Is it an Agfa Ansco 8x10 or ????

[Capocheny]

Greetings,

One of the fellows coming to Per Volquartz's, "The Western Canada Workshop" is looking to bring a camera that he's just bought off the bay. He hasn't seen it yet and would like a bit more information on it.

So, does anyone know this camera? Or, better yet... actually use one? It looks like an 8x10 to me but the seller has also stated that it "looks like it takes 5x7."

Here's the listing:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=002&item=120013469006&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Any advice on using this camera... hints? Tips?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Cheers

[Nick_3536]

Have him measure the ground glass.

It's a pre-tilt vintage camera. Advice? Don't drop it-) Fine sturdy camera. Not the lightest.

[Jim Jones]

The buyer will need film, film holders, and a rubber hose and bulb for the shutter. A good book on LF photography is an often overlooked accessory.

[Brian Ellis]

I owned a 5x7 Agfa Ansco and this looks like that camera (except that I agree with you, the proportions of the back look more like 8x10). It's going to be quite heavy, my guess is around 17 lbs. It isn't a clam shell, the rear rail folds up against the back, so the camera is very deep when folded. Unlike a lot of cameras of this vintage, the back rail is permanently attached, which is good and bad. Good because it hasn't been lost, bad because of the resulting depth which makes the camera a little awkward to handle until it's set up on the tripod. I couldn't use a normal camera back pack with mine because of the depth when folded, I had to buy a hiking type pack. I liked mine, I sold it only because I decided that 5x7 contact prints weren't big enough.

If everything is working right this should be a very usable camera, hopefully for not much money.

[Jim Galli]

Looks like a nice old Agfa 5X7 to me. The 24cm Skopar is a tessar design similar to zeiss tessar or Kodak Ektar. 24cm would be normal for 5X7 but wouldn't cover 8X10 except perhaps with darkened corners and no moves. They're OK in use but I don't like the imbalance of the lens right over the tripod bolt and the rest hanging out in the wind from there back. Kodak's 2D with the sliding tripod mount is much more user friendly of cameras the same vintage. Had both and kept the Kodak. Burke & James cheapened and pretty much copied this Agfa model except they added more beds instead of having sliding sections to get the length.

[Kirk Fry]

I have an old gray monster built for the Navy during or shortly after WWII. This is an earlier model, 20's or 30's. As mentioned there is no tilt on the lens. It looks like an 8X10, but one should measure it. The film holders however look like 5X7's so I can't really tell. The lens probably won't cover 8X10. I have not had a lot of luck with Packard shutters. The camera should be fine, the shutter iffy. If it was me I would get a modern shutter and that probably means new glass too.

[Nick_3536]

I think the weights given are off. My 8x10 is less then 15 lbs. The 5x7 is even lighter.

The camera has two tripod mounts so you can choose the one that balances the lens best. Plus it's wood so no reason you can't add a third mount if you really wanted.

[Randy H]

Proportionally guesstimating, from the rear view, judging from the size of the packard, having had an agfa 5x7, would guess it to be the 5x7. Glass is proportionate to the film holders, and judging from that, the rear standard would not allow for a larger glass area. Not a bad camera, especially for the price, with the holders, tripod, lens, etc dressed and ready to dance.

[Capocheny]

Thanks for all the responses... I sent Joseph this thread and am hoping that he has the opportunity of reading it.

Very informative!

He's located in Shanghai, China at the moment. :)

Cheers

[John Kasaian]

I can't really tell since theres some distorion with the photo of the back. It looks like a 5x7 but of course the only way to know for sure is to measure the gg I'm pretty sure it is the "Universal" model. I've got two working 5x7 examples and a couple of hulls for parts---they're nice sturdy little cameras with lots of moves, bellows and attached folding rails. If you can get a good one cheap, they're excellent bargains. AA used an 8x10 model IIRC.

[JMB]

Thanks gentlemen for all the very helpful information. I don't have the camera with me, but I have asked a friend to measure the g.glass for me and report. I am hoping that the lens has very distinct qualities. Although, I suppose I will be a little dissapointed if the camera turns out to be 5x7 instead of 8x10. Meanwhile, I really appreciate all of your responses. --Joe

[Capocheny]

Hi Joe,

Good to see you on the forum... stick around!

Lots to learn here. :)

Cheers

[Diane Maher]

I own an 8x10 Ansco and the ground glass on that one in that ebay picture looks like a 5x7 to me.

[John Kasaian]

Joe,

I was looking at that back again and it sure looks like a 5x7 and it dosen't look to me like 5x7 reducing back on an 8x10 camera. OTOH if the bellows are good, you won a real sweet 5x7 kit for that price.

[wfwhitaker]

My money says it's a 5x7. The first clue is the width of the tailboard relative to the width of the rear standard. On the 8x10 the tailboard is not the full width of the camera. On the 5x7 it's much closer to the same size.

The lens is a 24cm Voigtlander Skopar. The focal length alone suggests 5x7. But it's also an f/4.5 which makes the glass approximately 2 inches across. So use that as your measuring stick. By the way, that lens should be pretty desirable and alone is probably worth more than the selling price of the camera. If the Packard shutter is problematic, it can easily be replaced with a new one. This one appears to have sync terminals which is nice. Note how the lens flange has been cut away to allow room for the shutter pin (which is still there). That pin is probably the captive type which would explain why it hasn't been lost in the last 65 years. The hose which has been cut can also be replaced with new. The old hose shown with the film holders may be dry rotted anyway.

This was probably some working guy's portrait outfit and during its day was a pretty fine machine. It can make beautiful images now as it did back in the forties. I'm particularly fond of the old Agfa/Ansco's. Short of a Deardorff they were an excellent design and probably were the pinnacle of tailboard cameras. I have this camera in this vintage in both the 5x7 and 8x10 size. While not as transportable as a clamshell design, they're good solid cameras and the 5x7 shouldn't present any problem to schlep about. Morley Baer carried the 8x10 version around for years. The lensboard size for the 5x7 is 5 1/4" square. It's the same size as a Wisner lensboard except that the lip is a little thicker. A Wisner lensboard will be loose. However boards are easily knocked out on a table saw.

The one question still hanging if I were buying the camera is the condition of the bellows. The photos never show the camera extended. If the bellows needs to be replaced, it's simple enough to remove the old frames and send them with the old bellows attached to Camera Bellows. Even considering having to do that, the price is fair for a solid 5x7 with a nice lens. If I can offer any assistance to your friend after he receives the camera, I'd be happy to help.

-Will

[JMB]

Thanks again everyone. This has all been very helpful. And Will, I will indeed contact you if I need some additional advice once I get my hands on the camera. I will be arriving in Los Angeles next week to pick it up. I still have not heard from my friend whom I asked to measure it. But it looks like 5x7 has taken a decisive lead in the early rounds. --Joe