newcomer to BTZS tubes

[Blueberrydesk]

So I've bitten the bullet and took the leap into developing my own black and white; I'm armed with 25 (24 actually, I used one to practice loading holders in the light) sheets of Fortepan 200, and I've been searching through the archives for info on btzs tubes. I like the idea of ease of use, and I'm limited on space (it'll be a bathroom darkroom), so I thought the tubes would take up less than tray developement.

My questions, and I have many, would be these;

I've read that to get the film out of the tube, you can insert your thumb and twist the film slightly to break the bond between film and inside of tube. But I thought that the emulsion side would be the side facing inwards; wouldn't planting your thumb square on the emulsion and 'twisting' harm the image? Or is the film only removed after it has been fixed?

To start, I'll be doing one sheet at a time (4x5), until I get the hang of things. I'm curious about the procedure, though. I understand about getting the film in the tube and sealing it, then filling the extra cap with the developer, but when it's time to open and pour the developer, what happens then? I put the tube into the stop bath, then seal it again, right? And then I move it back to the water so I can 'roll' it? Then, pour the stop bath, fill with fixer, and move back to the water to agitate? At what point can I turn on the lights?

I wish I could hang out in one of your darkrooms for a day or two, to see how it's done. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Claude Sapp]

I use a double sided sink to develop, with one side filled with 68 degree water to spin the tubes in and the other side empty so I can pour out the used developer. I use plain water in a small plastic tub for stop. About 10 seconds before dev time is up I remove the tube from the water bath, turn it vertically so the removeable cap is on the bottom and let the developer drain into the cap for the last few seconds. When dev time is up I drop the cap into the empty side of the sink and quickly drop the tube in the stop spin it a few times and leave it there until all tubes are developed. I have fix in a deep tray and after I have developed all the tubes I take the tubes out of the stop bath tub, remove the film and then shuffle the film in the fixer. I do all this under very subdued light, just light enough so I can see, and have never had fogged film. Breaking the film away from the tube is very easy if you try to do it under water in the stop bath tub, less easy if you are just holding the tube in the air. Never had a fingerprint on a neg either. I find other ways to screw up negs. Tons of other ways.

[sanking]

SI've read that to get the film out of the tube, you can insert your thumb and twist the film slightly to break the bond between film and inside of tube. But I thought that the emulsion side would be the side facing inwards; wouldn't planting your thumb square on the emulsion and 'twisting' harm the image? Or is the film only removed after it has been fixed?

To start, I'll be doing one sheet at a time (4x5), until I get the hang of things. I'm curious about the procedure, though. I understand about getting the film in the tube and sealing it, then filling the extra cap with the developer, but when it's time to open and pour the developer, what happens then? I put the tube into the stop bath, then seal it again, right? And then I move it back to the water so I can 'roll' it? Then, pour the stop bath, fill with fixer, and move back to the water to agitate? At what point can I turn on the lights?



I use BTZS type tubes for developing film with rotary (continuous) type agitation and PVC open-ended tubes for reduced agitation development. There is no better way to develop film, IMO, in that you totally eliminate the risk of scratching, get more even development than is possible with trays, most of the work can be done with the lights on, and you can mark the tubes to give shorter of longer develoment to some of the sheets. Although my favorite method of develoment is reduced agitation in PVC open-ended tubes I will comment here only on development in BTZS type tubes with continous agitation since that is what you ask about.

You are correct in that the film is placed in tubes so that the emulsion is facing inward toward the center of the tube. However, it is good practice to wet the back of the film to prevent it from sticking to the side of the tube. To do this, just take the tube with the film already loaded (always load with the tubes completely dry), remove the cap and grab the film by one corner. Now drop the tube into a water batch, gently moving the film in and out of the tube. If you do this gently you will not damage the emulsion of the film. Wetting out the back of the film will insure that it does not get stuck to the side of the tube, which might happen if you poured in the developer with the film dry. It will also ensure that there is an exchange of chemicals on the back of the film during development, which promotes even development and prevents staining on the base of the film. After you wet out the film, put the cap back on and proceed with develoment.

Once development has finished just remove the cap and plop the tube into the stop bath. Assuming you do this quickly you can leave the lights on. No, the lights will not fog the film as it is almost completely de-sensitized near the end of development!! After the stop bath I generally remove the film from the tube and fix in a tray.

I have developed hundreds of sheets of 5X7 film in BTZS type tubes using Pyrocat-HD and have never experienced any uneven development or staining on the back of the film.

Sandy King

[Blueberrydesk]

Thanks to both of you for your fast answers! I think I've got the routine down (in my head, at least). Sandy, my only other question would be, doesn't wetting the film with water prior to developing cause uneven development or spotting? Obviously it doesn't, since you don't have either of those problems, but I guess what I'm wondering is how long do I let the water in the tube drip, before it's okay to screw on the cap with the developer and begin?

I'm really looking forward to getting my hands dirty and I can see myself taking all sorts of crappy around-the-house shots just to develope something... :-)

oh, before i forget, gloves during the whole process? or is it just the fixer that irritates?

Thanks again for all the help!

[Blueberrydesk]

Sandy, I'd love to hear the process for reduced agitation in open tubes, too. I apologize for all the rookie questions, but I'd be a bigger fool if I didn't try and pick the brains of everyone on this forum. :-)

[Claude Sapp]

I wear gloves for the whole process, and I use pyro developer. No matter what developer though, gloves reduce exposure to the chemicals. Can't hurt to wear them.

[sanking]

Sandy, I'd love to hear the process for reduced agitation in open tubes, too. I apologize for all the rookie questions, but I'd be a bigger fool if I didn't try and pick the brains of everyone on this forum. :-)


OK, I will try to briefly explain the use of reduced agitation in open end tubes. But first, a few comments on the reasons why one would chose this method.

1. Enhanced adjacency effects. Both theory and empirical evidence support the fact that when film is developed in an appropriate developer, with dilute solutions and reduced agitation, greater apparent sharpness is often the result.

2. Maximum possible emulsion speed is obtained with reduced agitation, even though time of development to reach a desired CI is longer. But don't confuse EFS with CI. Many people do, unfortunately.

3. Maximum compensation is obtained with reduced agitation. This works well for scenes of extreme contrast. Other methods can be used, i.e. divided development and reducing the time of development with standard dilutions, but IMO the best way to compress scenes of great contrast is with dilute solutions and reduced agitation.

4. Micro-contrast is enhanced.

5. There is almost no danger of scratching the film.

OK, how to do it. First, what you need.

1. PVC tubes. Basically, all you need are some pieces of PVC tube of the ID and length needed for your film. 4X5" film, 1.5" ID, 5.25" length, 5X7" film, 2" ID, 7.25" length, 8X10" film, 3" ID, 10.25" length, 7X17" film, 3" ID, 17.25" length. PVC is better than ABS for this purpose because it has a specific gravity greater than water, which means it will not float.

2. A container in which to place the tubes for development. This could be any open container, but if so development will need to be in the dark. To avoid developing in the dark use a container of the right size which can be closed off to the light. Depending on the size of your film this might be a plastic or metal can, a battery case, or print drum. I personally use a 11X14" Beseler print drum with a lid that when closed provided complete protection from the light. In this drum I can place up to six tubes with 5X7" film, in vertical orientation.

How to do it?

1. First, mix your developer and fill the developing container (tray, can, drum, etc.) to the needed depth. This will vary a lot depending on whether you develop in horizontal or vertical orientation. For this type of development I use a 1.5:1:200 solution of Pyrocat-HD or Pyrocat-MC, with four agitation periods. Others use the same dilution with only two agitation periods (semi-stand) or just one agitation period (stand), but normal agitation is also possible with the tubes.

2. Now, load the film into the tubes.

3. In a water bath, wet out the back of the film by pulling it gently from the tube and then pushing it back in. This will prevent the back of the film from sticking to the edge of the tube, as I explained in a previous message. If you are using a container that can be made light tight, place the lid on it at this time.

3. Agitate very vigorously for 1.5 minutes. Then agitate again for 10-15 seconds at the 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 points of total development time. Other agitation methods are possible, from normal agitation to stand agitation.

4. When time of development is over, remove the film (still in the tubes) from the developer and place in a stop bath. After 10-15 seconds in the stop bath remove the film from the tubes and fix in a tray. The lights can go on for good as soon as the film is in the fixer. Actually, as soon as the film is in the stop bath, but waiting until it hits the fixer is an added safety measure.

This is a very elegant and simple method of development, almost fool-proof in fact, for sheet film up to about 8X10" in size, or perhaps up to 11X14"or 7X17". Most of the work is done with the room lights on, and after the film gets the initial agitation very little attention is needed for the duration of development. Films larger than 7X17" require so much developer that the physical weight of the solutions imposes logistical problems that favors other forms of development.


Sandy King

[j.e.simmons]

For my 4x5 and smaller negatives, I found storage containers at Target that work well to hold 6 tubes horizontally. The containers come with lids, so you can slosh the developer around without sloshing it out. The containers are clear, so you have to develop in the dark. I don't find this to be a problem.
juan

[Brian Ellis]

I don't have time right now to read all the other responses so this may be duplicative but when your development time is up with a particular sheet remove the cap and place the tube in a pot or pail of stop bath. Just make sure there's enough stop bath to full cover each tube. Keep doing that until all the sheets are finished - it won't hurt anything to let the early tubes (assuming you have more than one development time in a run) sit in the stop bath for a few minutes. The light can be on, once the the film hits the stop the light won't affect it and as long as you move fairly quickly in getting the tube in the stop after the cap is removed the light won't hurt the film between the time you have the cap off and the time the tube goes in the stop bath. I'm sure someone else has explained that the emulsion side faces out, it's the base side that's stuck to the inside of the tube. I don't wear gloves but then I don't do pyro any more.

[Blueberrydesk]

Thanks all! Sandy, you intrigue me. I'm gonna order the tubes today, and I can see a lot of experimenting in my future.

Brian, thanks; an excellent summary of what I wanted to know. I can't wait to get started! I'm sure I'll have more questions for everyone in a week or two...