Older 210mm to cover 8x10

[Ron Marshall]

What are the options for a non-current lens about 210mm to cover 8x10. I prefer multicoated, but single is fine.

I am aware of the lenses currently in production, but they are either too heavy or too expensive for my needs.

From what I have read, the Fuji 210mm W f5.6 seems a likely candidate. What are the opinions of people who have used this lens?

Thanks!

[Ole Tjugen]

Don't know about the Fuji, but I use (several) Schneider lenses:

210/6.1 Xenar: Late, single coated, Copal #1, covers 5x7".
210/4.5 Xenar: 70's, single coated, Compound #3, covers 5x7".
210/9 G-Claron: 70's, SC, Copal 1, just covers.
210/5.6 Symmar convertible: 60's, SC, Compur 1, just covers.
210/6.8 Angulon: 30's, uncoated, Compound #3, lots and lots and lots of coverage!

And about half a dozen old barrel lenses...

[David A. Goldfarb]

And there is the 8-1/4"/6.8 Dagor. I have a coated late Gold Dot version, which covers 8x10". Older uncoated ser. iii versions might have more coverage.

[Jim Galli]

Coated Dagor's in a shutter are desireable and expensive but an 8 1/4" will do what you've asked. A cheaper solution is the venerable Schneider G-Claron in Copal 1 shutter. Prices seem to have dropped on the G-Claron's from a few years ago. I've sold perhaps a hundred of them. I would buy them in barrel from printing cameras and install and calibrate them in Copal 1 shutter. I've pretty much stopped because the price of the components actually dropped below what I could sell them for now. More trouble than it's worth. There are LOTS of barrel lenses that would do the job but most people aren't comfortable with a non shuttered lens. The Computar - Kyvytar - Graphic Kowa 210mm f9 lens is the best of all of them but they fetch nutty prices now.

[Jack Flesher]

Graphic Kowa 210mm f9 lens is the best of all of them but they fetch nutty prices now.

And thanks to Jim I was able to get one for a bit South of nutty!

FWIW... I have a 210 f4.5 Xenar in a Copal 3 (with the "s" insert) and it just misses the full 8x10 frame by maybe 1/4" at the corners. But it produces a really sweet, classic look. VERY sharp in the center, starts to fall off nicely about an inch out from the 8x10 corners. It is clearly a very sweet 5x7 or full-plate lens, but could be used on 8x10 if you are willing to crop a bit or don't mind the clips.

PS: In case anybody here is interested in a two-fer, I am going to be selling that lens in a few days with a set of Kowa 305 cells in the shutter. The 210 aperture marks are really close to 1-stop off for 305 and the Kowa has huge coverage -- from what I understand it almost makes 12x20. Again, FWIW...

Cheers,

[Tony Lakin]

Hi Ron
I was lucky enough to pick up a 210mm f9 Computar for around $600 I don't know if this would be within your budget but I am delighted with mine very very sharp and loads of coverage on 10"X8", well worth the 3 month wait for one to appear on Ebay.
Good luck.

[Matt Miller]

I used a 210 6.8 Angulon on 8x10 when I was shooting that format. Looking back, I wish I hadn't sold it. It is probably my favorite lens that I've owned.

[Ole Tjugen]

I used a 210 6.8 Angulon on 8x10 when I was shooting that format. Looking back, I wish I hadn't sold it. It is probably my favorite lens that I've owned.

I really needed mine two weeks ago - I needed 7" of rise in portrait orientation to get the picture I wanted, shooting uphill towards an old building under a very high and steep mountain. The very top of the mountain and the sky above are soft, but that doesn't matter.

[j.e.simmons]

I use a 210mm Rodenstock Sironar - no APN, no N, just plain. It covers well enough if I don't use more than a smidgen of tilt.
juan

[Ron Marshall]

I used a 210 6.8 Angulon on 8x10 when I was shooting that format. Looking back, I wish I hadn't sold it. It is probably my favorite lens that I've owned.

Did you have a coated or uncoated version? How was the contrast?

Am I correct that it covers 83 degrees at f22?

[Jack Flesher]

Ahhh, almost forgot to mention the older Fujinon W lenses -- the versions with 58mm front filter diameters were 80-degree plasmats, but were only single-coated. The 210 will cover with a few inches of excess IC and even the 180 will cover 8x10, but just. They command a bit of premium when you can find them, but still very affordable compared to Rodenstock 80-degree lenses.

[MIke Sherck]

I don't know how old my Fuji 210 f/5.6 is but it's multicoated, in a black Copal 1 shutter. It *just* covers 8x10 at f/22 or higher but is sharp corner to corner and has excellent contrast. I had originally thought to just use it until I could afford a lens with more coverage but after a few months of using it I don't really see much of a need to change it. I'll look up the serial number tonight and post it.

Mike

[Ron Marshall]

Ahhh, almost forgot to mention the older Fujinon W lenses -- the versions with 58mm front filter diameters were 80-degree plasmats, but were only single-coated. The 210 will cover with a few inches of excess IC and even the 180 will cover 8x10, but just. They command a bit of premium when you can find them, but still very affordable compared to Rodenstock 80-degree lenses.

Jack, How does the Fuji 210 W compare to the Kowa/Computer/Kyvytar 210 f9/6.8 in terms of sharpness?

[Nick_3536]

I don't know how old my Fuji 210 f/5.6 is but it's multicoated,

Then it's not a W. Instead of the serial number check the location of the lettering. Front of the lens? Or around the outside?


http://members.aol.com/subgallery/210w56.jpg

A W should have lettering like that. I'm guessing your lens is a later model.

http://members.aol.com/subgallery/210nw56.jpg

Like that.

[Jack Flesher]

I don't know how old my Fuji 210 f/5.6 is but it's multicoated, in a black Copal 1 shutter. It *just* covers 8x10 at f/22 or higher but is sharp corner to corner and has excellent contrast. I had originally thought to just use it until I could afford a lens with more coverage but after a few months of using it I don't really see much of a need to change it. I'll look up the serial number tonight and post it.

Mike

If it's MC -- lettering around the outside rim of the front barrel -- it isn't an 80-degree version. Also, not all single-coated Fujinons are 80-degree, but the 210 and 180 with 58mm front filter diameters are.

Cheers,

[Tony Lakin]

Hi again
Just a further comment, when I purchased my 210mm Computar I also purchased a 210 G Claron, a 210mm 6.8 Angulon and a 210mm Kowa graphic for comparison, the G claron was sharp enough but with little room for movement, the Kowa was also sharp with a lot more movement than the Claron but not as much as the Computar, the Angulon was old and uncoated in a Compound shutter, it wasn't as sharp as the others and noticably soft outside the 10x8 image area, maybe the more modern Angulon lenses are better.

I hope this is helpful.

[Jack Flesher]

Jack, How does the Fuji 210 W compare to the Kowa/Computer/Kyvytar 210 f9/6.8 in terms of sharpness?

The one I had was very sharp. It was a bit sharper than my Kowa 210, but the Kowa has maybe another 2 inches of IC and is tiny so it's the one I kept.

FWIW, I happened onto one of the 80-degree Fuji 180's, so I'll try it out and report on it next week. But since it just covers 8x10 and I already have a Schneider 180 APO for 4x5, my report on it will probably be a post in the B&S forum :)

Cheers,

[John Schneider]

I would recommend a 210 f6.8 Angulon. Mine is a late model (12 xxx xxx s/n) in a Copal 3 and it has tons of coverage for 8x10. Ones like these come up on eBay 3-4 per year. I used to have a 5 5xx xxx Linhof Angulon in a Compound shutter, and I tested it against the newer 210 Angulon and also two 210 Apo-Sironar-W's. In the center of the field the old Linhof model was the sharpest, although the Sironar-W's were sharper at the edges. The only reason I kept the other Angulon over the Linhof model was for the modern shutter.

[Pete Roody]

I prefer lenses that cover a format with movements over those that just cover. Based on that, the 210 angulon is the easiest to find compact lens that covers with movements. Harder to find is the 210 f9 zeiss dagor that i use and can recommend without reservation.

[Pete Roody]

I noticed you prefer coated lenses. The 210 angulon can be found single coated usually in a copal 3 shutter. The f9 dagors were not coated. However, they are 2/2 cemented construction with only 4 air/glass interfaces and have fairly good contrast even without coatings.

[Ron Marshall]

I prefer lenses that cover a format with movements over those that just cover. Based on that, the 210 angulon is the easiest to find compact lens that covers with movements. Harder to find is the 210 f9 zeiss dagor that i use and can recommend without reservation.

What is the image circle of the 210 f9 Dagor?

[MIke Sherck]

The lettering around the outside of the front lens element reads: "Fuji Photo Optical Co." and "Fujinon W 1:5.6/210". Around the outside of the rear element it reads, "Lens - Japan" and "487044". Reflections of an incandescent bulb are: Purple (on the surface of the outermost element,) gold or amber, violet, bright green. Front element is covered by a 67mm lens cap (generic), rear element by a 51mm Fujinon push-on cap. I bought it on Ebay about a year ago for about $300 and used it on 4x5 until I got my 8x10 this year. I hope this helps but I understand that identification of Fuji lenses can be a little contentious!

Mike

[Jack Flesher]

Mike, that's the newer style EBC multicoated lens, albeit in the slightly older-style chrome-ring shutter.

[MIke Sherck]

Then it's not a W. Instead of the serial number check the location of the lettering. Front of the lens? Or around the outside?


http://members.aol.com/subgallery/210w56.jpg

A W should have lettering like that. I'm guessing your lens is a later model.

http://members.aol.com/subgallery/210nw56.jpg

Like that.

Yes, it's the later model but it does just cover 8x10. I've seen these go for as little as $200, which is a pretty good price for a 210mm lens for 8x10. :)

Mike

[Pete Roody]

What is the image circle of the 210 f9 Dagor?

I have never run out of room on 8x10. The zeiss catalog says it covers 100 degrees (18") at small stops. This would be 11x14 with movements.

[Brian Ellis]

I used a 210 G Claron for 8x10 and it covered from about f16 on down with room for movements, more and more room the more and more you stopped down. G Clarons are single-coated but I never found that to be a problem.

[Kevin Klazek]

My Schneider Symmar-S 210 5.6 just covers with no movements. Sharp corner to corner but definitely tight.

[Ron Marshall]

Yes, it's the later model but it does just cover 8x10. I've seen these go for as little as $200, which is a pretty good price for a 210mm lens for 8x10. :)

Mike

Does your 210 W take 67mm or 58mm filters?

[Pete Roody]

The f9 dagors were not coated. However, they are 2/2 cemented construction with only 4 air/glass interfaces and have fairly good contrast even without coatings.

Whoops! Dagors are constructed of 2 groups of 3 cemented elements.

[turtle]

A 210 Angulon would be about my ideal assuming...or a Kowa. I missed one on ebay that went for $150 minus shutter. That hurt. I find my 210 G claron covers fine with a bit of movement at f32/45. I have not tried large amounts of movement so cannot say how extensive the coverage is. At f45 you certainly get an inch of rise which I can just about live with. Going to the 240 give a real increase in coverage.

[MIke Sherck]

Does your 210 W take 67mm or 58mm filters?

67mm.

Mike

[Pete Skerys]

My early, single coated, Fuji w 210 covers 810 with a enough movement even for non-radical architectural stuff. Fully sharp out to the mechanical vignetting. It was the cheapest 810 "wide field" lens I could find (got mine from KEH, who had a heap of 'em a while ago). Wouldn't swap it for quids! Highly recommended.

[Ole Tjugen]

http://www.bruraholo.no/images/Senja_2007/Scan-070713-0003.jpg

Here's the limit of coverage with a 210mm f:6.8 Angulon on 8x10". I was shooting uphill, so the lens axis was about at the bottom of the image area. Note the bellows intrusion at the bottom there. That makes it about 8 1/2" image circle RADIUS, or 450mm diameter at f:22...

[Mark Sawyer]

A recommendation for the 215mm f/4.8 Ilex Acuton, later labeled Caltar S-Series. I believe it's a Plasmat, and is nicely single-coated. Covers 8x10 with some movements, brighter than the Dagor and as sharp or sharper at the corners. (I have two 210mm dagors, it's sharper than the older uncoated one and as sharp as the very nice gold-rim, for maybe 20% of the cost).

Make sure it's the f/4.8. It also converts to a decent 14", and the two aperture scales were included on the shutter face by the factory.

In my experience, one of the best unknown lenses.

[Armin Seeholzer]

I have a Konica Hecanon II 210mm which covers 8x10 with a lot of movement but I need the Sinar behind the lens shutter or a darkslide!
But I prefer to work with the 210mm APO Symmar which is my sharpest lens, but has not always enough coverage!
Armin