Shen-Hao 5x7 HZX57-IIAT vs. FCL57-A(NEW)

[ppisczak]

I'm saving my pennys to purchase a new Shen-Hao 5x7. There are some obvious differences between the two models they offer such as weight, bellows extension and greater movements on the HZ. I do notice some differences in controls and was wondering if anyone has any opinion on those differences in terms of "creature comforts"? My use is city architecture, landscape, portraits and a modicum of backpacking. Weight is always important, but not critical in my case as I am already hauling around an 18 pound bogen tripod. The question is whether the extra 2.2 pounds of weight justifies the (ostensibly) more complex controls? Thanks again for your erudite opinions as they are always appreciated.

pj

[Nick_3536]

I haven't used the FCL so can't compare directly.

From my view point if you need any of the added features of the HZX you get the HZX. If you don't need those features then the FCL's lighter weight and lower price win out.

[ppisczak]

Nick,

Thank you for your response, it is much appreciated. In a more general sense it may be better if I pose the question in the following manner: For those of you who have knowledge, experience or have used either of the two 5x7 Shen-Hao models, what do you like or dislike? Opinions will vary, but each is important to me when making a decision, particularly at the associated costs.

Thanks,
pj

[Nick_3536]

If I could wave a wand and change anything about the HZX I'd make it lighter. Other then that it's perfect for me. It handles lenses wide to long. For both 4x5 and 5x7.

[Amund BLix Aaeng]

I have the FCL-57, and if anything architecture is on your mind, it`s not for you...
Actually, your post made me have a closer look at my own camera, and found a serious misrepersentation on Shen-Hao`s website regarding rise on the FCL-57. I don`t use that much movements, so maybe that`s why I haven`t seen this before now.. On the Shen-Hao website it`s says it have 50mm rise, but it`s actually 22mm at best! It also says +-10 degrees center tilt on the rear standard, there is no center tilt..... Hmm, thinking about it, I`d like those extra 28mm of rise...
Hmm, time to email them and ask a few questions...

[Songyun]

shen hao hzx57 is old model, while FCL57 is new model.
If I remember correctly, shen hao made 45 57 810 in the HZX series. About the same design. Focus knob is on the front. 57/810 may have a little bit knobs than 45.
Then all in a sudden, Shen Hao started to make FCL series 57 810 camera, with the focusing knob bellow the screen. (Philips design?). For the information I gather from a Chinese photo forum, that Shen Hao started to make these FCL series about 2 months after Chamonix started to make 810 camera for Chinese market.

Here is a very interesting thing here, when a few days ago when Mr. Zhang announce Chamonix on this forum, a lot of people jump on that thread, call charmonix stealing other people's idea (philips design)(I have no comments on the business conduct of Chamonix, just talk about the design). While on the other side, people here praise Shen Hao. If you look closely, FCL line from Shen Hao is also a philips design modified. Does some people here have double standard here?

[fuegocito]

I am quite baffled as well as to the 180 degree turn of altitude toward the two very "similar" build design between SH and Chamonix cameras. Where are those so righteously defending US intellectual property, Chinese low wages driving mom and pop shops to the ground and all the rest. Actually I don't want to know, much less need to hear more of those hostile posts. This is much more civilize way of discussing what we all like to do, work with descent cameras and make photographs.

I heard Chamonix just came out with a 45 that is feather weight yet tough as a rock.

[Songyun]

By the way, can any one show me a picture of philips 4X5? Tim showed me a link last time, but there are no pictures there. I just want to compare philips and charmonix. Really want to see the original philips design.

[Rob_5419]

Here is a very interesting thing here, when a few days ago when Mr. Zhang announce Chamonix on this forum, a lot of people jump on that thread, call charmonix stealing other people's idea (philips design)(I have no comments on the business conduct of Chamonix, just talk about the design). While on the other side, people here praise Shen Hao. If you look closely, FCL line from Shen Hao is also a philips design modified. Does some people here have double standard here?


I agree with your concern, however your question, asking others to reflect on their own views and standards, against what they have written in that awful thread, doesn't come easy on a public forum.

It's just as well Ralph Barker, the moderator has locked the thread , however it has shown LF Photography Forum at one of its ugliest moments which is best not revisited.

Returning to the question of 'copying' design: there is a marked fundamentalist and territorial ferocity about design concept when it goes beyond patent/copyright issues of design elements from some, who will then reiterate every single copyright law/infringement/penalty that others deserve, with a fluent ability to quote from obscure legal text.

However part of civilisation and development is about learning from others, as well as embracing new advances in design. This applies in every field beyond camera design manufacture too.

I'm pleased to see some support for large format camera manufacture on a large format photography forum. Sometimes it's just not clear - anyone who disagrees should leave now and join a forum for 35mm miniature format ;)

[ppisczak]

I appreciate those who have responded to my request for opinions on either of these two [2] models. I will likely purchase the HZ model at the expense of added weight and when the time comes, hopefully by the end of April or May I will do a Product Analysis and publish my comments. Thanks again to all those who were helpful.

pj

[fuegocito]

Hi PJ,

I must say first I have not handle any of the cameras mentioned above but I have keep abreast of all the comments made about them. From what I can gather, the Chamonix is a better crafted camera than the SH's. The HZ is obviously a time tested design but there have been talk of it being rough around the edges, an indication manufacturing tolerance is not what it needs to be. The FCL series, SH uses wood as their base plate where as Chamonix use Carbon fibre if that makes any difference to anyone. So far I have not heard any negative comments made about the Chamonix and yes, they do have a 5x8 model that you can order a regular 57 back.

Hope this helps

[Nick_3536]

I must say first I have not handle any of the cameras mentioned above but I have keep abreast of all the comments made about them. From what I can gather, the Chamonix is a better crafted camera than the SH's. The HZ is obviously a time tested design but there have been talk of it being rough around the edges,


Well it's obvious you've never seen a HZX.

[fuegocito]

Yes, I only seen them in photos. By no mean in saying anything negative about them, only options:D

[Amund BLix Aaeng]

Hi PJ,
The FCL series, SH uses wood as their base plate where as Chamonix use Carbon fibre if that makes any difference to anyone.
Hope this helps

And it pretty obvious you haven`t seen a FCL either, the main part of the base plate is metal...

[fuegocito]

opps:) I am really making a jackass out of myself here, never mind anything I have said:D

Amund, How are you liking the 57 so far, the FCL does look very interesting. Is the metal plate embeded into the wood base or screw on. Any thing you wish it to be different?

Thanks

[Amund BLix Aaeng]

You can see some snaps of it`s base here (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=19657) It`s screwed on..

I really like it, easy in use og light-weight. As you can see from a post earlier in this thread, I just discovered it has less front rise than advertised, other than that, I`m very pleased.

[turtle]

I asked on another thread about rigidity of the FLC57-A. Any views? I am seriously interested in this cameera if it nicely hadles a 450mm lens. Seems that the Canham has it doubters at longer extensions and this shen Hao is a LOT cheaper. I have heard that the 5x7s and 10x8 are very well made indeed. I could be tempted by the HZ as I do like the traditional construction and am a bit wary of the 'err how does that work' construction of the new lightweight. Is it fiddly to set up like a Canham ?

[kleinbatavia]

I have a HZX, it is a great camera, fit and finish are very good, better than my wista dx. That said, it is a heavy piece of equipment (8 lbs+ for just the body). The result is that I hardly, if ever, use it. Keep thinking about selling, but not actually doing so as I would feel sad to part with such a nice camera...