What is a "Satin Snow" screen?

[Bill_1856]

If my lens is slower than f:5.6, the GG on my Nagaoka is too dark for me to adequately compose an image. There's not enough depth in the back cutout to put in a Maxwell screen and cover glass (or other two piece bright screen). What, exactly, is a Satin Snow screen?

[Ron Marshall]

SS make GG for many camera models. Their glass is etched instead of blasted so it is somewhat brighter. I bought one as a back-up but then used it regularly due to the additional ease at focusing.

There are better GG made but much more expensive. SS can't be beat for the price.

http://www.satinsnowglass.com/

[Brian Ellis]

"If my lens is slower than f:5.6, the GG on my Nagaoka is too dark for me to adequately compose an image"

Usually you compose with the lens wide open, then stop down to the taking aperture. If you've been stopping down before composing maybe that's the problem rather than your ground glass.

[Los]

ron,

what are your ground glass dimensions? i have a ss i can't use, i'll send it to you if it fits your camera.

los

[Bill_1856]

Is the acid etched glass that Dagor77 touts pretty much the same thing?

[sanking]

SS make GG for many camera models. Their glass is etched instead of blasted so it is somewhat brighter. I bought one as a back-up but then used it regularly due to the additional ease at focusing.

There are better GG made but much more expensive. SS can't be beat for the price.

http://www.satinsnowglass.com/

SS ground glasses are not etched. Rather, they are ground by hand with a very fine grit. I have discussed this aspect of production with Dave Parker so I am fairly certain this information is correct.



Sandy King

[Ron Marshall]

SS ground glasses are not etched. Rather, they are ground by hand with a very fine grit. I have discussed this aspect of production with Dave Parker so I am fairly certain this information is correct.



Sandy King

Thanks for the correction Sandy. I was sure that I had read that on their site.

SS GG has a much smoother surface than the stock Sinar I originally had.

[Ron Marshall]

ron,

what are your ground glass dimensions? i have a ss i can't use, i'll send it to you if it fits your camera.

los

I got the SS GG as a spare for my Sinar to take with me on a trip. Since purchasing my Toho 4x5 I only use that Sinar with a 5x7 back, so no need for additional GG. But thanks very much for the kind offer.

[Dan Fromm]

Bill, I'm a tightwad so I tend to use cheap lenses. This means f/9 and f/10 process lenses, of which the shortest is a 150. In fact at the moment owing to the cruelty of fate I have four 150 mm process lenses. 150 happens to be 1.5x my format's normal lens. No problem focusing them on a dirty original issue Graflex for 2x3 Graphic ground glass, even less on a a nice new SatinSnow. The SS is a direct replacement for original issue.

Not to be impolite, but how do you work? Do you use a loupe? Do you work in poorly-lit situations?

I ask because not only can I focus slightly to very long lenses easily at f/9, I can focus an 80/6.3 easily too. With shorter lenses the corners go dark, but I have no problems at all with most of the field and a 65/8. I have three shorter lenses, but the slowest is f/5.6.

Cheers,

Dan

[Bill_1856]

Bill, Not to be impolite, but how do you work? Do you use a loupe? Do you work in poorly-lit situations?

Dan, I admit to being a little embarrassed about my inability to use the Nagaoka GG. My final focus is with a loupe, but the problem is seeing the entire screen for composition, even with a fairly fast 8.25" Dagor. I have no problems with my 4x5 Crown Graphic, nor Technika IV, both of which have Fresnel screens.
I remember being told a long time ago that with a plain GG, one has his choice -- it can be bright and finely ground, and tricky to focus critically, or coarsly ground and easy to focus but difficult to see for composition.
If there was enough depth in the Nagaoka back for a Maxwell screen and cover glass then I'd go that route, but there ain't so I was considering a SS.
Thanks for your interest and help.

[Colin Graham]

Bill, is there any way to tack a sort of extension frame to the back? A couple of strips of wood and some turn buttons? Probably look like hell but might give you the depth you need...

[Kevin Crisp]

If that is the problem, then try one of those thin, light weight, "reading" fresnels. Put it behind the ground glass, ridges facing forward. It does increase apparent brightness and certainly helps with the central hot spot. These don't meaningfully shift focus and they cost less than $10. The Satin Snow has a very fine surface and is somewhat brighter than plain ground glass. If you expect it to be as nice as a Maxwell, etc. option for a tiny fraction of the price you will be disappointed. If you expect it to be a really nice gg for a very reasonable price, you'll be happy. The fine grind makes it easier to focus on detail when checking focus stopped down. On the Maxwell screen are you sure this won't work? I think he can make one for a Tachihara and I don't recall the back on your camera being made much differently.

[Bill_1856]

Good idea, Kevin. I'll seriously consider it. Part of the problem is the springs which hold the GG in place are attached to the wooden back with tiny little woodscrews. Thanks.

[Brian Ellis]

At the Satin Snow prices there's no reason not to give it a try. I for one would like to know what you conclude if you buy and install one. When someone tells me that the non-Fresnel Satin Snow is brighter than the very bright OE Fresnel that was on my Tachihara (as someone did in another thread) I'm beginning to wonder why I spent $250 on a Maxwell.

[Don Bryant]

"If my lens is slower than f:5.6, the GG on my Nagaoka is too dark for me to adequately compose an image"

Usually you compose with the lens wide open, then stop down to the taking aperture. If you've been stopping down before composing maybe that's the problem rather than your ground glass.

My f/8 90 mm S.A. can be very difficult to view and focus with in dim light. That's what the fellow is describing.

Don Bryant

[Don Bryant]

Is the acid etched glass that Dagor77 touts pretty much the same thing?
No, those that dagor77 sell are lousy, IMO.

Don Bryant

[Los]

I got the SS GG as a spare for my Sinar to take with me on a trip. Since purchasing my Toho 4x5 I only use that Sinar with a 5x7 back, so no need for additional GG. But thanks very much for the kind offer.


no problem. the offer stands for anyone who needs it. i got it for a toyo 45g view camera, and the glass is too thick to use with my fresnel screen. they won't both fit in the clips that hold the gg and screen together. fyi, the ss gg was the same brightness and granularity as the toyo gg. a good buy indeed, if it fits.

[Bill_1856]

Los, what are the dimensions of your SS screen?

[Diane Maher]

I've bought an SS gg for my 8x10 Ansco and it was a drastic improvement. Same for my Hasselblad 500CM. The latter had some kind of plastic in the viewfinder.

[Ted Harris]

Bill .... if you bring it with you to the workshop then Richard may be able to help.

[Los]

bill,

i don't have the exact dimensions, they're not printed in my manual. SS said that it was a common glass for them to cut, they had the size already. the glass seats propery in the back, it's just a little too thick. you can try asking SS or toyo. i measure it out to be about 12.6cmW x 10cmH...roughly:)

[Bill_1856]

Los, thanks for checking it. Opening in the Nagaoka is just enough bigger that it won't work. Guess I'll order one (SS) when I get back from the workshop.

[lee\c]

I would recommend a Blackjacket Darkcloth also.

http://www.quietworks.com/FRAMES_FILES/WELCOME_BJ_FOCUSINGCLOTH.html

made a big difference with my Deardorff with Satin Snow and a blackjacket also.

lee\c

[Hany Aziz]

If you are going to the fall foliage workshop then by all means bring the camera. Richard Ritter is an absolute wizard with camera modifications.

Sincerely,

Hany.

[CP Goerz]

No, those that dagor77 sell are lousy, IMO.

Don Bryant



It may be noted from past posts that Mr Bryant has his own axe to grind on my posterior so one shouldn't expect an unbiased opinion from him. Whenever I read his comments I am reminded to take a pinch of salt and wash it down with some prune juice so it may be returned to the source as soon as possible.


CP Goerz