Bye, bye, Adorama [Archive] - Large Format Photography Forum

Ling Z

5-Jun-2007, 22:53

Well, I have been a long time loyal customer with Adorama, and about 1/3 of my LF and MF gears were purchased from them, either new or used. But, about one month ago, I swore to Adorama customer service that I would never purchase anything from them. I've had very bad experiences with them recently.

Five months ago, I ordered a used Schneider Super Symmar 210HM lens from them, and after I had waited for two weeks, they cancelled my order for no reason.

Three months ago, I ordered a Nikkor 90SW lens in EX+ condition. When I received it after ten days, I found they shipped me a Fujinon 90mm junk lens. I have never seen a lens in such a ugly condition in my life. Good thing is Adorama accepted my return and they told me they could not find the Nikkor lens so they shipped a wrong one.

About two months ago, I ordered a used Sinar X by phone. After a week, I found they (eBay ID: adorwin) listed a used Sinar X with same SKU#, so I called their customer service and told them something must be wrong since each used item has a unique SKU#. They told me that everything was fine with my order and that I would receive my camera in a week. However, ten days later, right after the auction closed with a final price about $300 higher than what I paid, they cancelled my order as they told me the camera was actually in much worse condition and they could not sell it.

Thanks for reading my stories with Adorama, and hope my bad experiences won't repeat on others. Bye, bye, Adorama.

CP Goerz

5-Jun-2007, 23:23

I've had similar experiences with their super-sloppy rating system and 'screw you' customer service....I thought I was the only one!

CP Goerz

davidb

5-Jun-2007, 23:38

I ordered film online from them. When it arrived, I checked the dates and it was expired. I called them, was treated like an idiot and was told I could now buy fresh film from them.

They will never get a penny from me again.

Will Thompson

6-Jun-2007, 00:22

Ditto on all the thing already said and add that a few years ago on three different occasions I bought used items (at a better than market price) from there web site to have the order canceled with little or no contact from them!

Martin D.

6-Jun-2007, 04:23

In 2003 I bought a "demo" Hasselblad XPan from Adorama. I had to pay extra 140€ to have it repaired. The lens cap was missing; had to buy a new one. I had to wait 2 month for the center filter. My experience. I will never buy from them again.

jnantz

6-Jun-2007, 06:14

i was buying an aristo cold light head from them a few years ago.
better price than b/h.
i asked a question or 2 pre-sale, they were nasty ...

i called b/h, they matched the and even gave me an additional discount ...
i won't buy from adorama, or even call them ...

Mike Davis

6-Jun-2007, 06:32

I've never had a problem with them that they didn't fix. Although, I can be rather persuasive...

For used equipment, I tend to prefer KEH or Jim at Midwest. But I have successfully purchased a number of items including a Toyo G from Adorama.

In 4x5, I was shooting Forte 200 for awhile so that decided my film supplier. Later in 8x10 I mostly used J&C for their store film.

Mike

Scott Davis

6-Jun-2007, 08:01

I think the consensus on Adorama is that if you're buying something used from them, buy it IN THEIR STORE so you can actually see the item in person before you leave the store with it. Otherwise, don't trust them as far as you can throw them. I think they've taken the retail philosophy of "caveat emptor" to its legally permissible extreme.

vinny

6-Jun-2007, 08:37

They did the expired film thing to me as well.

Ron Marshall

6-Jun-2007, 08:59

KEH Camera Brokers and Midwest Photo Exchange are the best places to buy used gear. Good customer service, and easy returns. The actual condition of the gear is always at least as good as their ratings.

Glenn Thoreson

6-Jun-2007, 09:42

Years ago, I made a phone an inquiry on some items. The were so nasty, I wouldn't buy from them if they were the only store on the planet. :(

Brian Ellis

6-Jun-2007, 11:31

Never had a problem of any kind with Adorama in many years of dealing with them. However, I can only think of one used item I've purchased, usually I buy new things.

Eric James

6-Jun-2007, 12:01

I've never purchased used gear from Adorama, and based on the reports I read around the Net we are well advised to avoid them for used items. My few dealings with Adorama have always been smooth. BHPV pulls the film thing too - just yesterday I recieved 6 boxes of Quickloads with great dates, and an expired box; they did the same thing to me this time last year. They'll take it back so I'm just out the postage and handling.

Gene McCluney

6-Jun-2007, 12:36

BHPV pulls the film thing too - just yesterday I recieved 6 boxes of Quickloads with great dates, and an expired box; they did the same thing to me this time last year. They'll take it back so I'm just out the postage and handling.

The only gripe I have about BHPV is that I can order mid-day (their time) on friday and request 2-day shipping, and sometimes the order won't go out until the following monday. I realize they start their sabbath observance Friday evening, but come-on, if they are open all afternoon, they could at least get out the orders with expidited shipping that came in before 1pm Their Time.

Oren Grad

6-Jun-2007, 14:44

I realize they start their sabbath observance Friday evening, but come-on, if they are open all afternoon, they could at least get out the orders with expidited shipping that came in before 1pm Their Time.

Gene, B&H closes at 2 pm every Friday. They're upfront about the closing time for 1-day/2-day shipping orders on Friday being 10:30am EST/11:30am EDT.

Jason Greenberg Motamedi

6-Jun-2007, 16:35

I have only had positive experiences with Adorama, but then I always go in person and only deal with two employees. Most of their staff don't have the slightest clue about photography, so I only deal with those who do. Julio is one, and I can't recall the name of the other.

As an aside, have you ever dealt with the B&H used equipment department? Now there you will experience a whole new meaning to the words rude and ignorant.

Paul Ewins

6-Jun-2007, 16:55

Yep, I've had the same run-around trying to buy a used Nikon LS8000 from them. See it on the website for a good price ($1100 inc international shipping) so email to enquire whether it has all the bits. Return email to say that I should be emailling somebody else (but not forwarding that email on). So, email guy #2 who says yes it has everything but is now sold. A week later I see another one (i.e. different stock number) at the same price. This time I just buy it and hope. After sorting out some credit card issues I then get told that, no, actually it turns out this one is broken and they can't sell it to me.

I haven't seen used film scanners at B&H or KEH (quite happy with both of them btw) so now it looks like eBay is my only choice.

Sylvester Graham

6-Jun-2007, 17:47

Whoa! I've never had the "pleasure" of purchasing from them, and now I never will! How do they stay in business?

John Kasaian

6-Jun-2007, 19:16

I refuse to buy anything from a store with the suffix "orama" :rolleyes:

Steven Barall

6-Jun-2007, 19:47

I've been handed expired film in store at B&H and Adorama. In addition neither place refrigerates their large format films. I only buy my film from Calumet now. Their prices are competitive and they keep everything nice and chilly.

Jan_6568

6-Jun-2007, 19:52

I bought HP Combiplan tank from them. When it arrived one part was missing. I called customer service only to be told that if I want this part I can call HP Marketing, which is the US distributor for Combiplan tanks. It was some two years ago, since then they did not get any panny from me and will not.
As to the film I usually get it from Freestyle. I think we should support companies like Freestyle.

Jan

Kevin Crisp

7-Jun-2007, 06:36

I used them just once, for an SL66 lens. It was not HFT as advertised. It was internally fogged as not mentioned in the ad. It was sold with caps that did not come. They promised caps then didn't send them and when I called back to ask about that (I'd seen options for other lenses with caps, so they had some) they promised to send the caps but then stopped responding when I asked why I still didn't have the caps. And to top it all off they spammed me after this experience. No thanks.

John Kasaian

7-Jun-2007, 07:30

FWIW, Badger Graphic (for Kodak & Ilford) and Freestyle (for Arista/Foma-oid & Efke) are getting all my sheet film business these days. You can expect excellent customer service from both!

Brian K

7-Jun-2007, 07:58

I've had nothing but bad experiences with Adorama when it comes to online or phone orders. First you can not place any trust in them when they state either on the phone or web site that an item is "in stock", they will take your money and then tell you after a few days that it is back ordered. This happened to me twice with them on time sensitive items and it really screwed me up.

B&H on the other is fantastic at updating their web site. I bought their last 360mm Nikkor tele-ED, and when I went to the store to pick it up, once I rang up the order with the salesman, they changed their web site instantly to "out of Stock".

Richard Kelham

8-Jun-2007, 09:29

Thanks for the info guys. They have recently stuck a lot of overpriced Hasselblad gear on UK eBay – now I've got even more reasons to give it a miss!

sparq

8-Jun-2007, 09:33

FWIW, Badger Graphic (for Kodak & Ilford) and Freestyle (for Arista/Foma-oid & Efke) are getting all my sheet film business these days. You can expect excellent customer service from both!

Freestyle rocks. I hope they'll stay around for a while.

Bob Salomon

8-Jun-2007, 10:12

When it arrived one part was missing. I called customer service only to be told that if I want this part I can call HP Marketing, which is the US distributor for Combiplan tanks.
Jan

Jan,

We, HP MArketing Corp., are the manufacturer of the CombiPlan T system. What part was missing? We very rarely get a report of a missing part. But we did list blue washers on the instruction sheet as being included when they are not even available any longer. Hope you were not referring to them.

However if a part was missing that would be the fault of the factory in Sweden, BiWex - the same factory that makes most of the Gepe mounts - not the fault of a store that sold it.

From the way your post was worded I assume that you had purchased a new, in the box, unit not a used or demo one.

Lazybones

8-Jun-2007, 10:13

Freestyle rocks. I hope they'll stay around for a while.

I agree, but their website is terrible.

Colin Graham

8-Jun-2007, 10:33

Freestyle is wonderful. They recently took back a batch of paper I had problems with, gave a full refund on even a half-used box, tested it and let me know their findings. They even sent UPS to pick it up from my front door! They'll always be my first stop. If only they sold more LF gear. For that I always use MPEX or KEH.

John Kasaian

8-Jun-2007, 16:40

MPEX is most often the first place I'll check when I'm looking for used gear!

J_Tardiff

9-Jun-2007, 12:52

MPEX is most often the first place I'll check when I'm looking for used gear!

Ditto and I'm local to Adorama.

I'll never forget going by Adorama to eyeball a Leitz lens they had listed on Ebay as virtually "mint" --- with a nice scratch across one of the "eyes".

I've also had the "in-stock" now "Backordered" runaround with them. Never again.

JT

Jan_6568

9-Jun-2007, 14:02

Jan,

We, HP MArketing Corp., are the manufacturer of the CombiPlan T system. What part was missing? ....

Bob,
thank you for this post. I bought this tank some two years ago. It was brand new, not the demo. After contacting Adorama customer service I called HP Marketing and I got this missing part. I amd not sure which one it was but it was an important one. I recall I could not use the tank without it, it was one of those orange clips.

best wishes,

Jan

tgtaylor

10-Jun-2007, 09:30

I purchased 6x7 cardboard "K Mounts" from adorama for years until they stopped carrying them. Never had a problem. Then one Sunday, 2 or 3 years ago, I saw a used Toyo 45AX in E+ condition on their website for $650 which was a very good price. I snapped it up on the spot. The next day I got a phone call from them saying that someone had purchased that camera about 10 minutes before I did but they had a 45AX in "demo" condition with warranty for $795 - still a very good price for that camera ao I authorized the additional charge. The camera arrived well-packed (with the folding focusing hood) and in what you hoped "demo" condition meant but with a sticker E+ still on the camera. I guess shipping forgot to switch the labels. I called them up and complained. It took almost a month but they finally put the $145 back on my card. Compared to what everyone else was charging, $795 was a great price - one not to pass-up. $650 was a steal!! Thanks for the bait and switch Adorama!!

Lazybones

10-Jun-2007, 10:57

Another in-stock/back-ordered victim here. Rosco gels sure are hard to get a hold of. :rolleyes: 2 months of e-mail black-out.

alec4444

10-Jun-2007, 14:20

About two months ago, I ordered a used Sinar X by phone. After a week, I found they (eBay ID: adorwin) listed a used Sinar X with same SKU#, so I called their customer service and told them something must be wrong since each used item has a unique SKU#. They told me that everything was fine with my order and that I would receive my camera in a week. However, ten days later, right after the auction closed with a final price about $300 higher than what I paid, they cancelled my order as they told me the camera was actually in much worse condition and they could not sell it.

I'm no legal expert, but if you have a receipt for that item and the ebay ID I think that's fraud and false advertising. I have little patience for such things...I'd report it to the NY Attorney General's office and the NYC Dept of Consumer Affairs. Then I'd report it to the Better Business Bureau, and jot off some nasty letters to the company. All takes about 20 mins of your time, and makes someone's life there most unpleasant.

--A

village idiot

10-Jun-2007, 15:20

Sure wish this thread had started back in May before I ordered my Tech V from them. It maight have saved me the grief I'm going through now. The busted to pieces Tech is on its way back to Adorama with instructions to refund. I will be tracking the package progress, and the minute it is signed for I will be on the phone to customer service. I am hoping the squeaky wheel gets the grease...

J_Tardiff

10-Jun-2007, 15:42

Rick,

Be sure to post what happens--- that was one of the worst mail-order sagas I've read in a long time. What a horror to open that box.

JT

6-Aug-2007, 11:54

Re: Freeestyle's web site:

I agree, but their website is terrible.

Interesting - I have found it fast and easy.

Best,

C

rknewcomb

7-Aug-2007, 13:58

Freestyle has outstanding customer service - they even special ordered boxes of metric sized Efke film for me. They have a very good inventory and even have a "low stock" warning on website items when they're running low on it.
I do wish J&C were still around - but Freestyle is great!
Robert Newcomb

John Berry

8-Aug-2007, 00:12

With all the camera stores that are closing why can't this be one of them?

Brian Bullen

8-Aug-2007, 08:39

I too have suffered from Adorama incompetence. Ordered a 4x5 camera from them, new, and it was supposed to be shipped the day I ordered. A week and a half later I called to check and they said it was being processed, charged my card the day I ordered but hadn't mailed it. I cancelled the order, went to B&H and it was in my hands 3 days later. I don't even check their site anymore, not worth the pain.

davidb

8-Aug-2007, 15:08

I am going to Adorama tomorrow for a darkroom item they have listed as used. I'll report back.

patrickjames

8-Aug-2007, 23:47

Years ago I bought a new 77mm UV filter from Adorama paying the full price for it and ended up receiving an obviously used one. Never again after that. B&H can have their little idiosyncracies as well. A couple years back I purchased a Elinchrom ringlight from them but it came in a box that was obviously not the original and had been fired before. Probably was a demo. I needed it immediately so I kept it, but it left a sour taste in my mouth. Freestyle, Calumet and the local guys get my business these days. Can't say enough good things about Freestyle. They seem to be truly committed to their customers.

Patrick

davidb

9-Aug-2007, 16:12

Okay, so I went to Adorama today for a Schneider Componon-S 150mm enlarging lens. It was listed on their site as EX condition with a price of $129.99

Was it there? Yes it was.

Was it in EX condition? I guess. The barrel showed lots of use but the glass is clean. It is the new style lens.

So, I asked the guy if he could do better on the price. He said yes and took off $10, which was basically the tax.

I think it was a good purchase. Would I buy from them without seeing the item? No.

As for the service, it was fine. Not super, not bad.

roteague

9-Aug-2007, 16:56

I ordered some Velvia 50 QuickLoads from Adorama the other day - at $99 a box. Then I found the Badger had them for about $70 (thanks to naturephoto1). Needless to say, I cancelled the order from Adorama.

Jerry Flynn

10-Aug-2007, 09:58

I purchased a lens shade for my Rollei on Ebay last week In the picture, it appeared to be new old stock. When I got the receipt for payment, I realized it was coming from Adorama. Based on what was written here, I was apprehensive, but the part arrived more or less on schedule, was what it appeared to be in the pictures, so I have no real complaint.

What did interest me is that Adiorama did not, in this case, make it very clear on Ebay who the seller was. Are they aware of their reputation?

SAShruby

10-Aug-2007, 16:46

So at the end of all stories, they bribe you with the low price, put you on the buying spot, than they tell you they have another buyer to try to get more money from you and then they ship you crap nobody wants they don't advertise and in the middle of this stupid selling technique they sometimes send you original item you bid in the first place insted of the crap. That sounds like a good court case to put them down.

Anyone wants to make some money? ;) I'm not a customer, but lots of you are...

jetcode

12-Aug-2007, 21:36

I had a similar experience where I placed an order for a standard Canon L series lens and got a call trying to sell me a refurbished version and spend the rest of the money on filters. Bye bye Adorama, B&H only from now on, no calls, no hassle, totally reliable.

Joe

gr82bart

13-Aug-2007, 07:19

Adorama is one of tose places where you have to know exactly what you want and be firm with these guys. Don't fall for the hard sales pressure they apply. I would not buy anything over the net or the phone from these guys. Not a good place for the meek and feeble. Or the trusting.

Regards, Art.

cobalt

15-Aug-2007, 08:30

dom

17-Aug-2007, 11:04

They are also great at saying things are in stock, then back-ordering, and eventually sending the item long after the order has been cancelled.

Jim Grimes

19-Aug-2007, 15:19

Adorama - Why? There's B&H, KEH, Midwest, and Calumet. I have had good experiences with these four.

pipitra

3-Oct-2007, 00:12

I bought a Sinar F1 on ebay three years ago from Adorwin.It arrived Taiwan two weeks later and I found it was a F.I wrote them to ask them refund me the difference since it's not cost effective for me to send them back.
Although I got the refund for $150 but I think they intend to take advantage of people who don't notice or feel troublesome to complain.
After then I won't even bother to look at their auctions.eric

deatojef

3-Oct-2007, 08:15

You can add my name to the long list of suckers that have used Adorama and B&H. Several years back I bought a huge batch of film from B&H, opened the box, and WHOA...half of my order was missing. It was a terrible experience and their customer service ability was non-existent - they flat out told me I was lying about the missing items. I swore off of B&H at that time.

Since then I've had several transactions with Adorama, small and large. Largely without peril, thankfully. However, last year I ordered some Lee filter parts (can't remember what they were at the time) and they sent the wrong items. So I called customer support, RMA'ed the stuff, and they STILL sent the wrong items. I got my refund after several rounds of painful haggling. One of my biggest gripes (beyond complete incompetence) has to be with them taking more than a week to fill an order - nevermind you paid for overnight shipping.

I'm with the others, I won't do business with B&H or Adorama.

-Jeff

Ted Harris

3-Oct-2007, 08:56

Wow, this thread has gone on for nearly four months and only 53 posts, not all slamming Adorama. What that tells me is that they are not so bad after all. Please do not misinterpert, I am NOT, repeat not a huge fan of Adorama. The only thing I have purchased from them in the past 5 years was a used Majestic head that works fine but was somewhat overrepresented in terms of its cosmetic condition. I buy 95% of my gear and consumables from Midwest and Badger. My point here is simply that Adorama doesn't really look so bad to me when you compare them to some of the real theives in the photo retail industry. I won't do business with Adorama unless they have something in stock that I need instantly and no one else has it bu thaving said that I am thankful they arae around as a (reasonably) full stocking retailer.

SamReeves

3-Oct-2007, 09:02

I'll chirp for Adorama. Sure they aren't the greatest people over the telephone. However all of my internet orders have gone quite smoothly. I've bought a few used lenses from them when I was in my 35mm days. No problems there. If you want to be waited on and pay a higher price, go to Calumet. If you want it cheap and want it fast go to Adorama.

jetcode

3-Oct-2007, 09:03

My point here is simply that Adorama doesn't really look so bad to me when you compare them to some of the real thieves in the photo retail industry.

I call this arm of the market the "Brooklyn Hustle" - gee that's an awfully low price on a very expensive camera, honest quote "do you actually think we are going to sell you that camera for that price?" oh no, you only advertised it on your website announcing it to the world, but thank god you want to sell me a whole lot of useless accessories at overly inflated prices to make up for the fact that you can't get the camera for what you are claiming to sell it for.

alec4444

5-Oct-2007, 05:00

Christopher Nisperos

6-Oct-2007, 14:59

Adorama doesn't really look so bad to me when you compare them to some of the real theives in the photo retail industry.

Ted,

Who, for example?

Best,

Christopher
. . . . . . . .

SamReeves

6-Oct-2007, 22:12

Like these guys Christopher:

http://donwiss.com/pictures/BrooklynStores/

"Heeeey, you wanna buya camera?" :D

Asher Kelman

7-Oct-2007, 01:51

I used to think Adorama and B&H were "it" when it came to photography. But that was when I was using 35mm and medium format. Even in medium format my interest began to wane (lack of Rollei SLR equipment....& knowledge), and now that I'm in large format both seem rather useless. I'll still pick up some photo paper there, but that's about where it ends. Having visited the used department for both stores, I can truly say their stuff is WAY overpriced.
--A
I buy from Adorama and they have always rated lenses conservatively and delivered as promised. I have had others complain and so that shows they need to tighten up Q.C. for sure.

B&H is in a whole class by itself. They have perhaps the largest inventory, a huge staff and yet 99% of the time they deliver what they say at a price that's competitve and the products are exactly as stated! Further when things go wrong, as somethimes things do, they correct the mistake, usually with one phone call.

Used gear sold in a photography forum is a bargain for all of us since the buyer pays less and the seller keeps more. A mega store, like B&H, however, has to pay for shelf space and all the overhead it demands. That view camera, gathering dust or not has to pay it's way just the same as a Canon 1DIII. So one cannot expect to get the used LF camera for the same price as on a photography bulletin board! Unless you know the person, buying at KEH, B&H and so forth means one does pay more, even WAY more. Still one get a large company behind the product.

One thing for sure, B&H and Adorama should never be mentioned in the same breath as "the Brooklyn hustle" scammers. Especially in the case of B&H, if everyone tried to do business the way that B&H carries itself, then we'd have a far more ethical world. I'd add to this Canoga Camera, Samy's Camera (unfortunately having only about 15 used and 1-2 new LF cameras (an 8x10 Canham) in stock in the LA store) in California. KEH goes to the top of the list in understating the descriptions of used items. For KEH "Bargain" is actually "Prety good and perfectly functional camera", LOL! BTW, Allen's camera in PA is another reliable store one can trust.

Asher

Christopher Nisperos

8-Oct-2007, 03:23

Like these guys Christopher:

http://donwiss.com/pictures/BrooklynStores/

"Heeeey, you wanna buya camera?" :D

Thanks for the information, Sam. I think every mail-order buyer ought to see the link you referenced. Regarding the prevalence of dishonest stores, here are a few quotes I found interesting:

==============

"It is a perennial problem for us, particularly in New York, not necessarily for New York customers but for customers around the country," said Anthony Barbera, manager of the Information and Investigations Department of the Better Business Bureau of New York. "It is kind of a gray area, and we don't have enforcement power."

Keeping track of the companies has been a challenge, Mr. Barbera said, because they shift identities, shedding each Web site as it gains a bad reputation.

Without evidence of outright fraud, law enforcement agencies have largely declined to pursue criminal charges. This year, the state attorney general, Eliot Spitzer, mediated four complaints against Price Rite and referred two to the city Department of Consumer Affairs.

"It's just not something we have the resources to pursue, in terms of you need a pattern and you "It is a perennial problem for us, particularly in New York, not necessarily for New York customers but for customers around the country," said Anthony Barbera, manager of the Information and Investigations Department of the Better Business Bureau of New York. "It is kind of a gray area, and we don't have enforcement power."

Keeping track of the companies has been a challenge, Mr. Barbera said, because they shift identities, shedding each Web site as it gains a bad reputation.

Without evidence of outright fraud, law enforcement agencies have largely declined to pursue criminal charges. This year, the state attorney general, Eliot Spitzer, mediated four complaints against Price Rite and referred two to the city Department of Consumer Affairs.

Keeping track of the companies has been a challenge, Mr. Barbera said, because they shift identities, shedding each Web site as it gains a bad reputation.

Without evidence of outright fraud, law enforcement agencies have largely declined to pursue criminal charges. This year, the state attorney general, Eliot Spitzer, mediated four complaints against Price Rite and referred two to the city Department of Consumer Affairs.

"It's just not something we have the resources to pursue, in terms of you need a pattern and you need a number of complaints and a similarity in the pattern in order to put an action together,"

===============

On this last point (needing similar complaints), if Mr. Spitzer were going after Adorama, for instance, the thought occurs that a thread such as this might suffice as a strong piece of evidence! The irony is that internet —the medium which has made it simpler for the con-men to fleece the consumer-cum-sucker— has also made it simpler to rapidly spread the word as to who those very crooks are. Weight and counterweight in one. Whew. But the warning, "caveat emptor" remains true. These alerts do no good if unread. Perhaps someone should create a website as a clearinghouse of complaints: "www.photoswindle.com" ?

Best,

Christopher

. . . . . .

tgtaylor

8-Oct-2007, 10:52

Adorama's not that bad. In fact I never really had a problem with them. Although they apparently hit the digital/film panic button and priced a film camera too low (way too low) on their website and then recovered their senses and called me up and wanted more, they made good on the initial price and even called me back one day and offered a $15 discount on my next lens for the camera (Toyo 45AX). I never took them up on the latter but just recently I purchased some darkroom equiptment from them that wasn't available locally and wasn't in-stock at B&H. Quick delivery and no problem.

Christopher Nisperos

9-Oct-2007, 13:08

Adorama's not that bad.

ACT 1
. . . they . . . priced a film camera too low (way too low)
... and then...called me up and wanted more . . .

ACT 2
they made good on the initial price and even called me back one day and offered a $15 discount on my next lens for the camera (Toyo 45AX).

Hi Mr. Taylor,

Act 2 is what any honest retailer does anyway. In my informed opinion, it does not excuse Act 1 and moreover, doesn't exactly show how they're "not that bad"!

Just my opinion (which includes the possibility that you're probably a very forgiving guy!).

Best,

Christopher

. . . . . . .

JW Dewdney

9-Oct-2007, 17:23

My first experience with them was purchasing a 180mm sironar in 1985 or so... it had a half inch chip out of the front of the glass. After that - i bought from them only when absolutely necessary...!

Asher Kelman

9-Oct-2007, 19:04

My first experience with them was purchasing a 180mm sironar in 1985 or so... it had a half inch chip out of the front of the glass. After that - i bought from them only when absolutely necessary...!
JW,

That sounds aweful! Was the chip in the package? What did they say? Could be some guerilla packed it. I cannot believe that the guys that graded the lens tried to put over a fast one on you! Was this sold as a used lens and how was it graded?

Did they refuse to correct things?

I remember a Canon 200 1.8 shipped from a guy that sells a lot arrived with the front element loose. He told them to collect from the shipping company!

I asked if he's photographed the lens prior to delivery. That's what I always do! Anyway he was so offended by me asking the question that he's never spoken to me again!

Now that's the risk one has with a private sale. With the superstores, errors or accidents can happen since the people packing and lugging the packages are, like all of us, descendants of apes!

Did your experience with Adorama really go over the top? Was it really bad practice or what happens with big companies with a huge staff?

Also. remember, the person who packed the 180mm sironar in 1985 is now probably long gone for not turning up or some other issue! That's 22 years ago!!

Since then I've bought many expensive lenses, especially in the past 5 years and never had a problem!

Asher

"Journeys To the Masterpiece" (http://www.openphotographyforums.com)

JW Dewdney

9-Oct-2007, 21:11

No - there was no chip inside the box - that I saw anyway. It was a 'brand new' (well - being SOLD AS a brand new) lens. It was about $175 or whatever they were at the time...! The funny thing about it was that the sales person didn't look surprised when I opened the box to check and noticed that. He seemed bizarrely cool about it. (I was buying it in the store - good thing I opened the box!). I'm guessing he was quite aware of it beforehand. My guess is that the lens had an accident in the store (fell to the floor) and they were trying to sell it - hoping someone wouldn't notice and not have a chance to return it. But who knows...

gr82bart

12-Oct-2007, 02:54

mikie

12-Oct-2007, 08:21

gr82bart

12-Oct-2007, 08:59

12-Oct-2007, 09:13

Might be fun to send a note to the whatever NYC bureau deals with consumer fraud etc. Ditto to NY state AG.

Adorama needs to get their act together. Way too many bad stories here.

best

Jeremy Moore

12-Oct-2007, 09:16

I recently purchased an SD Card, for my camera that does not work. I called Adorama to get a refund, and they told me, no refund will be made. I am stuck with an SD card that does not work.
I asked to speak to a manager and they sent me to voice mail.

Adorama will not be getting my business anymore, and I plan to tell as many of my friends about my experience with this crummy company as possible.

Good bye Adorama

Mikie

Did you pay with a credit card? You can charge back the amount. Or most SD card companies have very good warranties and you could contact them and let them know what happened in regards to your trying to return it for a working copy.

Asher Kelman

12-Oct-2007, 10:52

Did you pay with a credit card? You can charge back the amount. Or most SD card companies have very good warranties and you could contact them and let them know what happened in regards to your trying to return it for a working copy.

This is so right! Apple is the same. If you buy a 3rd party product in person and it doesn't work, they'll swop it out, right then and there! Wait or call by phone and you will depend on your interaction with the particular person you get on the phone. Then you have to generally get redress from the MFR not Apple.

Amazon is THE place for best return rights and option. I'm nort sure whether it's 10 or 30 days, but it works.

I frequently buy from Adorama and have never had any issue. There will always be an occaisional problem so call the manager.

B&H has one person, Mr. Posner who deals with public interface and that is a great experience generally. I don't know of anyone from B&H. In K&H, Tim is really helpful.

This SD card incident is not IMHO any reason for me to stop buying lenses I want from Adorama. I do call and get an assurance that if it doesnt work I can return it.

An SD is a commodity item and I've had cards from mail order sites fail and had to go to the MFR!

Asher

David Karp

12-Oct-2007, 11:23

I've said it before and I'll say it again about Adorama or many of the other NYC stores - B&H included. You have to go there in person, know exactly what you want ahead of time, don't ask a lot of questions - if any actually, inspect the items right there on the spot and buy/don't buy.

Deviating from this procedure will severely reduce your buying experience.

Regards, Art.

My only in-store experience with B&H was many years ago. I came in and asked to see a monorail camera, and some accessories I was thinking about buying. I told him that if I liked it, I was going to buy it by telephone, to avoid sales tax. The salesman was polite, helpful, did everything I asked, let me play with the camera, etc. Ultimately, I decided it was not for me, and bought nothing. No complaints, no problems. Nice guy, very helpful.

Via mail order, I have bought many items. I returned a MF lens that cost lots of $. There was nothing wrong with it. It was just the wrong focal length for me. I called after a few days. They accepted a return and refunded 100% of my money without question.

I mostly deal with MPEX now, but I never, ever had a problem with B&H.

On the other hand, a few weeks ago I e-mailed Adorama customer service regarding a used item shown on their website. About 2 weeks later they responded asking for their item number. I answered the same day they sent the e-mail. It has been days with no response!

gr82bart

12-Oct-2007, 11:56

..., but I never, ever had a problem with B&H.Fair enough, in my zeal, I lumped B&H with Adorama and that's not right on my part. I too have had no issues with B&H (no issues with Adorama either since I follow my own advice!). My bad. My apologies.

On the other hand, a few weeks ago I e-mailed Adorama customer service regarding a used item shown on their website. About 2 weeks later they responded asking for their item number. I answered the same day they sent the e-mail. It has been days with no response!Communicating by e-mail with Adorama is an exercise in futility. They're bad enough in person, so this route is slightly worse than self-flagellation.

Regards, Art.

Christopher Nisperos

12-Oct-2007, 12:31

I've said it before and I'll say it again about Adorama or many of the other NYC stores - B&H included. You have to go there in person, know exactly what you want ahead of time, don't ask a lot of questions - if any actually, inspect the items right there on the spot and buy/don't buy.

Deviating from this procedure will severely reduce your buying experience.

Regards, Art.

Good point, Art... although I notice that relatively few buyers (including myself) have any major problems with B&H. Regarding the inspection of the item(s) on the spot, I would add:

-Check for broken seals on exterior boxes or interior packages (this includes scotch tape on little plastic bags). Also, look for empty bags or packages.

- Try to know what normally should be included with the item. Batteries, neckstraps, instruction booklets, cases, pouches, body caps, lenscaps, eyecups, coupons, long guarantees or forms to fill-out for rebates*, etc. Sometimes these accessories or extras are listed on the manufacturer's website.

-This is perhaps obvious, but look for signs of previous use or abuse (such as the battery already having been installed, the straps already attached, fingerprints, dust, etc.)

Best,

Christopher

*I've heard stories of certain dishonest retailers who write fake invoices with the name of, say, the owner's son-in-law as "customer". These are then sent to the manufacturer so that the rebate money comes back to the store. As well, how would you feel about paying for an "extended warranty" and later finding out that the item already carried the longer than usual protection? Whether these stories are true or not, it doesn't hurt checking ahead of time to know if any rebates, promotions or programs will apply to your purchase.

. . . . . . .

David Karp

12-Oct-2007, 12:39

I actually got a reply. With photos!

John Kasaian

12-Oct-2007, 16:22

FWIW I've never had any problems from B and H, and all the transactions I've had were mail order.

Jim Graves

13-Oct-2007, 01:32

Adorama listed a 90mm Super Angulon on ebay in VG condition ... They rated it, had pictures of it, and a full description ... I was the only bidder @ $147 ... a pretty low price ... I paid by PayPal the same day... when it didn't arrive in 7 days , I inquired. My only communication from Adorama was a message from PayPal that my payment was refunded ... the note from Adorama within the PayPal message was that the lens "did not pass their pre-shipping inspection." They reveiwed, rated, photographed, and took the time to describe and list the item on ebay ... and it doesn't pass their "pre-shipping inspection?" I'm guessing, of course, but I don't think I would have been allowed not to pay ... but they felt fine about not shipping.
I asked for either a comparable lens or that they ship me the lens that was listed. They refused both ... even though they listed at least 4 similar lenses on their website over the month and a half in which we exchanged emails.
Did I lose any money ... no ... did Adorama screw around with the customer ... yes ... I ended up passing up a comparable lens and going on a backpacking trip without a 90mm that I thought I had bought because ... I suspect ... they didn't get the price they thought they should ... or they got another offer while the auction was supposedly going on ... and took it.
Complaints to ebay were fruitless ... but I will NEVER, EVER buy another item from Adorama and I will be sure to tell everyone I know about this thread and several other threads about Adorama's ethics. In the meantime, I have had great dealings with Badger and B&H.