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Linhof
3-Oct-2006, 02:02
Any new toys from Photokina this year?

Emmanuel BIGLER
3-Oct-2006, 06:02
Yes
A new Alpa 6x9cm camera Alpa 12 XY
http://www.alpa.ch/photokina2006/

and new hand-held Arca Swiss cameras, two models, a 6x9cm and a 4"x5". Plus new ball-heads.
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=20111
http://www.schoditsch.com/arcaswiss2006/arcaswiss_page1.jpg
http://www.schoditsch.com/arcaswiss2006/arcaswiss_page2.jpg
http://www.schoditsch.com/arcaswiss2006/arcaswiss_page3.jpg
http://www.schoditsch.com/arcaswiss2006/arcaswiss_page4.jpg
http://www.schoditsch.com/arcaswiss2006/arcaswiss_R_m3d.jpg

Plus the Linhof Technika 3000 and an improvement of the Technorama
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=20039
http://www.linhof.de/download/LINHOF_NEWS_06-d.pdf

Plus some new medium format products (but this is off-topic here)

and a 6x15 Seitz scanning back camera.
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=19894
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=19917

Brian Ellis
3-Oct-2006, 10:13
I'm not sure the announcements were literally at Photokina, I started seeing rumors a week or two before, but the big news for me was the new printers from Epson and HP. 17" wide prints for around $1,000, 24" wide prints for not a whole lot more . One of the HPs is self-profiling.

David Luttmann
3-Oct-2006, 14:53
I'm not sure the announcements were literally at Photokina, I started seeing rumors a week or two before, but the big news for me was the new printers from Epson and HP. 17" wide prints for around $1,000, 24" wide prints for not a whole lot more . One of the HPs is self-profiling.

Brian,

There are lots of reports appearing on the Epson 3800. With it's much improved dithering and more economical black ink switching, this appears to be a great deal at approx $1295. I'm thinking of getting one as more & more of by work is settling in on 16x20 / 16x24.

Regards,

Frank Petronio
3-Oct-2006, 17:55
The Alpa 12XY looks very interesting (but out of my range). I downloaded the photos and it seems like it is... a large format camera for the high-end digital world. A large paltform that allows you to -- perfectly -- stitch six high-res medium format digital back captures. Beautiful machining too.

I'm surprised it hasn't gotten more attention here.

Capocheny
3-Oct-2006, 21:40
What?

No updated version of the inexpensive "cube?" :)

That would be a nice toy to have but, at $1,500, it's just toooooo costly!

Now, that Technika 3000 is a sweet looking camera.

Cheers

Brian Ellis
3-Oct-2006, 21:54
Brian,

There are lots of reports appearing on the Epson 3800. With it's much improved dithering and more economical black ink switching, this appears to be a great deal at approx $1295. I'm thinking of getting one as more & more of by work is settling in on 16x20 / 16x24.

Regards,

I too had pretty well decided on the 3800 to replace my aging and 13" limited 2200 also. However, the more I read about a couple of the HP printers the more intrigued I am, especially the one (or maybe there's more than one) with the profiling feature. I haven't yet been able to keep the HP model numbers and features in my mind but IIRC there's one that will print 24" wide and that costs under $2000. I'm going to wait about six months so that I'll have a chance to read some user reports and then decide.

Gordon Moat
3-Oct-2006, 22:09
Hello Brian Ellis,

That HP would be the DesignJet 130 with the spectrophotometer built in. You can also order a version of the DesignJet 90 with thatm though it only prints up to 17" wide.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat
A G Studio (http://www.allgstudio.com)

Frank Petronio
3-Oct-2006, 22:18
Everytime I buy an HP for the kids they suck. Every Epson works out of the box, They lost me a couple years and a couple $$$ ago...

Gordon Moat
4-Oct-2006, 01:06
Interesting you would say that Frank, and I agree with you regarding their consumer items. In fact, about three years ago I would have told you that anything from HP was the worst crap you could ever buy. After seeing numerous DesignJet 130 printers in usage, and many sample prints, I would be more confident of using that than any Epson 7000 or 9000 series I have seen in use. Of course, living near where these HP printers are developed helps make service easier, though it seems quite rare to need service. So yeah . . . I would not recommend a cheap HP for your kids either.
;)

I am not against Epson gear, know several fine art photographers using these, and it seems anyone picking an Epson has a ready support base of users. They are definitely the marketing powerhouse in the inkjet world, though that should be far from the compelling reason to only consider whatever Epson makes. You can make bad (or good) prints with Epson printers just as easily as with any other printer.
:D

Anyway, if I had the cash to put into a wide ink printer, the best results I have seen were from ColorSpan printers. Then the professional high end line of Seiko (as in Seiko-Epson Company) and the very wide HP printers (DesignJet 5500 or 9000 series, et al). Likely all these are out of the reach of anyone on this forum. Anyway, if anyone is interested try to find the Spencer Labs or FLAAR reports on wide inkjet systems (pigment, dye, solvent, or other types) to evaluate cost per square foot, service and maintenance issues, training and set-up, etc.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat
A G Studio (http://www.allgstudio.com)

evan clarke
4-Oct-2006, 04:36
What?

No updated version of the inexpensive "cube?" :)

That would be a nice toy to have but, at $1,500, it's just toooooo costly!

Now, that Technika 3000 is a sweet looking camera.

Cheers

I would give up my camera before I give up my Cube!! It doesn't need an update!!..EC

400d
5-Oct-2006, 01:32
Bokeh, anyone?
1700mm f4

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0610/06100101zeiss1700f4.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0610/zeiss1700-01-001.jpg
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0610/zeiss1700-02-001.jpg
http://www.dpreview.com/articles/photokina2006/Misc/IMG_0919.jpg

Capocheny
5-Oct-2006, 02:16
I would give up my camera before I give up my Cube!! It doesn't need an update!!..EC

Hi Evan,

Yeah, I heard people who have them LOVE them... I'm sure it's a great tool to have in the ole kit bag. :)

One day....

Cheers

Patrik Roseen
5-Oct-2006, 02:46
Assuming it's not a joke...

On the web-site it says:
The ZEISS Apo Sonnar T* 4/1700 was developed by Carl Zeiss for a customer with very high demands and a special interest in long distance wildlife photography.

Long distance wild life photography, ...at a weight of 256kg I guess this would be mounted on a Jeep or something (possibly a privat tank)...Would be interesting to see the complete setup with the 'control tower' for this monster and the photographer desperately following a moving animal while looking into the WLF of the Hasselblad...probably sitting on top of the whole thing. ;-)

GPS
5-Oct-2006, 03:02
Impossible with 256 kg to have it on those 3 wires hanging at Photokina! Unless it's a maquette.
Why not a simple Nikon 1200 mm? Not too much a difference from a 1700mm.

tim atherton
5-Oct-2006, 17:57
Why not a simple Nikon 1200 mm? Not too much a difference from a 1700mm.

on a Hassy?

GPS
5-Oct-2006, 23:42
on a Hassy?

Why not? It's custom made anyway. At least you could use it on a normal tripod. The only difference is the smaller speed - there he would need to use some higher ISO speed, that's true.

400d
6-Oct-2006, 11:27
Seriously, I think I see Hindenburg in those pics..

Rainer
6-Oct-2006, 12:16
The Alpa 12XY looks very interesting (but out of my range). I downloaded the photos and it seems like it is... a large format camera for the high-end digital world. A large paltform that allows you to -- perfectly -- stitch six high-res medium format digital back captures. Beautiful machining too.

I'm surprised it hasn't gotten more attention here.

I think the 12XY really is the future dream machine for the architectural and interior guys who can justify the cost (i certainly can not ...).
5000 EUR only for the body which is a (very well) machined "metal plate" with shift possibilities. 2500-4000 per lens, 2000 for a 6x9 back, >15.000 for a digital back...

Some other manufacturers may do similar things marginal cheaper, but in terms of design, engineering, finish, usability they wont reach the 12xy.
Sounds like a commercial, i know, but i was truly impressed with it.
What impressed me even more was the kind and helpful attitude of the Alpa guys, i also had the pleasure to talk to Mr. Capaul-Weber himself. Nice guys.
BTW: all 12xys of the first production is already sold out. Waiting time for new orders is 6 months minimum...

GPS
6-Oct-2006, 12:59
...Some other manufacturers may do similar things marginal cheaper, but in terms of design, engineering, finish, usability they wont reach the 12xy. ...

Tastes are personal but let's see some facts. Usability?? The ready to shoot camera weight is more than 4kg... That limits the usability as a handheld machine... The new Arca Swiss R camera is certainly an adversary to count with!
The Alpa wants to create and bangs on the idea that it is the camera that makes pictures. I'm afraid, it is just a half of the truth... Personally I await the Arca Swiss R with more interest.

Frank Petronio
6-Oct-2006, 13:08
The 12Xy is no worse than a professional 8x10 (not a folding wooden box) so it would appeal to the same "no compromise / deep pockets" sort of crowd. We know that a $800 dSLR will satisfy 99% of the customers most of the time but there is still that niggling 1% who will pay for the best ;)

DominiqueMarcWehrli
7-Oct-2006, 04:03
Does anyone have more information about the Arca Swiss R? I would like to know about how much vertical and horizontal shift will be possible with this camera.

Dominique Wehrli

Paul Droluk
7-Oct-2006, 13:44
Since nobody from the forum came by to visit us (sob), here's what we debuted at Photokina... the Fotoman Dmax. (http://www.fotomancamera.com/prodect_list.asp?id=253). The Dmax camera has x/y movements of 50mm only, accepts rollfilm backs from 6x4.5 to 6x12, MF Digital backs and over 100 lenses... at a sub-stratospheric price tag of 2700 USD.

GPS
7-Oct-2006, 13:48
Paul, can those sliding bars on the front of the camera hold firmly even a heavier lens?

Paul Droluk
7-Oct-2006, 15:32
Paul, can those sliding bars on the front of the camera hold firmly even a heavier lens?

The camera pictured is of prototype #001... the sliding bars were added at the last moment in order to debut the camera at Photokina. Production cameras will not utilize this method to affix Lens/Cone assemblies, instead employing a lower flange receiver and two high strength engagement pins on the top corner of each Cone Assembly. The engagement pins will be captured in the body itself, and released by dual spring loaded sliding latches... the actual latching mechanism being internal.

This means no extraneous mounting hardware will be required, such as screws, making lens changes more sure and far quicker. Canteliever loads for heavier Lens/Cone Assemblies have been accounted for during the development of the latching mechanisms.

GPS
8-Oct-2006, 00:29
That consoles me, Paul, because I knew the sliding bar would not be enough (I had problems with similar Graflok sliding bars on my Mamyia Press).

Schaubild
8-Oct-2006, 05:38
I visited you, Paul. And even had a look at the Dmax (and especially the 810 :-)

Nice cameras, well made. Happily looking forward to order one in Germany.