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Gerry Harrison
23-Nov-2006, 23:34
Hello,

This is an announcement below from Beijing times Oct 24 2003...I have just purchased some Lucky SHD 100 new formula from ebay and sent from Taiwan. They seller said it acts very much like Kodak Tmax..interesting.

Eastman Kodak announced yesterday that it has signed a US$100 million 20-year co-operative agreement with China Lucky Film Corp, China's only enterprise in the imaging industry.

Analysts say the move will further secure the US imaging giant's presence in China --- the world's second largest film market, and put pressure on Fuji --- Kodak's global rival.

It signals that Kodak is finally out in front in its competition with Fuji to win Lucky co-operation. Fuji had also talked with Lucky over possible co-operation in past years, earlier reports even claiming they were very close to a deal.

According to the new agreement, Kodak will contribute US$45 million in cash and provide an emulsion making line for colour products for a 20 per cent stake in Lucky Film Co Ltd, the listing arm of China Lucky Film Corp.

Meanwhile, Kodak will provide US$54.5 million and technical support to assist Lucky in upgrading its existing triacetate film base production and coating lines, and give an emulsion and coating line to Lucky.

Kodak also promises to provide manufacturing technology support to Lucky on an ongoing basis to enable it to produce world-class colour products.

According to the agreement, Lucky will pay Kodak for the use of selected technologies, and pay dividends on the shares owned by Kodak.

After the two sides enter into co-operation, Lucky will continue to manufacture and distribute Lucky brand products.

However, the final co-operative contract is subject to the approval of relevant departments of the Chinese Government, according to a press release from Eastman Kodak.

Insiders say the agreement was inked after years of tough negotiation and obviously Kodak made a big comprise because it usually asks for a majority stake when launching joint ventures.

With only a 20 per cent stake in the listed company, Kodak has also promised in the agreement not to acquire the company's floating shares in the secondary market.

"This is very likely to be only the first step in Kodak's co-operation with Lucky," said Xiao Hanping, imaging industry analyst with China Galaxy Securities. "Even the parent company might become the next acquisition target."

Officials with Kodak and Lucky said the two companies hope the co-operation will help strengthen their competitive position and presence in new and existing markets, particularly among emerging markets in Asia.

For example, the Greater Asia region, Lucky's primary market, is the world's fastest growing market for photographic film, and China is Kodak's second-largest market for photographic film.

"The agreement reflects current practice in the industry, in which more and more companies are collaborating to achieve specific market goals," said a press release from Lucky.

However, the company declined to give reasons why it finally chose to co-operate with Kodak, not Fuji, and Fuji officials have not been available for comment.

A Kodak official said there will be a press conference next Wednesday in Beijing, when more detailed information about the co-operative deal will be disclosed.

Kodak is already the No 1 player in the Chinese film market. In 1998, it signed a US$1 billion contract with the Chinese Government to launch full-scale co-operation with China's imaging industry. That pact allowed Kodak to acquire all of China's enterprises in the film industry except for Lucky.

Now, the rough estimate is that Kodak controls about half of China's film market, with Lucky holding about 20 per cent.

Xiao said the new agreement would very likely reshape China's film market.

"Fuji might feel the squeeze if Kodak and Lucky form a sort of price or market alliance," he said.

Some experts also expressed the worry that if all of Lucky were to be acquired by Kodak, China would lose its only domestic film brand and Kodak would monopolize the Chinese market.

"The key is what Kodak will do next step," said a Beijing-based analyst who declined to be named.

However, Xiao of Galaxy said that for Lucky itself, seeking a foreign co-operative partner is a good choice, because it would be very difficult for the company to seek to further develop by itself, since its technology is not as advanced as that of Kodak and
Fuji.






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Capocheny
23-Nov-2006, 23:58
I'll still stay with Ilford and Fuji... Kodak, for me, will be a last resort. :)

However, if Kodak started formulating new films (or bringing back films that they've recently removed from production) for LF... I may reconsider using them again. But, I suspect I'll be staying with Ilford and Fuji. :)

Cheers

John Kasaian
24-Nov-2006, 09:24
I find it ominous that Kodak has agreed not to attempt to buy the controlling shares of Lucky, while Lucky did not reciprocate.

While the film market in Asia is huge by any standard, when digital-itis captures that market too (as it will) what then? 20% of a failing giant film market dosen't sound like a good return on a nickel shy of a cool billion dollar investment (hey, its deja vu all over again!)

Oren Grad
24-Nov-2006, 09:37
It's not useful to try to read anything into a three-year-old news item. Much has changed in the market for film since then.

Gordon Moat
24-Nov-2006, 11:51
Kodak signed a co-operative agreement with Lucky Film around four years ago too. I wonder if this changes that earlier agreement. I would suspect the reluctance of the Chinese government to allow much foreign control over any industry would limit the percentage of ownership of any investor; though the amount of potential revenue might be enough to make the deal quite good. Also, I nearly hate to say it, but it could be that anti-Japanese sentiments played into the decision not to do more with Fujifilm; I don't know that to be the situation, though it has happened in a few other cases in China.

I suppose an optimist would state that means at least twenty more years of film availability, plus cold storage and expiration dates. If nothing else, this would be a good article to forward to anyone attempting a death of film posting. I simply hope E100VS continues to be available, especially in Readyloads.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat
A G Studio (http://www.allgstudio.com)

eddie
24-Nov-2006, 16:48
GREAT!
i have been asking "when is china going to make films" for years. i have been waiting for them to steal some emulsion info for years so they can beging manufacturing it. this way we can all use film for the next 20 years easily and affordably. the chinese will be using film for a long time. i think it is even better that kodak went in. now i know that the chinese have good info to make nice films.

the chinese motorbikes in thailand are such good copies that the japanese parts work and visa versa. so i hope to have some good cheap chinese made kodak film for years to come.

one happy shooter

eddie

Andrew O'Neill
24-Nov-2006, 17:06
I would only get excited about Kodak if they brought back 45 infra-red film.


i have been waiting for them to steal some emulsion info for years so they can beging manufacturing it.

I hope they can get their hands on the infra-red formula.

Seriously, why doesn't Kodak even do a once a year run on this film? It would sell like hotcakes....moon cakes in China!

snuck
24-Nov-2006, 18:51
Yeah i'd spring for the good ol HIR in 4x5. Heck I'd bankrupt my poor student indebted self.

Scott Davis
26-Nov-2006, 02:53
Have you seen the haloing you get on the regular Lucky emulsion in 35mm? it looks an awful lot like HIE, but without red filtration. If they made the Lucky SHD 200 in sheet film, that could be a viable alternative.

al olson
26-Nov-2006, 06:45
This is interesting news...

I just recently noted the availability of Lucky 35mm when I received my most recent Freestyle catalog. Maybe I will have to try some?

I'm with you, Andrew, I still have about 20 sheets of Kodak HIE hoarded in my freezer. Don't know if it is still good, but I hate to use it up in case a better opportunity for its use comes along. I'm using 35mm instead. Kodak runs this one time a year.

Wouldn't it be nice to have their EIR in sheet film as well as the HIR?

Maybe Lucky will take over this market niche.

al

Andrew O'Neill
26-Nov-2006, 09:31
I still have about 20 sheets of Kodak HIE hoarded in my freezer.

It'll be fine, Al. I exposed my last sheet in September and it was 6 years old. I only kept it in the fridge. It came out fine.
Didn't people ban together recently and persuade Kodak to make ULF of Tmax or one of their conventional films??
Come on Kodak! If you can run 35mm IR once a year, certainly you could do the same for 4x5!

TLGG1
26-Nov-2006, 19:32
"Eastman Kodak announced yesterday that it has signed a US$100 million 20-year co-operative agreement with China Lucky Film Corp, China's only enterprise in the imaging industry."

One more good reason not to use the YellowBa$tards products. A nice agreement with a country that has actively threatened the use of Nuclear Weapons on the US. Why would TheYellowGodfather care, all they want is the money.

chinapaul
15-Oct-2008, 03:58
I used a lot of films, including Ilford, Kodak and Lucky.The T-max film was more gorgeous,the Tri-x film was more simple.But Lucy is cheaper than Ilford and Kodak.

I take a lot of photos about old buildings in Beijing with Lucky Film.I find that Lucky Film will also make some sense of simplicity.

D. Bryant
15-Oct-2008, 05:17
I used a lot of films, including Ilford, Kodak and Lucky.The T-max film was more gorgeous,the Tri-x film was more simple.But Lucy is cheaper than Ilford and Kodak.

I take a lot of photos about old buildings in Beijing with Lucky Film.I find that Lucky Film will also make some sense of simplicity.
Interesting Flickr photos.

Don Bryant

chinapaul
15-Oct-2008, 06:50
Interesting Flickr photos.

Don Bryant

Thanks, Don Bryant!