Longest Heliar in a modern #1 shutter

[Steve Clark]

Anyone know what the longest Heliar to fit in a #1 shutter is ? Either factory mounted, or cells that will thread in with no machining.
Thanks, Steve

[Jim Galli]

150mm.

[Steve Clark]

Thanks Jim. If I find a 150 in a barrel, are the cells likely to be a direct fit? Or am I better off to wait for one in a shutter? Which brings up another question. Earlier and later versions still the same size? Thanks, Steve

[Jim Galli]

Steve, barrel lenses are usually found with equal size front and rear barrels. I'd avoid them. The one I had was coated so probably from the 1950's or even '60's and was in a Compur #1 rimset shutter. That's the only one I'd put any $$ on. Good luck.

[Struan Gray]

There's a 180 mm Heliar in what looks like a Compur 1 on eBay.de right now. Swapping the cells to a modern Copal would be a doddle. Aperture scales from the usual suspects.

[Ole Tjugen]

The 180mm Heliar (if it's f:4.5) will most likely be in a Compur #2. I'm not certain about the 165mm, but on the other hand I've only seen that one in dial-set shutters, so it could well be a "special".

Even a 1925 Heliar 150mm f:4.5 in dial-set shutter is a direct fit in a Copal #1 - Voigtländer were among the first to adopt what was later to become "standard threads".

[Struan Gray]

Should have known not to bet against Galli :-)

[Ole Tjugen]

Found the 18cm Heliar on ebay - and that's a Compur #2 shutter. Max speed 1/200, when the #1 had 1/400.

[Arne Croell]

The regular (not Universal-) postwar Heliars came in 150,180,210, 240, 300 and 360mm focal length. The 360mm only came in barrel. The others used in most cases Compur 1, Compur 2, Compound 3, Compound 4, and Compound 5 for the 150, 180, 210, 240 and 300mm, respectively. Only the last versions used the Compur 5FS electric shutter instead of the Compound 4 and 5, and a Compur 3 instead of the Compound 3 (these are not compatible).
The sizes are the same for the Apo-Lanthar 150, 210 and 300mm versions, that is 1, 3, and 5. The 300 is occasionally also seen in a large Ilex shutter - not sure if that was a retrofit or a US-specific version made by Voigtländer.
All of them were also sold in barrel. In most cases, Voigtländer barrel lenses are not a direct fit into a shutter.

[Jim Galli]

The same gentleman that has the 180mm in Compur also has a much earlier 15cm in barrel. It appears to me that this is one that would NOT go into a no.1 shutter as both front and rear barrel appear to be the same diameter.

[Steve Clark]

Does that Compur #2 have a flash sync?

[Ole Tjugen]

Does that Compur #2 have a flash sync?

It has a PC flash contact, so I would assume it does.

That kind of #2 shutter was introduced in 1953, with X-sync right from the start. :)

[Alex Tymków]

Hi
I have a 1920s 150mm ƒ4.5 Heliar in a No 2 Compur dial set shutter, of course no flash synch. I tried to fit the front element into a rimset 1970s Compur shutter and it wouldn't fit - very nearly but it was slightly too small. They must have changed the thread after mine was made. I'm sort of relieved in a way as I have just had a Wista lensboard drilled to take the No 2 shutter. The lensboard plus drilling cost more than I paid for the lens plus shutter. Cleaned up the lens and found a chip in the front element, took some pictures, so we shall see.
Alex

[Steve Clark]

Thanks much for all the help. One other thing, should the front and rear serial numbers match? or not necessarily. Thanks again, Steve

[Ole Tjugen]

Hi
I have a 1920s 150mm ƒ4.5 Heliar in a No 2 Compur dial set shutter, of course no flash synch. ...

That's not a #2, it's a pre-standardisation "oddball". The #2 was only introduced as a defined size in 1953.

[Alex Tymków]

Steve
The numbers on mine do match, I'm not sure of the significance, if any, if they don't.
Ole
They certainly are "odballs". I have another Compur from the same era which has a 49mm mounting thread as opposed the 45mm with the Heliar. I think we forget that standardisation in most things photographic only happened post war.
Alex