excellent Chris Jordan interview

[paulr]

at Joerg Colberg's blog:

http://www.jmcolberg.com/weblog/archives/002303.html

Thoughtful, literate discussion that includes some issues we've been throwing around here lately.

[adrian tyler]

thank god someone has the courage to be outspoken about the terrible consiquenses of our neglect of our environment, chris's message is now the same message as the majority of the scientific community and yet the american media are muzzled, like the franco era here in spain. all of the "big" global warming related stories we read here in the most conservative press just don't make the us press, agaist this "climate" it takes a brave voice to stand out.

(ok throw it over to "the lounge")

[chris jordan]

Hi Ade, good to hear from you, and Paul thanks for the plug. Kind of funny how threads about scratched lenses get hundreds of responses here, while an interview on this subject is met with virtual silence...

[Oren Grad]

Kind of funny how threads about scratched lenses get hundreds of responses here, while an interview on this subject is met with virtual silence...

The discussion would very quickly turn into something that belongs in the Lounge, or not at all on this site. You should not conclude that people don't think or don't care about these issues just because they feel that it would be inappropriate or fruitless to discuss them here.

[paulr]

Without getting into one political position or another, I like the way the Chris addresses some of the larger issues.

like how do you attempt to raise awareness of a problem, without preaching-- especially when you acknowledge that you're as much a part of the problem as everyone else.

and what are some off the issues and implications of making something beautiful out of something horrible.

I also thought it was interesting as far as the personal story goes ... turning to art full time after years of it being in the background, and the evolution from esthetics to activism.

And Chris, I was interested in your brief remarks on your initial ideas about the work--your esthetic theories about spontaneous form. I realize this has taken a back seat in your mind (and possibly your audience's also), but I want to humbly suggest that it's not an empty idea. In fact I see it clearly in your work, and it might even be the aspect of the work that I'm most drawn to. Not to suggest that esoteric esthetic explorations are as important as saving the world ... but it's possible that art can even more powerfully serve the former goal than the latter.

But it's great that you can do both at the same time.

[Ed Richards]

I agree with Oren. I just finished writing an essay for a speech at the U of Toronto next week about Katrina. Part of it was reviewing the history of hurricanes on the Atlanta and Gulf coasts. There was nothing at all unusual about Katrina or Rita or the 2004 season, other than that there were a lot more people living where the storms hit this time than last time, and the land is lower because of subsidence.

Just for perspective, this is the memorial for the 1893 hurricane that destoryed the commuity of Cheniere, Louisiana, killing most of the inhabitants:

http://biotech.law.lsu.edu/katrina/HTML/4x5%20-%20000777%20-%20ptr_std.jpg

It was knocked over the storm surge from Katrina. The Gulf Coast has always been a killing zone for hurricanes, we just forget because the Gulf was quiet for 40 years. It is hard to say about the size of the storms - before we had hurricane spotters we could not measure a storm until it hit shore. In the old days, none of last year's storms would be have been catagory 5. Katrina was just a middling 3 when it hit.

The problems of New Orleans and Coastal Mississippi are about the failure of effective government and the refusal to make hard choices about risk. Global warming might make the consequences worse in the longterm, but this has more to do with the legacy of Huey Long than with the Koyoto protocol.

[Brian Ellis]

Hi Ade, good to hear from you, and Paul thanks for the plug. Kind of funny how threads about scratched lenses get hundreds of responses here, while an interview on this subject is met with virtual silence...

Perhaps the content of the interview is the cause of the silence. Your notion that it's the Bush administration that has somehow anesthetized people to the underlying causes of Katrina is IMHO silly. There's been plenty of information disseminated about the causes of Katrina so that anyone paying attention knows that it wasn't just a matter of a strong wind and a lot of rain. So the basic premise is wrong.

Second, even if it's right the Bush administration is hardly the sole or even an important cause of the attitude you discuss. As you've amply demonstrated by seizing on George Bush as the cause of the problem, it seems to be human nature to prefer simplistic analyses of complex problems.

And finally, all the talk about American consumerism is sophomoric - tell me something I haven't heard a thousand times before in a thousand different venues and in a thousand different ways. And yes, I know Europeans are more knowledgeable and sophisticated than Americans - deToqueville told us that several hundred years ago and we've been bombarded with it ever since. And yes, primitive people are more in touch with their souls than we are. But isn't it odd that so many of them want to move here?

I think you've spoken far more intelligently and eloquently in your wonderful photographs about the things with which you're concerned than you have in this interview.

[PViapiano]

Chris...

Great interview...and my two cents:

A photography forum is not just a place where we can only ask technical questions and get recommendations for gear, and there are plenty of categories one can choose to post off-topic discussions if need be.

That being said, we cannot forget that photography is an art, and art is an expression of an individual reacting to a huge variety of experiences. Those experiences may involve beauty, love, spirituality, death, war, politics...the whole gamut of human experience.

We should not deny that an artist (or anyone else) has a right to create a body of work to express a point of view, if that is what they choose to do. The comments they make in interviews or in other media allow them to define their point-of-view so that others can understand (if it's not obvious).

Art used to have the power to change the world. An artist is always curious about his world and therefore spends a lifetime searching, hopefully, for truth. Closed-mindedness and preconceived notions that are unalterable can only lead you down a path that is unrealistic and dangerous.

I only wish that we, myself included, were all a little bit more like Chris Jordan, in pointing out, while also being totally self-deprecating, that we need to shed denial and open our eyes to the truth in our world.

[GPS]

20 years ago this kind of photography was called in Europe in a little bit naive way "ecological photography". After you have shown the waste land, car grave yards etc. it starts to be a little bit flat argument - which it is also, if you don't add any solid spirituality to it - and that is hard to do over junk yards photographs.

[paulr]

After you have shown the waste land, car grave yards etc. it starts to be a little bit flat argumen ...

which is to assume the work does nothing but show the wasteland. considering how many people practice "ecological photography," many of them doing little besides showing us what we already know, I think it's a safe bet that Chris is getting noticed because he's doing at least a little more than this.

[GPS]

Call it a "safe bet" or an "assumption" - it's all up to your taste.

[paulr]

Call it a "safe bet" or an "assumption" - it's all up to your taste.

whether you like it or not is up to your taste.

whether you see more than just the surface (this is a picture of garbage!) is up to your visual literacy, and how hard you care to look.

[GPS]

Call it a "safe bet" or an "assumption" - it's all up to your taste.

"whether you like it or not is up to your taste." Paulr

It is, indeed, you got it...

[darr]

Since I do not believe most of what C.J. says to be the cause of Katrina or perhaps the devastation she left behind, I am left disappointed after reading the interview. Somehow the geographic location, historical weather records, and levees speak more to me than global warming or George Bush. The local and state governments in my opinion are more to blame than the White House if you want to blame someone politically for not helping more of the people to higher ground. That to me is the real disaster. Why were those school buses not filled with evacuees and driven north for goodness sake? The Coast Guard did an outstanding job from what I have heard and they are part of the Federal government, so that would be a plus for the Feds would it not?

I was in Homestead Florida for Hurricane Andrew (here today as well) and no one has ever said it was caused by global warming. A sign of the times?

[GPS]

Darr,
you touched the weakest point of this kind of photography - the added "spirituality" must be very solid in order to get somewhere further than just to the "What bad guys we are!" attitude.

[tim atherton]

you touched the weakest point of this kind of photography - the added "spirituality" must be very solid in order to get somewhere further than just to the "What bad guys we are!" attitude.

what's this touchy feely "required spirituality" in art BS all about...?

[GPS]

what's this touchy feely "required spirituality" in art BS all about...?

Read the interview - doesn't he speak about required "spirituality"? The only problem is he doesn't sell it...

[tim atherton]

Part of it was reviewing the history of hurricanes on the Atlanta and Gulf coasts. There was nothing at all unusual about Katrina or Rita or the 2004 season, other than that there were a lot more people living where the storms hit this time than last time, and the land is lower because of subsidence.


I thought also large portions of the wetlands had been developed?

[tim atherton]

Read the interview - doesn't he speak about required "spirituality"? The only problem is he doesn't sell it...

Don't think so - not as a requirement of art (perhaps as being important to living?)

[GPS]

I was speaking about spirituality requirement as a deeper statement than just "look, we're bad boys, it smells around us". Anyway, as Brian said, I could say too - is there any new junkyard not like the ones I've seen?

[tim atherton]

I was speaking about spirituality requirement as a deeper statement than just "look, we're bad boys, it smells around us". Anyway, as Brian said, I could say too - is there any new junkyard not like the ones I've seen?

I think you are confusing art speaking to/of our bankrupt spirituality (among other things) with spirituality in art - the "spirituality requirement as a deeper statement" thing. The latter generally being bogus. Trying to "add" spirituality to art is bs

[GPS]

No, I'm not. I think you misunderstood the sens of my note. Never mind, it's not important.