Broken Shen Hao, HELP!

[ageorge]

I was out in very damp conditions over the weekend and when removing by dark cloth the removable back of my Shen Hao 4x5 came part. There is a piece of wood that the GG spring is screwed into that is glued to the rest of the removable back. This came a part where it is glued. I guess the glue failed as I was not using much force. I pressed everything back together and carefully proceed to make 12 exposures without a repeat failure. I am contemplating what to do next. I guess I need to pull it apart, sand it and re-glue it. Not having done this kind of thing, I was wondering what grain of sand paper and if there is a specific wood glue that I should use? Do I need to refinish the wood after sanding or do I just carefully sand the old glue off? I contacted Badger Graphic to see if I could just get another back (it would actually be nice to have a backup), they have not gotten back to me with a cost as yet. Thanks in advance for your input.

-alan

[Dave Parker]

Alan,

If your comfortable with hand tools and sanding, I would not anticipate any problems carefully taking it apart, cleaning the the attachment areas and then re gluing, should be a pretty straight forward process, as long as none of the wood got broken, I would use Elemers Contractors wood glue, just make sure the mating surfaces are clean and sanded, with no hint of old glue or finish, another thing I have done in the past to fix cameras that come apart in this manner is to drill a couple of very small pilot holes and tap small brads in to help secure it, I would start out with about 220 grit sandpaper and progress to 400, this should clean things as well as leave it in good condition for gluing, also pick up some heavy rubber bands and wrap the area glued that way it don't shift while drying.

Dave

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

Alan,

Without seeing where your camera back came apart, I'm having a hard time visualizing what you'd want to sand. Is there some old glue residue or finish that needs to be removed, or are you talking about sanding the wood? Perhaps you could post a pic?

If it all fits tightly back together without sanding, I think that would be the way to go. A thin bead of waterproof exterior glue like Titebond II and clamping overnight should fix the problem. Gorilla Glue would be another brand to consider if you can't find Titebond II where you live. Just follow the directions on the bottle and wipe off any excess with a damp cloth before it has a chance to dry.

Kerry

[ageorge]

Kerry,

When it came a part there was quite a bit of glue on the exposed surfaces which is what I am assuming I would need to sand off. I am wondering if the damp conditions caused this. The glue held the tension of the GG springs for 12 exposures after reattaching to my surprise. Perhaps the damp allowed the glue to reattach? I was reluctant to try and force it apart again, but I don't want to be in the field when it fails again with an unusable camera.

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

Alan,

You might try using a scraper to remove most of the glue residue before using a little fine sandpaper for final clean up. The important thing is to not remove too much wood. You want a reasonably snug fit. The glue will fill small gaps, but you don't want it to be too loose. If you don't already have some, small Irwin Handi-Clamp and Quik-Grip clamps are available at your local Home Depot or other home repair center. They are inexpensive and good to have around for these types of small repairs. I have several of each and use them all the time (basically whenever I glue something). A good glue joint will form a bond stronger than the wood you are gluing. So, once the repair is done, you should be set for many years of happy shooting.

Kerry

[GPS]

Couldn't you just drill a small hole through both parts and fill it with a wooden pin, glued to hold?

[jmcd]

Your camera would have had to be sitting under water for the moisture to cause the glue to fail, so photographing under damp conditions should be fine. More likely a poor bond for one of many reasons at the time of manufacture—poor fit, insufficient clamp time, gluing with the wood and glue at vastly different temperatures, or gluing when it was too cold, say below 50 degrees.

If you are going to glue again, the goal should be wood-to-wood contact. A sharp scraper would be of great help, but they are not supplied from the store ready to cut properly. If you use sandpaper, wrap it around a small block of wood to keep from rounding the surfaces to be glued. You must remove the old glue on the surfaces, as the goal is wood-to-wood contact. When you are satisfied with the fit, vacuum the dust from the surfaces to be glued so that it does not interfere with adhesion. Regular yellow glue is more than strong enough for the job. The parts will need to be clamped snugly and evenly while the glue dries.

As an alternative, a good woodworker in you area could handle the repair.

Good luck.

[Nick_3536]

Sounds like too much glue to me.

Doesn't Shen still come with a life time warranty?

[jmcd]

One other possible cause for yellow glue and hide glue failure is exposure to high temps, say 120 degrees or more, such as baking in the trunk of a car, or in a closed shipping container in July. Still, a quality fix can be expected.

[Ken Lee]

Sounds like too much glue to me.

Doesn't Shen still come with a life time warranty?

Yes. If you return it to them for repair, be sure to contact ShenHao first, and remember to mark it appropriately for Chinese Customs.

My camera sat in customs for weeks on end, waiting for someone to pay duty. Luckily, I had a friend in Shanghai who could make the necessary phone calls.

[Dean Jones]

I would suggest a visit to a boat shop. Marine adhesives such as Resocinol are easily mixed, very strong, waterproof and long lasting. Sanding back and removing all the original glue is important.
I built a wooden boat once....went to sea in it...totaly held together with Resorcinol! :)

[ageorge]

Fixed!!!!

Stopped by the hardware store on the way home yesterday and picked up some sandpaper (100 and 220 grain) and some waterproof wood glue. When I got home the back had separated again, so I didn't have decide to force it apart. I did see why it held together during my last outing. The glued surfaces where very tacky, like when you put off a sticker and it leaves the sticky part on the surface. I was surprised that wood glue would do that. This made it particularly hard to get off the failed glue. Sanding would just push around the sticky goo on the surface, never really exposing the wood. I ended up having to take a putty knife at a 90 degree angel and scrape off the goo from the wood surfaces. It took quite a bit of force and effort to get it all off. Is this normal for wood glue? I would think that it would be more solid and sandable. After removing the goo, the rest of the procedure was pretty straight forward. Sand 100, then 220, apply glue, clamp, remove excess glue, leave clamped for a couple of hours, and then set for 24 hours.

Thanks for all your advice,
-alan

[David A. Goldfarb]

Isn't it great to be able to repair your own camera with ordinary stuff from the hardware store?

[Kevin Crisp]

Not as great as having a camera that doesn't come apart in moist weather....

Go get some Titebond II wood glue. Sand off the old glue, being careful not to alter any basic wood dimentions. Apply glue sparingly, clamp for a couple hours. It will never happen again -- at least not where you made the repair. The wood will tear before this stuff comes apart.

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

The glued surfaces where very tacky, like when you put off a sticker and it leaves the sticky part on the surface. I was surprised that wood glue would do that. This made it particularly hard to get off the failed glue.

Alan,

Congrats on fixing your camera.

The original glue was either defective, contaminated, improperly applied or imporperly cured (or perhaps all four). It should never have failed in the manner described. Your new repair should last a lifetime. I just hope the rest of your camera doesn't start coming unglued the next time you use it.

Kerry