Berlabach & Horseman LX, trust issues..

[Tony Flora]

I recently purchased a Horseman LX (15lbs+++), and I am doing some research on a suitable tripod. I have looked at most of the specs on the tripods within my price range and I have narrowed down the list to about 3 contenders. My price range is between $150 and $300 for a complete tripod and head setup. I realize that there are a lot of possibilities for using surveyor's tripods and other non-traditional tripods but I would like to stay with something fairly modern and specifically designed for photography. I will be using the tripod for about 95% Architectural subjects and 5% landscapes. I hope to buy a field camera in the future so I would like to have something that can handle itself in the field and also be nimble in a tight interior, but this is not a priority. The real priorities I think are 1. stability 2. utility and 3. mobility. I am looking at new and used tripods and I having no problem buying on *bay to get within my price range.

My short list:

1. Berlebach 2042 ($229 new)..... Wood tripod with lots of great feedback from this site and appears to be up to the task in every way. The only thing missing is a geared center column. Probably not the best tripod for shooting with my DSLR.

2. Davis & Sanford CC Compact C Tripod Legs ($129 new)..... Supports 30lbs, price is right, very light at 5 lbs. Also does not have geared rise. Not well suited for the field but can multi task with a DSLR..

3. Giottos MT-9170 ($144 new)..... Good all around tripod, claims to be able to support 25lbs.. I like this pod, it has everything I want except no geared rise. Looks like it would be great in the field, in a tight condo, or with my DSLR mounted to it. Also has a base that allows for direct mounting with panning and tilting abilility. Which I could use while I work on a tripod head. My major concern is: is it really up to the task of a 25lb camera?

I am leaning toward the Berlebach just because of reviews it has gotten on this site. Most people seem to think it will support much more then its rated 26.5lbs. But I am having a hard time getting past the functionality of the Giottos and the weight and support of the Davis and Sanford.

Am I missing anything? Thoughts. Advice.

Thanks,

Tony Flora

[Bob Salomon]

All Giottos MT series tripods are rated to support 33 pounds not 25.

[Tony Flora]

Bob,
Thanks for the reply. From my reading here I believe you handle marketing for Giottos in U.S.. Is that correct? If it is I guess you would know, but according to www.giottos.com the max capacity is rated at 12Kg which converts to 26.455 lbs. Also, both B&H and Adorama have it rated at 26.5 Lbs.

-Tony

[Brian Ellis]

I can't help you with these three tripods, I've never used any of them. But I'd suggest you ignore the availabilty of a geared center column as a factor in your decision for a couple reasons. First, using a center column converts a tripod into a monopod, which isn't such a good idea. Second, it's difficult to use them with a LF camera because you presumably already have the camera at about eye level and if you raise it much higher you can't see enough of the ground glass to focus and compose. Third, the center column adds weight and cost, unnecessarily so IMHO. There may be users out there who have a different opinion about the value of a center column for LF photography but I have two tripods, one with and the other without a center column. I use the center column quite a bit for medium format and digital photography but I've never used it that I can remember with my LF camera.

[Bob Salomon]

Tony,

We handle both Giottos and Berlebach in the US. The current MT line supports 33 pounds. The series introduced at Photokina and that will be here in Spring supports 25 pounds as it is a lighter version.

[Tony Flora]

Bob,
Nothing personal but that answer is what scares me about buying a Giottos. B&H and Adorama are currently advertising the MT-9170 at 26.5 Lbs. Your saying the current ones are 33 LBS, but the new ones in spring will be rated at 26.5 Lbs.. So B&H Adorama are selling pods that are not available yet? If this is true, the bigger issue would be why would a manufacturer change the max capicity (Which could only be done from altering the build) of a tripod and keep the same model number? I really like the Giottos but having doubts about the rated capicity is a major concern.

-Tony

[Bob Salomon]

Tony,

Our weight is correct. And are the capacity in the brochures from the factory for the models on the market currently.

[Nick_3536]

I forget is the 9170 the four section or the three section? I have the four section model. It has had no problem with holding my Ansco 8x10 [13lbs??] or my Cambo 8x10 monorail. 13+ pounds I think. Those are biggest cameras I have-) I guess with lens the most I've had on is 16+ or so.

It's better to go to the manufacturer websites then to trust the dealer websites. When I was looking to buy some lights last year the B&H website had the shipping weight for the lights I wanted at a crazy figure. Shipping would have been more then the cost of the lights. I don't know how many items B&H carries but it's enough that errors can be expected to creep in.

[Tony Flora]

Nick,
The 9170 is the 3 section tripod, the 9180 is 4 section. That appears to be the only difference between the two. I would go with the 3 sections just because it seams like it would have less places for problems to occur. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?

The manufacturer's website says 12KG/26.5 LBS.. www.giottos.com

[rob]

Those old Davis Sanford floating tripods work with the LX (I have both 4x5 and 8x10 LX). I have the model A (floating center) and BG (gear lift), both with nice heads. The BG is rather heavy. They are dirt cheap at the bay, I got the BG for $ 51 shipped.

[Nick_3536]

I went with the four section because it folds up smaller. I also almost never use the last section.

[Brian K]

I use many tripods, all of them Gitzo. While I have issues with Gitzos they seem to be the best overall compromise. I own all 3 sizes of the Carbon fiber versions 1228, 1349 and 1548, and 2 of the large studio metal Gitzos (509 and 1500) and find that carbon fiber doesn't resonate the way metal does. It seems to dampen vibrations better. I tried the Berlebach because it was wood and also dampened vibration, so I bought one from B&H and eventually returned it (sorry Bob) because in a head to head comparison with the gitzos, the head of the Berlebach had some wiggle. That might not be a factor for someone doing normal exposure times, but if you do exposures into the minutes or hours it can be.

[Robert Skeoch]

Hi Tony,
I only know about the Berlebach tripods. I don't like the 2042 for the following reasons.... the built in ball head works great with a spotting scope or small camera but I didn't find it suitable for my over-weight Wisner 8x10. It just wasn't solid enough.
I don't use a centre column with the 8x10 but reset the legs on a taller tripod. The 2042 is too short if you don't use the centre column.
I do like the Berlebach tripods though. People seem to find the 3002 to be a great tripod without a centre column or the 3022 if you want the centre column. My self I use a 4002 but it's really taller than I need. (I'm 6'2")
There's a good selection of tripods for LF at www.bigcameraworkshops.com

[Tony Flora]

Just thought I would update this thread, I ended up buying a manfrotto 475 with a 3057 head. (I know, not on my short list.... not the first time). The 475 is in excellent condition and appears to be a solid tripod. The head is only rated for 22lbs, so I will be pushing that with the LX fully loaded but I think it will be okay....? I got the whole setup for less then $300 and I think it will be a solid setup. What do you think?

[Lee Hamiel]

Tony:

Between my sons & I we have two Berlbebach's (7023/8043), Ries model C (early version), Manfrotto 3021/3001/3030a & the 475 you reference - with that said - it is a great tripod & very solid & having a geared center column is nice to have once you get up to these weights.

Good luck

[riooso]

I have the Berlabeck 2042 with a Bogen 577 quick release. I have a Toyo 4X5 AX metal camera. I love this tripod and if you can put up with the weight, rated at 7 pounds, you will find it sturdy. The balled center is stable when you are setting up if you keep it down till you are ready to raise it. When you lock it down, it is locked down. When raised it is still stable. You will not beat this tri-pod for the price.

Richard Adams

[Tony Flora]

I just got the 3057 head in the mail. Wow, what a beast. I think I'll be okay with this thing. 22lbs seems very conservative.

[Capocheny]

Just thought I would update this thread, I ended up buying a manfrotto 475 with a 3057 head. (I know, not on my short list.... not the first time). The 475 is in excellent condition and appears to be a solid tripod. The head is only rated for 22lbs, so I will be pushing that with the LX fully loaded but I think it will be okay....? I got the whole setup for less then $300 and I think it will be a solid setup. What do you think?

Tony,

I use the 475 with a 405 geared head on it... great tripod! It's fully agreeable to being used in the studio with the 400 head on it as well. I can tell you with absolute certainty that you wouldn't want to lug that combination around for very long out in the field.

Over the past weekend, I had occasion to dunk the legs of the 475 into a river while photographing a scene. It didn't cause me any concern whatsoever.

That said, I've been considering one of the Berlbebach 3022 pods from Rob because it is far less weighty than my present setup. However, my concern is with dunking the wooden legs into water for a period of time. Are they sealed well enough to withstand being in water for 1/2 an hour or more?

Any comments?

Thanks

Cheers