knobs ( prefer English Understatement!) The Linhofs are like sewing machines, but for me the Walker wins, it is a bit more versatile,though not so refined in terms of construction and it is virtually weather proof. If it gets dusty you can take the lens off and wash it! The real reason for me, though is that at one time or another I have dumped both of the cameras on the tripod, either through extraordinary bad weather, wind blowing it over or by accident, onto rocks. Both cameras survived, but the linhof though still useable was so badly damaged that it was written off by the company and the insurance, whereas there wasn't even a mark on the Walker. So go with the Walker. I always hang a pack from the tripod, but sooner or later it will surely go over. I am going to take mine to India in the new year and although there are lighter cameras, I have confidence in this one.

good luck

Robin

[Darryl Baird]

C'mon David.....this just ain't 'clunky'...... :D

http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~razzle/index.html

not clunky at all, I loved my Razzle-Roid. I could pull it out, insert film (first, not last), compose and shoot... all handheld. It is now doing service in Thailand with another photographer and there are days I wish I still had it, but I had too many cameras to manage. If I get overly flush with cash, I'd buy another and get it totally customized with burgundy leather(ette?).

I'm so locked into that late 60s color aesthetic(dark gray and burgundy were the colors of successful businesses and swanky restaurants back then.)