Flash Supermatic Shutter

[John Cahill]

Another neophyte question. I have a 152mm 4.5 Ektar in a Flash Supermatic Shutter (top sp is 1/200)

I once tried a flash with it, using an ASA bayonet to PC adaptor but it would not fire the strobe. Does the flash synchro? have to be cocked separately in that shutter, or should it work just like a modern Synchro-Compur?

TIA

[Diane Maher]

You should be able to get it to work. Did you change to the flash sync mode on the shutter?

[Mark Sampson]

There must be some variation in those shutters. I have in front of me a 127/4.7 Ektar from 1945. It's in a black 'Graphic' #2 Flash Supermatic. Its top speed is 1/400. It has a bipost flash connector and next to that, on the face of the shutter, is an arc-shaped window with delay settings for bulb flash. A set-screw holds the settings in place. There are only two settings, '5' and '20'; which must refer to milliseconds delay for the bulbs. Oddly there's no 'X' setting for electronic flash.
However at home I have a 135/6.3 Wide Field Ektar, from 1948, also in a Supermatic. This one has the ASA bayonet flash connector and 'X' setting in the window. Electronic flash works fine on that shutter.
That said, if your shutter has an 'X' setting and your flash won't fire, I'd suspect the external connections first, and the shutter internals last.
Another tip- you can check the age of your lens by the serial number which should have two letters at the beginning. Use the CAMEROSITY scale, 1-9 +0, to tell the year of manufacture ( E R = 45).

[John Cahill]

Diane and Mark, Thanks for your responses. I see no flash synch settings (M/F, nor any windows with delay numbers. Nothing at all. It is just an ASA post bayonet.
Thanks for the camerosity code. My lens is RR, so that comes out to 1955, nicht wahr?. I would ASS u ME that with no settings to change synch, it is just a good ol zero delay for strobe. Why I would want it to work for flash is beyond me. I think I shall just leave it as is.

I paid one hundred dollars for the unit at a DC area camera show mebbe ten years ago, including a flannge. I bought an Ansco lens board from some guy up in Pennsylvania who advertised in Shutterbug..

The lens is pristine and the shutter seems to work just fine. I probably will expose my first film over the weekend. I'll try to establish a baseline EI for this lens and shutter, using a Weston V meter that seems to be dead on.
Wish me luck.

[Glenn Thoreson]

The flash sync contacts in the shutter probably need cleaning or repair. Not a big problem.

[Doug Kerr]

Hi, Mark,


There must be some variation in those shutters. I have in front of me a 127/4.7 Ektar from 1945. It's in a black 'Graphic' #2 Flash Supermatic. Its top speed is 1/400. It has a bipost flash connector and next to that, on the face of the shutter, is an arc-shaped window with delay settings for bulb flash. A set-screw holds the settings in place. There are only two settings, '5' and '20'; which must refer to milliseconds delay for the bulbs. Oddly there's no 'X' setting for electronic flash.

Shutters with the sync markings in milliseconds were made before the "F" and "M" notation came into general use, and at that time, electronic flash hadn't really entered the picture either. Thus there would be no need for an "X" setting (and that notation wouldn't have been in use either).

The shutter might be earlier than the lens.

Best regards,

Doug

[Doug Kerr]

Diane and Mark, Thanks for your responses. I see no flash synch settings (M/F, nor any windows with delay numbers. Nothing at all. It is just an ASA post bayonet.

Is there any chance that the shutter is labeled "Flash Supermatic (X)" ? The Graphax/Rapax shutters that are "X-sync all the time" are marked like that, and I have this vague recollection of seeing something coresponding on Flash Supermatics). (May have come to me in a dream, of course!)

Best regards,

Doug

[Doug Kerr]

Hi, Diane,


You should be able to get it to work. Did you change to the flash sync mode on the shutter?

I don't believe that the Flash Supermatics have any way to disable flash sync contact operation. (The Graphax/Rapax full synchro shutters usually do. The X-sync only ones don't - they don't need it, as there is no sync delay timer needing to be disabled.)

Best regards,

Doug

[John Cahill]

Hi Doug,
I was looking over the Flash Supermatic again last night. I also found from an Ek manual that the top shutter speed of the Flash Supermatic with the 152 Ektar is 1/200.
The little knob next to the button which locks open the shutter, and which can be moved in a channel around the rim apparently has something to do with the flash.
I tried moving it (gently) with no result. But when I cocked the shutter it moved easily in the channel. When I release the shutter, there is a brief gear sound, then the shutter opens. I appears to be an adjustable delay--although there are no markings at all.
The plot thickens.

[Dan Fromm]

Self-timer, John.

[John Cahill]

Hi Dan, If it is a self timer, one would have to travel warp speed to take one's own pitcher. It provides a very short delay before firing the shutter, no matter how far it is set.

[John Cahill]

Hello, again. I finally got the answer to the problem with the Flash Supermatic.
The reason the flash would not fire was a faulty ASA bayonet to PC adapter. I know have one that works--and works just fine.

The knob at top to which I referred is obviously a continuously variable delay so the intrepid bulb user could establish a synch point for the ss and bulb used. According to Ek specs for the shutter, it can be synched with strobe and with any other bulbs. I see know how this is done. And in 1955, when the lens was made, there sure were a lot of different bulbs from which to choose.

Now, about a self timer........(vbg)

[Glenn Thoreson]

If it has a variable sync delay setting, that is for bulbs. On these shutters with the separate delay gear train, the way you achieve X-sync is to NOT cock the delay lever. It will sync for electronic flash/strobe uncocked if it is working properly. If it doesn't work, it may have a bad resistor inside the shutter. Some versions had a 10K ohm resistor in the circuit. The reason for this escapes me.

[John Cahill]

Hi Glenn,
Yup, it fires and synchs perfectly at zero delay (although there are no delay markings anywhere). I have not even seen a flashbulb for maybe, thirty years.

[Glenn Thoreson]

That's great. Now, all you need to do is make a test photo with it to make sure it's actually firing when the shutter is fully open. I hope so. Cheers ----

[Dan Fromm]

Glenn, I'm not sure that a test photo is needed. I check 'em by attaching a flash to the shutter, firing the shutter and watching to see what the flash shows. All this with the lens/shutter off the camera, the diaphragm wide open, the flash aimed at the back of the shutter and, usually, the rear cell removed. I look at the back of the shutter. I use a low-powered flash or one with variable power turned all the way down.