Ideas on First ULF Films?

[alec4444]

Hey Guys! Still don't have film holders quite yet, but I'm ready to shop for film. The day the holders arrive I want to be ready to shoot.

In the medium format world, I really liked Efke 25, 50, and 100. I liked the super-fine grain and the film had the overall "style" I was looking for. I was thinking about trying this out in 11x14.

When I was trying out LF, I used Kodak TXP 320, and I liked what I saw. In 11x14, when you contact print the whole "grain" worry is long since gone.

I should mention the application... while I learn about my camera and play with movements I'm pretty much going to be sticking to 11x14 silver gelatin contact prints. The first 20 shots will probably be developed at a lab, and after that I'll develop myself. After I start to get comfortable with shooting and developing, I'm going to want to begin to use the negatives in alternative processes, beginning with cyanotypes and hopefully ending with albumen prints.

I'm sort of torn between getting a box of ADOX PL100 (aka Efke 100) of 50 sheets from J&C, or getting a small assortment of 25 sheet boxes at Freestyle. I have no idea how long it's going to take to use up 25 sheets (or 50 sheets) of film.... I'll be shooting on weekends only, probably on one of the two days, and I'm pretty darn enthusiastic. :)

What films do you guys prefer and why? Is ISO 100 (or 25) WAY slow for large format? (I tend to stop down a lot in my medium format shots.) Anyone have experience with the J&C, Arista, or Bergger films?

Thanks!
--A

[John Kasaian]

alec,

It depends. If you're outside and theres a light breeze I like all the speed I can get unless I'm after blurry leaves in the trees. In a protected envirement with plenty of light slow films seem to provided richer details (though any big negative provides richer details!) If you're going to follow the directions on the box and not work out your personal exposure speed, I find that a 100-125 ISO/ASA film works for me 90% of the time and faster 320-400 ISO/ASA for blustery days, low light conditions etc... YMMV of course!

[Ron Marshall]

You may have to use f45 or f64 so the extra speed of 320 or 400 ASA will come in handy, especially if it keeps you from having to add time for reciprocity corrections.

[John Bowen]

I've been shooting 8x10 for two years now, and am about to venture to 7x17. The longer lenses required by the ULF formats mean a loss of depth of field. In order to help compensate for the lack of DOF, we tend to shoot at smaller aperatures, this leads to longer shutter speeds and hence reciprocity effects. THE ULF film with the best reciprocity characteristics is Kodak Tmax 400. This film also has a tremendously long straight line when developed in Pyrocat-HD. JandC may still have some in 11x14.

There is a lot of discussion about various ULF films and developers on the Azo Forum at MichaelandPaula.com the exact link is www.michaelandpaula.com/mp/AzoForum/default.asp

Reading this should give you lots to think about from a lot of folks that can "hang-em-on-the-wall"

Best with your new toy,

John

[Geert]

... The first 20 shots will probably be developed at a lab, and after that I'll develop myself....

May I ask why?
I'd suggest to develop them yourself from the start.

G

[alec4444]

... The first 20 shots will probably be developed at a lab, and after that I'll develop myself....


May I ask why?
I'd suggest to develop them yourself from the start.

The thought was to practice the exposure and controls of the camera first. I'm afraid that if I screw that up, and also screw up the development, I won't be able to figure out where I went wrong. Not true? I've never developed film in a tray; but I have done a lot of 120 development in reels. My "darkroom" is a second bathroom that's really light leaky except at night with all the lights off....

Thanks for your responses, guys. I'm going to start with higher film speed based on your advice. I saw some 400 speed film out there in stock. HP5 would be nice, but it's a bit expensive; particularly for someone on their first run. J&C makes a 400 speed film that's a little bit cheaper. OR I can try 10 sheets of the 320 TXP. (At $9.00 per sheet!!)

--A

[Michael Kadillak]

I should mention the application... while I learn about my camera and play with movements I'm pretty much going to be sticking to 11x14 silver gelatin contact prints. The first 20 shots will probably be developed at a lab, and after that I'll develop myself. After I start to get comfortable with shooting and developing, I'm going to want to begin to use the negatives in alternative processes, beginning with cyanotypes and hopefully ending with albumen prints.

Since you have made the jump to 11x14 (congrats by the way) and you have already delineated your objective - you may as well start with at least selecting a film that will serve you well in getting you where you untimately want to be. I would also take it a step further and develop it myself maybe in trays as starting point because the worse case scenario is it is only film and you may as well get this experience behind you. I would start with either PL100 or Classic 400 as they are clearly the least inexpensive options and work with the alt processes you desire and start with Rodinal, D76 or ? Ultimately, you may want to contemplate one of the versions of Pyrocat for your alt processes but for now you need to consider your space requirements and your technique. See how it goes and modify from there. At least you will have a good reference point. A cheap pair of nitrile gloves are all you need as you probably already have the trays. Start with one or two sheets and just take it slow and pull the sheet from the bottom and push it down from the top.

Yes, you will probably scratch some films and yes, there will probably be some other mistakes along the way but who cares?

A couple of standard recommendations with and non-standard camera including 11x14. Protect your film holders from light at all times after they are loaded with film particularly around the bottom flap. Use a dark cloth over the back of your camera when inserting, exposing and removing the film holder. Always use a compendium or lens shade and check the ground glass carefully on the corners when you stop down. Do not be afraid to stop down to f64 and beyond if you need to because contact printing has some latitude in this regard as opposed to projecting printing.

And above all Have Fun! I know that this journey to get to this point has been long and challenging but it is a genuine kick in the pants. Remember, if it was easy everyone would be doing it.

There is an excellent support group here so stay in touch and let us know how it goes

Cheers!

[David A. Goldfarb]

I agree with Michael. PL100 and Classic 400 are beautiful films that require some care in handling, but can produce great results with no compromises on quality, and they're affordable to boot. They also can produce the density range for alt-process printing.

If you're going to be shooting mainly indoors, go for 400. If you will be outdoors, go for 100, I'd say. Realistically, lenses that cover 11x14" for the most part aren't in high-speed shutters, and you're always on a tripod, so though I have some Tri-X in that size, I usually don't require that much speed most of the time. Then again, I like short DOF portraits, so there is also a question of style. If you want everything to be sharp and stopped down and plan to shoot landscapes at f:90 with a 25A filter, go for the faster film obviously.

[Oren Grad]

Much depends on what you like to photograph, when and how.

I do much of my LF snapshooting at the end of the day, when the light is fading. An ISO 25 film would be useless to me even in smaller formats, let alone 11x14. Even ISO 100 is a problem - by the time you factor in reciprocity correction, the reduced speed means being able to make only one or two exposures rather than being able to squeeze in four or five before falling off the "reciprocity cliff" and having to stop. And even among ISO 400 films, the superior reciprocity behavior of HP5 Plus or TMY compared to JandC/Forte 400 is a meaningful advantage when working in larger formats under those conditions.

[scott_6029]

I have had good results in 7 x 17 with the ADOX 100 (efke 100) and JandC 400. I have some kodak t-max 400, but have not yet used it. I tray develop in pyro hd with success (after getting over user error, testing etc.). I use a small laundry room as a darkroom and would suggest you try and develop yourself as it is an important learning step in the whole process.

[alec4444]

Michael, thanks so much for the encouragement and the advice with covering the filmholders. I was getting a lot of bleed on the Efke R100 & R25 films in 120...and quicly learned that the paper backing meant little. I'll try to keep in mind that the wooden film holders may not be much better.

I'm going to be doing most of my shooting in broad, sunny daylight so I expect 100 speed film won't be so bad. I'm going to go with the 50 sheet box of Adox 100, and if I have any Rodinal left over I'll do my development in my favorite 1:100 dilution. When I run out (and that'll be soon) I'll try the Pyro HD.

Oren, thanks for letting me know that the difference in price in the HP5 isn't based on Ilford's name alone...you're paying for better reciprocity (or is it lesser reciprocity?). When I start getting good at this; I'll give that a go.

--A